Avoiding the sales tax... tips? Ship to UPS store then forward

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intel

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I am pretty sure it has crossed your mind, you usually buy items from Tigerdirect (not in california) and save plenty of money if you are spending $100's. CA sales tax is close to 10%

Has anyone found a way to get around buying from Newegg and avoiding the sales tax (without getting a resale certificate). I have thought of maybe getting a UPS box in Las Vegas, then have them forward all my stuff. :eek:
 
bigddybn said:
What you are suggesting is pretty blatant tax evasion.
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Might fall under the forum rule that prohibits discussing illegal activities... ;)

From a practical standpoint, I think you'd have a hard time having your stuff shipped a second time from Nevada to California for less than the cost of sales tax. Especially larger items. Even if you could make the numbers work, is it worth it? Doesn't our state buy us cool shit with the taxes we pay, like schools and roads and fire departments?

I buy from whereever is cheapest or closest - so if Newegg plus tax is the same or lower than Amazon/Tigerdirect (no tax), Newegg gets my business. Trying to save more by shipping out of state is just greedy.
 
It wont work since your billing address is in Cali and that is where the tax is charged. Move to Oregon there is no sales tax there.
 
[AK]Zip;1037311791 said:
It wont work since your billing address is in Cali and that is where the tax is charged. Move to Oregon there is no sales tax there.
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I've shipped stuff a few times to my parents house in Riverside when I can't avoid tax. Get charged less tax in Riverside county than Los Angeles county. Same billing address in LA county.
 
bigddybn said:
What you are suggesting is pretty blatant tax evasion.
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He wants to explore a legal loophole that currently exists. Until the government closes a legal loophole, it's not illegal. One could consider it shady, possibly even wrong, but certainly not illegal.
 
You're responsible to pay your own taxes from Amazon and stuff anyway, not like anyone does though so he not trying to do anything most people, including me, do now anyway heh
 
You're still supposed to pay use tax on things like this that you bring into the state.

By supposed to, I mean according to tax law.
 
fattypants said:
He wants to explore a legal loophole that currently exists. Until the government closes a legal loophole, it's not illegal. One could consider it shady, possibly even wrong, but certainly not illegal.
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LAWL. thanks for the laugh.
 
fattypants said:
He wants to explore a legal loophole that currently exists. Until the government closes a legal loophole, it's not illegal. One could consider it shady, possibly even wrong, but certainly not illegal.
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According to my understanding of the law it is illegal (but I am no legal expert). You are still required to pay sales tax on items bought online even if they don't charge you the tax. Even though this is almost impossible to enforce and it is rarely, if ever, actually prosecuted and millions of people do it. It still doesn't make it legal. If I were an admin here I would lock this thread based on the rules.
EDIT: Looks like we have a consensus. It is illegal.
 
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Forget the legality of it all. It seems pretty silly to me inless you are spending acouple grand. After paying for the box and the shipping to your house your spending more in the 10-20 bucks you wanted to save in the first place.

Ninja edit
 
[21CW]killerofall;1037321891 said:
Looks like we have a consensus. It is illegal.
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In the state of California, the seller is required to collect and pay taxes for purcases, not the buyer.

So intel is not required to pay California sales taxes no matter what. If the seller did not collect it, it's on them. intel has no obligation to collect or pay taxes.

In shipping to another state besides California, the seller has fulfilled their obligation to California (which is nothing), and the buyer has fulfilled his (also nothing).
 
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I think we should impose an universal tax for every thing purchase online, this can be done with the shipping service such as UPS, Fedex and USPS. We can call it shipping tax or something. Anything has to be shipped will be tax like 10% and if the sales tax is below 10% for your state, you get a tax return with the invoice. This will level the play field for lots of local business.
 
JeanLuc said:
I think we should impose an universal tax for every thing purchase online, this can be done with the shipping service such as UPS, Fedex and USPS. We can call it shipping tax or something. Anything has to be shipped will be tax like 10% and if the sales tax is below 10% for your state, you get a tax return with the invoice. This will level the play field for lots of local business.
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No thanks. Just about the dumbest idea I have heard on taxing items lately.
 
I live in Pennsylvania, and I know, here, technically you are supposed to report these purchases when you do your taxes and pay it there.. I'm sure most people don't, so one day, I suppose the state could come after people for it.

It's the law, it's just not one they are vigilant in enforcing, although I guess if the budget crunches continue, they'll probably crack down.
 
Mackowitz said:
Might fall under the forum rule that prohibits discussing illegal activities... ;)
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Except its not illegal, just impractical.
Mackowitz said:
Even if you could make the numbers work, is it worth it? Doesn't our state buy us cool shit with the taxes we pay, like schools and roads and fire departments? I buy from whereever is cheapest or closest - so if Newegg plus tax is the same or lower than Amazon/Tigerdirect (no tax), Newegg gets my business. Trying to save more by shipping out of state is just greedy.
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Exactly! The altruistic thing is to fall on your sword and let your life blood flow into the liberal monster that is Kalifornia's wealth redistribution, pork barrel projects, special interest and handout programs. Long live the Republik! :p

On topic though, if there were a simple workaround, you'd likely have heard of it by now as its not a unique idea. There are plenty of other states that don't take all your money and have a much lower cost of living to boot.
JeanLuc said:
I think we should impose an universal tax for every thing purchase online, this can be done with the shipping service such as UPS, Fedex and USPS. We can call it shipping tax or something. Anything has to be shipped will be tax like 10% and if the sales tax is below 10% for your state, you get a tax return with the invoice. This will level the play field for lots of local business.
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Or do away with taxing the citizenry six ways from Sunday and reduce government bloat and spending.
 
fattypants said:
He wants to explore a legal loophole that currently exists. Until the government closes a legal loophole, it's not illegal. One could consider it shady, possibly even wrong, but certainly not illegal.
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Incorrect.
Just because you can get away with it, doesn't mean it isn't illegal; even if it is easy.

This reminds me of The Federal Analogue Act which basically controls any new substance related to a controlled substance respectively.
That is why honest chemists don't take ecstasy and add an inactive molecule group to it and say it's a brand new thing that isn't bound by law. That being said, there are chemists that do just that and come up with stuff like bk-mdma which mimics ecstasy, but technically isn't ecstasy.
Sorry if I am rambling, I am rolling hard.
jk
 
Sounds like a dumb idea. How much you gonna pay for that ups box in Nevada? Then you got to pay for them to forward it. What if you got to do a return, that's gonna be a hassle. You'll probably spend twice what you would save in tax just in paying for the ups box and shipping from Nevada.

I don't know how much a box at ups costs but at the post office by me its $62 a year for the smallest box. So you are going to need to spend at least $620.01 a year just to make the box viable, then you got the reship cost, lets say its their cheapest $5 flat rate box, meaning on top of that $620 you would need to add at least $50.01 for a purchase to come out ahead (this is pennies we are talking about).
 
I tried this with a camera lense shipping to the UK, well kinda. Wanted to avoid paying VAT.

After I realized duty/tax would be charged ANYWAYS upon arrival to the UK and I'd only save about 100 dollars (with a 2+ week wait for the lense) I opted to just buy it locally.
 
Dark12 said:
Just because you can get away with it, doesn't mean it isn't illegal; even if it is easy.
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While this statement is true in itself, it has nothing to do with the OP's question.

Not paying sales tax in California isn't illegal unless you're the seller. The person who started this thread is the buyer. California does not require him, as a buyer, to pay sales tax. He is circumventing the need for Newegg, the seller, to charge him sales tax. A buyer can ask Newegg to ship the product wherever the hell he wants it shipped.

That's a loophole that allows him to avoid the seller collecting taxes from him. The "tax" he's "evading" was never his responsibility to pay in the first place. In the state of California, it is incumbent on the seller to pay sales taxes to the state.
 
fattypants said:
While this statement is true in itself, it has nothing to do with the OP's question.

Not paying sales tax in California isn't illegal unless you're the seller. The person who started this thread is the buyer. California does not require him, as a buyer, to pay sales tax. He is circumventing the need for Newegg, the seller, to charge him sales tax. A buyer can ask Newegg to ship the product wherever the hell he wants it shipped.

That's a loophole that allows him to avoid the seller collecting taxes from him. The "tax" he's "evading" was never his responsibility to pay in the first place. In the state of California, it is incumbent on the seller to pay sales taxes to the state.
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Neat. I didn't know it worked like that.
Good info!
 
fattypants said:
While this statement is true in itself, it has nothing to do with the OP's question.

Not paying sales tax in California isn't illegal unless you're the seller. The person who started this thread is the buyer. California does not require him, as a buyer, to pay sales tax. He is circumventing the need for Newegg, the seller, to charge him sales tax. A buyer can ask Newegg to ship the product wherever the hell he wants it shipped.

That's a loophole that allows him to avoid the seller collecting taxes from him. The "tax" he's "evading" was never his responsibility to pay in the first place. In the state of California, it is incumbent on the seller to pay sales taxes to the state.
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That's not true. Are you a california resident? I am. And I can tell you, there's a place on the california tax form that asks you to pay sales tax on any out of state purchases.

http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/r-ar..._tax_on_the_internet_who_pays_it_who_doesnt-i

yahoo said:
Consumers' Responsibility to Pay Sales or Use Taxes

Consumers who live in a state that collects sales tax are technically required to pay the tax to the state even when an Internet retailer doesn't collect it. When consumers are required to pay tax directly to the state, it is referred to as "use" tax rather than sales tax.

The only difference between sales and use tax is which person -- the seller or the buyer -- pays the state. Theoretically, use taxes are just a backup plan to make sure that the state collects revenue on every taxable item that is purchased within its borders. But because collecting use tax on smaller purchases is so much trouble, states have traditionally attempted to collect a use tax only on big-ticket items that require licenses, such as cars and boats
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Well, i'm in FL and we don't get charged sales tax yet, i do get charged from tiger direct, but when i buy the whole thing from newegg, with shipping and combos and stuff i pretty much get it cheaper at NE.

Though if you are buying about 10,000 or more a year (some of you i'm sure builds PC for others to make some extra $$ on side) you can get reseller licence. not sure how much will it cost, but depending on how much buy check it out if you save money (probably over $250 or so) if so it's worth the time, the effort and the investment to get the licence. win win for all.
 
I think that it is important to ask is it really legal or not. There are many things that ignorant people think are legal but actually they are illegal. They are just things that are not commonly talked about or done because the people who could profit handily on them already know they are illegal and the other people stand to gain so little it is hardly worth mentioning. The OP would fall in the latter catagory, how many people actually live in a place and purchase so much goods that it would be convienient or save them enough money to be worth all the trouble?

For instance there is nothing illegal about speaking freely, or reccomending that somone purchase stock. But combined in the right circumstances of a pump and dump scheme it is in fact illegal. There was a story not long ago about a young kid who thought this would be cool using multiple AIM accounts till he got busted. He could have went for year unoticed but at some point he made enough money that it triggered interest. It is not legal to purchase beverage cans in 1 state and move them to Michigan where the 10cent refund can net you a profit. People do it and many do not think there is anything illegal about it but in fact it is.

I would guess if CA expects you to report all out of state purchases then it is definitely illegal. And I would guess unless you are purchasing a lot of electronic goods I cannot imagine you would save enough money on this to justify the wasted time for those few sales that you cannot find for comparable prices at Amazon.
 
Whatever item you seek to purchase, even if the sales tax is hundreds, you can easily purchase from an out-of-state seller for what may initially be an increased cost, but is more than likely less than either the tax, or the cost of shipping to two locations.

Do not forget the amount of time this will take up to keep up; is your time worth the savings and constant thinking about it?
 
Dark12 said:
Incorrect.
Just because you can get away with it, doesn't mean it isn't illegal; even if it is easy.

This reminds me of The Federal Analogue Act which basically controls any new substance related to a controlled substance respectively.
That is why honest chemists don't take ecstasy and add an inactive molecule group to it and say it's a brand new thing that isn't bound by law. That being said, there are chemists that do just that and come up with stuff like bk-mdma which mimics ecstasy, but technically isn't ecstasy.
Sorry if I am rambling, I am rolling hard.
jk
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That's because the act failed to outline how 'similar' is similar. :eek:
MM, I love me some phenethylamines. ;)
 
Sales tax is imposed on in state businesses because they require the use of state services in the state they reside. If their business ever has a fire and need assistance, a police call, the sidewalk in front of the store, etc....

Out of state businesses should NEVER have to pay or collect sales tax because they don't use the services of the state they are shipping to if they don't have a physical presence there.

The items may use state/city/county roads via the delivery company that brings the package to you but UPS/Fedex/etc pay taxes in every state for the same reasons I stated above so that point is moot.

And, no, online businesses don't have an "advantage" because they are cheaper. They are cheaper because they have less overhead and PLENTY of people prefer to handle items before buying them and gladly pay a bit extra locally for it to handle the items and get it immediately.
 
shawnoen said:
Sales tax is imposed on in state businesses because they require the use of state services in the state they reside. If their business ever has a fire and need assistance, a police call, the sidewalk in front of the store, etc....

Out of state businesses should NEVER have to pay or collect sales tax because they don't use the services of the state they are shipping to if they don't have a physical presence there.

The items may use state/city/county roads via the delivery company that brings the package to you but UPS/Fedex/etc pay taxes in every state for the same reasons I stated above so that point is moot.

And, no, online businesses don't have an "advantage" because they are cheaper. They are cheaper because they have less overhead and PLENTY of people prefer to handle items before buying them and gladly pay a bit extra locally for it to handle the items and get it immediately.
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I agree 100%. Just look what happened in CT.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/connecticut/1287834-increased-sales-tax-online-retailer.html
 
Ducman69 said:
Except its not illegal, just impractical.

Exactly! The altruistic thing is to fall on your sword and let your life blood flow into the liberal monster that is Kalifornia's wealth redistribution, pork barrel projects, special interest and handout programs. Long live the Republik! :p
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Does spelling things with k's make them more evil?
 
shawnoen said:
Sales tax is imposed on in state businesses because they require the use of state services in the state they reside. If their business ever has a fire and need assistance, a police call, the sidewalk in front of the store, etc....

Out of state businesses should NEVER have to pay or collect sales tax because they don't use the services of the state they are shipping to if they don't have a physical presence there.

The items may use state/city/county roads via the delivery company that brings the package to you but UPS/Fedex/etc pay taxes in every state for the same reasons I stated above so that point is moot.

And, no, online businesses don't have an "advantage" because they are cheaper. They are cheaper because they have less overhead and PLENTY of people prefer to handle items before buying them and gladly pay a bit extra locally for it to handle the items and get it immediately.
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Incorrect, if this was true then the state would only service the business and not the residential areas. It should be really obvious that a business that pays sales tax takes in way more taxes then needed to service their buildings. The sales tax is collected by the business because it is easiest to enforce there but the primary recipient of the service is the clients or people like you. If you change your buying habits so you buy nothing in your state and do it all out of state to avoid sales tax how can they afford to send a fire truck to your house? This is the problem and exactly why many states are looking to tax online purchases or find some way to track them because they are loosing millions to online purchases now days and those amounts will only continue to rise as more and more people move more of their shopping online and purposely purchase out of state to avoid tax.

You must remmeber that taxes are paid for services we all need, and that the way those taxes are collected is often somewhat indirect but is the easiest way to collect them that works well enough. The problem is that as society changes how it does things many times a tax will just stop working well. In the past people made the vast majority of their purchases near where they lived and it worked well to use sales tax to generate money. But now days that system is failing and we will either need to raise another tax, such as property tax or tax online purchases, or perhaps the shipping of those goods.

An interesting note is that many states do not charge sales tax on food, but food is one of the few things that now days still cannot be moved to online sales. This is part of why it is so difficult to deal with for states. What do you do to make up for all the lost money? Raise gas taxes? Raise property taxes? Also I would say that in reality I bet the local fire and police are actually handled through property taxes not sales tax already. You could raise income taxes but one of the cool things about sales tax is it gets to people who cheat on taxes IE you cant cheat on your sales tax but you can cheat income tax if you take lots of your income under the table,
 
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I ordered a Dyson AM02 Tower fan on overstock.com for $362. shipped last night, I stayed up to see if it went through and when I checked the prices again, it was back to $44x. There was no sales tax and shipping was $2.95.
I guess overstock.com varies or I just got lucky, saved about $135 for a full priced + cali taxed dyson tower fan!!
 
have the item shipped to a friend's or relatives house in another state that doesn't charge sales tax...then have them ship you the item

Amazon used to not charge sales tax in NY but a few years back they were forced to by some lawsuit...that really sucked when they started charging for sales tax
 
Double shipping would probably cost more than the tax on most items, and especially more expensive items that are bulky.
 
fattypants said:
In the state of California, the seller is required to collect and pay taxes for purcases, not the buyer.
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I doubt California is so queer. In the rest of the country, sales tax is owed by the buyer. The seller is required to collect sales tax, but if the seller fails (such as out-of-state sellers that the state cannot coerce), the buyer still owes the tax to the state.

Don't mistake a lack of enforcement or what government summery webpage for what the law really says.
 
Ducman69 said:
Exactly! The altruistic thing is to fall on your sword and let your life blood flow into the liberal monster that is Kalifornia's wealth redistribution, pork barrel projects, special interest and handout programs. Long live the Republik! :p

Or do away with taxing the citizenry six ways from Sunday and reduce government bloat and spending.
Click to expand...

THIS
 
fattypants said:
Good thing he's not avoiding taxes then, since he's not the one required to pay them.
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He is required to pay them if the seller does not. You quoted FAQ that outline the details for businesses operating in California. You didn't cite the tax code itself so I suggest you read that before making conclusive statements.


fattypants said:
While this statement is true in itself, it has nothing to do with the OP's question.

Not paying sales tax in California isn't illegal unless you're the seller. The person who started this thread is the buyer. California does not require him, as a buyer, to pay sales tax. He is circumventing the need for Newegg, the seller, to charge him sales tax. A buyer can ask Newegg to ship the product wherever the hell he wants it shipped.

That's a loophole that allows him to avoid the seller collecting taxes from him. The "tax" he's "evading" was never his responsibility to pay in the first place. In the state of California, it is incumbent on the seller to pay sales taxes to the state.
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Think about what you are writing for a minute...when the seller doesn't collect taxes due to buyer fraud then the onus falls on the purchaser to declare his tax liability.
 
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