brothers in arms: cod rip off?

[Stiler]

Have you fired any of the WWII era guns?

They aren't refined in the least. They are made of steel and wood. Not the lightest pieces of weaponry. Have you ever noticed the shape of the canteen cups? Then looked at the butt of teh B.A.R.? Ever heard of marching fire? The BAR gunners would put teh cup on their belt, turn it sideways instert the butt of the BAR into it and "fire-from-the-hip" There was no "aiming" of a BAR there is no physical way of doing so from a standing position, you'd have to be prone to aim it. So, the marching fire became the standard. Recoil on a BAR was insane as well.

Same stood for the Thompson. The gun either had the 31 round magazine or a 100 round drum. It weighed about 20 or so pounds unloaded and about 30 or so loaded (drum), not the lightest gun compared to say an M-16 or MP5 in the least.

With BiA they went for uber realism. Hell, one of the guys from that unit helped in making the game. It's based off of a real military unit during WWII. Everything that is done in the game is based off of actual events.

I've heard nothing but good things about this game and have been to Wal-Mart several times this week to pick it up but they haven't had it I'm disappointed in Wally-World. They suck.Maybe this weekend.

20 pounds for a thomspon?
try around 11lbs....

though it was more of a weight compared to other smgs.

The thompson had both a 20 round and a 30 round box mag and a 50 round drum. The paratroopers used the 20 round magazine because the 30 round mags had a tendency to come out because of their weight and things.

as far as: "Hell, one of the guys from that unit helped in making the game. It's based off of a real military unit during WWII. Everything that is done in the game is based off of actual events. "

uhh, col antal wasn't part of the Unit...he's just an army historian guy who was in the army and he helped them make the game as realistic as they could in terms of authenticity.

The game is based on a real unit , however your character isn't a real guy.


On to the topic, anyone that has the game (for pc) tell me if it has Surround sound? there's talk about the game not featuring Surround sound? that's a HUGE disappointment if it doesn't, and I can't fathom why a new game of this calibur wouldn't have simple surround sound.

 

[HansB]

With BiA they went for uber realism. suck.Maybe this weekend.

Uber realisim must include not being able to open doors until you kill a certian amount of germans or hop over a 3 foot fence.

 

[versello]

So... WHERE ARE THE PIX?

 

[ProwlerTech]

The only problem with the iron sights aiming is recoil and muzzle flash. You have to come to the conclusion that Sgt. Baker is kinda wimpy and can't hold a rifle secure enough to keep the muzzle from kicking up about 5 inches after a shot. Not that that's abnormal, but you have to accept it.

The other problem is muzzle flash, after each shot you cannot see your target because your view is immediatly obstructed. Again, not abnormal.

Not to say these are 'problems', but inconveniances you might say. That's just the reality of the game. I've only played the first chapter or two, havent used any MG's aside from the mounted MG early in the game to see how they react.

My 2 cents...

 

[SuX0rz]

I'm really glad that BiA sounds like its more realistic. CoD and MoH have they're place but I'm sick of running and gunning UT style and blasting down a whole comany of Germans. I hate being but in situations where you have to destory a whole company of Tigers with your small squad who are only equipped with only pazerfausts (You might be able to disable a Tiger with one if you hit it in the right place, but there is not way you'd get it to explode like the game models it). Not to knock on them too hard but CoD and MoH are extremely simular. Sounds so far that BiA has taken a different approach.

 

[133]

this game is great, and hard as hell even though im playing on Normal.

And they were right, rushing in and trying to kill everyone does not work, the AI will pwn you!

I'm up to DDAY+3, forget the name of the mission, but my unit of men and a sherman tank are about to clear out a village and meet up w/leggit on the other side..

damn german paratroopers are tough, and its hard protecting my friendly tank from enemy panzerfausts

 

[Terpfen]

The only problem with the iron sights aiming is recoil and muzzle flash. You have to come to the conclusion that Sgt. Baker is kinda wimpy and can't hold a rifle secure enough to keep the muzzle from kicking up about 5 inches after a shot. Not that that's abnormal, but you have to accept it.

If it's not abnormal, what's the problem?

I wouldn't be surprised if the recoil was exaggerated slightly, because the point is to use your fire teams rather than going Rambo on your own. If you nab a couple of kills, that's fine, but Corrion and his guys should be taking care of things without you.

 

[I'm the Dude man]

this game is great, and hard as hell even though im playing on Normal.

And they were right, rushing in and trying to kill everyone does not work, the AI will pwn you!

I'm up to DDAY+3, forget the name of the mission, but my unit of men and a sherman tank are about to clear out a village and meet up w/leggit on the other side..

damn german paratroopers are tough, and its hard protecting my friendly tank from enemy panzerfausts

Well Shermans are a dime a dozen right? You should be allowed to have some of them blown away.

 

[ProwlerTech]

If it's not abnormal, what's the problem?

Later in my post I re-stated that it's not exactly a problem, just an inconvieniance or certainly 'different' if you're used to the CoD style of play. I say again, I'm not defending BiA or downing CoD, I really like both games. I'm just giving my opinion on it, after all, that's what this thread is for right?

 

[I'm the Dude man]

Later in my post I re-stated that it's not exactly a problem, just an inconvieniance or certainly 'different' if you're used to the CoD style of play. I say again, I'm not defending BiA or downing CoD, I really like both games. I'm just giving my opinion on it, after all, that's what this thread is for right?

You'd think that, but not true. The thread is for relentlessly tearing the game apart attribute by attribute until people either think "screw that, it sucks" or "fuck it, I'm gonna buy it anyway."

 

[Stiler]

The other problem is muzzle flash, after each shot you cannot see your target because your view is immediatly obstructed. Again, not abnormal.


My 2 cents...

Actually, it is abnormal.

Guns do NOT have a muzzle flash like that every single time you fire, you hardly see a muzzle flash during the day like that either.

On the forums people pointed this out and they said they did it for "Game'ism" reasons, for "feedback" that someone was firing at you so you could see it or what not.

I'm really glad that BiA sounds like its more realistic. CoD and MoH have they're place but I'm sick of running and gunning UT style and blasting down a whole comany of Germans. I hate being but in situations where you have to destory a whole company of Tigers with your small squad who are only equipped with only pazerfausts (You might be able to disable a Tiger with one if you hit it in the right place, but there is not way you'd get it to explode like the game models it). Not to knock on them too hard but CoD and MoH are extremely simular. Sounds so far that BiA has taken a different approach.

You're going to be disappointed with the tanks in BIA then, it's pretty much the same way, you find a very......"convient" cache of bazooka's (infinite amount) and you can take down the tanks, they explode and literally fly up in the air a bit (the whole tank).

Seems a bit arcadey in that aspect. the infrantry and such is more realistic though. I just wish the tanks were, and you had to use DIFFERENT means to take them down, or simply hide from them and wait it out if you don't have a way to take them out.

I would have liked to have been able to fire into the slights on the tanks, have a flamethrower, and take out the tracks on them so they can't move, or use molativ's.

 

[ProwlerTech]

Actually, it is abnormal.

Guns do NOT have a muzzle flash like that every single time you fire, you hardly see a muzzle flash during the day like that either.

I agree it is abnormal with modern weapons, especially during the daylight. I don't know much about the weapons of that timeframe so I refrained from stating otherwise. If they did or didn't, I simply don't know. Muzzle flash IS 'real', just how much these weapons really had it is my question.

I grew up using firearms and I agree, you don't see it unless your a bystander and it's dark out.

 

[Moose777]

Uber realisim must include not being able to open doors until you kill a certian amount of germans or hop over a 3 foot fence.

Sorry, I don't have the game just yet. Didn't know that. I was going off of old information about the game somethign I saw on TV a while back about it.

And as for the Thompson and the 50 round drum there was also a 100 round drum. I knew my weights were off. The point of what I was trying to say is that the guns from back in WWII aren't made of lightweight composite materials that todays weapons are so comparing todays weapons to weapons used during WWII isn't the same.

I'll just discontinue posting to the thread. Sorry.

 

[finalgt]

 

[doh-nut]

nice pic, but whos throwing that frisbee?

 

[Bugalaman]

wow! those graphics look better than HL2!

 

[Moose777]

20 pounds for a thomspon?
try around 11lbs....

though it was more of a weight compared to other smgs.

The thompson had both a 20 round and a 30 round box mag and a 50 round drum. The paratroopers used the 20 round magazine because the 30 round mags had a tendency to come out because of their weight and things.

as far as: "Hell, one of the guys from that unit helped in making the game. It's based off of a real military unit during WWII. Everything that is done in the game is based off of actual events. "

uhh, col antal wasn't part of the Unit...he's just an army historian guy who was in the army and he helped them make the game as realistic as they could in terms of authenticity.

The game is based on a real unit , however your character isn't a real guy.


On to the topic, anyone that has the game (for pc) tell me if it has Surround sound? there's talk about the game not featuring Surround sound? that's a HUGE disappointment if it doesn't, and I can't fathom why a new game of this calibur wouldn't have simple surround sound.

The first Thompsnon weighed in at 7 lbs. unloaded. But it also didn't have the buttstock nor the sights. So that's probably where the 11 lbs comes from. The very first "Tommy" gun was designed to fir .22 long rifle cartridge. It was later designed to fire, get this, .22 long and rim, .38 ACP, .45 ACP, 9mm Mauser and 9mm Luger rounds. The Mauser and Luger versions were experimental. It was then made to fire the Winchester .351 cartridge. But the only version that made it to production was the .45 ACP version.

Other various weights not related to the Thompson.

Luger = 2 pounds, 4 1/4" barrel, 8 round grip mag., 9mm.
Walther = 2.5 pounds, 4 3/4" barrel, 8 round grip mag., 9mm.
MP40 = 9 pounds, 33.5" overall, 32 round mag, 9mm, 500 rounds per minute (cyclic) 180 rounds per minute (pratical).
MP43/1 = 11 pounds, 37" overall, 7.92mm, 35-38 round mag., muzzle velocity 2200' per second.
MP44 (43/1 MODIFIED) = 9 pounds, 7.92mm, 5 round clip, effective range 800 yards.
Gewehr 41 = 7.92mm, 45" overall, 10 pounds 14 ounces, Two 5 round clips.
Model 42 AR = 7.92mm, length W/ bayonett 43 3/4", 9 pounds, 20 round mag.
Karabiner 43 (Gewehr 43) = 7.92mm, 45" overall, 10 pounds.
MG 34 = 7.92mm, 48" overall, 26.5 pounds (Bipod), 42 pounds (Tripod), belt or drum fed, 900 rounds per minute (cyclic), practical as a light machine gun 100 - 200 rounds per minute, practical as a heavy machinegun 300 rounds per minute. Effective range as a LMG 600 - 800 yards as a HMG 2k - 2500 yards.
MG 42 = 7.92, 49" overall, 23 3/4 pounds, mainly belt fed, cyclic rate of fire is 1200 - 1400 rounds a minute as a LMG it's about 250 rounds as a HMG it's about 500 rounds. Range: LMG 600 -800 yards, heavy 2k - 2500 yards. Can also be used on a bi or tri pod mount or on an aircraft. It is never used on tanks due to the shape of the barrel (square).

 

[I'm the Dude man]

Looks good to me.

I didn't realize it was only DVD. So couldn't get it yet.

 

[finalgt]

wow! those graphics look better than HL2!

Not exactly. The models are about on par with CoD. The game just ends up looking damn purdy in motion due to a combination of the light bloom effect, and really, really well-done environments. The foliage looks particularly cool.

edit: case in point

 

[DavePars7]

You can get behind an enemy tank and drop a granade down the hatch by pressing the "F" key, its a nice feature. Pay more attension to the help screens

I personally dont like the way the guns shoot. He has pretty awful aim even when prone, the rifles with iron sites weave up and down like a sniper rifle when the germans are 30 feet away. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasnt a soldier expected to hit a head sized target every time from 50 yards or more? You can sit there and empty clip after clip into an exposed soldiers leg/arm/helmet and the HAYBALE he is behind seems to extend out another foot, protecting him the whole time. If they are in supression mode it means you CANT hit them front on, even if they are exposed in someway.

What this means is the game always turns to the same exact tactics, simply have your team supress fire, then run up behind the impenetrable shield (dont worry they wont see you till you fire your first shot) and lite them up with your 20 round tompson...........sigh. I want the option to pick them apart if my aim is good enough, even with the awful accuracy. I dont want to have to sit there and wait for them to stupidly expose their entire upper half either....as is the case. When it comes to machine gun nests forget about it, you have to rush around it, even if the germans entire chest is exposed you will never hit him.

Sorry, bit of a rant, this game has some flaws though. Its still fun....with the tank tactics and differnt style of missions, I hope it can keep my interest.


edit: I just noticed Im a [H]Lite now hehe

 

[JEEVES/whohasmyname?]

You can get behind an enemy tank and drop a granade down the hatch by pressing the "F" key, its a nice feature. Pay more attension to the help screens

I personally dont like the way the guns shoot. He has pretty awful aim even when prone, the rifles with iron sites weave up and down like a sniper rifle when the germans are 30 feet away. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasnt a soldier expected to hit a head sized target every time from 50 yards or more? You can sit there and empty clip after clip into an exposed soldiers leg/arm/helmet and the HAYBALE he is behind seems to extend out another foot, protecting him the whole time. If they are in supression mode it means you CANT hit them front on, even if they are exposed in someway.

What this means is the game always turns to the same exact tactics, simply have your team supress fire, then run up behind the impenetrable shield (dont worry they wont see you till you fire your first shot) and lite them up with your 20 round tompson...........sigh. I want the option to pick them apart if my aim is good enough, even with the awful accuracy. I dont want to have to sit there and wait for them to stupidly expose their entire upper half either....as is the case. When it comes to machine gun nests forget about it, you have to rush around it, even if the germans entire chest is exposed you will never hit him.

Sorry, bit of a rant, this game has some flaws though. Its still fun....with the tank tactics and differnt style of missions, I hope it can keep my interest.


edit: I just noticed Im a [H]Lite now hehe

My thoughts exactly. I do not like how you cant hit them, and the few that you can you have to fire 3 mags at the guy before he goes down. Only other thing I do not like is the fact that you can not peak around corners. They put such an emphasis on supressing fire but yet they make you stand up to do so. You should be able to stick your head and gun around and fire.

The graphics do look good, but I do not like how everything is real foggy looking. And for some reason it makes me feel sea sick if i play for awhile. Not sure what it is but the whole thing just doesnt feel right.

I for one have not played an awful lot as this game does not keep my interest long enough. The game itself feels more like full spectrum warrior, but you have a useless gun in your hand.

JEEVES

 

[Stiler]

You can get behind an enemy tank and drop a granade down the hatch by pressing the "F" key, its a nice feature. Pay more attension to the help screens

I personally dont like the way the guns shoot. He has pretty awful aim even when prone, the rifles with iron sites weave up and down like a sniper rifle when the germans are 30 feet away. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasnt a soldier expected to hit a head sized target every time from 50 yards or more? You can sit there and empty clip after clip into an exposed soldiers leg/arm/helmet and the HAYBALE he is behind seems to extend out another foot, protecting him the whole time. If they are in supression mode it means you CANT hit them front on, even if they are exposed in someway.

What this means is the game always turns to the same exact tactics, simply have your team supress fire, then run up behind the impenetrable shield (dont worry they wont see you till you fire your first shot) and lite them up with your 20 round tompson...........sigh. I want the option to pick them apart if my aim is good enough, even with the awful accuracy. I dont want to have to sit there and wait for them to stupidly expose their entire upper half either....as is the case. When it comes to machine gun nests forget about it, you have to rush around it, even if the germans entire chest is exposed you will never hit him.

Sorry, bit of a rant, this game has some flaws though. Its still fun....with the tank tactics and differnt style of missions, I hope it can keep my interest.


edit: I just noticed Im a [H]Lite now hehe

Yea I know about nades, I just meant that I wished they didn't have to "cheat" in order for us to take out tanks with unlimited bazooka's.

Also, you can hit exposed people if they are supressed, they've said on the forums that you can and there's nothing stopping you.

 

[G'ßöö]

how are the designers going to make the hardened and rigid FPS player to use more group tactics and fight as a group? this is a group game and not meant to be a solo shoot em up as we are all so use to. I bet the designers thought long and hard on this one but I think we see how they are achieving this. I'm all for it. its rare to see multiplayer orientated games actually being played realistically as a group but the firing has to be realistic. the character is a soldier after all...

baby steps I guess ....kudos to the coders

 

[Terpfen]

My thoughts exactly. I do not like how you cant hit them, and the few that you can you have to fire 3 mags at the guy before he goes down. Only other thing I do not like is the fact that you can not peak around corners. They put such an emphasis on supressing fire but yet they make you stand up to do so. You should be able to stick your head and gun around and fire.

Two reasons for this: one, if you could lean and go prone, the Germans would have to as well, and firefights would bog down. Notice how your squad has unlimited ammo, too--some concessions had to be made in order to make the game fun. Two, they couldn't work leaning and prone into the control configuration on the Xbox and PS2 controllers, so they structured the game to work without it. Personally, I think they did a great job of it.

The graphics do look good, but I do not like how everything is real foggy looking. And for some reason it makes me feel sea sick if i play for awhile. Not sure what it is but the whole thing just doesnt feel right.

That's how the weather usually is along Normandy and the English Channel. You should try to avoid trips to the coast if you don't like how it looks in-game.

I for one have not played an awful lot as this game does not keep my interest long enough. The game itself feels more like full spectrum warrior, but you have a useless gun in your hand.

Which gun is useless? The Colt .45? Maybe, but you only use it on the first couple of missions, and you can pick up some Kar98s to replace the .45. Or if you're referring to the Garand, well, welcome to the world of heavy guns made of wood and steel.

 

[DavePars7]

Have you tried to shoot a fully supressed germans head with anything but a sniper rifle? I promise you can empty every round on him and never hit him....also...just got to the end....all I can say is "Wow, thanks for the dissapointing fake out Ubi"

 

[kick@ss]

how are the designers going to make the hardened and rigid FPS player to use more group tactics and fight as a group? this is a group game and not meant to be a solo shoot em up as we are all so use to. I bet the designers thought long and hard on this one but I think we see how they are achieving this. I'm all for it. its rare to see multiplayer orientated games actually being played realistically as a group but the firing has to be realistic. the character is a soldier after all...

baby steps I guess ....kudos to the coders

People are never going to fight as a group (usually) other than in matches and scrims. There are plenty of tactics in games - people who say otherwise obviously don't compete in leagues or are members of pathetic clans.

 

[Terpfen]

Have you tried to shoot a fully supressed germans head with anything but a sniper rifle? I promise you can empty every round on him and never hit him....

You CAN hit a suppressed German's head (I've done it a couple of times), but you have to have superb aim and/or luck to do so. The point is to flank them, not attack them while they're behind cover.

 

[DavePars7]

ok, for some reason in the probably 1000+ shots i've taken I never hit them, guess im unlucky then.

 

[joethemole]

anyone else hate it when you start reloading, you can't stop or switch weapons until ur done?

theres been numerous times where i run out of ammo in close quaters, then it automatically starts reloading and i can't change my weapons while it reloads, and the enemy gets 5 free shots on me

 

[Terpfen]

anyone else hate it when you start reloading, you can't stop or switch weapons until ur done?

No, not really...

theres been numerous times where i run out of ammo in close quaters, then it automatically starts reloading and i can't change my weapons while it reloads, and the enemy gets 5 free shots on me

So keep a closer track of your ammo count. Even when scoped, the count is still displayed in the lower-right corner. If you need to reload, crouch behind cover, which is pretty damn plentiful in this game.

 

[joethemole]

No, not really...




So keep a closer track of your ammo count. Even when scoped, the count is still displayed in the lower-right corner. If you need to reload, crouch behind cover, which is pretty damn plentiful in this game.

urr not everyone has the habit of looking at the bottom corner every 5 seconds, not to mention thats just stupid when spraying close range with an smg. The thing in cs is way better, like fast switch so ur not strapped.

 

[Terpfen]

urr not everyone has the habit of looking at the bottom corner every 5 seconds, not to mention thats just stupid when spraying close range with an smg.

Given that you're attacking suppresed Germans with a fire team, why is it stupid? You aren't supposed to rack up every single kill. If you're worried about exact ammo count, use your Garand.

 

[1337m0dd3r]

I think its a rather good game myself, but thats just my 2 cents.