Chieftec Bt-04b unleashed !

[qwerkus]

Hello,

Long time lurker; first time poster. After spending some time with the new Chieftec case, I thought I might as well share my experience with others. I actually built a sff case with the bt-02 2 years ago, and needed an upgrade of the graphic card. The combination of a new chieftec case, and nvidia maxwell chips convinced me, so I gave it a try.

Old Parts (from my 2 year old build):
- Asrock z77e-itx + i5 3570k + 8Gb PC 1600 CL 9 Corsair vengeance low power (1.35V)
- AXP-140 (yes it fits) + bequiet shadow wings 140mm pwm fan
- samsung 830 128Gb ssd (linux); adata pro 64Gb msata (windows), HGST Travelstar 5K1000 1TB (data)

New parts:
- Palit gtx 750 ti stormx dual (factory OCd, since gpu oc under linux sucks) + EKL Alpenföhn wing boost 2 120mm fan + vga pwm adapter (see below)
- chieftec bt-04b-350bs; scythe kama flow green 80mm 1400rpm

Here some infos about the case:http://www.chieftec.eu/en/chassis/itx-tower/bt-04bu3.html

contra:
- cheap fabric (had to fix some rivet, feet crappy, whole contruction no very stable)

pro:
- [EDIT ]9.2 L volume !
- dual slot 20mm long gfx card, with awesome ventilation options (4 Sides open)
- price: 65 € including 350W sfx psu

and probably the best part is actually the psu. Check this out:

That's right 27A on the +12V rail. And nearly completely silent - take my word, I'm an extremist when it comes to noise.

1. At first, all I wanted was to do a quick upgrade. I opened the new case, got the mobo+cooler from the old case, and... it didn't fit! Those optical drive rails where in the way. I got frustrated, and started by stripping everything from the new case, until it looked like this:

2. Now without the black rails, the whole thing turn out very shaky. Something had to be done to strenghen it. I used cheap 8mm wood, and a variety of screwery. Since the upper holes would not be aligned, I used large washers to create an offset; in addition, the 1.5mm strong steel turned out to be holding the entire case together! Some modding is also required.

3. The second thing to consider is a case foot upgrade. The Bt-04b is shipped with cheap platic feet, not only horrible in terms of vibrations but (I my case) not even at level! So I bought some cheap Rubberfeet on ebay, added some washers to get to the right height (front panel causes an offset of 18mm), et voila:

Note that M3 screws in 5mm holes are pain to align, but I couldn't find M3 Rubberfeet with a >15mm height.

4. Without the rails, there is only 1 free 2,5" slot at the bottom of the case available (without stacking the hard drive on top of another). Fortunately, there is plenty of space underneath the fron panel, if you don't make use of the optical drive. I drilled 2 M3 holes, added nuts+whasers as spacer, and have now a nicely cooled ssd there (see below).

5. Than the Palit gfx card turn out to bee too long. This one I had anticipated, so I removed the fan case, and swaped the 2pin header for a 4pin header, to enable pwm fan control via graphic card. All you need to do is carefully remove the platic header, solder two more pins, and (carefully) press the 4pin header onto the pins.

It works pretty well. Unfortunately, my 120mm fan has only 1500rmp and seems to start at around 5V, which means it wouldn't turn on below 50% pwm signal. This sort of things could easily be set thanks to a vga bios flash; but I couldn't find any bios editor supporting fan control on maxwell chips. Will have to wait this one out, and for the time beeing, use the case fan switch.

6. Ok time to put everything together.

Notes:
-if you have a long card like mine, put it in FIRST (before the mobo)
-check cabling BEFORE fasting the motherboard, as with other sff cases. Some headers might not be reachable anymore once it's in the case.
-since I wanted to keep the optical drive bay cover, I had to mod it (cut, duct tape)
-things a VERY cramped inside this; I used rubber gloves to avoid cuts.
-I put the alpenföhn fan in exhaust mode, instead of blowing onto the gfx card; not sure if this is the best option, seeing the there is some 1cm space between the fan and the vga heatsink.

Voila! Hope you found this interesting. Will try to update temp & oc stats. Here a teaser:

 

[Juan Carlo]

i want this case since the first time i saw it on the web but it seems to be unavailable in my country. and purchasing online makes it more expensive; the freight charges are outrageous!

i wish this becomes available here at my place soon.

thank for sharing your build qwerkus. at least now i have an idea of how to fit certain stuff inside the case. i have the same graphics card.

BTW, why don't you cut the front of the case a bit to be able to fit the stock StormX Dual cooler of the graphics card?

 

[qwerkus]

i want this case since the first time i saw it on the web but it seems to be unavailable in my country. and purchasing online makes it more expensive; the freight charges are outrageous!

i wish this becomes available here at my place soon.

thank for sharing your build qwerkus. at least now i have an idea of how to fit certain stuff inside the case. i have the same graphics card.

BTW, why don't you cut the front of the case a bit to be able to fit the stock StormX Dual cooler of the graphics card?

1. Where do you live ? The case seem widely available in Europe.

2.
a. I needed an exhaust anyway
b. the 120mm fan moves a lot more air, and is quiet <1200rpm
c. the power button MIGHT be in the way; should be a matter of millimeter; an the upper front panel screws are definitely in the way.

 

[vipz]

I'm getting 10.5L when I plug in the dimensions from the website - where did you get the 6L figure from?

 

[qwerkus]

I'm getting 10.5L when I plug in the dimensions from the website - where did you get the 6L figure from?

I got this figure from a short spec sheet shipped with it; but you are correct - 6L is way too little. My *main* volume is about 235 (L) x 135 (W) x 290 (H) = 9.2L - not counting the U bar on top and at the bottom, and not counting the feet. Turns out one should always measure this kind of stuff again...

EDIT: The spec sheet was from the bt-02; not the bt-04. Yet, besides the fancy U bars and the feet, both have exactly the same volume

 

[niksus]

Wow, I would've bought this case in a blink a few years back. Chieftec had only single expansion slot ITX cases for so long. Now I'm looking at much smaller volumes.

 

[qwerkus]

Wow, I would've bought this case in a blink a few years back. Chieftec had only single expansion slot ITX cases for so long. Now I'm looking at much smaller volumes.

Agreed. I was actually looking for that case 2 years ago. Now I got it essentially to fit my axp140 cooler. Was enough of a pain to match it to the asrock mobo, and it works miracles under load.

 

[niksus]

How about that U-bar - is it metal or plastic? Is it strong and supported enough so the case can be carried around?

 

[qwerkus]

How about that U-bar - is it metal or plastic? Is it strong and supported enough so the case can be carried around?

Cheap plastic. Wouldn't touch it, unless you wanna hurt yourself. It's main use for me is to remember that both the top and the bottom need enough space for airflow
The front panel has a thin aluminium cover though.

 

[qwerkus]

While the cpu was overclocking just fine, the gpu reached 80°+ under load! Something had to be done. So I reverted the fan in push mode, sitting directly on top of the gpu heatsink, and cut out the upper grid.

Yes I know, that's gotta be the cheesiest way of fastening a fan !
Anyway, gpu temps are down to 62°, but I can't push the cpu to 4.4Ghz anymore, when the gpu is under load. Probably the lack of proper exhaust. Have to test different setups.

 

[qwerkus]

Still working on the heat-stacking issue. Maybe adding 2 60mm exhaust fans over the io pannel would make a difference ?

 

[qwerkus]

Thanks to this phoronix article, I discovered that oc and fan control is also possible under linux with nvidia gpus. I enabled coolbits, tweaked a little script to run in the background, an can now power the 120mm fan sitting on the gpu heatsink via gpu pwm controller. Yay!

Various tests also showed, that the main problem of the current setup is a weak 140mm fan. So I ordered a new one. Hopefully the increased airflow and twice! the static pressure will make a difference. Moreover, I managed to grab a cheap Noiseblocker e-loop on amazon second hand shop, which might come handy in the next ventilation overhaul, hopefully on friday...

 

[Harnser]

Various tests also showed, that the main problem of the current setup is a weak 140mm fan

Which 140mm fan are you using at the moment?

 

[qwerkus]

duplipost

 

[qwerkus]

Which 140mm fan are you using at the moment?

Bequiet shadow wings 140 pwm (you can spot it on the pics). Awesome noise to cfm ratio a low speed, mid range airflow (60CFM@12V) but low static pressure (0.81). Was a good choice for the originial setup, in the bt02, where low temps and low power consumption was my priority. At the time, when undervolting the i5 3570k, I could even run the system passively with the axp-140 Now that performance is more of an issue (render time under blender), temps jumped to 80°+ and the fan appears to be too weak.

 

[edward78]

Oh man, accept for the handle and feet, I like. It would look so good sit on its side.

 

[qwerkus]

Oh man, accept for the handle and feet, I like. It would look so good sit on its side.

Agreed. Was my biggest disappointment too (in terms of design). While the new rubber feet I put turn out to be really good vibration absorbers, I'm still puzzled about the handles. Maybe to remind people that they shouldn't obstruct the top and bottom vents ? On the plus side, I like the front aluminium finish more and more. Huge improvement, when compared with the ugly plastic frontside of the bt-02.

 

[edward78]

Agreed. Was my biggest disappointment too (in terms of design). While the new rubber feet I put turn out to be really good vibration absorbers, I'm still puzzled about the handles. Maybe to remind people that they shouldn't obstruct the top and bottom vents ? On the plus side, I like the front aluminium finish more and more. Huge improvement, when compared with the ugly plastic frontside of the bt-02.

Why did they place the ODD like that? It is wide enough for normal ODD placement. Like the Element Q so good looking, if it had 2 slots, I could get the silverstone 600w psu & a slimline ODD to make one good looking gaming machine. I would figure out the heat issues hopefully. I ran into a few cases that would look a lot better if it was a little different.

 

[qwerkus]

Why did they place the ODD like that? It is wide enough for normal ODD placement. Like the Element Q so good looking, if it had 2 slots, I could get the silverstone 600w psu & a slimline ODD to make one good looking gaming machine. I would figure out the heat issues hopefully. I ran into a few cases that would look a lot better if it was a little different.

There is not enough space for a horizontal odd, no matter where you'd put it. I actually like it this way: since I had no plans fo any odd, it gave me a lot more cpu cooler header. I'm not a huge fan of psu sitting on top of a cpu cooler; if you're not going for water, it almost always ends up in heat stacking issues when overclocking.

I know someone owning a thermaltake Q; he has to leave the case permanently open to avoid overheating - though this way he can also us a 2slots gfx card. Thermaltake should update it with a slim ODD and a 140mm top fan exhaust. And a better or no psu: this one is loud, and inefficient.
If you go for thermaltake, I see a lot of modding. Loose the case cover, and built a custom one with only a top panel prepared for a large fan. On the 3.5" side, you can mod a 140-200mm rad. On the other side a watercoolded gfx card. Maybe add some rubber feet, and a 120mm fan intake on the case bottom. If you plan to carry it around, it also needs reinforcing; this is no silverstone, and isn't sturdy in any way.

Truth is, the more I work with the chieftec case, the more I have to respect it's design. If only the fabric was of equal quality... If you're looking for a great case to experiment with itx, this is the one. If you're looking for an addition to your salon hi-fi, go with jonsbo.

 

[qwerkus]

The NB e-loop B12-3 fan arrived today! Sadly, the same can't be said for the phantek (which I bought new), but since this is a mere replacement for the bequiet, I went on with the modding.

Now here is the plan:

While looking at the back of the case, I realized that there is actually enough space for a large 120mm fan. Of course, this would mean loosing a lot of usb ports and the e-sata port. But since I wasn't really using them anyay... The only real problem were the 2 antennas, which I wanted to keep. Luckily, the chieftec case has this strange unused opening just beneth the graphic card slot, which can easily accomodate 2 antennas and a fan cable. Back to the drilling machine !

Serial slot uncovered, IO plate still there. Turns out the side holes of the serial slot are M3 sized, while the antenna headers are just above M6:

IO plate gone, fan mounting system in place:

Fan, cable an antenna headers in place:

Sideview, e-loop sitting on top of the gfx heatsink:

The e-loop bp12-3 is a much better fit for the vga than the EKL fan, thanks to its very short cable:

Everything plugged in:

Clearance between fan and usb plugs:

I'm starting to become a huge fan of rubber bands. It's cheap, really good a absorbing vibrations, and you can fit fans pretty much everywhere using this system.

So much for now, update on temps coming.

 

[qwerkus]

Unbelievable! Even without the phantek, cpu temps are down to 62-66°C under load, at 4,3Ghz. 4,4 turned out to be too unstable under linux. (will try to post some screenshots)

Now the true miracle is the e-loop: 56°C after 30min of stresstesting on my stock palit gtx 750 ti (1202Mhz gpu, 6004Mhz Mem) is incredible, knowing that the fan never crossed the 80% PWM bar (which I set a 60°C). Static pressure just owns on this heatsink, and I'm even considering a heavier OC, based an higher voltages.

The nice thing is also the low starting voltage; now 30% PWM works, and nets a nice little 25-26°C when idle (or watching a movie). Don't know what everyone has to complain about the e-loop; while it's true that at high RPMs (>1200), it becomes quite loud, it's performance is just astonishing.

Overall, putting the EKL as back exhaust fan, and the e-loop as semi-intake GPU cooler got me one of the best air-cooled case I ever had. Nearly silent when idle (browsing, movies) and able to cope with heavy rendering loads at mid-ranged OC clocks. Thumbs up for chieftec !

 

[qwerkus]

Tried the Phanteks 140 XP today, and didn't notice a big difference in temps. Maybe some 1-2°, but nothing really worth the extra costs of a new fan. I'm going to return it. Turns out static pressure is really heatsink-dependent: while the gpu heatsink works really well under the pressure of the e-loop, the axp-140 doesn't seem to need that much pressure; airflow seems a bigger issue, and the phanteks doesn't really improve it. Those 140mm fans are just damn slow, if you ask me. Is there a way to hack a fan into spinning at higher rmps ?

 

[edward78]

It still would look awesome laying on its side, just wish thay made that handle removable & the back feet.

 

[qwerkus]

It still would look awesome laying on its side, just wish thay made that handle removable & the back feet.

Well, you can always use glue-feet. If you don't mind reading "hdd" vertically, and hide the base of the case (ugly metal grey) in a corner, it should be doable.

 

[owim]

Hello qwerkus,

Greeting from Eastern Europe!

I love how BT-04B looks like and even more like your posts on modding it and updating all of us, with pictures included. Amazing work!

Can BT-04B handle these below with ease? My future case -- what will be inside:
- Pentium G3258 CPU, 3.2GHz, 54W TDP
- stock CPU cooler (if it can fit!) as long as it cools properly, or an aftermarket cooler (your case), low profile if needed
- miniITX Gigabyte GA-B85N MoBo
- 1x3.5" HDD, 1x2.5" SSD, no optical drive
- I'm not a gamer so, no GTX 750 Ti for me (at least for now!), just weak GPU from Pentium
Note: Only version with 250W PSU built-in is available.

Furthermore, just like you, I'd like to OC this Pentium, more for fun than real need, since B85 chipsets can easily be OC'd through new BIOS in few clicks. Watched YT clip showing A-Z OC using Gigabyte B85 MoBo from 3.2 to 4.2GHz (70W TDP) using stock cooler (as they say, stays pretty cool). It would be overclocked just sometimes, not in regular work, less than 1% of time, like when doing video encoding/decoding.

That's it! Beware, I'm a noobie! Never built a PC. Don't even know some HW terms. I'd like to avoid almost any modding (have no knowledge).

Can I go straight ahead with few Qs ?

- Would all from my list fit in BT-04B and run smooth, no bumps, no temp spikes (judging from your case - it will)?
- What extras I need to buy right at start? Is new CPU cooler mandatory? Any other fans, like your top fan or I/O fan?
- What extras are likely to be needed?
- Can MoBo size 24.4cm x 17.4cm fit in? I know, it's not mITX (17x17cm).
- Aside 1x2.5" SSD, can I also put 2x3.5" HDD at the same time -- asking just in case (no optics, no graphics)?

Since you know what will be inside and how hot, what would you recommend, I've narrowed my selection to:
a) GA-B85N (miniITX) + Chieftec BT-04B
b) GA-B85M-xxx (microATX) + LC Power 3000B (24 liters)

Thanks a lot!

 

[qwerkus]

hi Owim; welcome to the world of hw geeks! Don't be afraid; if you allow yourself a few mistakes, building a comp is not that much of a issue.

1. Your parts list ist ok, though not optimal for a good OC. I'm also building a new rig based on the intel g3258 (post coming), and while you CAN OC with a cheap h81 or b85 board, z chipset will just net you a much better result. Furthermore, I'd make sure the Gibabyte can handle the OC since the manufacturer's webpage doesn't explicitely mention the g3258 like asus or asrock pages. A good board (and cheap) for a non-z g3258 OC is the ASUS H81I-Plus. In the bios download section of the manufacturer's website, you can read that it supports the g3258 since version 2001.
What I did, was monitoring ebay for a cheap z97 board. That way, I got an asrock z97m itx for the price of your board...

2. The 250W psu will handle the load just fine, as long a you don't add a power hungry vga. I would try to find the 350W version though, because that PSU is MUCH MUCH better, and a lot quieter.

3. Stock intel cooler will give you limited OC possibilities, especially in such a cramped case. Great LP cooler nowadays are the raijintek pallas and the not-so-well-known id-cooling is-60. Both should fit fine, and allow you to keep the ODD bay.
If you don't plan on using a hot gfx card, a strong 120mm exhaust fan on the top like my first setup yelds impressive results, even with a stock cooler (provided noise is not a problem).

4. Case choice is up to you. Large case = better airflow possibilities in theory, but a lot of cases out there a just not really planned through. 24cm motherboard won't fit into the BT-04.

Note that I actually found a version of the BT-04 with much better airflow: http://www.gtr.com.hk/case/itx/sd28i/master.htm
If I was to do this again, I would get this case, with the 3x 80mm fans - must be awesome!

 

[owim]

Thank you very much for the long and informative answer.

 

[qwerkus]

PS: I'm trying to get the sd28I case from hong-kong. If it works out, I could send you my bt-04 case without PSU for free, as long as you pay for the transportation.

 

[owim]

Hello qwerkus,

Thank you for the warm welcome and very informative reply!

1. Regarding OC, as I previously wrote, PC will be OC'd less than 1% of time and light OC only: no voltage regulation (only stock 1,2V), which allows me 3.2 -> 4.2GHz with stock cooler in seconds. That's not "good OC", so I'd say it might be "optimal". I don't really need a much better result, so B85 would serve it's purpose (don't really need more expensive Z-boards). Gigabyte can handle OC, I checked. Thank you for suggesting Asus H81I-Plus. H81 really has less connectors than B85 and the price is the same, so I think my choice would be:
a) GIGABYTE GA-B85N - 65 eur --or--
b) ASROCK B85M-ITX - 72 eur --or--
c) ASUS H81I-PLUS - 65 eur
Double-checked, all have BIOS update, can overclock, Gigabyte has fixed voltage to 1.2V, while ASRock does not have (can go 1,35V, for instance, on this board). Everything else is pretty much the same. My fav is ASRock at the moment. NewEgg comment:

With the latest BIOS 2.10 it does support the G3258 and it overclocks beautifully on such a low cost board. 4.6 Ghz at 1.37V

2. I think I did find a way to get BT-04 with 350W PSU; it will be more costly (they don't sell 350W version), but they'll get it for me. Thank you for pointing our the PSU importance.

4. Case choice: I guess I like BT-04 (small 12l tower format). The other option is LC Power ATX tower of 24l or cube like CoolerMaster Elite 110 (15l, I don't like cube form).

Can I put 1x 2.5" SDD + 2x 3.5" HDD + no optics?

Your GTR Hong Kong web page looks "scary" (like 15 years in the past); it might be a great product, but... who knows. And shipping from that far would double the cost.

Let me thank you for your kind offering to send me your BT-04 case. However, you know I'm in Europe, there is an Ocean between us, I guess packing + transport would be higher than buying a new one here.

Good luck with GTS sd28i!

 

[qwerkus]

My fav is ASRock at the moment.

Good board. There is a german thread on http://www.hardwareluxx.de/ where they try to build <10W comps, and this asrock board is one of the favorites.

Your GTR Hong Kong web page looks "scary" (like 15 years in the past); it might be a great product, but... who knows. And shipping from that far would double the cost.

Don't get scared by looks. I just ordered an aluminum case from shenzen - everything went for the best. The thing is, in my experience, you have to engage into extensive discussion before buying anything from china, to make sure you understand each other. Direct-from-china is the future. Most of the stuff you use (like 99%) for comps is already from there. Why pay for the middle man ?

Let me thank you for your kind offering to send me your BT-04 case. However, you know I'm in Europe, there is an Ocean between us, I guess packing + transport would be higher than buying a new one here.

I actually live in germany at the moment... Though I could not find a retailer for the sd28i yet. GTR replied pretty fast, but they don't do retails apparently.

 

[owim]

Hello qwerkus, greetings to Germany!

Did you find a retailer for sd28i so far? I fully agree on everything you wrote regarding China. However, since I experienced "extensive discussion" with them, I still keep on using the middle man, and order just little inexpensive frills from DX.com.

Regarding Chieftec BT-04B, it's still on it's way. Can I put 1x 2.5" SDD + 2x 3.5" HDD + no optics?

Thanks a lot!

 

[edward78]

The PSU is removable, built in doesn't mean attached to the case. That would be odd. silverstine has a 600w SFX now.

 

[owim]

Regarding my question
Can I put 1x 2.5" SSD + 2x 3.5" HDD + no optics?

If possible, can you pls tell where you would put 2x 3.5" HDD? One on top, over CPU? Maybe not a good idea. On bottom, next to the PSU, there is space. Is there enough space for 2x 3.5" HDD? Finally, where to put SSD inside of the case (yours was hanging out from the case). Can I put SSD instead low profile optics?

* * *

When you respond to this one I wahe one more question to ask.

Like always, thanks a lot!
Ivan

 

[qwerkus]

Regarding my question
Can I put 1x 2.5" SSD + 2x 3.5" HDD + no optics?

2x 2,5" + 1x 3,5" is no problem, if you don't used the gfx card. If you want a gfx card, maybe it's doable with a very lp cpu cooler. The latter config could theoretically allow you for 2x 2,5" + 2x3,5" hdds. Keep in mind that the more cramped your rig will be, the more lickely is the risk of overheating issue.

In my experience, there is no point in building mini itx comps and using 3,5" disks, since it defies the set goal of keeping it as small as possible - exept for NAS of course. 2,5" are just fine nowadays, and the price difference is minimal. Fitting 5x 2,5" hdd in this rig is absolutely possible, and you can still use the gfx slot.
The setup would be as follows:
- one under the front cover (maybe even two)
- two at the bottom, in front of the psu - one atop another
- two on the odd rails. Using a very lp cooler, you can even have 5x hdds + 1x odd.

best regards,

qwerkus

PS: still no sd28i

 

[owim]

Hello qwerkus, thanks for your kind reply as always. I just wrote a big one, and it was gone after submitting, so I'm writing again, just a shot version.

there is no point in building mini itx comps and using 3,5" disks

I know, it's just 3,5" drives have bigger plats and therefore they're faster. Also, 2,5" are not storage drives. Furthermore, I just got two new 3,5" drives and have to use them.

So, I'll definitely have 1x 2.5" SSD + 1x 3.5" HDD + 0x ODD + 0x gfx. Just wondering about putting my storage 2nd HDD, and I plan on using iGPU. Do you think that would be okay, or 2nd 3,5" HDD should go out?

 

[qwerkus]

So, I'll definitely have 1x 2.5" SSD + 1x 3.5" HDD + 0x ODD + 0x gfx. Just wondering about putting my storage 2nd HDD, and I plan on using iGPU. Do you think that would be okay, or 2nd 3,5" HDD should go out?

All depends on your cooler. Here you can read that if you put a 3,5" hdd on the odd rail, cpu cooler height is limited to 60mm. So no overclocking.

On a sidenote, I understand less and less your build. If you're using the igpu, why get the bt-04b ? The flyer is much smaller, comes with a decent psu, and offers plenty of space for hdds... The whole point of getting a bt04 is my opinion is to enjoy the full size gfx slot.

 

[qwerkus]

Should anyone be interested, I'm selling this case (withou PSU). 30€+shipment. Of course, it's only interesting if you live in Europe.

 

[edward78]

I like it, but the handle (or what ever it is supposed to be), is strange & I see a silver one on their site laying on it;s side, but can't find anything on that one...

 

[kierwest]

I am not a fan the case choice... sorry:/

 

[qwerkus]

Case sold, and system transferred to a new one. Here is the build log