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CRT dimming over time?

O

Objekt

Limp Gawd
Joined
Apr 6, 2012
Messages
302
I'm still using a 21" CRT as my primary desktop display for many reasons, among them the superior color representation vs. an LCD.

What's sitting on my desk now is an NEC AccuSync 120. It was one of the last ones manufactured, probably ever, and I bought it in 2008.

In the last year or so, it seems I'm having to use higher and higher brightness settings to keep things looking good. Particularly in the last couple of months, when I've been doing a lot more PC gaming after not doing it for a while, it seems I am constantly turning the brightness up to maximum or near-maximum. Typically I operate it at about 90% of maximum brightness, with contrast always maxed out.

Is it my imagination, bad video card/game settings, or does a CRT start to get dimmer after 5 years or so?

Contrast (pun intended) with my Samsung LCD, which is about 3 years old and I have to turn DOWN to around 70% brightness to make it tolerable. That hasn't changed one whit since it was new.
 
Objekt said:
Is it my imagination, bad video card/game settings, or does a CRT start to get dimmer after 5 years or so?
Click to expand...

All monitors get dimmer over time, CRTs and LCDs. The rate will depend on how much use it gets. For CRTs, I found that 4-5 years was about their lifespan. After that, it's around time to get a new monitor.
 
Eh, that's annoying. The last CRT I had (Dell M992, 19") went out of focus before I noticed any change in brightness.

Guess it's time to shop for a new monitor. The new 4k monitors are amazing, but something less ambitious (maybe WQXGA, 30" or so) will probably be more practical for a desk. I might could do with a 24" WUXGA LCD, though there aren't as many choices vs. the 16:9 low-res screens foisted upon us by the advent of HDTV.

Now to begin the long process of finding a combination of panel type (I'm thinking IPS, based on prior experience with a Dell Ultrasharp at work), responsiveness, warranty, and input lag that I can live with. Maybe a Dell U2412M.
 
Dell 2412 has a heavy antiglare coating that bothers a lot of people. Most people switching from a CRT probably would be better off with a lighter coated model, unless you are using it next to a window or in a bright office.
 
Food for thought.

I once assumed I would want a 120 Hz monitor. As a CRT aficionado, I am rather used to higher refresh rates than has been the norm in the LCD world. 1600x1200 @ 75 Hz is "home" for me, and I crank up the refresh rate as high as possible when operating at lower resolutions. 60 Hz or below on that big 21" screen is almost physically painful, at least to my eyes.

Obviously, it's different with an LCD. I haven't gamed much on my 24" Samsung LCD; it's primarily for watching movies and TV. But I don't notice the 60 Hz "refresh rate."
 
I've been through a shed load of CRTs. If they've been used for 8-12 hours a day constantly for 5 years the brightness level drops significantly. It's one of the many reasons I'd always want to see a CRT in person before purchasing, unless it was dirt cheap. The last Dell 21" I purchased was so dim it went straight in the bin (granted I only paid £5/$5 for it).

On the flipside, modern LED LCDs are often too bright even at 0% brightness. Something worth considering and looking into if you're going to "upgrade".

For CRT motion clarity look towards lightboost displays. For CRT colours you'll probably want to go for a secondary IPS. There is no perfect replacement as yet.
 
As stated above, there really isn't a good CRT replacement. LCDs can be similar in some regards, but they require different panels to do so.

Lightboost TNs for motion ... worse color accuracy, bad color angle shift, especially vertically.

IPS for color accuracy, decent color shift at angles, okay-ish motion (but much worse than CRTs), IPS glow and so-so blacks. Some IPS panels have a very heavy antiglare coating that bothers some people.

VA for contrast and blacks, worse color accuracy when compared to IPS (in general), motion not as good as IPS, angles not as good as IPS.

It's sort of pick your poison -- whichever type of panel suits your needs best.
 
We need an LCD with the motion clarity of LightBoost, the blacks of VA, and the color accuracy of IPS. Will three monitors in a blender work? ;)
 
Field-emission displays (FEDs) are the "real" solution. Unfortunately, they're wildly impractical at the moment; I'm not sure a working one of any size has been cobbled together, although there are references to prototypes in the Wackypedia article on FEDs:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_emission_display

Executive summary: a FED would consist of, essentially, an array of millions of tiny CRT-like arrangements, where multiple redundant electron guns would activate phosphor material to form images. But, the display would be as thin as an LCD, and flat, with none of the distortions due to necessarily-curved glass tubes (or shadow mask wires in a Trinitron, choose your poison!).

Unfortunately, at the time FED tech was being developed actively (ca. early 2000's), LCDs started to take over the market, so the major player - basically only Sony - gave it up.

Supposedly AU Optronics is continuing research. Japan Economic Times published a rather premature news article claiming that AU would start selling FED displays in 2011, but clearly that didn't happen.

FEDs based on carbon nanotubes are, unfortunately, likely at least a decade away. There is still a LOT we simply don't know about the physics of carbon nanotube field emission, although what we do know suggests this may be the path forward for FEDs.

Based on what I've learned so far, I might just go for a Lightboost TN panel. I mainly just play games on my desktop machine. For that matter, the Samsung LCD I already have (model BX2440X) might suffice, although it's a low-rez 16:9 display.

Wonder if I should get an IPS for watching movies on? I've never been satisfied with the color and image quality on the Samsung monitor. Part of this is the crappiness of the source material (DVD being stretched to 1080 lines, highly compressed .mkv and .avi's, or Netflix streaming video). But then, it would be pointless to buy a 1920x1200 display if I'm only going to watch at-most 1080p, more often 720p or up-sampled NTSC, content on it.
 
No "image restore" or other such feature on the NEC AccuSync 120 to sort it out?
 
How far are you from the max brightness settings on your CRT. You can keep using it until you hit 100% brightness and then it dims to unusable/undesirable on that setting. Perhaps by then there will be more 4K resolution choices or more reliable OLED monitors out if you can get another year or two out of it.

Written on a CRT...
 
With *MOST* CRTs you can crank up the brightness by turning a potentiometer near the high voltage power supply. It doesn't work on CRTs with digital controls and it can kill you - use non-conductive tools and be ready to sacrifice 2 or 3 fingers (if you feel the charge hitting your hand put 3 fingers of that hand on the grounded chassis - they will burn completely off your hand but you *MIGHT* survive). There are usually 2 potentiometers, the other one controls focus.

Of course you have to ask yourself if fixing the monitor is worth your life or at the very least 2 fingers. It is no coincidence that I haven't opened a CRT monitor in a decade.
 
StormUP said:
How far are you from the max brightness settings on your CRT. You can keep using it until you hit 100% brightness and then it dims to unusable/undesirable on that setting. Perhaps by then there will be more 4K resolution choices or more reliable OLED monitors out if you can get another year or two out of it.

Written on a CRT...
Click to expand...
I generally operate it in the 90% to 100% range. 100% sometimes, for example in the daytime or if I have other lights on in the room. When the room (and outside world) are dark, 90% suffices. So I'm not totally out of options yet. But it's certainly time to look for a replacement display.
 
my crt is 12 yrs old.. still plenty bright and contrasty. never had an issue with a crt.
 
I'm sure it's quite dependent on the individual CRT. I previously used a Dell M992 (19"). The only reason I got rid of it was that it went out of focus. At some point it was just too fuzzy to run it at 1600x1200 and 1280x1024 didn't look too great either. But I got a good 5-ish years out of it. I gave it to someone who was planning to use it as a monitor for a game console.

I wish I could have bought something using a Trinitron tube, but they simply were no longer available when I went shopping a few years ago. The first - and last - Trinitron-based CRT I owned was a Nokia 447x. It was on the small side (17") and it self-destructed. Twice. Complete garbage electronics.
 
Wish I had one of those but I'm not going to put good money toward something with no warranty at this point, which I'd have to buy off fleaBay.

So it's off to LCD compromise land. Probably will end up with a 120 Hz monitor of some type, since mainly I play games on my desktop machine.
 
I may end up in the same boat soon it looks like.

Shortly after my initial post here my CRT started snapping/popping during use. When it does the screen does the larger/smaller flicker before evening out. It is likely arcing inside :/ I've been using it as my primary monitor for the last month or so for various reasons, but historically it typically serves as my secondary and plays video while I do other things on my main LCD, a role I'd been planning to return it to. The blacks...are so black....it's awesome.

When it's not arcing, it still runs great so I plan to run it until it burns itself out. My main LCD is fairly old and has crap color/black levels/most anything else you can imagine so I'll relegate it to the secondary role and buy a new main monitor I suppose.

Will monitor this thread to see what replacement you end up with as I suspect I'll be looking soon as well now.
 
sigh

I have some classic O scopes here that barely display any more
 
StormUP said:
I may end up in the same boat soon it looks like.

Shortly after my initial post here my CRT started snapping/popping during use. When it does the screen does the larger/smaller flicker before evening out. It is likely arcing inside :/ I've been using it as my primary monitor for the last month or so for various reasons, but historically it typically serves as my secondary and plays video while I do other things on my main LCD, a role I'd been planning to return it to. The blacks...are so black....it's awesome.

When it's not arcing, it still runs great so I plan to run it until it burns itself out. My main LCD is fairly old and has crap color/black levels/most anything else you can imagine so I'll relegate it to the secondary role and buy a new main monitor I suppose.

Will monitor this thread to see what replacement you end up with as I suspect I'll be looking soon as well now.
Click to expand...

Haven't experienced that with my F520s yet. My former FW900, RIP, did start doing that...so I left it on for two days solid (with my usual aggressive screen saver) and it went away. Like what was causing the arc burned out or something...or maybe I just got real lucky...and monitor lived on for years afterwards...
 
Good news is, I cranked up the gamma in the one game where I was really noticing lack of brightness (Day of Defeat: Source) and it helped. Doesn't look too terribly washed out. Might be I can get along with the remaining brightness for a good while longer.
 
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