Doom III - The Bottom Line.

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heyheyhey

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ok, heres the deal. i want to know the absolute best card that will run d3 the fastest/best with all the eye candy on. i know that it will be strong on ogl, and since nvidia cards run ogl better, i was thinking the 5950, but im starting to see some 9800xt ogl tests, and theyre putting up some nice numbers, but i havent seen many 5950 tests. please provide links to articles if available. :)
 

Scalpel

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For best results buy the most expensive card in the store on the same day you buy Doom III. :rolleyes:

Seriously though, there's no way of knowing the answer to your question until the game is out. We don't have a benchmarkable demo, there's probably going to be another chip coming out from both nVidia and ATi before the game ships, and almost assuredly there will be newer drivers from both companies before then. All of those things affect the answer to your question.

I'm sure that as soon as Doom III hits the shelves Kyle or some other good site will have a review that details (among other things) which card runs the game best. I'd hold tight until then, or just buy the best card you can afford today and assume it'll run Doom III okay when it ships.
 

ST|FFY

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i dont know the exact anwser to this question but i do know that most of ATI's cards handle eye candy much better than those of Nvidia

i would suggest.....9800XT 256Mb?
 

DocFaustus

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The absolute worst thing you could do is buying a card for a game that does not exist yet. Doing so rips yourself off in terms of performance AND money.

Nobody really knows what the system requirements will be until they say. But, the way you have worded the question, it is almost like you can drop Doom III out of the equation and say "What is the best openGL card out right now?"

Do like Scalpel and wait for it to hit the shelves.
 

f00t

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just wait for it to be released. with all these delays the 9800xt/ 5950 will probably be obsolete by the time it is available. lol
 

Jared701

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they already have doom 3 on preorder at best buy. go there and pick up a box to see the minimum requirements. for now id say 9800 xt
 

Badger_sly

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There is no bottom line, the games not out, and previous tests don't mean squat because it was unfinished code being tested.

Buy the game, then a card (likely nVidia).
 

dderidex

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Course, that's assuming you can wait that long.

What if he had a top-end gaming card that just died?

Or, an older card he tried to play KotOR on, and it sucked and he wants a replacement now - to play this game - but one that will last a while?

There are a lot of reasons someone would need to pick *their* 'Doom 3 card' from the cards currently available. That's why benchmarks like 3dMark03 have been handy in the past - because some people do HAVE to buy cards *right now* to play games that won't be out for years, and a forward-looking test is needed. That the relative scores on 3dMark03's release have been validated in DX since then proves its worth.

That said....

I am not aware of any such test for OGL games (a really forward looking test), so it's hard to say. nVidia's OGL drivers have traditionally been stronger than ATI's....OTOH, Doom3 is mostly DX7-level effects with PS3.0 effects added in....which nVidia's cards suck at.

It's just really, really hard to say on this.
 

CrimandEvil

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If you need a card now then a 9800XT would be the best but it's stupid to buy a video card for a game that hasn't even been released yet. Your best bet would be to buy a card the day the game comes out.
 

Scalpel

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Originally posted by dderidex
...There are a lot of reasons someone would need to pick *their* 'Doom 3 card' from the cards currently available...

Hell, I totally agree with you. I just bought my video card and processor this month, so I'm not claiming that everyone should wait until the game ships. Sometimes upgrading won't wait.

...That's why benchmarks like 3dMark03 have been handy in the past - because some people do HAVE to buy cards *right now* to play games that won't be out for years, and a forward-looking test is needed. That the relative scores on 3dMark03's release have been validated in DX since then proves its worth.

After reading Kyle's horror stories about 3DMark I'm hesitant to use it for anything, and certainly not to compare cards. A better bet in my mind is to buy a current game and crank the details up really high. If the game runs fine, the future games six months down the road should probably run fine with slightly scaled back settings.
 

obs

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Well unless you want to rely on over year old benchmark numbers put out by a video card maker, wait until the game is out. People never cease to amaze me.
 

heyheyhey

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dderidex is right. im putting together a shuttle system in the next week/weeks, and am buying a card within the week, and i cant justify buying a $300 card now, then in 4-5 months, laying own another $3-400 for a new card. otherwise, im stuck on this dell for another 5 months waiting for d3. so, i was hoping not to get a plethora of "you cant buy a card for a game thats not out," but aye, i did, and i can. lets reword the question a little :

what card is the absolute best OGL card out *today*?
 

LabRat

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Originally posted by heyheyhey
...

what card is the absolute best OGL card out *today*?

GF FX 5950. But the difference between it and the 9800XT is rather small and IIRC flips when high AA/AF is used. I suggest you read this review carefully (I can't beleive I'm linking to Tom's, but it IS a good comprehensive review).

http://www6.tomshardware.com/graphic/20031229/index.html

BTW, my suggestion for a great card that will likely have no problem with ANYTHING that comes out this year is the 9800XT. The 5950 is suspect in some areas; if you want nVidia, buy a "cheap" (5900non-ultra for $170) card for now and wait for the nv40 to blow your wad.
 

CrimandEvil

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Well the best OpenGL card would probably be 5950 Ultra but for better performance in other games you should get a 9800XT. But you could get a 9600XT (about $160 USD) and then wait for the NV40/ R420 stuff to come out in the next few months, that would probably be the best thing to do.
 

heyheyhey

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Originally posted by CrimandEvil
Well the best OpenGL card would probably be 5950 Ultra but for better performance in other games you should get a 9800XT. But you could get a 9600XT (about $160 USD) and then wait for the NV40/ R420 stuff to come out in the next few months, that would probably be the best thing to do.

im not made of money here dude.

i was always under the impresion that nvidia blew ati out of the water when it came to ogl... guess ive been out of it for a while. looks like i'll have a 9800xt heading my way soon (they can run on a shuttle 200w psu, right?)
 

Mikey20

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You can't go wrong with a 9800pro or 9800xt for max results on d3 and hl2. Now if you want to save money and just get the minimum card needed to run d3 then i would wait till the game is out. Because it could be a geforce3 and then you went out and bought a fx5950 but then again it wouldn't hurt to get one of the high end cards out today...because you will be running at max eye candy...soo my answer would be either one of these cards.

1. fx5900nu
2. 9800pro
3. 9800xt

maybe even a 9700pro but i have more confidence on a 9800pro
 

DocFaustus

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Originally posted by dderidex
1) Course, that's assuming you can wait that long.

2) What if he had a top-end gaming card that just died?

3) Or, an older card he tried to play KotOR on, and it sucked and he wants a replacement now - to play this game - but one that will last a while?

<SNIP>

1) If he cannot wait that long then he is NOT buying the card for Doom III. He is buying it to statisfy a need now, not one some unknown months down the road.

2) Then he should replace it with another top-end gaming card. Again he is buying it for another reason other than Doom III. He can try to take D3 into consiteration, but without a crystal ball, nobody really knows. Best suggestion is buy whatever card is strong opengl right now hope it can hold up.

3) Then he is buying it to make a CURRENT game run better. See above answers and add the following: The only thing somone could tell him right now is buy the best you can if you HAD to buy right now. If you don't have to buy right now, then there is still NO good reason to buy a video card for a game that is not out right now. If he waits, then cards out today that can handle it will be cheaper. If being thrifty isn't a concern, then if he waits, new cards out will be more powerful.

There is still no good reason to buy a card for a game that is not out.
 

Ponder

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Well assuming that buying a card today is a requirement...aim for a 200 dollar card today and save the difference for a card in the future. Ati 9700 pro, 9800np or 9800 pro(229)...If you research and find nvidia does well in the games you play 5900 nu.
 

heyheyhey

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guys, ok, here. i dont just *pull* 200-300 dollars out of the blue. im getting about 30 a week right now, k? i cant afford to plop down $200 now, then another $200 in a few months, its not gonna work. WHAT i want is a card that *based on what we KNOW* will run it the best.
 

HRslammR

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eh just go buy doom 3 and run it with whatever ya got now. enjoy it then go back and see what makes it run the bestest.

just save up for a few more weeks then get a 9800 pro when the next generation comes out. they'll have a drop in price and they're easily top 3 cards even with the newest generation.
 

heyheyhey

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Originally posted by HRslammR
eh just go buy doom 3 and run it with whatever ya got now. enjoy it then go back and see what makes it run the bestest.

*hugs his 9800 pro*


im seriously doubting that intel extreme 2 graphics will run d3.. hell, it barely runs counter strike...
 

Mikey20

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Then save $200 until you can afford a worthy card don't go off buying something with only $150-$170 that is a very bad place to stop. Best card like everyone here said already 9800pro and higher if you want nVidia go for 5900nu $175 don't get something lesser than a 9700pro. If you get $30 a week you going to have to be patient and save up until you have at least $200 to work with for a video card.
 

heyheyhey

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omfg.

ok guys its not that fucking hard. please point me to where i said "im broke and only have $175 to spend on a card." i have ~350 now to spend on a card to get it up and going. i just wanna know whats the best card out today that will run d3 based on what we know. geeez.
 

Scalpel

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From what I've heard around here, a Radeon 9800 Pro will overclock to speeds close to or matching the 9800XT, which is considered the current top-of-the-line videocard by many people. It'll run you about $230 at current prices.

If that's too expensive, try the 9600 XT. It's still a decent card, and being an XT it'll come with a coupon for a free copy of Half Life 2 when it releases, which makes for a nice little bonus.
 

HRslammR

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best card that will run doom 3 (and anything else you throw at it) today.

9800pro hands down. say what you will about the 9800xt but you can just about push every 9800pro to XT speeds.


and it'll probably be at least 3rd or 4th still even when the "next generation" comes out.
 

dderidex

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There is still no good reason to buy a card for a game that is not out.

Maybe for YOU.

But there are a lot of people who can only AFFORD to buy a major system upgrade every 2 years.

That means, if they have to buy a card NOW to play games out RIGHT NOW, it must ALSO be a card to play Doom3.

It is *entirely possible* someone could find themselves in a sitation they must buy a card NOW *FOR* Doom3 - and that they are buying it now to play current games doesn't mean it is any less their 'Doom 3 card'.

Unless, of course, you live in some strange world where the only thing people do with PCs is hit 'refresh' on ID's page waiting for Doom3's release until they can play it....then, finish the game and throw their computer away.
============
In any case, to answer a previous posters question...yeah, a 9800 CAN run on a Shuttle's 200W power supply....but I wouldn't want to. I wouldn't count very highly on the resulting stability - this will NOT be a 24/7 machine, and if you plan on running stressing games for 8 hours or more, expect a few crashes.

For such a small power supply, you might want to consider the 9600 XT. They can be had in the ~$150 price range, and have MUCH lower power requirements.
 

LabRat

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Originally posted by heyheyhey
omfg.

ok guys its not that fucking hard. please point me to where i said "im broke and only have $175 to spend on a card." i have ~350 now to spend on a card to get it up and going. i just wanna know whats the best card out today that will run d3 based on what we know. geeez.

OK, with $350 you can almost afford a 9800xt, but I would suggest the OEM 9800pro 128mb (256mb if you want to spend $100 more for ~10% gain) mentioned MULTIPLE TIMES ALREADY. It will have no problems with D3, based on what I currently know*.



*jack shit


I'm trying to help, but you sure are not making it easy. Please re-read my prior post.
 

theNoid

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Ill put it this way.. I've played a demo of DIII, and my 9500pro played everything on high just perfectly :). No game in the next year or 2 atleast will even push the 5950 or 9800pro/xt. nuff said. Dont' believe every review you read ... just make sure anything you buy is 8 pixel pipelines and you'll be fine.

happy hunting.
 

heyheyhey

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Originally posted by dderidex
Maybe for YOU.

But there are a lot of people who can only AFFORD to buy a major system upgrade every 2 years.

That means, if they have to buy a card NOW to play games out RIGHT NOW, it must ALSO be a card to play Doom3.

It is *entirely possible* someone could find themselves in a sitation they must buy a card NOW *FOR* Doom3 - and that they are buying it now to play current games doesn't mean it is any less their 'Doom 3 card'.

Unless, of course, you live in some strange world where the only thing people do with PCs is hit 'refresh' on ID's page waiting for Doom3's release until they can play it....then, finish the game and throw their computer away.
============
In any case, to answer a previous posters question...yeah, a 9800 CAN run on a Shuttle's 200W power supply....but I wouldn't want to. I wouldn't count very highly on the resulting stability - this will NOT be a 24/7 machine, and if you plan on running stressing games for 8 hours or more, expect a few crashes.

For such a small power supply, you might want to consider the 9600 XT. They can be had in the ~$150 price range, and have MUCH lower power requirements.


thank you god for the first intelligent person to grace my thread.

is the 9600xt 8 pipes? i may go with a 5900nu if not, since its cheaper, and oc's higher.
 

dderidex

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No, it's not.

BUT....the 5900 has fairly higher power requirements.

A good way to get a feel for it is the need of an external power adapter. If it has one, it probably needs too much power for a 200W PSU.

(Now, I KNOW some people are going to post arguments on this, but just look at the forums! You'll get a bunch of people posting in a thread "Oh, I don't know what you are talking about, I have a 9800XT overclocked to the MAX and it works just FINE with a 200W PSU!!". Then, you go two threads over and the same person is trying to track down system instability they just can't seem to identify. Trust me, if a card lists a 350W PSU as a *requirement*, you may rest assured it ACTUALLY NEEDS THAT.)
 

Ponder

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>>
guys, ok, here. i dont just *pull* 200-300 dollars out of the blue. im getting about 30 a week right now, k? i cant afford to plop down $200 now, then another $200 in a few months, its not gonna work. WHAT i want is a card that *based on what we KNOW* will run it the best.
<<

Goodness...

Seriously you misread about everything. I think it is time to take a step back. You started off wanting 5950s or 9800Xts...Simply save the difference.(later stated to be 350) 350-200/230=150-120 left to save for a card in 12-18 months+ Of course a faster video card is going to be faster...the question is how to get the best value.

9800XT is faster then a 9800 pro, but the difference is pretty slim. At this point it is better to hedge and save a good portion of a new video card should the need arise. In 12-18+ months should the nv40 or r420/r423 set the world on fire you will have the option to upgrade.

As to Nvidia versus Ati for doom3...I would not stress about it. Considering the developer both should handle Doom3 with ease.
 

Scalpel

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Originally posted by heyheyhey
thank you god for the first intelligent person to grace my thread.

You're a charming fellow aren't you? I'm sorry the rest of us were such #@&%ing idiots and provided no help.

Based on that, I take back my stupid suggestion to get a 9800 Pro. Get a Parhelia. I heard they r0x0r.

:rolleyes:
 

heyheyhey

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Originally posted by Scalpel
You're a charming fellow aren't you? I'm sorry the rest of us were such #@&%ing idiots and provided no help.

Based on that, I take back my stupid suggestion to get a 9800 Pro. Get a Parhelia. I heard they r0x0r.

:rolleyes:
i will.
 
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