Budget Options

Eradan

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 7, 2006
Messages
1,188
I have two iPads, two iPhones (I've had my iPhone 6+ since Friday and love it), and an Apple TV in the house but the wife and I are still using Windows PCs. I recently considered bailing on all the Apple stuff because I was pretty disgusted with iTunes on Windows and wanted to see what else was out there. After poking around with Android phones, tablets, and TV devices for a few weeks, I think we're going to stay put. Looking forward to iOS 9, Apple Music, and the rumors about the future of their TV services are really interesting. I grew up on Commodore and the Amiga 500 is my favorite computer of all time. There's something about the Macs that, IMHO, is reminiscent of the old Commodore stuff and I've often considered making the jump but never did because of PC gaming.

At this point, I'm interested in the possibility of obtaining a Mac computer as my daily driver. The PC in my sig is what I currently use and was built for gaming. I honestly don't game much any more and a lot of the stuff I have my on my radar is available for Mac (Wasteland 2, for example). And then there's Bootcamp as well. What I'm looking for is a good value on something used that will give me a chance to see if I will like moving fully into OS X. Other than the occasional game, most of my time at the PC is spent browsing, listening to music, Excel, Word. There are a few web-based apps that I use which are based on Silverlight. I'm seeing a lot of Apple stuff on Craigslist from 2008-2009 that's affordable but I'm not sure what I should be looking for. I'd prefer a desktop or Mac Mini but a laptop would be fine if I can connect to the Asus monitor in my sig.

Any thoughts on how to dip a toe in the water without spending a ton of money? Can I do this for $300 or $400? If all goes well, I'd invest in something new at that point.

Finally, I am aware of Hackintosh, a subject which I know is verboten here at [H], in case someone is going to suggest that. I'm a 20 year IT professional and it doesn't look particularly daunting. I do own a copy of Snow Leopard that I bought a few years ago when I was supporting a firm with a Mac-based art department. Never did anything with it. I haven't ruled that out but will seek detailed guidance on that elsewhere.

Thanks for reading. Appreciate any suggestions/comments.
 
Finally, I am aware of Hackintosh, a subject which I know is verboten here at [H], in case someone is going to suggest that.

Does this forum actually have a rule about Hackintosh discussions? I am wondering why you would be discouraged from discussing it here.
 
It's in violation of the OSX EULA from what I understand. And I generally adhere pretty strictly to that stuff, but I'm considering making an exception to test the waters before spending what to me would be a significant sum of money on Mac hardware. I'd prefer, however, to find a good value on something used though...hence my OP.
 
There are lots of options. If you want bargain basement budget, then I'm sure you can find a Mac Mini within your budget without too much work.

In terms of power, you'll want to get specific specs for the best experience.

You'll want a machine made in 2011 or later if you want an i5/i7 (which you do).
2012 or later if you want USB3.

Depending on the machine you may want the lowest specs possible and just upgrade them yourself. RAM and HDDs are upgradeable in Minis.

Other than that you can look for 2010-2011 MBAs if you want something portable or 13" MBPs. Finding these with decent specs will be more difficult on your budget however. Still possible.



Does this forum actually have a rule about Hackintosh discussions? I am wondering why you would be discouraged from discussing it here.

It's in violation of the OSX EULA from what I understand. And I generally adhere pretty strictly to that stuff, but I'm considering making an exception to test the waters before spending what to me would be a significant sum of money on Mac hardware. I'd prefer, however, to find a good value on something used though...hence my OP.

That is correct. Anything that is against TOS for other pieces of software is banned on the [H].
 
I would probably avoid hackintosh if you are trying to figure out if the "pure" OSX experience is right for you. You don't want to be dealing with issues of hardware incompatibility, OS updates screwing up your setup, etc. If you must hackintosh, Notebookreview's forum allows discussion, and people are pretty accommodating over there in that respect.

I'd recommend trying to get a refurb/used mac mini with min specs; however, you will want a 2012 unit as it was the last version that has user accessible parts. The revised mac mini opted for soldered RAM and a more power efficient CPU (internals are similar to MBAir).

If you can find a 2012, you can beef up the RAM to 8 or 16gb at a reasonable price and even slip a SSD in to maximize the experience while keeping costs to an acceptable minimum. Good luck!
 
I'm Mac Mini shopping. I want to get the Apple keyboard and mouse, too, for the full experience. There's an article floating around right now about an Amiga 2000 still in use to control HVAC systems for a school. Makes me nostalgic for the days when computers were fun. Hoping the Mac will rekindle that sense of fun, but a little skeptical...I'm sure my problem these days is me.
 
I would go Mac Mini. It is going to be the most powerful budget machine. The iMac you pay for the monitor/form factor. Laptops are all old and underpowered for your budget.

Even new the Mac Mini's are very affordable if you have a monitor and such you can use. Plus they are the most upgradable at this point.

Personally I HATED apple machines for the longest time. I finally started liking them once Lion came around and much more so with Mavericks. I rock rMBPs' for my laptops and still use windows machines for my desktops. I still like the productivity on windows a bit better, but the integration is really nice on OSX with iPhone, iPad, etc.

I would recommend running a virtual machine for windows in VMWare Fusion or Parrallels over going the bootcamp route. Nice to be able to run both OSes side by side.
 
I would go Mac Mini. It is going to be the most powerful budget machine. The iMac you pay for the monitor/form factor. Laptops are all old and underpowered for your budget.

Even new the Mac Mini's are very affordable if you have a monitor and such you can use. Plus they are the most upgradable at this point.

Personally I HATED apple machines for the longest time. I finally started liking them once Lion came around and much more so with Mavericks. I rock rMBPs' for my laptops and still use windows machines for my desktops. I still like the productivity on windows a bit better, but the integration is really nice on OSX with iPhone, iPad, etc.

I would recommend running a virtual machine for windows in VMWare Fusion or Parrallels over going the bootcamp route. Nice to be able to run both OSes side by side.

Do you game? Just wondering what the full screen gaming experience is like in Fusion or Parallels.
 
You know you won't be able to game on pretty much everything Apple unless you pony up at least $1300 right?
 
I don't know shit. That's why I'm asking questions.

Sorry, that was the minimum price for gaming on "new" Apple hardware. You might be able to get it for less, but for some stupid reason people pay outlandish prices for used Apple gear.

Anyway, here's a rundown of gaming capability of all current Apple products:

All Mac Minis use crappy Intel integrated graphics.

All iMacs under $1300 use crappy Intel integrated graphics, and the $1300 model has Iris Pro (faster, but still Intel) And really you need to spend $1600 for a crappy Nvidia GTX 650 equivalent. You'll end up dropping well over $2000 for the iMac with a Radeon R9 285.

All Macbook Airs use crappy Intel integrated graphics.

Macbook Pro 15" with discrete graphics (featuring cutting-edge HD 7770) starts at $2500. All other models use Intel Iris Pro.


Basically, if you want to game beyond casual, and you have ANY budget at all, new Macs are a lost cause. Most people are smart and keep separate gaming systems, or look for used deals like you.

If you want to try out OS X, the Mini is the best way to do it. But don't expect to find any other use for it, as Apple does not believe in easily upgradable systems.
 
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I think my plan is to go for a Mini to (hopefully) use for all my non-gaming stuff because I want the integration with my iPhone/iPad. Will keep my sig PC as my gaming rig. I'm looking to upgrade my display (and video card) to either 1440 or 4K and share that between both systems, but will swap input devices accordingly. That's if I can get used to the Apple keyboard.

Thanks for the input! :)
 
Thunderbolt eGPU enclosures are becoming more do-able and less expensive. There is a $189 Akitio box you can use as a base, and TBH if you are okay with using a GTX 750 Ti you can get away with using the stock enclosure with an upgraded power brick.

http://forum.techinferno.com/implementation-guides-apple/

Check there for guides. Keep in mind the 2012 Mac Mini uses Thunderbolt 1 not Thunderbolt 2, if you were looking to get a quad-core Mac Mini. I am selling off my gaming rig and iPad to get a used 15" rMBP base, and if I get into any heavier gaming again down the road that is what I planned to do.
 
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$189 for enclosure that supports 25w cards, so really $225 to 250 with a better PSU? That's $350-400 with graphics card!

Holy crap that's a stupid waste of money just to add a GTX 750 Ti. And although it would be a reasonable "investment" for a hardcore Mac user (can plug it into your next machine), that's incredibly overpriced for a one-off upgrade to make a castrated machine more viable for a potential one-time user.

I've never understood this infatuation to spend almost as much as the cost of a second dedicated PC just to add a feature like this.

Signed,

One-time OS X User.
 
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You need a $20 120W AC-DC brick with the same 5.5mm plug to support the 750 Ti. Don't blow it out of proportion. For guys that are going to do a GTX 960/970/980 then you can get a $35 cheapo Corsair PSU that provides 350watts.

You're neglecting the several hundred dollars in parts + video card you would need to have your own windows box instead in addition to the Mac... I agree the 750 Ti isn't the most economical choice vs doing this with a 970, but it is the easiest route if you are not playing demanding games.

How is a quad-core 2012 Mac Mini castrated besides the video card?
 
Apple isn't really a great gaming platform. I'm a hardcore Apple user, but if I still gamed I would recommend keeping maybe a small SFF system to game on if I cared.

I use a 2011 iMac, and it's passable for D2/SC2/Wasteland and FPS's that are made in 2011 or before at native resolution, but anything more modern I know I'll have to game at 1080p or below, with other compromised settings (not maxed). And that's fine, because that isn't the big reason to have a Mac for me.

To reiterate, if you game, Windows will always be king. But everyone else getting a lot of serious work done is perfectly happy with Linux/Unix/derivatives thereof & OSX.
 
Yeah, ultimately I agree with that, they are meant more for productivity machines. It was just nice to see an alternative open up if you only want one box that didn't cost $800 out the gate like the Sonnett boxes used to be.
 
You need a $20 120W AC-DC brick with the same 5.5mm plug to support the 750 Ti. Don't blow it out of proportion. For guys that are going to do a GTX 960/970/980 then you can get a $35 cheapo Corsair PSU that provides 350watts.

Last time I checked, $190 + $35 = $225, which is my low-ball in my post above. $225 + $130-150 GTX Ti ..............................WAIT FOR IT.........$355 WITH CARD! Therefore., my estimate of: $350-400.

[JOBS]Why won't IT READ? [/JOBS]

You're neglecting the several hundred dollars in parts + video card you would need to have your own windows box instead in addition to the Mac.

Let's come back down to planet earth here.

Core i5 Dell with 8GB ram and expansion slot: $450:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0..._m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=07EKT8GP5XTTEMA3SM11
 
As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
Oh, I got it. You're just a dick with a four-year-old's case of Tourette's. Great, I'll just pity all the people that have to work with you then.

Also, my solution is still cheaper then your $450 box that doesn't come with a video card.
 
I spend such a small amount of time actually gaming on my PC these days that I'm not going to lock myself to Windows just for that purpose. I just got Yosemite running in VMWare on my Windows 8.1 rig and am really liking it so far. I may go full Hackintosh so I can just flip back and forth if I do want to game. I also plan to buy a friend's Macbook Pro in a few weeks. I think it's a 2011 but he's offering it to me for $100 if I will migrate his data off it to a new one. Pretty excited about all this new stuff.
 
Sorry for the rude comments in the thread. I hope that 2011 MBP works out for you.
 
Sorry for the rude comments in the thread. I hope that 2011 MBP works out for you.

No worries, sir. Thanks for the input...checking out the info you provided now while I wait for my Yosemite USB drive to build on this VM. :D
 
That 2011 Macbook is your best bet.

I just sold my 2012 mac mini for $760 dollars ($750 but the guy handed me all twenties and told me not to worry about the change because I was selling it for nearly half what they were going for on eBay and mine had 8gb memory and a 180gb ssd).
 
Turns out it's a 15" mid 2010 Macbook Pro with a 2.4GHz i5 and 4GB RAM. I'll still take it for that price. Trying to get a Clover Hackintosh running on my sig PC has been a pain in the ass. Going to look into refurb Mac Mini's this week.
 
There's no reason to bother with a mac mini. You won't be able to get a decent one on the same level of the macbook for a reasonable price. You sound disappointed with that macbook...but that's actually a very nice macbook pro that will handle all the things you want to do with it and fetch more than you paid on the used market.

Instead of a mac mini spend the coin on an SSD, more RAM, an external keyboard/trackpad, and monitor and enjoy the best of both worlds: laptop and desktop OS X. You don't even need to worry about all the external peripherals unless you want to. You can simply VNC into the laptop from your windows box--it's built into OS X natively.
 
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