Just wanted to share: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDacjrSCeq4&feature=player_embedded#at=81
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Disk Vibration is a serious issue
- Thread starter hotzen
- Start date
Red Squirrel
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Seen that, quite interesting.
I actually witnessed an issue like this at home. Installed a hard drive in a small SuperMicro (it screws right to the chassis) and added a 9000 RPM fan on the chassis.
It took me long to figure out why the drive randomly dropped completly out of the system. When screwed in, it did not work, when I just left it hanging after testing it fine in another system, it worked, when I screwed it back in, it did not. At one point I was actually rebooting the system while screwing it. The SECOND the screw was tight, the boot process would halt.
Never put a 9000 RPM fan near a hard drive.
This has me thinking, is vibration an issue in those big Norco cases where you have like 24 hard drives? I know enterprise drives are designed for this, but what about with consumer drives?
I actually witnessed an issue like this at home. Installed a hard drive in a small SuperMicro (it screws right to the chassis) and added a 9000 RPM fan on the chassis.
It took me long to figure out why the drive randomly dropped completly out of the system. When screwed in, it did not work, when I just left it hanging after testing it fine in another system, it worked, when I screwed it back in, it did not. At one point I was actually rebooting the system while screwing it. The SECOND the screw was tight, the boot process would halt.
Never put a 9000 RPM fan near a hard drive.
This has me thinking, is vibration an issue in those big Norco cases where you have like 24 hard drives? I know enterprise drives are designed for this, but what about with consumer drives?
phalantice
n00b
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they arent end of story. some situations can survive desktop drives but i bet after about 8-10 drives your pushing your luck with vibration. you may be able to get away with more by adding a rubber pad between the drive and cady but thats just a workaround. I did see some wd? sas drives i think that were 2.5 drives with a casing that made them the size of 3.5 just looking at them i suspect that was to help control vibration. thats also why the drive cages for ent cases are about 1/3 the weight of the case...
Red Squirrel
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That might explain my issues with my main server, when I had added more drives they all started showing signs of failure.
Kinda sucks, as it twarts my plans to build a SAN with one of those norco cases, and no way do I want to pay 100's of dollars for 100GB drives when I can get 2TB ones for about $100. I guess I may need to build my own case, and have tons of rubber padding or something.
Kinda sucks, as it twarts my plans to build a SAN with one of those norco cases, and no way do I want to pay 100's of dollars for 100GB drives when I can get 2TB ones for about $100. I guess I may need to build my own case, and have tons of rubber padding or something.
I have seen that video before. I actually use Sun's Amber Road unified ZFS based storage systems at work. The Fishworks analytics is *amazing* from a storage managers point of view.
However, I agree vibration to hard disks in operation is a problem I don't think he was showing disk vibration. He was showing loud acoustical vibration from his vocal cords transferred to a high performance SAS or FC disks. Those were probably 15K SAS drives in that storage system. The disks probably included rotational vibration tolerance.
I also would not single out Norco disk chassis either. SuperMicro, while makers of very high quality equipment, don't use any major vibration reducing methods in their disk chassis that I have seen.
Enterprise drives do include rotational vibration tolerance, but they also tend to have higher spindle speeds and operate in high density chassis that include many high speed fans too. If an array chassis of consumer drives start to fail vibration is not something I would investigate as a top cause unless you have a fan out of balance or sit the chassis on your HT subwoofer.
I could be wrong...
phalantic, as for the WD drives - I think you may have seen a 150GB WD SATA Raptor 10K drive. I bought several of those that came in a 2.5 form factor drive in a 3.5 inch chassis. I assumed they made the drives that way for cost purposes. Not sure if they did this for SAS units too.
However, I agree vibration to hard disks in operation is a problem I don't think he was showing disk vibration. He was showing loud acoustical vibration from his vocal cords transferred to a high performance SAS or FC disks. Those were probably 15K SAS drives in that storage system. The disks probably included rotational vibration tolerance.
I also would not single out Norco disk chassis either. SuperMicro, while makers of very high quality equipment, don't use any major vibration reducing methods in their disk chassis that I have seen.
Enterprise drives do include rotational vibration tolerance, but they also tend to have higher spindle speeds and operate in high density chassis that include many high speed fans too. If an array chassis of consumer drives start to fail vibration is not something I would investigate as a top cause unless you have a fan out of balance or sit the chassis on your HT subwoofer.
I could be wrong...
phalantic, as for the WD drives - I think you may have seen a 150GB WD SATA Raptor 10K drive. I bought several of those that came in a 2.5 form factor drive in a 3.5 inch chassis. I assumed they made the drives that way for cost purposes. Not sure if they did this for SAS units too.
koolaidkitten
Gawd
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that is very interesting to know. thanxs for the post.
I have seen that video before. I actually use Sun's Amber Road unified ZFS based storage systems at work. The Fishworks analytics is *amazing* from a storage managers point of view.
Man I so wish that Sun would have tossed Amber Road/Fishworks out for mass consumption before they got swallowed by Oracle. I so want a Sun/Oracle ZFS appliance, but not at the prices they want.
Man I so wish that Sun would have tossed Amber Road/Fishworks out for mass consumption before they got swallowed by Oracle. I so want a Sun/Oracle ZFS appliance, but not at the prices they want.
I am totally with you there! And the kicker is that the Fishworks storage systems are built on top of off the shelf hardware and open source software. So, when I open up the Sun box you see an AMD Operton MB, SAS HBA, ECC RAM and a bunch of SAS disks. Mix that with Solaris/ZFS, place the Sun(Oracle) logo on it and charge people "whatever the marketing department says" prices.
If I could get the GUI and analytics plugged into Nexenta I would be so happy.
I am totally with you there! And the kicker is that the Fishworks storage systems are built on top of off the shelf hardware and open source software. So, when I open up the Sun box you see an AMD Operton MB, SAS HBA, ECC RAM and a bunch of SAS disks. Mix that with Solaris/ZFS, place the Sun(Oracle) logo on it and charge people "whatever the marketing department says" prices.
If I could get the GUI and analytics plugged into Nexenta I would be so happy.
Nexenta is supposedly working for better analytics in 3.1 or 4.0 (not sure which yet).. I've been "running" it since the early 2.0 days, and by "running" it I mean fighting Kerberos/AD issues with their enterprise support dept ...
3.0.3 fixed a LOT of stuff in that regard, but to be fair all that code is from Sun before Oracle closed the doors.