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Decent, Illuminated, and Subtle Keyboard

P

P4rD0nM3

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jun 5, 2007
Messages
1,544
Hey guys, can any of you suggest a decent, illuminated, and subtle keyboard? Sure I have a DeathAdder mouse replaced my MX 3200 mouse but I couldn't find any better mouse that performs as well as this mouse.

I want something that's not flashy and doesn't scream that I play games at work, lol. I'm looking at that Logitech thin keyboard right now but it's too thin for me. I prefer bulky ones.
 
Bohica69 said:
Microsoft X6

http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/gaming/ProductDetails.aspx?pid=102&active_tab=overview

'nuff said
Click to expand...

I don't think that qualifies as subtle. My choice would be the Deck ICE Legend. No BS multimedia keys on it and the backlight has I think 10 levels of adjustment. Best of all it can be had with Cherry MX Blue or Cherry MX Black key switches.

Mechanical Keyboard > Membrane Keyboard

The only thing that blows about any mechanical keyboard is the price. The keyboard I recommended is expensive to say the least. $149.99 I believe.
 
If not that Logitech, (which is a GREAT keyboard) then the Saitek Eclipse 2 might work for you.
 
Mr. Wolf said:
If not that Logitech, (which is a GREAT keyboard) then the Saitek Eclipse 2 might work for you.
Click to expand...

It is my understanding that Saitek hasn't resolved the issue with the finish coming off the keys. I know Logitech addressed this successfuly however.
 
Razer Lycosa/HP Gaming keyboard is not bad if you like laptop style keys, but its a little overpriced for the quality you get (which is average).

I've tried Logitech G15, Saitek Eclipse 1/2, Razer Tarantula, and DeCK Legend but they all had keys that didn't have much tactile response (no resistance on the threshold of a keystroke), which was a dealbreaker for me (especially the DeCK which was really disappointing considering the price and all the hype)
 
Xeth said:
Razer Lycosa/HP Gaming keyboard is not bad if you like laptop style keys, but its a little overpriced for the quality you get (which is average).

I've tried Logitech G15, Saitek Eclipse 1/2, Razer Tarantula, and DeCK Legend but they all had keys that didn't have much tactile response (no resistance on the threshold of a keystroke), which was a dealbreaker for me (especially the DeCK which was really disappointing considering the price and all the hype)
Click to expand...

Which Deck Legend did you try? The older versions all used the Cherry MX Black switches which are non-tactile, non-clicky. Now they have a version available using the Cherry MX Blue switches which are the tactile and clicky switches similar to that of the IBM Model M's buckling spring switches.
 
Dan_D said:
Best of all it can be had with Cherry MX Blue
Click to expand...

The tactile boards they now sell are using MX white/clear switches which are tactile but not clicky. They are similar to MX browns but with heavier springs, similar to those found in the MX blacks.
 
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sayu said:
The tactile boards they now sell are using MX white/clear switches which are tactile but not clicky. They are similar to MX browns but with heavier springs, similar to those found in the MX blacks.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the correction. I thought they were using the Cherry MX Blue switches.
 
Dan_D said:
Which Deck Legend did you try? The older versions all used the Cherry MX Black switches which are non-tactile, non-clicky. Now they have a version available using the Cherry MX Blue switches which are the tactile and clicky switches similar to that of the IBM Model M's buckling spring switches.
Click to expand...

Must be the older version then, I tried one about 2 years ago.
 
Dan_D said:
It is my understanding that Saitek hasn't resolved the issue with the finish coming off the keys. I know Logitech addressed this successfuly however.
Click to expand...

I had a saitek eclipse 2 since they were released and never had a key wear out (unlike my g15, lasted 30 days), however, I drowned my last on with a full cup of coffee and replaced it...with another eclipse 2.
 
Dan_D said:
It is my understanding that Saitek hasn't resolved the issue with the finish coming off the keys. I know Logitech addressed this successfuly however.
Click to expand...
The first Saitek Eclipse had some problems with its keys/finishes, but the Eclipse 2 has laser etched keys. I've not heard of any problems with the 2. Mine still looks/works great after nearly two years.
 
My Logitech G15 has been good to me. I had a Saitek but several keys stopped working a couple months later. Could be a bad keyboard, but I'm not one to take chances. I'd recommend a Logitech G15 to everyone. I especially love the LCD screen on it.
 
I have had the Saitek Eclipse blue background model for about 2 years now. The "s" has worn considerably, but all the other keys are fine. Keyboard has held up very well overall. Only $38 with free shipping on newegg right now, so I can live with a little "s" rubbing over that period.
 
One vote for the Logitech Illimunated keyboard. Good tactile response (no rubber dome switches), $40 or so with rebate (if still available), classy looking and subtle. Previous keyboard was the Saitek Eclipse V1. The Logitech keyboard look a bit getting used to, but definitely feels better.
 
The Logitech Illuminated IMO is arguably one of the top 5 keyboards available, especially for typists. The key-feel and travel is superb, and the overall typing experience is both clicky and creamy. Clicky in each satisfying keystroke, and creamy in how one's hands seem to be on auto-pilot gliding over the board, burning up the keys. My Das Professional keyboards are collecting dust in the basement. While I haven't tried the newer DiNovo Edge, the older DiNovo (which also has the "PerfectStroke" system) feels mushy and pales in comparison to the Illuminated.
 
CookieFactory said:
The Logitech Illuminated IMO is arguably one of the top 5 keyboards available, especially for typists. The key-feel and travel is superb, and the overall typing experience is both clicky and creamy. Clicky in each satisfying keystroke, and creamy in how one's hands seem to be on auto-pilot gliding over the board, burning up the keys. My Das Professional keyboards are collecting dust in the basement. While I haven't tried the newer DiNovo Edge, the older DiNovo (which also has the "PerfectStroke" system) feels mushy and pales in comparison to the Illuminated.
Click to expand...

Das Keyboard has switches that feel very much like the IBM buckling spring switches. There is no way in hell I'd trade one of those out for any membrane based Logitech.
 
Dan_D said:
Das Keyboard has switches that feel very much like the IBM buckling spring switches. There is no way in hell I'd trade one of those out for any membrane based Logitech.
Click to expand...

I have two DAS Professional keyboards. Both are collecting dust as I vastly prefer the Logitech Illuminated to them.
 
CookieFactory said:
I have two DAS Professional keyboards. Both are collecting dust as I vastly prefer the Logitech Illuminated to them.
Click to expand...

Yeah I saw that in your post. I find it hard to believe. I'd never trade the feel of a good mechanical keyboard for anything else.
 
Have you tried the Logitech Illuminated? The key-feel is crisper and travel is a bit shorter, which results in a much more satisfying typing experience for me. I can easily hit 90+ GWAM with minimal errors on the Illuminated while I can only reliably get 80 or so GWAM on the Das with less accuracy.

I've been using the DAS since purchasing them in February but have recently returned to the Illuminated as the typing experience is just flat out more effortless and satisfying. The Das professional is a nice keyboard no doubt, but right now they are a pair of $120 paperweights for me.
 
CookieFactory said:
Have you tried the Logitech Illuminated? The key-feel is crisper and travel is a bit shorter, which results in a much more satisfying typing experience for me. I can easily hit 90+ GWAM with minimal errors on the Illuminated while I can only reliably get 80 or so GWAM on the Das with less accuracy.

I've been using the DAS since purchasing them in February but have recently returned to the Illuminated as the typing experience is just flat out more effortless and satisfying. The Das professional is a nice keyboard no doubt, but right now they are a pair of $120 paperweights for me.
Click to expand...

No I haven't tried the Logitech Illuminated keyboard. Nor had I planned on it. I don't like membrane based keyboards and I doubt I ever will. I've never liked the feel of them. The typing experience always feels more satisfying to me when using mechanical keyboards. This is true regardless of the switch type though my preference is for the IBM buckling spring, or Cherry MX Blue switches. I've got a Deck ICE Legend which uses Cherry MX Black switches but even that's preferable to any membrane keyboard in my book. (At least with most of the switches I've tried.) The feel of the keys seems inconsistent to me. The feel of them also changes over time as they wear out. They also seem to wear out much more quickly. Membrane keyboards that I have used all feel like crap and look like shit after about a year or so of use. The Logitech G15 revision 2 is easily the best membrane switch keyboard I've ever used and I still use it on some of my other machines. There is simply no comparison between that type of keyboard and mechanical units made with quality switches.

I'll give a Logitech illuminated a quick test run if I ever see one in the store. I doubt I'll be impressed by it. I've never been impressed by any non-mechanical keyboards.
 
Dan_D said:
No I haven't tried the Logitech Illuminated keyboard. Nor had I planned on it. I don't like membrane based keyboards and I doubt I ever will. I've never liked the feel of them. The typing experience always feels more satisfying to me when using mechanical keyboards. This is true regardless of the switch type though my preference is for the IBM buckling spring, or Cherry MX Blue switches. I've got a Deck ICE Legend which uses Cherry MX Black switches but even that's preferable to any membrane keyboard in my book. (At least with most of the switches I've tried.) The feel of the keys seems inconsistent to me. The feel of them also changes over time as they wear out. They also seem to wear out much more quickly. Membrane keyboards that I have used all feel like crap and look like shit after about a year or so of use. The Logitech G15 revision 2 is easily the best membrane switch keyboard I've ever used and I still use it on some of my other machines. There is simply no comparison between that type of keyboard and mechanical units made with quality switches.

I'll give a Logitech illuminated a quick test run if I ever see one in the store. I doubt I'll be impressed by it. I've never been impressed by any non-mechanical keyboards.
Click to expand...

As the old saying goes, "Don't know it 'til you've tried it".
 
CookieFactory said:
As the old saying goes, "Don't know it 'til you've tried it".
Click to expand...

I believe it's actually, "Don't knock it until you've tried it."

In any case I've tried many keyboards over the last decade and a half. No membrane keyboard has felt "good" as far as I am concerned. I don't see how that could change.
 
Dan_D said:
I believe it's actually, "Don't knock it until you've tried it."

In any case I've tried many keyboards over the last decade and a half. No membrane keyboard has felt "good" as far as I am concerned. I don't see how that could change.
Click to expand...

So pray tell, what exactly are you trying to accomplish? I own both keyboards, and having used and tested both extensively, have concluded the Logitech is superior for me. You've used neither keyboards, and yet have attempted a refuting argument based on generalizations and assumptions in order to tell me, implicitly or otherwise, that my preferences are wrong. If you have a personal vendetta against non-mechanical keyboards, or dream of making love to your Cherry switches, I suppose I could see where you are coming from. Otherwise, you're just not making sense.
 
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Pretty funny response, CF. :p

If you like typing on laptop keyboards, chances are you'll like the Logitech Illuminated.
 
CookieFactory said:
So pray tell, what exactly are you trying to accomplish? I own both keyboards, and having used and tested both extensively, have concluded the Logitech is superior for me. You've used neither keyboards, and yet have attempted a refuting argument based on generalizations and assumptions in order to tell me, implicitly or otherwise, that my preferences are wrong. If you have a personal vendetta against non-mechanical keyboards, or dream of making love to your Cherry switches, I suppose I could see where you are coming from. Otherwise, you're just not making sense.
Click to expand...

Wow, what a response. I have to admit, when I typed my post I never envisioned a response like this. Allow me to clarify for you since you have obviously misunderstood my posts on this subject. I'm really expressing a bit of disbelief that any membrane "switch" based keyboard could ever be as good as a mechanical keyboard in terms of feel or longevity. I'm just talking here. I am not trying to convince you or anyone that you are wrong. The broadly technical discussion of the Cherry MX switches, IBM buckling spring switches and comparisons to various membrane keyboard switches is only the basis of my current opinion on keyboards in general. I'm sorry you find my opinion offensive and have misconstrued that opinion (and the stated basis of that opinion) as an attack on your "preferences". Believe me I don't care enough about your opinions to do that.

As for your comment that I've not used either keyboard, you are again off base and have clearly misunderstood the context of my posts. In fact I have used Das Keyboards before, though I don't own any personally. However, I do still remember what it is like to use a Das Keyboard. In my earlier post I made a comparison between Das Keyboard and the IBM Model M which uses buckling spring switches. If anything most people would assume that I have used Das Keyboard in the past given that I compared the feel of the switches used in Das Keyboard to those used in another keyboard. (In this case the IBM Model M.) As for your getting pissy about "generalizations and assumptions", I don't know what to tell you. I don't think that your statement concerning my "generalizations and assumptions" is accurate. I made very specific and very non-general statements concerning mechanical keyboards. I made specific statements concerning membrane keyboards as well, but conceeded that I hadn't used the Logitech Illuminated keyboard. So while I have generalized a little about membrane keyboards" it isn't exactly unwarranted given that the keyboard in question is of that type.

I don't know if you simply didn't read the full text of my posts or if you've failed to understand them. If you'll go back and read them you may notice that I had also said that I'd give the Logitech Illuminated keyboard a quick test if I ever saw one in the store. That hardly sounds like I'm trying to convince anyone that you are wrong. If anything I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and taking your statements at face value even if I am expressing some simultaneous disbelief in them at the same time.

CookieFactory said:
If you have a personal vendetta against non-mechanical keyboards, or dream of making love to your Cherry switches, I suppose I could see where you are coming from. Otherwise, you're just not making sense.
Click to expand...

This last part is just flamebait.
 
I dont like the Saitek V1 feels like a mushy POS. +1 for the Logitech Illuminated though, most expensive keyboard I bought yet at $80 but its more than worth it.
 
ryken said:
I have had the Saitek Eclipse blue background model for about 2 years now. The "s" has worn considerably, but all the other keys are fine. Keyboard has held up very well overall. Only $38 with free shipping on newegg right now, so I can live with a little "s" rubbing over that period.
Click to expand...

Everything said also applies to me, except for me except its the D key.
 
I've been looking for similar...

Right now I have the logitech illuminated keyboard. I want to eventually find something else. I enjoy the overall feel of the scissor switches on the board and that is fine. I used old IBM M style keyboards for a long time, but do not want a keyboard with too forceful of a keypress, and also need something a bit quieter (though membrane level silence is not required). For the logitech, I have found that I cannot adjust to the non-standard layout of the keyboard. In particular, I have found that the raised set of lower keys (space bar, alt, ctrl, etc) create typos for me that I haven't been able to adjust to. The half-sized F-keys are really difficult to adjust to as well, and the F-key numbers are not illuminated (instead, the media keys are). The numkey pad is "mushy" but serviceable. The backspace key is smaller than standard and I also find difficulty adjusting to that. I do kind of enjoy the double sized delete key, though.

I want a good white led illuminated kb, and the only other choice on the market I see is the Deck Legend Frost (soft key tactile). I've searched their forum for reviews and got a bit of info, but not much. I also looked around for other reviews but there isn't much out there for reviews w/their tactile kb switche offerring. It looks like they just came out with it in the past few months. I can tell from their website what cherry switches they use, but i'm just not an expert on the subtle differences between each one.

Does anyone have any experience with the Deck Tactile version of their keyboard? I think they only offer it in "Frost" and "Ice". I'd get the Ice since i'm looking for white leds. I'm particularly curious as to the noise level of the keys. My present understanding is that they will be not as loud as something like Das Keyboard. Can anyone confirm? At least with Das Keyboard I can go to youtube videos and compare with the click style.

The aesthetics look decent, but the fonts look a bit weird. I dont think I'll mind that as the look still appears subtle. I don't want any kind of gamer bling. I'm thinking of ordering one and just trying it out and hopefully I won't have to do the return policy. But if anyone has tried Deck's new soft tactile keyboards I'd love to hear your thoughts.

Thanks!
 
Last edited:
sippm said:
I've been looking for similar...

Right now I have the logitech illuminated keyboard. I want to eventually find something else. I enjoy the overall feel of the scissor switches on the board and that is fine. I used old IBM M style keyboards for a long time, but do not want a keyboard with too forceful of a keypress, and also need something a bit quieter (though membrane level silence is not required). For the logitech, I have found that I cannot adjust to the non-standard layout of the keyboard. In particular, I have found that the raised set of lower keys (space bar, alt, ctrl, etc) create typos for me that I haven't been able to adjust to. The half-sized F-keys are really difficult to adjust to as well, and the F-key numbers are not illuminated (instead, the media keys are). The numkey pad is "mushy" but serviceable. The backspace key is smaller than standard and I also find difficulty adjusting to that. I do kind of enjoy the double sized delete key, though.

I want a good white led illuminated kb, and the only other choice on the market I see is the Deck Legend Ice (soft key tactile). I've searched their forum for reviews and got a bit of info, but not much. I also looked around for other reviews but there isn't much out there for reviews w/their tactile kb switche offerring. It looks like they just came out with it in the past few months. I can tell from their website what cherry switches they use, but i'm just not an expert on the subtle differences between each one.

Does anyone have any experience with the Deck Tactile version of their keyboard? I think they only offer it in "Frost" and "Ice". I'd get the Ice since i'm looking for white leds. I'm particularly curious as to the noise level of the keys. My present understanding is that they will be not as loud as something like Das Keyboard. Can anyone confirm? At least with Das Keyboard I can go to youtube videos and compare with the click style.

The aesthetics look decent, but the fonts look a bit weird. I dont think I'll mind that as the look still appears subtle. I don't want any kind of gamer bling. I'm thinking of ordering one and just trying it out and hopefully I won't have to do the return policy. But if anyone has tried Deck's new soft tactile keyboards I'd love to hear your thoughts.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

The Deck ICE Legence uses the Cherry MX Black switches. The tactile version uses the Cherry MX Brown switches I believe. I've got the older style Deck ICE Legend based on the Cherry MX brown switches. The keyboard took a couple days to get broken in but once I did it has been great. I would have preferred Cherry MX Blue switches because they are the most like the IBM Model M keyboard switches. Still the Cherry MX Black switches are pleasant to use. One upside to this is that they are quieter than keyboards based on the Cherry MX Blue switches or anything similar with the tactile and clicky sound.

I haven't tried the tactile version but given what I know from typing on similar keyboards, it should be pretty nice. I'm still holding out for someone to make a backlit keyboard based on Cherry MX Blue switches.
 
Thanks for the reply. I did a typo (which I fixed above now) and meant to say I was considering the new "Frost" version of the Deck Keyboard, which is with the white led and only comes in the soft tactile. Soft tactile is also now avail in the "Ice" (blue led), although it appears their older model was just linear. I confuse the deck model names since I tend to think of Ice as white, but whatever...

Deck states that their new cherry soft tactile switches are the MX1A-C1NW, which I believe are "clear". I looked at the cherry site and it indicates that it should be a softer, quieter keypress, so I think its what I'm looking for. If anyone has any comments or experience with that board it'd be much appreciated. So far I'm hearing lots of great comments about them, but they seem to be a small operation. Thanks!
 
sippm said:
Thanks for the reply. I did a typo (which I fixed above now) and meant to say I was considering the new "Frost" version of the Deck Keyboard, which is with the white led and only comes in the soft tactile. Soft tactile is also now avail in the "Ice" (blue led), although it appears their older model was just linear. I confuse the deck model names since I tend to think of Ice as white, but whatever...

Deck states that their new cherry soft tactile switches are the MX1A-C1NW, which I believe are "clear". I looked at the cherry site and it indicates that it should be a softer, quieter keypress, so I think its what I'm looking for. If anyone has any comments or experience with that board it'd be much appreciated. So far I'm hearing lots of great comments about them, but they seem to be a small operation. Thanks!
Click to expand...

Actually Deck is a fairly small operation but their parent company isn't. They make mechanical keyboards for point of sale systems which require long lasting keyboards that need to stand up to years of service. In fact the Deck 82 is derrived from their server keyboard which is almost the same form factor. It was designed to fit into pull out trays installed in server racks. Hence the small form factor. As for the Cherry MX Clear switches (The part number you mentioned) those are fairly new I think. Similar to the Cherry MX brown but with softer key press. I don't know for sure. Cherry has so many key switches they can get confusing pretty easily.
 
Thanks for the info about Deck. That makes sense because in my research I did read somewhere something to the effect that their keyboards were in part cannibalized from their parent (TG3 I assume). Seeing as everything looks good, and its the only other quality white illuminated kb in town anyhow, it looks like I'm going to sit on this over the weekend and hopefully pull the trigger next week =)
 
sippm said:
Thanks for the info about Deck. That makes sense because in my research I did read somewhere something to the effect that their keyboards were in part cannibalized from their parent (TG3 I assume). Seeing as everything looks good, and its the only other quality white illuminated kb in town anyhow, it looks like I'm going to sit on this over the weekend and hopefully pull the trigger next week =)
Click to expand...

Yes, the designs are based in part on TG3 designs. At least the 82 is. I've had my Deck for about a year now and it has shown very little signs of wear. As I said before the keyboard will need some time to break in properly. Some keys like the space bar are often quite stiff at first. I got my keyboard while writing a review article and by the end of the article it was completely broken in. It doesn't take long depending on how much you type. I type a lot so mine probably got broken in faster than most. I did it in about 7 hours or less. Again I type fast and I type often so that helps. Also all Deck keyboards come with two keycaps for the escape key. A skull and crossbones, or a traditionally marked escape key. Mine had the skull and crossbones installed on it when I got it. Apparently they aren't normally done that way, but I like it.

The Deck is well built and the back light is about the best I've seen. It has 7 brightness levels. The keys are also still visible with the back light turned off. I can't really say the same about my Logitech G-15 Revision 1 or 2 keyboards. Their lettering is barely visible unless the lighting in the room is really bright. The font on the keys is also interesting and quite unique. I've never seen another keyboard that had a similar font on it. Not that I went looking for it but you get the idea. So it does have a distinct look but is still fairly subtle.
 
Thanks for your comments.

I pulled the trigger today and it should arrive by the weekend. I'm going to give it a week or so to break in and to adjust and let you know how it goes. It was pricey for a keyboard but if its high quality then I have no problem with that. I'm hoping it works out and will report back in a few weeks!
 
sippm said:
Thanks for your comments.

I pulled the trigger today and it should arrive by the weekend. I'm going to give it a week or so to break in and to adjust and let you know how it goes. It was pricey for a keyboard but if its high quality then I have no problem with that. I'm hoping it works out and will report back in a few weeks!
Click to expand...

As long as you like the way the keys feel, I have no doubt that you'll enjoy it. It should last a long time providing years of service.
 
I'm sure you will enjoy this keyboard.

I have the Deck 82 fire and I love this board. Fantastic build quality and a very solid feeling board.

Think I actually like it better than my Das board but they are both good boards. I would say that the Deck is more solidly constructed though.
 
Canon said:
I'm sure you will enjoy this keyboard.

I have the Deck 82 fire and I love this board. Fantastic build quality and a very solid feeling board.

Think I actually like it better than my Das board but they are both good boards. I would say that the Deck is more solidly constructed though.
Click to expand...

Yeah the latest generation Das Keyboard seemed a little flimsy to me.
 
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