Blu-ray Winning Studio War, Needs To Sway Consumers

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USA Today says that although Blu-ray is currently winning the high-def DVD war, it still needs to win the hearts of the consumer. This is something we have said from the beginning, regardless who “won” the format war, they’d still need to win over the general public.

Seven out of 10 households with high-definition TV sets see no need to replace their DVD players, according to a recent NPD Group survey of more than 5,500 households. Many said they plan to wait for the format war to end, for prices to drop and movie selection to increase.
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Isn't the pr0n industry is behind Blu-Ray? I think I read somewhere that their support (more than any other factor) will likely determine which format emerges victorious.
 
I'm fairly sure that they are behind HD-DVD, but I don't think that will matter much in the internet age. Downloadable content will win the war imo. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray will both lose to bandwidth.
 
Just w00ted a Pioneer upconverting DVD player --mainly so I could get HDMI, keep DivX playback, and free up a component vid on my TV for my Nintendo Wii. It cost $65 shipped. For awhile, that'll be all I need. While I know it's not true HD, it still looks pretty darn good at 720p (I decided not to set it up to 1080). Compare that to the price of a BR player, and I think it's hard to justify upgrading at this point.

I feel the same way as other consumers --a Blu-Ray player will arrive in my home when the price of a quality brand drops to $100 (maybe $150, depending on features) or less, and when movies are as widely available as DVD's are. Also, aside from the PS3, most players aren't Blu-Ray 2.0 compatible, and I'd like to wait until feature-sets shake out. Maybe some of it is also because with my media extender, discs just aren't as important any more.
 
starsfan7 said:
I'm fairly sure that they are behind HD-DVD, but I don't think that will matter much in the internet age. Downloadable content will win the war imo. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray will both lose to bandwidth.
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Not in the US it won't. As long as our broadband companies continue to refuse to turn up our bandwidth, we'll always have Blockbuster, Hollywood Video and Netflix. I can't speak for other countries, but I think we in the United States are ripe for new and better physical media format.
 
BluRay players are too much. HD players are uber cheap, but both formats content are too much money.
 
I wish they'd come up with something that keeps me awake for an entire movie. I don't care how good/bad the movie is, I get bored and fall asleep.
 
HD DVD players upconvert really well and are cheap. Anyone in the market for an upconverting DVD player can spend maybe an extra $50 or less for one that also plays HD-DVD. So thats a no brainer. Then if you want to rent high def you can.

Blu ray players are too expensive, and the format isn't even finalized. Maybe Spec 2.0 will be the final spec, but those are not readily available if it all.. It's been a half baked product since launch, overpriced to boot. I will not buy a Sony PS3 just for blu ray. I will buy a dual format player once they have all the proper capabilities of the HD-DVD players and BD spec 2.0 minimum and I can fnid one manufactured by someone other than Sony. Sony is the reason we have a damn format war in the first place, so the last thing I will do is support them.
 
Azhar said:
Not in the US it won't. As long as our broadband companies continue to refuse to turn up our bandwidth, we'll always have Blockbuster, Hollywood Video and Netflix. I can't speak for other countries, but I think we in the United States are ripe for new and better physical media format.
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HTPC + Netflix watch instantly = great on-demand service. I am on a 8-10mbps internet connection and I get those literally, instantly with great IQ, it's not HD, but it only takes me maybe 10-20 minutes to get started on a 720p Xbox 360 download. We may not be there yet, but it will get there.
 
G0lluM said:
Isn't the pr0n industry is behind Blu-Ray? I think I read somewhere that their support (more than any other factor) will likely determine which format emerges victorious.
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People actually go out to the store and buy porn? The shit on the net is 10x better anyways. /boggle:confused:
 
G0lluM said:
Isn't the pr0n industry is behind Blu-Ray? I think I read somewhere that their support (more than any other factor) will likely determine which format emerges victorious.
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They back HD-DVD... but obviously this proofs that the pron industry doesn't dictate which media to be used.

Azhar said:
Not in the US it won't. As long as our broadband companies continue to refuse to turn up our bandwidth, we'll always have Blockbuster, Hollywood Video and Netflix. I can't speak for other countries, but I think we in the United States are ripe for new and better physical media format.
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Truth.

Monkey God said:
BluRay players are too much. HD players are uber cheap, but both formats content are too much money.
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Define too much? Content costs too much money? It's the same price as DVD. This subject is getting lamer each time it gets brought up when a HD format is discussed.

starsfan7 said:
HTPC + Netflix watch instantly = great on-demand service. I am on a 8-10mbps internet connection and I get those literally, instantly with great IQ, it's not HD, but it only takes me maybe 10-20 minutes to get started on a 720p Xbox 360 download. We may not be there yet, but it will get there.
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Ahh yes, because you represent 100% of the rest of America. Wake up, not everyone has broadband and the ones who does, are no where near your 10mbit service.

We will get there, someday, but as for the next few years, we need a physical HD format.
 
Agreed. The greed and short-sightedness of US ISP's will stop HD distribution dead in it's tracks.



Azhar said:
Not in the US it won't. As long as our broadband companies continue to refuse to turn up our bandwidth, we'll always have Blockbuster, Hollywood Video and Netflix. I can't speak for other countries, but I think we in the United States are ripe for new and better physical media format.
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Most don't see the reason...Must be why all the BD players have terrible upconverting.
FORCE the user to buy new movies to make them look good.
All of the HD players have good chips and do excellent upconverting.

Any wait till Sony wins..you think the music cd anti piracy screwed legit people. YOU AINT SEEN NOTHING YET
 
Can't we just get a script to generate comments for HD/BD trheads.

You know insert Random name, then pick random comment said 500 times already:

A: Sony is BluRay, Sony is evil, therefore BluRay must lose.
B: The porn industy is picking HD-DVD and therefore they can't lose.
C: Blu Ray players are too expensive.
D: BluRay players don't have PIP

Or from those who have figured out that HD-DVD is down the tubes, but still feel the need to kick BluRay:

E: Upconverted DVD is all you ever need. DVD forever.
F: Physical media is dead and downloads rule. Usually because they downloaded/steamed a sub 4G movie and it was good enough.

Did I miss any? This was just off the top of my head.
 
Snowdog said:
Can't we just get a script to generate comments for HD/BD trheads.

You know insert Random name, then pick random comment said 500 times already:

A: Sony is BluRay, Sony is evil, therefore BluRay must lose.
B: The porn industy is picking HD-DVD and therefore they can't lose.
C: Blu Ray players are too expensive.
D: BluRay players don't have PIP

Or from those who have figured out that HD-DVD is down the tubes, but still feel the need to kick BluRay:

E: Upconverted DVD is all you ever need. DVD forever.
F: Physical media is dead and downloads rule. Usually because they downloaded/steamed a sub 4G movie and it was good enough.

Did I miss any? This was just off the top of my head.
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E. Sony is only winning because their PS3 can also play Blu-Ray movies.

:D

But seriously though, I think we're more focused on high definition getting out in general, not which format would win. I think it's pretty obvious now who's going to win.
 
Azhar said:
E. Sony is only winning because their PS3 can also play Blu-Ray movies.

:D

But seriously though, I think we're more focused on high definition getting out in general, not which format would win. I think it's pretty obvious now who's going to win.
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But noones buying PS3's whats up with that?
 
Snowdog said:
Can't we just get a script to generate comments for HD/BD trheads.

You know insert Random name, then pick random comment said 500 times already:

A: Sony is BluRay, Sony is evil, therefore BluRay must lose.
B: The porn industy is picking HD-DVD and therefore they can't lose.
C: Blu Ray players are too expensive.
D: BluRay players don't have PIP

Or from those who have figured out that HD-DVD is down the tubes, but still feel the need to kick BluRay:

E: Upconverted DVD is all you ever need. DVD forever.
F: Physical media is dead and downloads rule. Usually because they downloaded/steamed a sub 4G movie and it was good enough.

Did I miss any? This was just off the top of my head.
Click to expand...

You missed one. 7 out of 10 households could give a shyt about either one.
 
Azhar said:
...<snip>
But seriously though, I think we're more focused on high definition getting out in general, not which format would win. I think it's pretty obvious now who's going to win.
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Are you sure? What we do know is that Sony is working hard to get the studios on their side... But so far consumers haven't "bought in" to their game. The article briefly alludes to economic factors for DVD's success, and then they go on like it's just a matter of marketing. So I'll give you the Economic answer.

The format that is most available, especially at the lowest price, will win. It's also the best way for Toshiba, or Sony, to make money according to the principle of "Price Elasticity Gain". But historically Sony seems to have a poor grasp of such a concept, preferring to rely on Marketing and the "Value" of their brand name.

In any case the statistics that relate to DVDs successful adoption, clearly illustrate the dynamics of Price Elasticity Gain. Namely: 1. These products are "non-essential" goods; 2. Because they are non-essential consumer adoption is based heavily on their price. Toshiba seems to understand this and have priced their players accordingly. Sony doesn't seem to understand.

In fact the reason Blue-Ray has "more players" is because they are counting PS3s. But are most of the PS3s selling because they are also Blue-Ray players? or because they are game consoles?

Now please! I'm not trying to bash Sony, though some of you might feel the need to defend them. I am simply stating things that are obvious facts. Based on these facts I think I'll wait a bit longer before I purchase equipment for either format. The "War" doesn't look like it's over just yet.
 
Ockie said:
They back HD-DVD... but obviously this proofs that the pron industry doesn't dictate which media to be used.
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Negative. They switched to BD just in the past few months. First going dual format, then supporting Blu-Ray only.
Digital playground is the one I am talking about, and they are the big one.
 
Cannydog said:
Toshiba seems to understand this and have priced their players accordingly. Sony doesn't seem to understand.
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Toshiba failed the grasp the profit concept and of building alliances on the hardware side.

It doesn't cost any less to build a Toshiba player than a Sony player. Toshiba lowered prices below profitability and killed the market for anyone but Toshiba (who else wants to make no money) to build HD-DVD players. Thus no one else was interested in building HD-DVD players.

Sony only did this with the PS3 which no one else makes. Standalone BD players are profitable.

Some interesting results. In the weeks leading up to CES stand alone Blu Ray player captured slightly more than 50% of the standalone HD player market.
Despite being more expensive more people were going Blu Ray. This is before Warner. We live in an information world today. Consumers are very savy to which way the wind blows. They won't buy the cheaper standard when it is likely the losing standard. Since Warner this number has turned into a crushing route of HD-DVD. Some people might grab up clearance HD-DVD bundles as a DVD player with some bonus HD movies, but the direction is obvious now.

At CES the Blu Ray player hardware from just about every consumer electronics manufacturer faced off against Toshiba, who was practically going it alone. In terms of getting manufacturing cost lower, the Blu Ray alliance of competing Blu Ray manufacturers are likely lower manufacturing costs faster than Toshiba going it alone against everyone. Toshiba can keep subsidizing it's money losing players, but with the end game clearly lost, the war is over.

If despite giveaway prices, Toshiba is still losing on hardware sales it is over and they will need to give up quickly or face shareholder wrath.

When all is said and done, I wonder how much this debacle will cost Toshiba and if heads will roll?
 
As someone who is excited about HD media and formats I have been firly frustrated with BR.

I own a combo player (Samsung BP-UP5000) and I absolutely love it. The picture is stunning from both HD and BR. Every HD disk I have put in the player has run flawlessly. However, I have had problems with several BR disks. Samsung did just release a firmware update and it seems to have cleared up many of the issues. But it is a bit frustrating. It was never anything that would make a movie unwatchable, just little things like the picture and voice getting garbled and then you could reverse and watch it again and it would be fine. It is an annoyance. And I think it is enough to keep people from being too excited about HD media. I also own an Oppo upconverting DVD and love it.
 
Snowdog said:
Can't we just get a script to generate comments for HD/BD trheads.

You know insert Random name, then pick random comment said 500 times already:

A: Sony is BluRay, Sony is evil, therefore BluRay must lose.
B: The porn industy is picking HD-DVD and therefore they can't lose.
C: Blu Ray players are too expensive.
D: BluRay players don't have PIP

Or from those who have figured out that HD-DVD is down the tubes, but still feel the need to kick BluRay:

E: Upconverted DVD is all you ever need. DVD forever.
F: Physical media is dead and downloads rule. Usually because they downloaded/steamed a sub 4G movie and it was good enough.

Did I miss any? This was just off the top of my head.
Click to expand...

LMAO, good one.
 
Snowdog said:
Can't we just get a script to generate comments for HD/BD trheads.

You know insert Random name, then pick random comment said 500 times already:

A: Sony is BluRay, Sony is evil, therefore BluRay must lose.
B: The porn industy is picking HD-DVD and therefore they can't lose.
C: Blu Ray players are too expensive.
D: BluRay players don't have PIP

Or from those who have figured out that HD-DVD is down the tubes, but still feel the need to kick BluRay:

E: Upconverted DVD is all you ever need. DVD forever.
F: Physical media is dead and downloads rule. Usually because they downloaded/steamed a sub 4G movie and it was good enough.

Did I miss any? This was just off the top of my head.
Click to expand...


Only prob with that is that the Porn industry is backing BD now and not HDDVD. And the 1.1 profile Blu-Ray now DOES support PIP.

So that takes out a few options. I would just add 4. everyone is misinformed.
 
If everyone would just read the Digital Bits, we would have far fewer people talking out their backsides :)
 
I've been waiting years to see how this finally pans out. Sony's SACD is about to curb-stomp DVD-A?

Oh, right - no one cared about either format. History repeats itself. :p
 
yagisencho said:
I've been waiting years to see how this finally pans out. Sony's SACD is about to curb-stomp DVD-A?

Oh, right - no one cared about either format. History repeats itself. :p
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HMM expects High Definition discs, BD/HDDVD sales to top 1billion in sales this year.

They are already far outpacing DVDs adoption rate at its inception.
 
The pr0n industry really doesn't matter this time around though. When they "decided" the VHS vs. BetaMax teh internetz didn't exist like it does today. Now it's a moot point who they back since pr0n is easily accessible from the privacy of your own computer.
 
"Seven out of 10 households with high-definition TV sets see no need to replace their DVD players,"


And I bet that 5 of those 7 have TVs that aren't actually "HD". Probably just some LCD 480p Walmart special.


It's a huge uphill battle with the general public, even after there's only a single format.

HD content is worlds beyond regular dvds, upscaled or not. People only believe they're fine, because they haven't seen the content, or flat out don't even care about HD anything.

Hell, I'm content with my 2.1 sound coming from some cheap PC speakers, but I'm well aware that 5.1 sound via a nice home theatre setup with a receiver is 100x better :p
 
4saken said:
HMM expects High Definition discs, BD/HDDVD sales to top 1billion in sales this year.

They are already far outpacing DVDs adoption rate at its inception.
Click to expand...

The key word is "expects"...rewind one year (or more) and what were they "expecting" then? I can tell you because I reported on it every day. Hit the search button on the front page of the [H] and search, how many bajillions of High-Def DVD were going to be sold last year? What were the predictions again? What has been sold is a mere drop in the bucket compared to the "experts" predictions back then.


Blu-ray Disc vs. HD DVD

No. of discs sold in 2007:

Blu-ray: 5.7 million (64% or $172.8 million)
HD DVD: 3.2 million (36% or $97.2 million)

Discs sold since inception:

Blu-ray: 6.1 million (62%)
HD DVD: 3.7 million (38%)

Could that $1 billion number be possible? Sure. Probable? I wouldn't make a wager on it. Matter o' fact, I wouldn't take ANY bet in the High-Def arena right now simply because none of what the "experts" predicted actually panned out.
 
I'm guessing a great many households grew up with black and white TV's and aerials. Now, they have at a minimum good quality TV's, standard DVD players (and upgrade from VCR's) and receive their TV signals via cable or satellite. I'm guessing that for the vast majority (7 out of 10 households), it's freakin' good enough.

It has less to do with "selling" the technology and more to do with the majority of households not giving a krap.
 
Steve said:
The key word is "expects"...rewind one year (or more) and what were they "expecting" then? I can tell you because I reported on it every day. Hit the search button on the front page of the [H] and search, how many bajillions of High-Def DVD were going to be sold last year? What were the predictions again? What has been sold is a mere drop in the bucket compared to the "experts" predictions back then.


Blu-ray Disc vs. HD DVD

No. of discs sold in 2007:

Blu-ray: 5.7 million (64% or $172.8 million)
HD DVD: 3.2 million (36% or $97.2 million)

Discs sold since inception:

Blu-ray: 6.1 million (62%)
HD DVD: 3.7 million (38%)

Could that $1 billion number be possible? Sure. Probable? I wouldn't make a wager on it. Matter o' fact, I wouldn't take ANY bet in the High-Def arena right now simply because none of what the "experts" predicted actually panned out.
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Actually, if you followed the increase in disc sales per month since January last year and the fact that last year did not start with 10 million+ blu-ray capable players in households, the numbers would definitely indicate a potential 800million-1billion in sales. Just on Blu-Rays merits alone this is not out of the question.

Last year != this year.
 
4saken said:
Actually, if you followed the increase in disc sales per month since January last year and the fact that last year did not start with 10 million+ blu-ray capable players in households, the numbers would definitely indicate a potential 800million-1billion in sales. Just on Blu-Rays merits alone this is not out of the question.

Last year != this year.
Click to expand...

The point was, they predicted billions and billions of $$ in sales by the end of last year and millions and millions of HD disks sold by then too. What makes this $1 billion number so funny is that they are actually predicting LESS now than they predicted for last year. :eek:

Anyhow, you wouldn't catch me dead using an analysts prediction to make a case for myself or something I am backing.
 
FWIW, I did a check on 2 online pr0n dealers... One has 61 HD-DVD titles, Blu-Ray only garnering 11. Another dealer having 151 HD-DVD, Blu-Ray coming in at 4. So at this point, the Blu-Ray pr0n over HD-DVD ain't happening.

And yes, I see downloadable content (pr0n or not) being a big player in the future, but not with the asshole ISPs capping bandwidth usage. What good is having an 8MBit-20+MBit link if your ISP is going to cut your ass off for over using what you paid for?
 
Oh, and Blu-Ray can go fuck themselves. I will not be forced to have my DVD viewing be hinging on whether or not I have the player hooked up to a net connection (part of BR 2.0 no?)
 
kush said:
Oh, and Blu-Ray can go fuck themselves. I will not be forced to have my DVD viewing be hinging on whether or not I have the player hooked up to a net connection (part of BR 2.0 no?)
Click to expand...

Well yea, how else is Sony gonna install rootkits into your TV?

:p
 
I've seen Blu-Ray, I've seen HD-DVD and I'm one of those guys who just doesn't care enough to choose. I like dvd's, have a good library of them, and will start an HD collection when a standard is chosen, and the movies come down in price.
 
Ahh no you don't have to hook your player up to the internet to view movies. That is if you want lame ass internet content on your player. Ooh I can download a lame movie related applet. Yipee!

What strikes me as nuts is people complaining about the lack of this functionality like it is important and calling 1.3 profile players impaired because they don't have it. Who really wants to hook their disk player to the internet?
 
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