Can bad sectors get copied too?

D

Duckzilla

Limp Gawd
Joined
Dec 13, 2002
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468
I just bought a new WD drive to replace the one I have now. The old one is a Maxtor and scan disk shows 32,768 bytes in bad sectors on it. When I copied the old to the new, the bad sectors got copied too. Has anyone ever seen this before?

I'm thinking that the Maxtor may not be truly damaged after all, it just has some seriously corrupted data on it that only writing zeroes may fix. I'm using FAT32 in case anyone is wondering.
 
I don't think that the bad sectors will get copied, but if you have corrupt files they will still be corrupted after a copy.
 
Thats what I thought, but scan disk is showing the same number of bad sectors on the new drive as the old.
 
do a chkdsk /r or scandisk /c or /t

I presume you used a partition copying utility... it copied the FAT/MBR etc. and those list the bad sectors, so you copied the record of the bad sectors over...

Untill you tell it to rescan them (will take a long time) it will assume those sectors are bad.

==>Lazn
 
Sorry, I was thinking that you meant doing an explorer drag and drop type copy. What Lazn said makes sense...
 
as mentioned its likely a filesystem isssue not physical sectors on the new drive
some info
Enhanced Chkdsk, Autochk, and Chkntfs Tools in Windows 2000
and NTFS Data Integrity

FileSystem

An Explanation of CHKDSK and the New /C and /I Switches

<MORE

"To understand when it might be appropriate to use these switches (/C and /I) , it is important to have a basic understanding of some of the internal NTFS data structures, the kinds of corruption that can take place, what actions CHKDSK takes when it verifies a volume, and what the potential consequences are in circumventing CHKDSK's usual verification steps.

CHKDSK's activity is split into three major "passes" during which it examines all the "metadata" on the volume and an optional fourth pass. Metadata is "data about data." It is the file system overhead, so to speak, that is used to keep track of everything about all of the files on the volume. Metadata tells what allocation units make up the data for a given file, what allocation units are free, what allocation units contain bad sectors, and so on. The "contents" of a file, on the other hand, is termed "user data." NTFS protects its metadata through the use of a transaction log. User data is not so protected.

During its first pass, CHKDSK displays a message on the screen saying that it is verifying files and counts from 0 to 100 percent complete. During this phase, CHKDSK examines each file record segment (FRS) in the volume's master file table (MFT). Every file and directory on an NTFS volume is uniquely identified by a specific FRS in the MFT and the percent complete that CHKDSK displays during this phase is the percent of the MFT that has been verified. During this pass, CHKDSK examines each FRS for internal consistency and builds two bitmaps, one representing what FRSs are in use, and the other representing what clusters on the volume are in use. At the end of this phase, CHKDSK knows what space is in use and what space is available both within the MFT and on the volume as a whole. NTFS keeps track of this information in bitmaps of its own that are stored on the disk allowing CHKDSK to compare its results with NTFS's stored bitmaps. If there are discrepancies, they are noted in CHKDSK's output. For example, if an FRS that had been in use is found to be corrupted, the disk clusters formerly associated with that FRS will end up being marked as available in CHKDSK's bitmap, but will be marked as being "in use" according to NTFS's bitmap.

During its second pass, CHKDSK displays a message on the screen saying that it is verifying indexes and counts from 0 to 100 percent complete a second time. During this phase, CHKDSK examines each of the indexes on the volume. Indexes are essentially NTFS directories and the percent complete that CHKDSK displays during this phase is the percent of the total number of directories on the volume that have to be checked. During this pass, CHKDSK examines each directory on the volume for internal consistency and also verifies that every file and directory represented by an FRS in the MFT is referenced by at least one directory. It also confirms that every file or subdirectory referenced in each directory actually exists as a valid FRS in the MFT and checks for circular directory references. Finally, it confirms that the various time stamps and file size information associated with files are all up-to-date in the directory listings for those files. At the end of this phase, CHKDSK has ensured that there are no "orphaned" files and that all the directory listings are for legitimate files. An orphaned file is one for which a legitimate FRS exists, but which is not listed in any directory. When an orphaned file is found, it can often be restored to its rightful directory, provided that directory is still around. If the directory that should hold the file no longer exists, CHKDSK will create a directory in the root directory and place the file there. If directory listings are found that reference FRSs that are no longer in use or that are in use but do not correspond to the file listed in the directory, the directory entry is simply removed.

During its third pass, CHKDSK displays a message on the screen saying that it is verifying security descriptors and counts from 0 to 100 percent complete a third time. During this phase, CHKDSK examines each of the security descriptors associated with each of the files and directories on the volume. Security descriptors contain information regarding the owner of the file or directory, NTFS permission for the file or directory, and auditing information for the file or directory. The percent complete in this case is the percent of the number of files and directories on the volume. CHKDSK verifies that each security descriptor structure is well formed and internally consistent. It does not verify that the listed users or groups actually exist or that the permissions granted are in any way appropriate.

The fourth pass of CHKDSK is only invoked if the /R switch is used. /R is used to locate bad sectors in the volume's free space. When /R is used, CHKDSK attempts to read every sector on the volume to confirm that the sector is usable. Sectors associated with metadata are read during the natural course of running CHKDSK even when /R is not used. Sectors associated with user data are read during earlier phases of CHKDSK provided /R is specified. When an unreadable sector is located, NTFS will add the cluster containing that sector to its list of bad clusters and, if the cluster was in use, allocate a new cluster to do the job of the old. If a fault tolerant disk driver is being used, data is recovered and written to the newly allocated cluster. Otherwise, the new cluster is filled with a pattern of 0xFF bytes. When NTFS encounters unreadable sectors during the course of normal operation, it will also remap them in the same way. Thus, the /R switch is usually not essential, but it can be used as a convenient mechanism for scanning the entire volume if a disk is suspected of having bad sectors.

The preceding paragraphs give only the broadest outline of what CHKDSK is actually doing to verify the integrity of an NTFS volume. There are many specific checks made during each pass and several quick checks between passes that have not been mentioned. Instead, this is simply an outline to the more important facets of CHKDSK activity as a basis for the following discussion regarding the time required to run CHKDSK and the impact of the new switches provided in SP4"

MORE>
Click to expand...

also an excerpt of the Data Storage FAQ > Corruption 101
 
Ice Czar said:
as mentioned its likely a filesystem isssue not physical sectors on the new drive
some info
Enhanced Chkdsk, Autochk, and Chkntfs Tools in Windows 2000
and NTFS Data Integrity



also an excerpt of the Data Storage FAQ > Corruption 101
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info, but I quickly scanned that and saw that it was peppered with "NTFS" so I didn't actually read it. As I stated before, I use FAT32. I'm doing a DOS-based scan disk on the new drive and will report back. Thanks again.
 
you know, I actually read that and then spaced it out :p
tryin to do too many things at once

NTFS is a journaling file system. It writes a log of changes being made to the files on disk. This offers significant benefits in cases where a system is susceptible to power loss, experiences an unexpected reboot, or a crash. NTFS can quickly return a disk to a consistent state without running CHKDSK, whereas FAT32 always requires CHKDSK to be run effect recovery if a failure occurs.
Click to expand...

http://www.computerhope.com/chkdskh.htm
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MS-DOS, Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows ME chkdsk syntax

Checks a disk and displays a status report.

CHKDSK [drive:][[path]filename] [/F] [/V]

[drive:][path] Specifies the drive and directory to check.
filename Specifies the file(s) to check for fragmentation.
/F Fixes errors on the disk.
/V Displays the full path and name of every file on the disk.
Type CHKDSK without parameters to check the current disk.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
so your limited to the above, while NTFS adds so much more
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Windows 2000, Windows XP chkdsk syntax

Checks a disk and displays a status report.

CHKDSK [volume[[path]filename]]] [/F] [/V] [/R] [/X] [/I] [/C] [/L[:size]]

volume Specifies the drive letter (followed by a colon), mount point, or volume name.
filename FAT only: Specifies the files to check for fragmentation.
/F Fixes errors on the disk.
/V On FAT/FAT32: Displays the full path and name of every file on the disk.
/R Locates bad sectors and recovers readable information (implies /F).
/L:size NTFS only: Changes the log file size to the specified number of kilobytes. If size is not specified, displays current size.
/X Forces the volume to dismount first if necessary. All opened handles to the volume would then be invalid (implies /F).
/I NTFS only: Performs a less vigorous check of index entries.
/C NTFS only: Skips checking of cycles within the folder structure.

The /I or /C switch reduces the amount of time required to run Chkdsk by skipping certain checks of the volume.

Microsoft Windows 2000 and Windows XP users should also consider using the CHKNTFS command.

CHKNTFS SYNTAX

Displays or modifies the checking of disk at boot time.

CHKNTFS volume [...]
CHKNTFS /D
CHKNTFS /T[:time]
CHKNTFS /X volume [...]
CHKNTFS /C volume [...]

volume Specifies the drive letter (followed by a colon), mount point, or volume name.
/D Restores the machine to the default behavior; all drives are checked at boot time and chkdsk is run on those that are dirty.
/T:time Changes the AUTOCHK initiation count down time to the specified amount of time in seconds. If time is not specified, displays the current setting.
/X Excludes a drive from the default boot-time check. Excluded drives are not accumulated between command invocations.
/C Schedules a drive to be checked at boot time; chkdsk will run if the drive is dirty.

If no switches are specified, CHKNTFS will display if the specified drive is dirty or scheduled to be checked on next reboot.
 
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