Build me a Setup

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zwbuntster

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 26, 2005
Messages
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Ok, here is the deal:
I am a television production student beginning to do a lot of my own project and such and really need a setup of my own away from campus stuff. I have the oringial MBP from years ago that just is not gonna cut it and is pretty much falling apart anyway. I am dealing with large 1080HD files, so keep that in mind. For the least amount possible and keeping the following "necessities" in mind, what would be your approach

obviously ability to easily run FCP with high-res files
photoshop work
able to handle even greater files in the near future (2 years at least)
still need to be able to take notes and such in class (come back to later)

So obviously I need a laptop of some sort for the mobility and working with school work and such. So, my ideal approach would be obviously a Mac Pro and maybe an Air for those occasions but that's just out of my budget. There is no set amount but the lower the better. What do you think?
 
You seem to know fairly well what you require. I don't want to seem negative etc, but you know what you need it to do, picking the hardware for your requirements and budget is basically all about going online and looking at the Apple store.

If there truly was no budget, your last option would be fine, but clearly there is one or you'd just do that.

Operating under the assumption that you have about 3k to spend and therefore can't realistically afford multiple machines, a fully upgraded MBP 15" would be an incredible workhorse. i7, 8GB of RAM, SSD, and 1680x1050 in a portable package that small is compelling. For 1080p, you'd simply use an external monitor. Of course if you need 1080p wherever you go, then the 17" is the only alternative.

With the same 3k budget, it would be possible to buy a base level 11" MBA, and a base level 27" i5 iMac. That would be a pretty workable setup as well, although having some additional money to upgrade the RAM on both system would help a lot as well as moving to SSD's and bumping up the processors... that all goes without saying of course...
 
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A base level 27" i5 iMac costs only about 2K so a 3K budget will earn you an i7 and an SSD already.
 
the thing that worries me about the i5 iMacs is the processing and video card. I'm sure it would be able to handle the footage decently now but I don't see that really being the case for very long
 
Haiku214 said:
A base level 27" i5 iMac costs only about 2K so a 3K budget will earn you an i7 and an SSD already.
Click to expand...

Please re-read my post. I stated the purchasing of two machines in that particular setup.


zwbuntster said:
the thing that worries me about the i5 iMacs is the processing and video card. I'm sure it would be able to handle the footage decently now but I don't see that really being the case for very long
Click to expand...


It's all a matter of what is deemed to be "enough". People tend to forget that post has been done on machines far less powerful. Additionally you may find this article interesting:

http://www.barefeats.com/imac10c.html
You'll see an 8 core Mac Pro whoop on an i7 iMac...

http://www.macworld.com/reviews/product/343881/review/27inch_imac_core_i5266ghz.html?expand=true
That was written about the first gen 27" i7 iMac not even the newer upgraded model with better video card. However it's still relevant as that's the only change. Towards the bottom of the article they show the full suite of tests they did (and they did A LOT of tests)... you'll see the iMac coming out ahead vs the Mac Pro's in a lot of them.

What these articles tell me, and perhaps you: If you want a Mac Pro that will perform better than an iMac, be prepared to pay for something with 8-cores or above (and actually be using software that can utilize that many threads...). Expect to have to have more than 8GB of Ram, and/or expect to shell out tons of money for a Quadro. Any of these options are going to push up your budget by alot. There are tons of articles written on this subject. When the 27" iMac came out in 2009, it was lauded. This was because it basically makes the base level Mac Pro redundant at best, over priced and unnecessary at the worst. Google around, you'll see what I mean quickly. To reiterate, if you want a faster machine you'll be paying a lot more money for it, which is fine if you have the money for it, but your first post made it sound like cost is an issue. I'm sure we'd all like to have 12-Core, 32GB, Dual Quadro Mac Pro's under our desk...

A 27" i7 iMac with 8GB of Ram is going to win every time going head to head against a base model 4 Core 2.66GHz with 8GB of Ram Mac Pro, and for the same cost you're getting a Mac 27" monitor thrown in.
 
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For serious production work, I still think the Mac Pro is the right choice despite its expense. For a few reasons:

1) Error-correcting memory. It's costly, but it's a valuable thing to have in a production environment.
2) Hard drive expandability with RAID support. You won't have to rely on Firewire drives or a dedicated NAS unit with the Mac Pro.
3) Better cooling. The iMac uses a few centrifugal ("blower") fans that can become quite loud when pushed and are somewhat more prone to failure (typically). The Mac Pro uses several axial fans, so there's better redundancy against failure, they're a bit quieter when pushed, and the fans are, unless I'm misinformed, user-replaceable. The Mac Pro is less likely to be a doorstop if one of the fans should go out, unlike the iMac.

Don't make the mistake of making a decision based solely on performance.
 
zwbuntster said:
the thing that worries me about the i5 iMacs is the processing and video card. I'm sure it would be able to handle the footage decently now but I don't see that really being the case for very long
Click to expand...

Well, a single core Mac Pro is pretty much the same i7 that's in the 27" iMac i7... (imo lga1366 i7 vs lga1156 i7 is moot, if anything the 1156 i7 seems a bit better, but that's from a desktop PC viewpoint).

With an education discount the BASE dual-cpu Mac Pro is $3200. If your budget is ~$3000 that's just not feasible...

But it seems pretty straightforward with the Mac lineup, it's alllll dictated by price
 
Arkangyl said:
Well, a single core Mac Pro is pretty much the same i7 that's in the 27" iMac i7... (imo lga1366 i7 vs lga1156 i7 is moot, if anything the 1156 i7 seems a bit better, but that's from a desktop PC viewpoint).

With an education discount the BASE dual-cpu Mac Pro is $3200. If your budget is ~$3000 that's just not feasible...

But it seems pretty straightforward with the Mac lineup, it's alllll dictated by price
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Precisely. Know your budget, know what you need, and buy it. It's pretty straightforward.


phide said:
For serious production work, I still think the Mac Pro is the right choice despite its expense. For a few reasons:

1) Error-correcting memory. It's costly, but it's a valuable thing to have in a production environment.
2) Hard drive expandability with RAID support. You won't have to rely on Firewire drives or a dedicated NAS unit with the Mac Pro.
3) Better cooling. The iMac uses a few centrifugal ("blower") fans that can become quite loud when pushed and are somewhat more prone to failure (typically). The Mac Pro uses several axial fans, so there's better redundancy against failure, they're a bit quieter when pushed, and the fans are, unless I'm misinformed, user-replaceable. The Mac Pro is less likely to be a doorstop if one of the fans should go out, unlike the iMac.

Don't make the mistake of making a decision based solely on performance.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree, it's just a cost issue. Like I said given the funds, we'd all like to have maxed out Mac Pro's. But it's just not feasible given our respective budgets.
 
i'd go for a top end 15" mbp. decent mobility and battery life for class. also, should have the power to handle some of those larger video editing tasks. also, figure out what the fastest external drive options are and get the largest drive you can.
 
this may sound a little crazy, but how would something like the top iMac or lower Mac Pro and the second gen iPad once it comes?
 
UnknownSouljer said:
I don't disagree, it's just a cost issue. Like I said given the funds, we'd all like to have maxed out Mac Pro's. But it's just not feasible given our respective budgets.
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The OP is a little ambiguous about what the budget is, though. He says that a Mac Pro and an Air would be out of his budget (in which case it would just be question of "which iMac/Mac mini do I buy?"), but then he states there isn't a strict budget.

Obviously if you straight up can't afford a Mac Pro, then the Mac Pro is not the right choice. But if the budget is just "the lower the better", I would argue for the Mac Pro as opposed to the iMac despite its high cost. For a production machine, I simply prefer machines designed specifically for that purpose, whether that's a PC, a Mac, whatever :)
 
If you're strapped for cash, I recommend the 27" iMac. You can get an i5 or i7 based Mac in there with a $1000 2560x1440 IPS LCD built-in for about $2000. Throw in some FW800 drives if you want and you're in business. Small footprint, fast, quiet, really nice display, and if you have money left over you can get a super nice NEC LCD as a secondary.
 
If you need a laptop in the equation go for the i7 MBP, get a 17" for larger workspace for editing and for the expresscard34 slot. You can add an inexpensive esata expresscard and hook up to faster external raids for editing.
A decent secondary IPS panel screen can be under $500-400.
Expresscard slot will also be handy if you're doing any XDcam EX work, as those cameras shoot directly to expresscards that can plug right into the 17" MBP and you can copy files over to a firewire drive(without esata card the next best on the MBP is firewire800).
If you have the cash get the ssd for your internal drive(always do editing/store footage on externals), that should tide you over for a 2 years while until you can regain your funds and get the Mac Pro.

Now the only issue I see is that the MBPs are due for an upgrade within the coming months. Coming from the MB air upgrade they could add built in flash storage with possibly a secondary drive/ssd, new chipsets will mean faster processors and likely new GPUs.
 
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A little while ago, a friend of mine picked up a pretty much base model Mac Pro for $1000 put another ~$500 into it, including 12GB of memory and it runs like a champ.

Look for a 1-2 generation old Mac Pro used, add memory, HD and video card with video acceleration and you'll be set ;)
 
You don't need a new laptop to take notes in class. Continue to use your current MBP, though I recommend pen and paper over a laptop for notetaking.

Hackintosh is an option. It'll be cheap, but you'll have to fiddle with it often. Are you able and willing to do that?

Video work parallelizes easily so you want an i7. The real question is how much hard drive you need. If you need RAID for the throughput, you're gonna pay Mac Pro money. That's it. That's why they sell it. That's why they can charge those prices.

If not, $1700 buys you an education + refurb iMac i7 right now.
 
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1. i don't want to deal with a hackintosh since i will be dealing with final cut, compressor, etc and would like to not have to worry about fiddling around and such

2. i realize i can use my current notebook for whatever mobile needs until it dies (which is very well could any day now)

3. i like the 27" iMac but am not sure if that is as future proof as maybe waiting and saving more for a better mac pro
 
zwbuntster said:
1. i don't want to deal with a hackintosh since i will be dealing with final cut, compressor, etc and would like to not have to worry about fiddling around and such

2. i realize i can use my current notebook for whatever mobile needs until it dies (which is very well could any day now)

3. i like the 27" iMac but am not sure if that is as future proof as maybe waiting and saving more for a better mac pro
Click to expand...

Future proof in what sense? For hard drive space you can get additional FW800 drives. RAM can be upgraded. Get it preinstalled with 8GB of RAM or install it yourself, and if you want 16GB in the future you can also do that yourself.

The thing to keep in mind with Macs is that they retain their value very well. I sold a three year old iMac for about 60% what I paid for it. When it is time to upgrade, don't think in terms of incremental component upgrading, instead you are swapping out the entire system.

It actually worked out very well, in that along with a faster system I also upgraded from a 24" IPS display to a 27" IPS at 2560x1440. I honestly wish it was as cost effective and easy to upgrade my gaming PCs in the same way.

In any case, I believe that the iMacs are a very good value, especially the 27" given the cost of their displays when bought separately from Apple or Dell. The main thing a Mac Pro buys you is rendering time, but that is the difference between a multiple i7 Xeons and a single vanilla i7. In terms of running FCS, the iMac does great.
 
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