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Cordless Antistatic Straps

R

Reaper00702

n00b
Joined
Jan 15, 2005
Messages
42
Does anybody know where I can buy one of those antistatic wrist straps that contain a metal stud instead of connecting it to a exposed wire? My teacher had it, but he said he didn't remember where he got it from.
 
Reaper00702 said:
Does anybody know where I can buy one of those antistatic wrist straps that contain a metal stud instead of connecting it to a exposed wire? My teacher had it, but he said he didn't remember where he got it from.
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i wouldnt worry about it. i havent used one of those for all the years ive been working on electronics and have never shocked anything.

could be luck, but i think the need for them is way overrated.
sorry to troll i guess, but to answer your question is no. ive never even heard of them
 
As long as you don't work on your computer outdoors during thunderstorms on a piece of old carpet wearing a pair of woolen socks with itchy feet you should be fine :)

But im curious, how exactly would the thing ground you if it doesnt connect to anything? Having a strapless one kind of defeats the purpose. But maybe he was wearing it as a weird science teacher fashion statement? never know heh.
 
I dunno, he had some strap that had what I guess was a special metal stud connected to it, I don't know. But I'm not stupid (at least, when working with electronics)
 
Would that even be possible? Thats like asking if you can power your case without any power cable :p

The point is you need the wire for the electricity to flow through. The cable on your wrist is allowing any possible electricty to flow through it and ground out on your case.

Oh and never have shocked anything myself, and I am constantly working on a carpeted floor.

I would be quite surprised for someone to prove me wrong though :)
 
The amount of current necessary to destroy electronics is much much lower than what the human body can feel as a shock. Just because you don't feel it does not mean there was no current. Damage isn't immediate sometimes, either. Just because a chip appears to work when you turn it on does not mean there is no damage to it.
 
Ive had a couple electronics courses and I find the wireless grounding device a little hard to swallow. If your'e still worried about it, you could get an anti static mat to stand on, but i wouldn't say you need anything.
 
Wow, didnt know such thing existed. I wonder how well they really work. I may just puic one of those up for myself because i know how the cord is always getting in the way.
 
jpmkm said:
The amount of current necessary to destroy electronics is much much lower than what the human body can feel as a shock. Just because you don't feel it does not mean there was no current. Damage isn't immediate sometimes, either. Just because a chip appears to work when you turn it on does not mean there is no damage to it.
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Yes thats very true, I suppose its the risk I take by sometimes not wearing a band when I am working.
Luckily its been humid lately so the amount of static has been mild.
 
jpmkm said:
The amount of current necessary to destroy electronics is much much lower than what the human body can feel as a shock. Just because you don't feel it does not mean there was no current. Damage isn't immediate sometimes, either. Just because a chip appears to work when you turn it on does not mean there is no damage to it.
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This is very true. I do ESD protection as part of my job. The human body can only feel voltages of around 3000 volts (in the form of ESD), but electronics can be damaged by as little as a few hundred volts or less. You can find static disspative wriststraps pretty much anywhere for around $6. Well worth it.

You can get away with keeping your skin touching a part of the case. The second you aren't touching the case however, and you twist around to pick up something, the movement of your clothing can generate several hundred volts.
 
I make sure I ground myself all the time, considering most of my house is carpeted, but sometimes i stand on a wooden chair to make it a bit less ESD-prone. I guess you could say better safe than sorry, and I really don't understand the wireless ones, but hey, that cord is horrible, and I don't have any exposed wires to plug it into.
 
The only time i've ever shocked stuff was here at work.. it's static hell.. and we don't use straps! As much as i'd like to be paranoid about the "even if you don't feel it , and even if it works, it could still be damaged..", until I am actually burned (in the pocketbook) by static, i'm gonna keep touchen my psu...
 
ESD is real and it does fry electronics. I've fried three SD cards just by touching them in the last two years.

Mind you, I'm in the perfect climate for it. When its -30 Celsius outside and the humidity is 10 percent (Calgary, Canada) Its almost impossible to *not* see a spark on everything you touch. I would think it would be less/no problem for someone living in Florida (high temperatures and high humidity make static almost moot)
 
I would really like someone to explain how these straps are supposed to work without a ground. I smell a scam - or a joke. I haven't used a strap myself...I just keep touching the case to equalize the relative charge, but I fully understand why they are needed and if I was building or repairing professionally I would insist on them being used.
 
No scam, at least, I don't think so. I honestly don't know how it works, but he didn't fry anything at all when he touched things. Now, it may be luck, but I don't know. I was just interesting, cause I'm not too keen on frying things. I mean, computer parts aren't exactly cheap...
 
Intresting I just read this at http://www.compgeeks.com/details.asp?invtid=CT-511W&cat=CON....

...PROTECT YOURSELF! This Cordless Blue Anti-Static Wrist Strap provides protection from computer-generated static electricity. Just wear it on your wrist at least 15 minutes before performing computer work or repair, making sure its stainless steel back touches bare skin on your arm....
 
well, this looks really cool...it says

"The high-tech wrist strap is now cordless! Utilizing the Corona principle to harmlessly rid your body of static electricity before it can damage your data or computer equipment."

but since i dont know what the corona principle is (probably something about ions and static electricity...) i'm assuming that it is the vital part of it...

ESD is deadly real....poor poor 6800....fortunately we got it RMA'd which is a miracle in itself.
 
i know exactly how these would work.


something along the lines of a variable resistor. (hint, get a cheap resistor somewhere, work up a huge static charge, and touch it)

resistor's make half-decent portable grounds. its just little known.
 
omega-x said:
i know exactly how these would work.


something along the lines of a variable resistor. (hint, get a cheap resistor somewhere, work up a huge static charge, and touch it)

resistor's make half-decent portable grounds. its just little known.
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Where does the electricity go? Can you provide some sources to back up your claim?
 
Ah the mysteries of science, lol. I don't know how they work, I just figure better safe than sorry. I have a bad habit of taking my hand of the case when checking something and forgeting to put it back on. So this is really one of those things I need.
 
jpmkm said:
Just because a chip appears to work when you turn it on does not mean there is no damage to it.
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This is the first that I've heard of this. If a component gets turned on and functions properly than what could possibly be wrong? Are you suggesting that it will start to suffer from secondary effects somewhere down the road?
 
GVX said:
This is the first that I've heard of this. If a component gets turned on and functions properly than what could possibly be wrong? Are you suggesting that it will start to suffer from secondary effects somewhere down the road?
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Latent defects are quite real. One possibility is dramatically shortened life. For a very in-depth and technical explanation, I refer you to Ice Czar's ESD rant.
 
Yeah, my friend zapped his modem once, and it worked for about 2 more days before it died. Kinda stinks for him, he still hasn't gotten his cable back...
 
Corona discharges are basically high pressure plasma discharges. What these guys are claiming is that they can convert the static electricity into a glow discharge similar to a neon tube. That ionization would then allow the static charge to discipate. Well, if you'd have a ground I'd believe that's possible.
 
http://www.pcworld.com/howto/article/0,aid,82184,00.asp

"If you don't want to deal with a ground, $39 cordless wrist straps, based on a technology that uses the Corona principle to dissipate static without using a ground, are also available at Directron.com. Industry experts say they're not as effective as a true grounded wrist strap, but they're better than taking your chances."
 
Since no one followed the link (or rather the link on the page I linked to) I will put it here with a quote: http://www.esdsystems.com/default.a...Resource&showsidebar=no&action=question&id=17

"Question:
A cohort purchased several "wireless" ESD wrists straps for his PC maintenance bench. He was told they worked similar to a corona wire on a copier/laser printer. I thought it may be a part of a composite system, but he said the need for other equipment was not mentioned. He is now convinced it does not work by itself as he was shocked while opening his car door (while wearing the strap). There is a small oblong monolith attached to the cloth-elastic strap, which a brass colored screw is screwed into. The head of the screw is exposed. I carefully opened one with a dremmel tool and found a 1M resistor wired between a second screw which contacts the wrist contact-plate and a soft rubbery "C" shaped plate (about 1 mm thick, 2 cm sq with a chunk removed forming this c-shape) which the brass colored screw contacts. Does this sound like anything viable? - Anonymous, S. Portland, ME
Answer: No. This is not a viable ESD control device to employ in ESD safe areas. These passive "wireless" wrist straps have severe limitations. Assuming you were tribocharged to 10 KV and wearing the "wireless" wrist strap, it would take many hours (days even depending on the ambient RH) to get you below 5 KV, never the less 10 Volts. Most (if not all) of the charge reduction would be due to natural recombination of the charges on your skin (and now metal casing of your "wireless" wrist strap) with the air molecules and the natural conductance of the air through water vapor content (RH).

P.S. You could get the same effect by cutting your hair to about 1/4" long and then putting conductive jell in your hair. The ends of your now conductive hair would act like corona discharge points at extremely high voltages to bleed current into the air or help to enhance the natural recombination process. The fact that your hair would need to come in very close proximity [0.1 to 1.5 inches] to ground or any other potential with at least a 3 Kilovolt difference (due to the dielectric strength of air) or enhancing the natural conductivity of the air needs to be considered to even get you down below a few KV. "

==>Lazn
 
sigh...

RESISTORS PEOPLE.

resistors turn electricity directly into heat by resisting it.

this is why they pop if they overload, and get warm when a current is run through them (fanbus's)

current -> resistor -> HEAT -> no more electrons = ground!
 
All you need to do to ground yourself is to touch an exposed peice of metal (inside a case) while it is pluged in. Doesn't need to be on, just plugged in.
 
omega-x said:
sigh...

RESISTORS PEOPLE.

resistors turn electricity directly into heat by resisting it.

this is why they pop if they overload, and get warm when a current is run through them (fanbus's)

current -> resistor -> HEAT -> no more electrons = ground!
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:rolleyes: Tell me, what is the other side of the resistor connected to? I really hope you don't say nothing, because that is just plain wrong. I will give you a hint. If only one side of the resistor is connected to anything, no current will flow.
 
touch both.

ive done this personally with a large static build up and felt a shock.

to make a point here..
you can also attach a strong one to a small faraday cage / bag and defeat various anti-theft systems..but i have not tested that personally...but im aware that it does indeed work

so resistors DO absorb energy and turn it into heat.

it makes sense.
 
No it doesn't make sense. Touching both leads of a resistor will do absolutely nothing unless there is a potential between your hands. Current does not flow if there is not potential. If there is a potential between your hands then you have bigger problems then static discharge. And what the hell is a 'strong' resistor? I guarantee you the resistor has nothing to do with the magic bag you are talking about. The bag will work just fine without a resistor. Resistors do not absorb any energy. If you want to keep making these claims then you need to support them. All you have done so far is make yourself look foolish. Please, explain how your claims make sense, because they make no sense to me.
 
Instead of blowing money on an ESD wrist band can't you just take some copper wire, tie it around a clip and wrap it around your wrist then attach the clip to a grounded object?

It'll save a few $$.

I was looking at the things and they cost like $20.00 CAD locally.
 
Ok how should i put this...


wireless anti statis strap is bullshit.. you have to be connected to the machine you're working on. You need to be at the same electric potential as the machine so that you don't discharge electrons.

Imfucking possible..

To avoid the flow of electricity all you have to do is keep your whole body attached to a part of the circuit that has no change in voltage..

so as long as you touch say 0V (ground) or even 500V you're fine.. as long as you don't touch two places with two different voltages..
 
Seer said:
All you need to do to ground yourself is to touch an exposed peice of metal (inside a case) while it is pluged in. Doesn't need to be on, just plugged in.
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you should do it when it's off.. and you don't really need it plugged in

it should be off because when it's on you're gonna have other parts of the machine that are had higher and lower voltages.. say you're connected to ground (0V), and you touch a 12V rail.. you might have some sort of charge flow, and it could disrupt other parts of the machine.. if the machine is off.. everything is roughly at the same voltage level

if it's connected to the wall while it's off might help.. possible.. because if i's not on the wall, then all teh stuff on the machine could flux a bit more in potential. and possibly you could fry somethign if you touch the wrong part of the computer.. i highly doubt it though...
 
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