Downgrading to XP for the 2nd time (sigh)

[Enlitence.Systems]

Okay. So I went back to vista, and I tried. I really did. I loved the look of it and I was sick of looking at the XP interface for 6-7 years. I wanted something new, something fresh. Vista was it. although it really wasn't.

First problem. Vista is not for an advanced user. or if it is, I sure as hell have to learn a lot more new tips and tricks to get around things. Normal processes do not work anymore because there is so much stupidity protection that it just gawks at me.

Sound and Wireless. Maybe it's me, maybe I'm the one at fault. but these 2 features, which should be straightforward to setup as long as I have the drivers are the most infuriating thingI have ever experienced.

Sound. My in-line wouldn't display for the longest time. I wouldn't get sound because Microsfot or realtek, not sure whom, decided it was a good idea to only use enable sound on "secure connection" sound plugs. so most older plugs, or my chewed up and spat out speaker connectors sound muffled and crappy.

Networking, By god I hate windows automatic wireless connector, it is a thorn in my side. Even if I disable the feature. I cannot use the manufacturers simple to use program which almost always connects to the AP that I want and never conflicts with other computers.

It never crashes, maybe I'm not susceptible to crashes in OS, or maybe I just don't notice them since I'm so quick to just reload the program (Firefox has been crashing lately I've noticed)

is there anyone like me? that feels that there's too much stupid ware in Vista to take full control of it? are you enduring? downgrade? or patiently awaiting Windows 7?

Maybe I'm just a noob.

I've heard good things from Server 2k8 running as a workstation, but the Driver situation for a server OS makes me scared. any word?

 

[silent-circuit]

Not to be harsh, but I'm honestly leaning toward "You're just a noob."

I've yet to have a single issue with Realtek HD onboard sound, aside from having to disable the whole "detection" thing, because that's never worked properly, since Windows 98. I just update drivers regularly. Maybe that was part of what you were running in to? Because honestly, this whole "secure connections" thing is a joke. There is no secure connection to my headphones. Or my speakers. It's the same standard analog jack it's always been. Digital out works fine as well.

I've also yet to have a single issue with the Windows integrated wireless app, and I've been able to turn it off and use the app my Gigabyte wireless card came with without issue... though I hate that app and immediately went back to using the integrated app. Works fine. Set an order of preference, give it any necessary keys, off you go. Again, make sure your drivers are up to date and you aren't using second-rate hardware.

What apps are you using that the "stupidity protection" is causing issue with? I ran in to some a few years ago (RivaTuner stands out in memory, as does CoreTemp / RealTemp) but they've /all/ moved on and got properly signed drivers that cause no issues now. The only real "stupidity protection" I can think of is UAC, and If you don't like UAC turn it off. It's not difficult at all, and can actually improve startup times. Google is your friend -- takes all of 5 minutes to look up and it's a one time thing. As for requiring signed drivers and limiting kernel mode access... those are real security features, with actual benefits, not 'stupidity prevention'.

The last few versions of Firefox have been utter trash -- it crashes on every machine in the house here, from my laptops running XP and Linux to the desktop here running Vista Ultimate 64bit to the other desktop running XP. Mozilla's gone down entirely the wrong fork somehow. It has nothing to do with Vista.

What tricks and work-arounds have you been forced in to using? I have a really hard time believing you weren't doing similar things in XP.

 

[Enlitence.Systems]

Probably my second rate hardware any having trouble with solutions. blah. I don't know why but it seemed XP just did what I wanted easier. I dunno.

 

[silent-circuit]

Probably my second rate hardware any having trouble with solutions. blah. I don't know why but it seemed XP just did what I wanted easier. I dunno.

Please give specifics. That's all I'm asking for.

 

[mmtom]

Are you running SP1?

I had some weird issues with my X-Fi a while ago, but most of those were attributed to crappy drivers. With the latest drivers, everything works well. You say you weren't getting sound at all? The only time a "Secure" sound output is required is if you're using something that's using HDCP, as far as I know.

As for networking, I don't really have anything to add. I always use the built-in Wireless Zero-Config. I never install the 3rd party stuff since it usually sucks (IMO).

Since Vista (SP1) and Server 2008 are the same kernel version, you can use the same drivers on both. I'm running Server 2008 on my laptop and with the exception of the Server manager and the logon screen, you can't tell it's a server OS. Looks exactly like Vista.

 

[Starcrossed]

Not to be harsh, but I'm honestly leaning toward "You're just a noob."

How did people like the quoted inflitrate this place? Wasn't like this a few years ago... maybe I just forgot. Nothing is wrong with being a beginner. That is where everyone is, at one time or another.

 

[Liver]

How did people like the quoted inflitrate this place? Wasn't like this a few years ago... maybe I just forgot. Nothing is wrong with being a beginner. That is where everyone is, at one time or another.

I disagree. The beginner / student poses a problem then asks for help to solve it, and I agree we were all there at some point.

The "noob" in its degradation is more of a beginner that complains first and really doesn't want to learn.

As an example, to differentiate the two, as related to this thread.

The student: I installed Vista and I am having these problems. How can I fix them?

The "noob": I installed Vista, had some issues, and now I am running away from them. Not only am I running, but I will complain about it as well. No, I really don't want you to help me understand and solve the problem.

I understand sometimes there are very legitimate reasons to walk away from problems, as all can not be fixed. However, we are talking about Vista here! Many people had issues and solved them.

 

[bigdogchris]

First problem. Vista is not for an advanced user. or if it is, I sure as hell have to learn a lot more new tips and tricks to get around things. Normal processes do not work anymore because there is so much stupidity protection that it just gawks at me.

Vista has all the features that XP has, mostly, they are just in different places. You can disable the UAC prompt that comes up. And in Windows 7, they are allowing you to relax the settings to prevent it from coming up as much.

Sound and Wireless. Maybe it's me, maybe I'm the one at fault. but these 2 features, which should be straightforward to setup as long as I have the drivers are the most infuriating thingI have ever experienced.

Vista does have poor wireless support. When I put Vista on a box that has wireless, I first used a wired connection, then use the Update Drive for my wireless card, connect to Windows Update, and it finds the driver (x64 is what I've used it for).

Sound. My in-line wouldn't display for the longest time. I wouldn't get sound because Microsfot or realtek, not sure whom, decided it was a good idea to only use enable sound on "secure connection" sound plugs. so most older plugs, or my chewed up and spat out speaker connectors sound muffled and crappy.

I really like Vista's sound features. The built in driver for high def audio is pretty nice, but simple. The line in stereo recorder was hacked down to prevent people from' recording what you hear', to stop copy protection. If your using a newer driver (not the Windows Default), you can go to recording properties, right click and view hidden devices, then make the device the default. Now I can record what I hear without needing an extra program.

Networking, By god I hate windows automatic wireless connector, it is a thorn in my side. Even if I disable the feature. I cannot use the manufacturers simple to use program which almost always connects to the AP that I want and never conflicts with other computers.

I've never had issues with it, nor have known anyone too. It's easy to use and you can program what AP's you want to connect to and which is the default etc. It's very easy, I don't see why you wouldn't want to use it.

It never crashes, maybe I'm not susceptible to crashes in OS, or maybe I just don't notice them since I'm so quick to just reload the program (Firefox has been crashing lately I've noticed)

Vista doesn't? Or XP? I think Vista is very reliable in itself. Firefox 3.0.3 is buggy and I had to rollback to 3.0.2 to stop it from crashing myself, but that's a FF issue, not Vista.

is there anyone like me? that feels that there's too much stupid ware in Vista to take full control of it? are you enduring? downgrade? or patiently awaiting Windows 7?

Windows 7 is like a better performing version of Vista. It's the same in itself though so if you don't like Vista, you won't like 7.

I've heard good things from Server 2k8 running as a workstation, but the Driver situation for a server OS makes me scared. any word?

Server 2008 is Vista with server functionality. If you put the desktop experience on it, and re-enable some services that you normally use on a desktop like Sound, Indexing, etc, you basically have Vista. It even benchmarks very similar to Vista. I've tested it and Windows 7.

 

[number69]

I still use XP Pro as my main OS but I do have Vista loaded up in a VM and it runs well.

 

[Azhar]

How did people like the quoted inflitrate this place? Wasn't like this a few years ago... maybe I just forgot. Nothing is wrong with being a beginner. That is where everyone is, at one time or another.

You're (a 46-day vet) back lashing against a 3.2 year vet about how things were a few years ago?

Try not to take things out of context. He was merely quoting the OP who admitted he might be a little noobish with his anti-Vista attitude, then provided his reasoning and opinions of how he should approach the new OS.

Not to take things out of context myself, I realize you might have had another nick once upon a time. I did too (WizKid is an 8-year vet before I retired the nickname for this one). About the only thing that changed then and now is today's kids seem to think some technology is a waste of time rather than looking at the bigger picture.

 

[silent-circuit]

I thought I was being reasonable, really, and yes I was only quoting the OP with the "noob" bit. Hell, it was /in/ quotes.

I've also asked twice now for specifics with regard to the OP's various "work-arounds" and "issues with stupidity protection"... and got "I dunno" so I'm feeling anything but repentant at this point.

Starcrossed, I regularly spend hours in Gen[H]ard helping people with new builds and issues. I honestly try to help, and I generally back up my points when they're controversial, but I've developed something of a reputation for intolerance when it comes to people unwilling to listen or actually accept assistance. Maybe that's what you saw coming through.

 

[Catweazle]

/OT

How did people like the quoted inflitrate this place? Wasn't like this a few years ago... maybe I just forgot. Nothing is wrong with being a beginner. That is where everyone is, at one time or another.

There definitely HAS been an increase of late, particularly from people arguing pro-Vista stuff, of the "You're a n00b/FUD-monger/idiot/whatever" type comment. It's ugly, rude, unnecessary, and whilst I'm one of the people who will jump in boots and all to counter misinformations and intolerances I often don't like seeing some of the careless and callous comment I see around me.

BUT...

Second post in this topic isn't such an instance. It's a comment which speaks specifically to a comment made in the topic post! Go look again