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Dominator Pro 437 Performance Update

D

DNA

Weaksauce
Joined
Aug 7, 2004
Messages
109
System Configuration:
Lian Li PC75B Case
(2) Rear Fan, Panaflo 80MM, 40CFM – pull configuration
(1) Rear Fan, Delta 120MM, 152CFM - pull configuration
(1) Floor Fan, Evercool 120MM, 80CFM - pull configuration
(2) Front Fan, Panaflo 80MM, 40CFM – pull configuration
AMD 64 3000 Processor – OCed to 2.25G, FSB @ 250Mhz, Vcore @ 1.41V, ~86W
Abit Fatal1ty AN8 Motherboard w/uGuru Clock
(2) Crucial Ballistix PC3200 256MB
(2) Hitachi SATA II 80G HDD (RAID 0)
(1) Hitachi SATA II 80G HDD (Backup)
Abit RX300SE Video Card
Lite-On DVDRW Model 1673S
LS-120 Floppy Disk Drive
Antec Neopower 480W Power Supply
Dominator Pro 437W TEC CPU Water Block
Lian Li Expansion Drive Bay Grill - Mean Well Exhaust Vent
Swiftech Pump Relay, Version II - Mean Well Power Control
Mean Well S-600-24 Power Supply - 5 1/4-in bay-mount
(2) Aqua Computer Airplex Evo 240 Fan Grill
(2) Black Ice Extreme II Radiator – internally top-mounted
(4) Sanyo Denki 120MM,102 CFM Fan – pull configuration @ 12V
Mean Well SD-50A-12 DC-DC Converter
(2) AquaXtreme 50Z-DC12 Pump @ 14.0V
Dual 3 ½-in. Bay Reservoir
Masterkleer General Purpose Clear PVC Tubing 7/16-in. ID, 3/16-in Wall
Crystalfontz Model 634 4-Line LCD
Water Temperature Metal Probe/LCD - (+/- 1C accuracy)
*Cold Plate Temperature Metal Probe/LCD - (+/- 1C accuracy)
Digital LED Volt & Amp Meter w/Shunt - internally mounted monitoring TEC PS output

Low CPU core power results are as follows:
TEC PS Output = 20.0V @ 24.8A
Idle/Load Temps - Load temps taken after running CPU Burn-In for 15 minutes
Room Temp (C) = 20.8/20.8
Water Temp (C) = 29.6/29.9
Cold Plate Temp (C) = -24.7/-21.5
CPU Temp (C) = 0/3 per BIOS - BIOS will not report temp < 0C

Best estimate is BIOS reports CPU temp 12C higher than actual.

* Probe embedded in cold plate. Probe tip located over CPU center area.
 
temps still looking pretty decent.

are you aware of any reasons that your first pelt might have died so quickly?

is the pelt pre-installed on that unit, or do you have to put it in yourself?

please tell me more about you system in general. i also run with pelts, and would like to discuss them.

the ongoing chiller discussion is pretty silly in many ways, but the problems that i see with it are things that the OP should already be aware of and is either choosing to ignore, or doesn't believe the performance curves.
 
DFI Daishi said:
temps still looking pretty decent.

are you aware of any reasons that your first pelt might have died so quickly?

is the pelt pre-installed on that unit, or do you have to put it in yourself?

please tell me more about you system in general. i also run with pelts, and would like to discuss them.

the ongoing chiller discussion is pretty silly in many ways, but the problems that i see with it are things that the OP should already be aware of and is either choosing to ignore, or doesn't believe the performance curves.
Click to expand...

It was'nt an intentional overvoltage condition on my part. My guess, infant mortality, but I can't rule out an output regulation problem with the Mean Well. If the later is the case, I should loose another peltier. What are your thoughts as to the cause of the failure?

I originally purchased the DP 437 new as a complete assembly. I had to replace the peltier due to this recent failure.

Sure, what might you be interested in knowing about the system that was'nt noted in my "System Configuration"? It's all new hardware and I purchased it with plans of running a max OCed FX 57. The cooling system/PS are mounted within the case, no getto job here. I spent a ton of money on it, so much that I am considering getting myself some professional counseling.
 
given that you are listing it as being a bit under-volted, i didn't think that it was over-volting.

the most nerve-wracking opperation for me every time that i strip apart and re-assemble my system is tightening down the cold plate. i am always afraid of crushing some of the modules within the peltier. the way that it creaks and squeals as soon as i put some torque on the retention bolts...............but i need to tighten things down at least enough to hold the peltier in place. i kind of wonder if wintsch might have over-tightened a bit.

the other thing that i notice is that you are under-volting that peltier by a fair margin. perhaps too much. the pelt has a max rating of 26.7 volts. the pelt has a sustainable voltage of 24 volts. for best lifespan, the rule of thumb that i have been taught is not to go over 80% of max voltage, and don't go below 75% of maximum. you are right at the bottom of that range, maybe you should take it up to a bit higher than 21 volts.

have you peeled back the pot on your dead pelt to have a look and see if anything is visably charred or if one of the leads has become disconnected from its terminal?
 
DFI Daishi said:
given that you are listing it as being a bit under-volted, i didn't think that it was over-volting.

the most nerve-wracking opperation for me every time that i strip apart and re-assemble my system is tightening down the cold plate. i am always afraid of crushing some of the modules within the peltier. the way that it creaks and squeals as soon as i put some torque on the retention bolts...............but i need to tighten things down at least enough to hold the peltier in place. i kind of wonder if wintsch might have over-tightened a bit.

the other thing that i notice is that you are under-volting that peltier by a fair margin. perhaps too much. the pelt has a max rating of 26.7 volts. the pelt has a sustainable voltage of 24 volts. for best lifespan, the rule of thumb that i have been taught is not to go over 80% of max voltage, and don't go below 75% of maximum. you are right at the bottom of that range, maybe you should take it up to a bit higher than 21 volts.

have you peeled back the pot on your dead pelt to have a look and see if anything is visably charred or if one of the leads has become disconnected from its terminal?
Click to expand...

When I removed the failed unit, it did not take must force to break the screws loose but then that is subjective. When I installed the new unit I just tried to duplicate the force for lack of a spec and torque gauge.

I'll take your advise and increase the voltage to 21.3 if there is no negative impact on cold plate temp.

No, I did not inspect the failed unit other than measure its resistance which read ~1.2K. The first thing I did when I unpackaged the DP was to carefully form and strain relief the peltier wires. The leads were formed on a 90 degree bend ~ 3/8-in from their entrance point on the peltier body. I installed a 50A zero-loss connector on the wire ends. I used #13 straned wire and soldered all connections between the female zero-loss connector and the supply output/ampmeter shunt. The failed peltier was returned to Wintsch Labs as they agreed to supply me with a new peltier on a no-charge basis.

I'd be interested in any technique you've used to find the performance sweet spot of a peltier. This is a new adventure for me.
 
no real tips about getting the best performance other than varying you voltages a little bit at a time and seeing what happens, and keeping your coolant below 40C.

right now it it my rad holding me back the most, so no matter what i do with my pelts, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference. i had kind of hoped to work on that with an additional 120mm rad/fan and a swiftech radbox on the back of my case, but events this weekend make that rather unlikely. :(

so long as your rads and fans can keep your coolant temps down close to where they are now, the added voltage on the pelts is unlikely to adversly affect your cold side temps, and might improve them.

to elaborate a bit regarding my rad: running my two panaflo U1A fans at full power keeps my coolant temps at about 40C under load. adding a second set of similar fans with similar output, in push-pull config drops my coolant temps by about 5C and my coldside temps by about 10C. all four fans together are too loud for me, though, hence the desire for an additional rad and fan.

if the added voltage on your pelts does not take you coolant up above 33C or so, then go for it. a few degrees differences in coolant temps are not as extreme at temps below 34-35C as they are above. you dual rads should keep things down there without too much difficulty.
 
DFI Daishi said:
no real tips about getting the best performance other than varying you voltages a little bit at a time and seeing what happens, and keeping your coolant below 40C.

right now it it my rad holding me back the most, so no matter what i do with my pelts, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference. i had kind of hoped to work on that with an additional 120mm rad/fan and a swiftech radbox on the back of my case, but events this weekend make that rather unlikely. :(

so long as your rads and fans can keep your coolant temps down close to where they are now, the added voltage on the pelts is unlikely to adversly affect your cold side temps, and might improve them.

to elaborate a bit regarding my rad: running my two panaflo U1A fans at full power keeps my coolant temps at about 40C under load. adding a second set of similar fans with similar output, in push-pull config drops my coolant temps by about 5C and my coldside temps by about 10C. all four fans together are too loud for me, though, hence the desire for an additional rad and fan.

if the added voltage on your pelts does not take you coolant up above 33C or so, then go for it. a few degrees differences in coolant temps are not as extreme at temps below 34-35C as they are above. you dual rads should keep things down there without too much difficulty.
Click to expand...

Just curious, were is the warm part of the great white north?

Have you already purchased a 120mm radiator? The reason I ask is that I have a new BIX that I never used.
 
DNA said:
Just curious, were is the warm part of the great white north?

Have you already purchased a 120mm radiator? The reason I ask is that I have a new BIX that I never used.
Click to expand...
the great white north = canada
the warm part = southern ontario (residents of BC have warmer weather, but due to the ridiculous amount of rain they get, i usually call BC the damp part) :)

as for the rad that you have, i would be very interested in purchasing it if you also happen to live in canada, however given my experiences with shipments from the US, i don't think that i will purchase your rad if you live in america.
 
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