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did i really upgrade?

A

asciibaron

n00b
Joined
Oct 31, 2005
Messages
33
old system:
Asus A7N8X-X
AXP 2800 Barton OC'd to 2.2GHz w/stock HSF
512MB Crucial 133 PC-2100

new system:
Chaintech VNF3 250
S64 2500 Palermo OC'd to 2.0GHz w/stock HSF
also have an A64 2800 ClawHammer OC'd to 2.2GHz w/stock HSF
2x512 Corsair 400 PC-3200

not sure if i really gained any performance increase with the switch to a 64bit system. i tried the A64 2800 OC'd to 2.2GHz and it seemed to be on par with the AXP 2800, but that was running double the RAM. the S64 is a great value, considering i am getting a 40% clock increase, but i don't feel it's performing as well as the AXP 2800 Barton.

the reason for the upgrade was to tinker with 64bit O/S's and to upgrade my wife to a fast system (Celeron 333 right now). she gets the AXP 2800 ;)

here's a quick look at the 2 64bit CPU's:
Palermo vs ClawHammer
90nm vs 130nm
1.4GHz vs 1.8GHz
$60 vs $116
256K vs 512K

maybe i should just return both CPU's and go for something else??? i chose the 754 platform because i have an AGP video card and a limited budget. this is mostly an interim upgrade - i'll go crazy when the M2 is released.

AMD has me so confused, but once i settle on a processor, i'll be happy. even being confused with the AMD, i'm better off than having an Intel.

-da baron
 
To get a decent performance increase over your old system, you have to get out of the Semperon chips. You also need to get more up to date on your motherboard chipset.

So I would go back to the drawing board and reevaluate, try finding some prices on a Socket 939 64 3000+ and an Nforce4 or Nforce4 Ultra motherboard. (doesn't much matter which of those two chipsets, you're going for value here) Look at motherboards from DFI, ASUS, or MSI.
 
Advil said:
To get a decent performance increase over your old system, you have to get out of the Semperon chips. You also need to get more up to date on your motherboard chipset.

So I would go back to the drawing board and reevaluate, try finding some prices on a Socket 939 64 3000+ and an Nforce4 or Nforce4 Ultra motherboard. (doesn't much matter which of those two chipsets, you're going for value here) Look at motherboards from DFI, ASUS, or MSI.
Click to expand...

i have a limited budget for this and therefore need to stay with AGP video. the budget is $250 and going to the nForce4 means a new videocard - money i don't have for this project. i decided the 754 gives me 64bit, AGP video, and is easy on the wallet. i figured i could load up on RAM and OC a slower CPU and at least be where i was with he AXP 2800 Barton. i guess the A64 2800 ClawHammer does that, but i guess i'm feeling some buyer's remorse thinking i could have done better with a different 754 processor.

any suggestions on a 939 based system with an AGP slot?

-da baron
 
Epox 9NDA3J or 9NDA3+, with a venice 3200... i'd much rather have nf3 ultra than via.
 
aye, told ya ye should've stayed with th'A64, ye can overclocke the sempy which'll helpout a lot.
 
running the A64 right now - it's stable at 2250 (250x9) with the other mult at 3x. the temp is 60-61c at load - not much i can do there - maybe back down the clock a tad. the core voltage is 1.52v.

i'm not sure i can really see a difference between the sempy at 2.0GHz and the A64 here at 2.2GHz. can anyone tell me what the difference is, really?

-da baron
 
Elysian said:
200 mhz?
Click to expand...

if it comes down to just a difference of 200MHz for $56 more, i'll save the money and take my wife out to dinner. there has to be more to the difference in Sempron vs. Athlon - less speed and less cache? both are 64bit enabled now.

it's no wonder people think technology is hard to understand, it is!

-da baron
 
What are you using your computer for? If you're not noticing a difference, then just keep the sempron and save some cash for a future upgrade.
 
so, you are really not noticing a difference between the sempron and the claw, even though the claw has twice the cache and and extra 200 mhz?

is this on a fresh install of windows?

i haven't upgraded past my XP-M becuase i just don't need to.. i can do anything i need.. that is becuase i don't play games..

i guess you can run the good old benchmark programs and see how they compare, but really, its the real world difference that matters...

are you saying that the s64 feels slower than the xp? you probably are running a divider with the xp too, since the memory is 2100, and you oc'ed the xp.. have you tried getting the s64 higher than 2ghz?

you could look at this: http://www.cheapguys.com/cgi-bin/qu...PECIALS&keywords=&hits_seen=&page=search.html
but that's a lot more than you originally wanted to spend.. that will give you a 1mb cache and 2.4 ghz stock.. so if you got it up to 2.6 or 2.8 or something, you should be good.. but it costs as much as 3 of the semprons..

i guess if your main goal was to get your wife a good running computer for cheap.. and keep yours the same or better, then you succeeded.. but i think that either new combination should perform better.. twice the memory.. the memory is faster.. the XP system should run a lot worse because of the slower memory and the divider..

what power supply are you using in each system, and hard drives..

finally,, since i am going in circles.. i would return or sell the 2800+ clawhammer.. for $50 more you can get a 3700+ with a 1 mb cache.. but between that and the sempron, i don't know if it is worth 2.5 times the money..

where is eclipse with his post that shows how s754 vs s939 isn't that much of a difference? even though he moved on to 939 and opterons since..
 
scottatwittenberg said:
so, you are really not noticing a difference between the sempron and the claw, even though the claw has twice the cache and and extra 200 mhz?
Click to expand...

i have run every benchmark under the sun and in the end, the A64 is only beating the S64 by a narrow margin - a margin that probably doesn't justify the price difference. the PC3200 is bumped down due to the OC'ing on both processors and i'm using an old drive compared to the new one in the XP box.

i still have no idea what makes an Athlon better than a Sempron beyond the clock and cache differences. for the money, OC'ing the S64 2500 is a great deal - i did get it up to 2.2GHz, but the memory was shaky - if i invested in better memory, that would push the price up and no savings would be realized. if i was in it for bragging rights, i could dump money in RAM and a water cooler and go for 400MHz - not sure when the S64 would go supernova.

with all that said, the A64 runs much hotter than the S64 with stock HSF's, even when only pushed to 2GHz. this and the lack of real world speed is what got me thinking in the first place. if the difference isn't apparent in my real world computing, than i think going with the S64 makes more sense. i can always pickup a faster 754 CPU when they are discontinued :D

thanks for the advice and putting up with my neurosis

-da baron
 
finally some numbers from Prime95 with both processors at roughly 2GHz. both a re stable, but the S64 runs cooler (40 idle, 43 load)

AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 2800+
CPU speed: 2001.48 MHz
CPU features: RDTSC, CMOV, Prefetch, 3DNow!, MMX, SSE, SSE2
L1 cache size: 64 KB
L2 cache size: 512 KB
L1 cache line size: 64 bytes
L2 cache line size: 64 bytes
L1 TLBS: 32
L2 TLBS: 512
Prime95 32-bit version 24.14, RdtscTiming=1
Best time for 512K FFT length: 23.860 ms.
Best time for 640K FFT length: 31.212 ms.
Best time for 768K FFT length: 37.798 ms.
Best time for 896K FFT length: 45.191 ms.
Best time for 1024K FFT length: 50.112 ms.
Best time for 1280K FFT length: 63.684 ms.
Best time for 1536K FFT length: 78.234 ms.
Best time for 1792K FFT length: 94.720 ms.
Best time for 2048K FFT length: 105.690 ms.
Best time for 2560K FFT length: 142.642 ms.
Best time for 3072K FFT length: 174.596 ms.
Best time for 3584K FFT length: 210.974 ms.
Best time for 4096K FFT length: 235.449 ms.
Best time for 58 bit trial factors: 6.059 ms.
Best time for 59 bit trial factors: 6.080 ms.
Best time for 60 bit trial factors: 6.056 ms.
Best time for 61 bit trial factors: 6.077 ms.
Best time for 62 bit trial factors: 10.808 ms.
Best time for 63 bit trial factors: 10.830 ms.
Best time for 64 bit trial factors: 13.974 ms.
Best time for 65 bit trial factors: 13.882 ms.
Best time for 66 bit trial factors: 13.910 ms.
Best time for 67 bit trial factors: 13.876 ms.

AMD Sempron(tm) Processor 2500+
CPU speed: 2012.35 MHz
CPU features: RDTSC, CMOV, Prefetch, 3DNow!, MMX, SSE, SSE2
L1 cache size: 64 KB
L2 cache size: 256 KB
L1 cache line size: 64 bytes
L2 cache line size: 64 bytes
L1 TLBS: 32
L2 TLBS: 512
Prime95 32-bit version 24.14, RdtscTiming=1
Best time for 512K FFT length: 23.378 ms.
Best time for 640K FFT length: 31.110 ms.
Best time for 768K FFT length: 37.732 ms.
Best time for 896K FFT length: 45.305 ms.
Best time for 1024K FFT length: 50.280 ms.
Best time for 1280K FFT length: 63.935 ms.
Best time for 1536K FFT length: 78.275 ms.
Best time for 1792K FFT length: 94.634 ms.
Best time for 2048K FFT length: 105.512 ms.
Best time for 2560K FFT length: 141.186 ms.
Best time for 3072K FFT length: 174.738 ms.
Best time for 3584K FFT length: 211.467 ms.
Best time for 4096K FFT length: 238.478 ms.
Best time for 58 bit trial factors: 5.941 ms.
Best time for 59 bit trial factors: 5.949 ms.
Best time for 60 bit trial factors: 5.944 ms.
Best time for 61 bit trial factors: 5.963 ms.
Best time for 62 bit trial factors: 10.649 ms.
Best time for 63 bit trial factors: 10.695 ms.
Best time for 64 bit trial factors: 13.807 ms.
Best time for 65 bit trial factors: 13.727 ms.
Best time for 66 bit trial factors: 13.722 ms.
Best time for 67 bit trial factors: 13.675 ms.

-da baron
 
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