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DOOM3 for nVIDIA and HL2 for ATi !!!

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Cannibal Corpse

Cannibal Corpse

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 22, 2002
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1,285
It was very obvious.

I bet ATi is going to strike back (with a vengeance) with Half Life 2 beating nVIDIA's 6800GT and Ultra.


This is SO interesting to say the least! ;)
 
And ATI is just as lame as Nvidia by getting in bed with a game company to ensure HL2 runs better on their cards. This whole Doom is for Nvidia and HL2 is for ATI is fucking dumb. Both games should run on both flag ship cards within 5 fps of each other. But noooooo......to much MONEY flying around.
 
If I had to choose between the two, I'd take HL2 over Doom3 any day of the week.
 
There has been NO proof that HL2 will not run about as well if not the same on the 6800's. Why do people keep saying HL2 is going to be ATI's DOOM 3?

DOOM 3 isn't anything special. Its just called OpenGL. And OpenGL is something ATI does not perform well in. The 6800nu has already been beating the PE in other OpenGL games like Call of Duty and Neverwinter Nights. KOTOR 2, the Call of Duty expansion, Quake 4, Soldier of Fotune 3, and possibly RTCW 2 are upcoming hits for OpenGL.

HL2 is going to support Smart Shader 3.0 as well.

And if you'll look at the projected system requirements for max detail in HL2, you will see its nowhere near what it is on DOOM 3. The DOOM 3 engine is a heavy hitter for graphics, espeically because of the extensive use of shadows.
 
Take off the tinfoil hats. id does OpenGL. OpenGL is NVIDIA's playground, always has been.

Valve = D3D. ATI is currently doing very well with their D3D drivers. They're on relatively equal footing with NVIDIA with the current crop of cards.

There is no conspiracy, there is no sinister plot.

Unplug from the computer, go outside, and do something.
 
Well I like Doom and never really got into HL, but then again, I prefer ATi's over nVidia..

But then again it's not like I'm buying a $500 video card anytime soon. Ati 9600 Pro will have to do for now.
 
Wow, I must be lucky then since I plan on buying and playing both of them!
 
Morley said:
Take off the tinfoil hats. id does OpenGL. OpenGL is NVIDIA's playground, always has been.

Valve = D3D. ATI is currently doing very well with their D3D drivers. They're on relatively equal footing with NVIDIA with the current crop of cards.

There is no conspiracy, there is no sinister plot.

Unplug from the computer, go outside, and do something.
Click to expand...

Totally agree ;)
 
this is just plain stupid.....HL2 ran better with ATI hardware in the last generation hardware(Stupid FX vs Radeon 9800) Of course the Radeon 9800s were better in DX9 stuff. With this generation hardware(6800 vs X800) I personally think that 6800 is designed better in hardware. 6800GT will perform on par with X800XT-PE and the X800 Pro is just outmuscled. I heard that ATI coming out with another SKU that only reduce the clock speed but will reserve the full 16 pipelines

I am not royal to any company, ATI or Nvidia or AMD or Intel, I just buy the best price/performance ratio products at any given time.
 
ShowMeThe$$$$$$ said:
And ATI is just as lame as Nvidia by getting in bed with a game company to ensure HL2 runs better on their cards. This whole Doom is for Nvidia and HL2 is for ATI is fucking dumb. Both games should run on both flag ship cards within 5 fps of each other. But noooooo......to much MONEY flying around.
Click to expand...

eh?
1600x1200 HigQ 0xAA 8xAF PCI-Express
6800U = 68.5 FPS
6800GT = 59.6 FPS
X800XT-PE = 51.8FPS(And this is supposed to compete against the 6800UE, not the 6800U!)

6800U vs X800XT-PE = 16.7 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!
6800GT vs X800XT-PE = 7.8 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!

1600x1200 HighQ 4xAA 8xAF PCI-Express
6800U = 42.5 FPS
6800GT = 37.2 FPS
X800XT-PE = 33.5 FPS

6800U vs X800XT-PE = 9 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!
6800GT vs X800XT-PE = 3.7 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You where right!(first time!!!)

1024x768 HighQ 4xAA 8xAF PCI-Express
6800U = 72.6 FPS
6800GT = 65.6 FPS
X800XT-PE = 63.3 FPS

6800U vs X800XT-PE = 9,3 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!
6800GT vs X800XT-PE = 2.3 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You where right!(second time!!!)

Ah...the hell with it..I can read my self and don't need the advice of someone being right 2 out of 6 times... :rolleyes:
(This mean that you wrong 66% of the time) :D

Terra
 
the way i see it is they should pretty much equal out in HL2 performance. With sm3.0 support i think they will be equal to a certain degree. I remember reading an article a while back about how the 9800 series of cards pounced all over the 5900 series. and i think this is where alot of us are getting these idea's from. the 6800 is a whole new artitecture and i dont think that same statement is going to hold true.
 
Terra said:
eh?
1600x1200 HigQ 0xAA 8xAF PCI-Express
6800U = 68.5 FPS
6800GT = 59.6 FPS
X800XT-PE = 51.8FPS(And this is supposed to compete against the 6800UE, not the 6800U!)

6800U vs X800XT-PE = 16.7 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!
6800GT vs X800XT-PE = 7.8 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!

1600x1200 HighQ 4xAA 8xAF PCI-Express
6800U = 42.5 FPS
6800GT = 37.2 FPS
X800XT-PE = 33.5 FPS

6800U vs X800XT-PE = 9 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!
6800GT vs X800XT-PE = 3.7 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You where right!(first time!!!)

1024x768 HighQ 4xAA 8xAF PCI-Express
6800U = 72.6 FPS
6800GT = 65.6 FPS
X800XT-PE = 63.3 FPS

6800U vs X800XT-PE = 9,3 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You are wrong!
6800GT vs X800XT-PE = 2.3 FPS(in favour of nVidia) You where right!(second time!!!)

Ah...the hell with it..I can read my self and don't need the advice of someone being right 2 out of 6 times... :rolleyes:
(This mean that you wrong 66% of the time) :D

Terra
Click to expand...

and... what is this info from?
 
Terra said:
The [H]ardOPC DOOM ]|[ benchmark :)

.oO(Dosn't anyone read the freaking thing? *LOL*)

Terra...
Click to expand...

did, but since the thread has to do with hl2 also, wasn't sure if it was some benchmark based off the leak of hl2. and some people have been passing those benches off as gospel, which of course is dumb.
 
The difference in performance between the same priced nv40 and r420 in HL2 will be closer than the blowout we see in Doom3.
 
ShowMeThe$$$$$$ said:
And ATI is just as lame as Nvidia by getting in bed with a game company to ensure HL2 runs better on their cards. This whole Doom is for Nvidia and HL2 is for ATI is fucking dumb. Both games should run on both flag ship cards within 5 fps of each other. But noooooo......to much MONEY flying around.
Click to expand...

The only reason ATi sucks in Doom3 is because they spent all thier time working on filtering tricks when they should have been rewriting thier OpenGL driver.

They have noone to blame but themselves.

Nobody is in bed with anyone here, you're imagining things.
 
Morley said:
Take off the tinfoil hats. id does OpenGL. OpenGL is NVIDIA's playground, always has been.

Valve = D3D. ATI is currently doing very well with their D3D drivers. They're on relatively equal footing with NVIDIA with the current crop of cards.

There is no conspiracy, there is no sinister plot.

Unplug from the computer, go outside, and do something.
Click to expand...
I bet you're on the computer more than anyone around here.
 
Cannibal Corpse said:
It was very obvious.

I bet ATi is going to strike back (with a vengeance) with Half Life 2 beating nVIDIA's 6800GT and Ultra.


This is SO interesting to say the least! ;)
Click to expand...

ATi isn't going to strike back with a damned thing. The 6800 matches the X800 in all other D3D games and it matches it in the leaked version of HL2, so I doubt the final will prove to be an Nvidia killer.

I bet Nvidia is within 5fps of ATi by the time HL2 ships. And that will only be with their non-existent XTPE, the Pro will fall to the GT in HL2 for sure.
 
ShowMeThe$$$$$$ said:
And ATI is just as lame as Nvidia by getting in bed with a game company to ensure HL2 runs better on their cards. This whole Doom is for Nvidia and HL2 is for ATI is fucking dumb. Both games should run on both flag ship cards within 5 fps of each other. But noooooo......to much MONEY flying around.
Click to expand...

It's a consiparcy.
 
It dosen't matter for many people who have systems like mine, which card they use. My understanding is that with my oc'd barton 2500 @3200 I would'nt gain much by upgrading my vid card anyway (9800 AIW pro) because I am cpu limited. So, only people with much faster pent 4s or A64 chips will benefit from these newer generation vid cards. Most people would do well getting a 9800 pro on the cheap, or upgrade the cpu/motherboards. Some people would benefit more simply by having a gig of ram in their systems.
 
^eMpTy^ said:
The only reason ATi sucks in Doom3 is because they spent all thier time working on filtering tricks when they should have been rewriting thier OpenGL driver.
Click to expand...

Not every ATI employee is versed in the art of creating openGL drivers, besides ati has more employees than Nvidia I don't see how this works as a joke
 
SnakEyez187 said:
Not every ATI employee is versed in the art of creating openGL drivers, besides ati has more employees than Nvidia I don't see how this works as a joke
Click to expand...

I wasn't joking.
 
so if Nvidia owns ATI with Doom3 and are pretty close in HL2 (PROBABLY), then i might aswell get the 6800U
 
SnakEyez187 said:
Really? Do you happen to work for Ati, or did you just join to add another person to the cheap shot/no fact/no logical discussion side?
Click to expand...

I do not work for ATi.

<logic>
ATi is good at anistropic filtering and fsaa without losing much speed.

ATi sucks at OpenGL as evidenced by thier loss to a card with a 195Mhz speed deficit to make up for.

It seems a logical rational conclusion that the reason they are losing in Doom3 is because they focused too much on high level filtering in D3D instead of getting thier OpenGL performance up to par.
</logic>
<cheap shot>
If you can't see the logic in this I can explain again and use smaller words.
</cheapshot>
 
The game tic simulation, including player movement, runs at 60hz, so if it rendered any faster, it would just be rendering identical frames. A fixed tic rate removes issues like Quake 3 had, where some jumps could only be made at certain framerates. In Doom, the same player inputs will produce the same motions, no matter what the framerate is.
Click to expand...
-John Carmack

I'd say that makes it more than a rumor.

http://pc.ign.com/articles/456/456054p1.html?fromint=1
 
To me, that doesn't mean the actual frame rate is going to be capped. That is just saying that they have implemented a way to stop frame rate cheating like what happened in quake 3. Just look at the final version that [H] and iD used in the benchmarks. That is higher than 60fps. For game benchies and reviews, i trust kyle and [H].
 
botreaper10 said:
To me, that doesn't mean the actual frame rate is going to be capped. That is just saying that they have implemented a way to stop frame rate cheating like what happened in quake 3. Just look at the final version that [H] and iD used in the benchmarks. That is higher than 60fps. For game benchies and reviews, i trust kyle and [H].
Click to expand...

Here's my question. So I can't move faster than 60fps...but can I LOOK faster than 60fps??? Like whip around real fast and look the opposite direction and actually make use of something about 60fps?
 
I am not saying that anything above 60fps will be beneficial to the gameplay. I am just saying the vid card can render at its maximum level and not be limited by the engine. Yeah you could whip around real fast, but the only thing it would do is render the screens smoothly. It wouldn't make you actually turn around faster and that is my point. The card will render the game to its best ability. I doubt they are going to cap the actual fps at 60. Why would they? If you can stop the cheating, which this is meant to do, without hurting the gameplay and/or rendering, why not?
 
No. What it means is, if you get 120 FPS, you will get 120 FPS, but it will be 60FPS each rendered twice.
 
^eMpTy^ said:
I do not work for ATi.

<logic>
ATi is good at anistropic filtering and fsaa without losing much speed.
Click to expand...

Actually, the 6800's have higher performance Anti Aliasing and support alot more modes then the X800's do. If you run 1600x1200 with just 4xAA enabled, the 6800u will win every time.

ATI uses alot of Brilinear optimizations for their anisotropic filtering in order to minimalize the performance hit.

I'm curious as to how nVidia's anistropic filtering works compared to ATI's and how its performed on the hardware. I guess i'm gonna have to go try and find some info on it.

ATI also says they have gamma corrected AA which they dont. Its gamma adjusted and set to gamma 2.2.

nVidia also has gamma adjusted AA on their 6800's but it wasn't enabled yet a month or two ago. I'm curious as to if its enabled in the more recent drivers.

You can see the AA + AF performance of the 6800, 6800GT, and 6800u as it scales higher in this review here:

http://www.hexus.net/content/reviews/review.php?dXJsX3Jldmlld19JRD04MDQmdXJsX3BhZ2U9NQ==
 
Cannibal Corpse said:
It was very obvious.

I bet ATi is going to strike back (with a vengeance) with Half Life 2 beating nVIDIA's 6800GT and Ultra.


This is SO interesting to say the least! ;)
Click to expand...

Betting is not a logical corse of action. As it stands ...

Nvida - 1
ATi - 0

Until HL2 comes out and we see benchmarks... the score remains that way. :p
 
botreaper10 said:
I am not saying that anything above 60fps will be beneficial to the gameplay. I am just saying the vid card can render at its maximum level and not be limited by the engine. Yeah you could whip around real fast, but the only thing it would do is render the screens smoothly. It wouldn't make you actually turn around faster and that is my point. The card will render the game to its best ability. I doubt they are going to cap the actual fps at 60. Why would they? If you can stop the cheating, which this is meant to do, without hurting the gameplay and/or rendering, why not?
Click to expand...

I agree with you here. People hear "capped" and they think it's like vsync or something...which it is not...I don't think this is really a big deal at all, in fact I think this is the way most games actually work...
 
theNoid said:
Betting is not a logical corse of action. As it stands ...

Nvida - 1
ATi - 0

Until HL2 comes out and we see benchmarks... the score remains that way. :p
Click to expand...

What I really what to point out in this thread is that there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to believe that HL2 will run any better on ATi vs Nvidia. In fact, if driver releases keep going they way they are going for Nvidia it might end up leading ATi in HL2. We don't really know, and it doesn't really matter, but one thing you can say for sure is that HL2 will NOT counter the loss ATi suffered in Doom3.
 
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