Drone Hits Army Helicopter over New York

Huh, it just happened to happen at 500', the exact minimum altitude that military helicopters are allowed to fly at (and the max for drones). Its not at all possible that these pilots were showing off a bit and dropped below that, into the airspace in which drones are allowed to fly at.

Also, which is more likely, that some drone operator managed to intercept a military helicopter, or that the massive air intake of the helicopter sucked up a drone that was near it?
 
DTN107 said:
What if the drone was hovering in the same spot?

Wouldn't it mean that the army helicopter "hit" the drone instead?
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It doesn't matter, which is why the author specifically mentioned it. Drones aren't supposed to be above 500 feet.
 
zamardii12 said:
It doesn't matter, which is why the author specifically mentioned it. Drones aren't supposed to be above 500 feet.
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I think 400-500 feet is considered a gray zone in which drones are not supposed to be in.
I don't see an exact location. It could be likely that the drone operator (depending on tree lines) could not see the helicopter until it flew too close to the drone and there wasn't enough time to adjust the drone's position before a crash occurred.

Honestly, i think this should lead to mini avoidance systems in which a drone can transmit a point signal which can be interpreted by real aircraft as hazards. The aircraft can then in turn send a signal to drones in the area that will give the operators a chance to get out of the way.
I think this already occurs in emergency vehicles, but i doubt that drones have evolved to really utilize these signals yet.
I have no idea if this works on military aircraft. Just because of their nature i would doubt it.
 
Gigus Fire said:
I think 400-500 feet is considered a gray zone in which drones are not supposed to be in.
I don't see an exact location. .
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Like I said it doesn't matter. And the 500 feet is not a gray zone. It's very specific when you register with the FAA. "No not go above 500 feet." So either way you look at it the drone pilot was at fault because he/she knew exactly how high they were and if I had to guess the drone was likely way much higher than 500 feet for a military helicopter to hit it.
 
Bandalo said:
Helo engines are filtered and screened far, far more than the intakes on fighters and other jet aircraft. Helo's are designed to land, take off, and hover over gravel, dirt, dust, etc. Drone pieces might screw up the rotor blades, but they're not going to get into the turbines.
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I just wanted to say that I appreciate that you responded to a hostile post in a calm manner. I was hoping I could find a spec sheet or similar for the intake on the engines but wasn't able to. They use these engines, https://www.geaviation.com/military/engines/t700-engine, which may help somebody else get a n official answer, unfortunately I don't have time to look into it further.
 
andrewaggb said:
I just wanted to say that I appreciate that you responded to a hostile post in a calm manner. I was hoping I could find a spec sheet or similar for the intake on the engines but wasn't able to. They use these engines, https://www.geaviation.com/military/engines/t700-engine, which may help somebody else get a n official answer, unfortunately I don't have time to look into it further.
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If you dig online you can find UH-60 manuals and pictures with a lot of detail. I happen to have 2 Navy helo pilots down the hall from my office, and I double checked with them before I posted. ;) They fly the 60S and 60R variants, but they're almost identical to the Black Hawk from the story.
 
jpm100 said:
Because there's a law of physics against it?


The length of a helicopter blade makes for strange instability issues. Disturb one enough and it will do the work of destroying itself.
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Main rotor != turbine.
 
BloodyIron said:
This could possibly be a new avenue of attack, even if this time was an accident. In terms of scale of cost, I suspect a swarm of drones would be substantially cheaper than a weapon that normally takes down black hawks. I can't speak for all weapons mind you, but swarms of drones as a weapon seems very versatile and cost-effective.
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The US Air Force has you covered!
 
zamardii12 said:
Like I said it doesn't matter. And the 500 feet is not a gray zone. It's very specific when you register with the FAA. "No not go above 500 feet." So either way you look at it the drone pilot was at fault because he/she knew exactly how high they were and if I had to guess the drone was likely way much higher than 500 feet for a military helicopter to hit it.
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Hobbyists don't have to register with the FAA.
 
Not the first drone collision not going to be the last. Wonder how long until a civilian drone collision downs a civilian passenger aircraft. Mind unless it's a swarm of drones it probably won't be crash landing but likely a emergency reroute.
 
Tweak42 said:
Not the first drone collision not going to be the last. Wonder how long until a civilian drone collision downs a civilian passenger aircraft. Mind unless it's a swarm of drones it probably won't be crash landing but likely a emergency reroute.
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If it happens it would likely be considered intentional, the radius around airports pretty much excludes takeoff and landing strikes. Planes are flying too high outside the no fly zone. I consider willful ignorance the same as intentional. You don't get the benefit of the doubt on shit like this.

I do agree tho it is only a matter of time before someone weaponizes a drone in the US, which is why we need fast and easy ways of providing aerial denial of them, be it with a jammer or sharks with freakin lasers on their heads.
 
Brian_B said:
Depends on the size of the drone - over about half a pound must be registered. One going to 500ft would probably need to be registered.

Drone limit is 400 ft, more than 5 mi from airport, and maintain in line of site. Manned aircraft have right of way.

https://www.faa.gov/uas/getting_started/
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That was overturned a few months ago in court. The FAA website doesn't reflect the ruling. Only commercial pilots have to register.

edit for reference: https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...b83bf8-416a-11e7-adba-394ee67a7582_story.html
 
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zamardii12 said:
Like I said it doesn't matter. And the 500 feet is not a gray zone. It's very specific when you register with the FAA. "No not go above 500 feet." So either way you look at it the drone pilot was at fault because he/she knew exactly how high they were and if I had to guess the drone was likely way much higher than 500 feet for a military helicopter to hit it.
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Do all drones have altimeters? Are you sure the helicopter was flying at exactly 500ft and not lower? There's a lot of unknowns here.
 
Gigus Fire said:
Do all drones have altimeters? Are you sure the helicopter was flying at exactly 500ft and not lower? There's a lot of unknowns here.
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None of mine do. Some have a barometer which isn't all that accurate, but others use GPS which will give you pretty close accuracy, usually +/- 15 meters. However, I've seen plenty of people fly and crash DJI quadcopters (including some of my friends) who program a waypoint, and it is pretty far off the actual path, both in longitude/latitude and elevation. My friend just ruined his DJI Phantom 4 because he was flying out behind his house in the farm fields, set his altitude for 300 feet, programmed his waypoints, then took off on the route. About 400 meters from his house are 345kV lines (not much more than 100ft off the ground), and his quadcopter crashed into them and fried.
 
w1retap said:
None of mine do. Some have a barometer which isn't all that accurate, but others use GPS which will give you pretty close accuracy, usually +/- 15 meters. However, I've seen plenty of people fly and crash DJI quadcopters (including some of my friends) who program a waypoint, and it is pretty far off the actual path, both in longitude/latitude and elevation. My friend just ruined his DJI Phantom 4 because he was flying out behind his house in the farm fields, set his altitude for 300 feet, programmed his waypoints, then took off on the route. About 400 meters from his house are 345kV lines (not much more than 100ft off the ground), and his quadcopter crashed into them and fried.
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I work with a lot of gps devices. Most of them are built so that they toss away the altitude portion and assume that you're at ground level. Unless the algorithms are modified to reflect that, you'll get really inaccurate readings. Plus you'll need more than 4 satellites for altitude readings in general.
I just assume that most drone operation is done visually and that automatic flight (which is another grey area in the fcc rules) is pretty untrustworthy/newish.
 
DTN107 said:
What if the drone was hovering in the same spot?

Wouldn't it mean that the army helicopter "hit" the drone instead?
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Not if the drone was at 500'. Max height for personal remote drones/planes is 400'. Above that is violating FAA air restrictions.
 
jpm100 said:
I never brought up turbine. Correct someone else.
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No, but you were responding to a post where the author was discussing potential damage to the turbine, with a comment about the main rotor blades.
 
focbde said:
No, but you were responding to a post where the author was discussing potential damage to the turbine, with a comment about the main rotor blades.
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I was responding to the implication that the notion was "james bond"-esque. It is until someone does it. 9/11 could have easily been an 80's or 90's action movie plot, until it happened.
 
jpm100 said:
I was responding to the implication that the notion was "james bond"-esque. It is until someone does it. 9/11 could have easily been an 80's or 90's action movie plot, until it happened.
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You're right there, and in my opinion the idea of taking down a helicopter with a drone isn't THAT James Bond-esque in the first place. Helicopters are damn fragile things in many ways.
 
Wyodiver said:
I was in the AF for a better part of a decade. I primarily worked on modified C-130s. Dealing with birds is bad enough, having to deal with drones just doesn't help matters any. And, yes, drones can and will be weaponized by countries like Somalia, Syria, Iran, Canada, etc.
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Canada, huh?
 
Romale23 said:
You know there was a hail storm in Afghanistan that caused all the helicopters that were outside to require blade replacement. Was crazy expensive. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jun/27/freak-afghan-hailstorm-helicopters and this was on non functioning helicopters
I don't know why people are so surprised that anything hitting a helicopter could cause damage.
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I was in Afghanistan in 2009 for a year or so and we were doing a night raid using ch-47's, as we were landing our ch-47 was being hit by bullets.

So actually, the hail thing is pretty surprising to me.

Then again, not sure if the CH-47 was the same one that picked us up or if the other one was grounded...
 
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