DIY versus pre-built

[ssp23]

I am ready to build my first water cooled rig. I've been reading up on the Tt tai-chi and Koolance pre-built cases. I know most people here will say go custom for better results, but my question is how much better are the results? I know the hardcore will talk in terms of fractions of a percentage, but if you look at the big picture how much does it really matter? Are we talking a half a degree or is it much more?

I have 2 goals in mind. A quieter system and a moderate to good OC. I have a E6600 that I would like to take to 3.6Ghz if possible. I'm not really into customizing my case for looks so much. I know these cases are $$$, but if you take price out of the equation, do they get the job done?

 

[w1retap]

heh.. you can take the e6600 to like 3GHz on air cooling..

 

[ssp23]

heh.. you can take the e6600 to like 3GHz on air cooling..

oops, yeah I meant 3.6

 

[Kuyt]

No question, DIY > Pre-Built, obviously.

Koolance may look good, but are vehemently overpriced and perform no better or even worse than a customized loop worth around $150.

 

[ssp23]

No question, DIY > Pre-Built, obviously.

Koolance may look good, but are vehemently overpriced and perform no better or even worse than a customized loop worth around $150.

Right. I understand that DIY > pre-built, but I'm asking how much better? I'm sure there are a lot of factors, but what order of magnitude are we talking here? 1 degree, 10 degrees? I'm not necessarily trying to push my system as far as it can go. I have a goal in mind (at least for the sake of this argument).
If I can reach my OC goal and run at 37 degrees under load with a pre-built, then does it matter if I can run the same system at 33 degrees with a DIY? These numbers are made up of course as I have to experience with WC and don't know what to expect

 

[Arcygenical]

Most Koolance systems won't get you better temperatures than a Tuniq. So, a 3.5ghz clockspeed... expect temperatures in the high 50's, low 60s.

A good water loop will get you in the high 40s to low 50s. So a 10'c drop is fairly reasonable.

 

[ziddey]

My setup is DIY and pretty "decent" in terms of parts. The coolrad 22t is about on par with the swiftech mcr220, which is the next best thing to the all hailed thermalchills. I've got an apogee block, and am waiting to purchase a thicker o-ring for it. But as it is right now, even my system (which is loads better than your average tt or koolance) is feeling the heat (literally) with an e6400 that I'm trying to push to 3.6 with ~1.45v under load, and a 7900gs that I took from stock 450 core to 720. I'm thinking adding a 120mm bip (low end, but fairly effective radiator) into my loop will bring it somewhere closer to where I want it to be. But even then, to give a reference to your question, what I have (although I can't quantify a number) is loads better than most any kooland / tt you can get.

I have to say though, when I went water, one of the big reasons was also to hit the big "3.6".

However, I've found (well, I knew all along, but I wasn't willing to face facts for what they were but rather wanted to see it for myself) that it does still take a bit of a "lucky" core2 to hit 3.6. It's easier with e6600+ I suppose, but with 2 e6400's I've had, I come real close to 3.6, but am only 98% stable. I'm still thinking I might be able to get all the way there with a better motherboard / better psu / thicker o-ring for better cooling, since I'm so so so close to being stable.

With that said, if you're looking for 3.6, there's a good chance you'll be disappointed with watercooling. My advice would be to get a moderate to decent air cooler and see how close you can get to 3.6. If you can do real close, or right on the dime, and stably, but with unsatisfactory temperatures, then by all means go water. But if you're not really hitting that close to 3.6, and you're finding it's taking a disproportionate amount of voltage to scale the last few mhz to get there, there's a fair chance water won't help you over that final wall.

edit: Sorry if this isn't what you want to hear. It for sure wasn't what I wanted to hear, and I knew I had to find out for myself. And sure enough, I'm not there either *yet*. But water has been something I've wanted to do for 4+ years, and what I have should hopefully last me a while (at least bits and pieces).

What I did learn is that the experiences people are right when they say, if you want to do it, do it right the first time. Sure, my radiator is "second best", but even that isn't good enough, and now I'm "stuck" with bandaid solutions of tacking on an auxilliary 120mm to add some performance. It's the little things like that that kill you in the long run. Although, that is what keeps most of us here interested in the whole scene... constantly upgrading and tweaking, and never being satisfied. Guess I was trying to stay out of that black hole (for money reasons... I have none...), but I got sucked in regardless.

Hope this helps


edit2: If you're considering a prebuilt kit, just spend a few days here and on xtreme and do a little reading and research. Then venture into building your own setup. Not only will it perform better, be about the same price (depending on how you set it up), you'll feel so much better about it. Just a much more satisfying feeling.

 

[MrWizard6600]

yeah as stated above, i (really) cant afford my "schedualed" liquid cooling rig right now but, I've decided FYI over pre built, espicially over TT prebuilt.

TT is known for its quality, or rather lack there of. On the site, fans boast huge ammounts of CFM, at wisper quiet noises, but they're always far from it. The PSUs are constantly failing tests by PSU reviewers, with heavy crossloads and huge V-droops, So bad so as to make [H]ard|Forum's own "PSUs to Avoid" list. The cases are sometimes half bad, sometimes poor. While they can be feature rich, I have found that they are often excessivly expensive. You would think something with as much aluminum as the Thermaltake shark would provide some noise reduction, but no.

And as for the part that concerns you: the blocks, I have only ever heard of two water blocks bursting, take a guess as to which name they bore. The Cheap acyrilic does not expand at the same rate as the copper below it, causing the screws to bend, and buckle, until either the plastic cracks, or the screw loses a thread, and water gets through the seal.

So, would I, as a heavy liquid cooling reader (but never actually used a liquid cooling setup myself) recomend a TT liquid cooling product? Never.

If you are really worried about installing your own liquid cooling loop, you can get one of these, an Antec P180 modded to have a swiftec loop (w/ 240Rad, CPU block, and the high powered pump). The only downside is, there expensive, and doesnt come with a VGA cooler its self, meaning you'd have to install one.

 

[Arcygenical]

WC will not help you clock any higher, as was stated, if your chip simply can't do it.

On the other hand, it will get you a much quieter and cooler setup.