Audio newbie looking for some help

[stevecamp09]

Hi -

Could really use a little guidance...building a pretty high-end gaming rig and the one part that I kind of neglected up to now was sound...figured i'd probably go the standard route of picking up a Creative X-fi something card and some Logitech speakers. But after a good amount of research, have decided to up the quality of the sound card and am thinking strongly about picking up the Asus Xonar Essence STX. Since i'm upgrading my sound card, it seemed a shame to go cheap on the speakers so started researching those too...seems Logitech are thought of as not all that great...from what i've read, the M-audio Studiophile Bx5a are held in high regard. So...long winded way of asking...is this a recommended setup? I'm not really an audiophile but I do care about sound and want my games and music to sound good and be immersive. Am I going too high end with this pairing of card and speakers or just right? anything else I should consider?

Thanks for any input!

 

[Zenshi]

Are you thinking of going 2.1 or 5.1 or 7.1 and what is your budget? Do you want to get active speakers or go receiver/amplifier + passives?

I presume you want at least 5.1 for gaming. If so, and if you are going active speakers, then you will need at least two pairs of the bookshelves and most likely a replacement longer cable for the rear surround speakers to make sure you can connect the right and left speaker without having ugly cables all over the floor. You can get another single speaker for the center. And then a sub.

Separately I guess you can also get an amplifier and hook the output of the cards to the amp and hook the amps to some passives.

If you have the desire and the funds, you can make an amazing setup either way you go. Even with my budget 2.1 (using POS satellites at the moment) and a receiver, I get very nice sound that makes movies sound wonderful, music sound like music for a change, and games sound very immersive.

Edit: If this is mostly for games, my opinion is don't skimp on the sub. I think for games you want that punch in the face sort of bass and a nice sub will not only give strong bass but clean bass that is not often found from PC subs. I love watching the demo of 3DMark03 on my setup since the sound during the WWII battle, where the two planes collide is just amazing (striking but also very clean).

 

[J Macker]

Edit: If this is mostly for games, my opinion is don't skimp on the sub. I think for games you want that punch in the face sort of bass and a nice sub will not only give strong bass but clean bass that is not often found from PC subs.

Spoken like a true owner of an HSU sub.

I have the VTF2-MK3 for my home theater and the Dayton "Elite" (HSU) 10" sub for my computer. I also have the Epik Dynasty 18" 1300w rms hooked up to my home theater which I will be purchasing from my friend.

I would also recommend not skimping on the sub. But having the Epik Dynasty kinda makes me a bit biased.

Also, OP, please don't use the words "logitech" and "speakers" in the same sentence again.

 

[stevecamp09]

Are you thinking of going 2.1 or 5.1 or 7.1 and what is your budget? Do you want to get active speakers or go receiver/amplifier + passives?

I presume you want at least 5.1 for gaming. If so, and if you are going activer speakers, then you will need at least two pairs of the bookshelves and most likely a replacement longer cable for the rear surround speakers to make sure you can connect the right and left speaker without having ugly cables all over the floor. You can get another single speaker for the center. And then a sub.

Separately I guess you can also get an amplifier and hook the output of the cards to the amp and hook the amps to some passives.

If you have the desire and the funds, you can make an amazing setup either way you go. Even with my budget 2.1 (using POS satellites at the moment) and a receiver, I get very nice sound that makes movies sound wonderful, music sound like music for a change, and games sound very immersive.

Edit: If this is mostly for games, my opinion is don't skimp on the sub. I think for games you want that punch in the face sort of bass and a nice sub will not only give strong bass but clean bass that is not often found from PC subs. I love watching the demo of 3DMark03 on my setup since the sound during the WWII battle, where the two planes collide is just amazing (striking but also very clean).

Thanks for the reply...honestly my budget isn't as high as i'd like given how much i'm spending on my PC...probably around $500 or so. I could stretch a little higher if it would make the difference. As for setup, I was coming around to thinking a 2.1 setup would be ok...thanks

 

[Zenshi]

@JMacker

Wow some nice subs. :drool:

I hear Epik subs are, well they are epic. Would love to hear one. For my small setup the STF-1 is more than adequate but of course I dream of someday upgrading to a VTF-1. But first I need a pair of good bookshelves in a few months.

@stevecamp

$500 for 2.1 is pretty nice. If I was astralight I would say go get the WAF-1/Gizmo combo and spend the remaining $200 on a nice sub (sometimes you can luck out and find Energy subs at that price...if not a good Dayton sub is nice too).

Another possibility if its really near field is to get a T amp and some decent speakers for $200 and get a nice sub for like $250.

Finally an active setup is nice too. Swan M200MkII and a $250 sub would be great.

If you want to put more funds on the sub than the bookshelves a pair of Insignias and a $400 sub will definitely provide a good kick in the face sort of sound. (whoops forgot the Insignia is passive so a T amp, insignia and a $350 sub). Sorry

 

[stevecamp09]

@JMacker

Wow some nice subs. :drool:

I hear Epik subs are, well they are epic. Would love to hear one. For my small setup the STF-1 is more than adequate but of course I dream of someday upgrading to a VTF-1. But first I need a pair of good bookshelfs in a few months.

@stevecamp

$500 for 2.1 is pretty nice. If I was astralight I would say go get the WAF-1/Gizmo combo and spend the remaining $200 on a nice sub (sometimes you can luck out and find Energy subs at that price...if not a good Dayton sub is nice too).

Another possibility if its really near field is to get a T amp and some decent speakers for $200 and get a nice sub for like $250.

Finally an active setup is nice too. Swan M200MkII and a $250 sub would be great.

If you want to put more funds on the sub than the bookshelves a pair of Insignias and a $400 sub will definitely provide a good kick in the face sort of sound. (whoops forgot the Insignia is passive so a T amp, insignia and a $350 sub). Sorry

Any chance you could link to some of these products? if i'm honest, i'm realizing how little I know about this stuff...some of the products you mention i've not even heard of

 

[Zenshi]

Ok no problem.

Insignias- cheap but nice. Sold in of all places....Best Buy. Go listen to them if you want.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Insigni...air)/7705307.p?id=1138085354138&skuId=7705307

Swan M200MkII Sold at The Audio Insider

http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php/p/swan-m200mkii/products_id/80

WAF-1 /Gizmo combo sold at Tweak City Audio (AVS forum said the WAF 1 were comparable to the $900 Ascend Sierra 1 (thanks astrallight ))

http://tweakcityaudio.com/index.php...-ask.tpl&pop=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

T-amp Sold at Parts Express (low power but popular to drive easy-to-drive speakers (like the Insignias) for near field...cheap price.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-380

Some Dayton subs sold at Parts Express

http://www.parts-express.com/wizards/searchResults.cfm?srchExt=CAT&srchCat=620

Possible other subs that are nice in the $200-$300 category:

BIC Accoustech H100:
http://acousticsounddesign-amazon.com/Bic-Acoustech-H100-Powered-Subwoofer/M/B0006DNW6U.htm

Energy ESWC 10
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/item/clearance/549237573/energy-eswc10

If you can go to $350 for a sub then one possibility is a HSU STF-2
http://hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html

These are not even close to all the options but are just some possibilities.

 

[stevecamp09]

Ok no problem.

Insignias- cheap but nice. Sold in of all places....Best Buy. Go listen to them if you want.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Insigni...air)/7705307.p?id=1138085354138&skuId=7705307

Swan M200MkII Sold at The Audio Insider

http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php/p/swan-m200mkii/products_id/80

WAF-1 /Gizmo combo sold at Tweak City Audio (AVS forum said the WAF 1 were comparable to the $900 Ascend Sierra 1 (thanks astrallight ))

http://tweakcityaudio.com/index.php...-ask.tpl&pop=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

T-amp Sold at Parts Express (low power but popular to drive easy-to-drive speakers (like the Insignias) for near field...cheap price.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-380

Some Dayton subs sold at Parts Express

http://www.parts-express.com/wizards/searchResults.cfm?srchExt=CAT&srchCat=620

Possible other subs that are nice in the $200-$300 category:

BIC Accoustech H100:
http://acousticsounddesign-amazon.com/Bic-Acoustech-H100-Powered-Subwoofer/M/B0006DNW6U.htm

Energy ESWC 10
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/item/clearance/549237573/energy-eswc10

If you can go to $350 for a sub then one possibility is a HSU STF-2
http://hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html

These are not even close to all the options but are just some possibilities.

Thank you so much, I realize that was a lot to ask for but thank you for being so courteous and helping me out...I will review those closely

 

[astrallite]

I would actually recommend a receiver if this is for a small room, you don't need anything with a ton of power, and a receiver will have more than integrated amplifiers.

For $250 you can get a receiver with a ton of inputs and process the current high definition audio technology. I would recommend the Yamaha RX-V465BL. I think a receiver really becomes an advantage if you plan to bring in a console (or two!).

I personally think a good sub starts with the Hsu entry level series and for that you have to put down at least $200 used on ebay/audiogon, and $300 new.

Also depending on the size of the room, and how close to the wall your speakers are going to be, there will be plenty of bass reinforcement and I think a sub may actually be a detriment--and if you are in an apartment, I don't like subs at all, given how neighbors will react.

 

[stevecamp09]

Ok no problem.

Insignias- cheap but nice. Sold in of all places....Best Buy. Go listen to them if you want.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Insigni...air)/7705307.p?id=1138085354138&skuId=7705307

Swan M200MkII Sold at The Audio Insider

http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php/p/swan-m200mkii/products_id/80

WAF-1 /Gizmo combo sold at Tweak City Audio (AVS forum said the WAF 1 were comparable to the $900 Ascend Sierra 1 (thanks astrallight ))

http://tweakcityaudio.com/index.php...-ask.tpl&pop=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

T-amp Sold at Parts Express (low power but popular to drive easy-to-drive speakers (like the Insignias) for near field...cheap price.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-380

Some Dayton subs sold at Parts Express

http://www.parts-express.com/wizards/searchResults.cfm?srchExt=CAT&srchCat=620

Possible other subs that are nice in the $200-$300 category:

BIC Accoustech H100:
http://acousticsounddesign-amazon.com/Bic-Acoustech-H100-Powered-Subwoofer/M/B0006DNW6U.htm

Energy ESWC 10
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/item/clearance/549237573/energy-eswc10

If you can go to $350 for a sub then one possibility is a HSU STF-2
http://hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html

These are not even close to all the options but are just some possibilities.

Ok...so going a little lower budget, if I were to pick up those Insignia's and pair them with a decent sub, say, one of the Dayton subs you linked to, this would be a decent setup?

 

[Zenshi]

Decent is a subjective term but it should blow away any PC speaker setup. Many people here have the Insignias and I have heard nothing but good things about them. Ditto the Dayton subs. Both are nice items for their price level.

If it was me, I would probably like the combo. If it is a major audiophile it may not be enough.

As the Insignias are passive, you will need something to drive them. If you only need a 2.1 setup, something like the Gizmo is nice since it has a sub out. If you want to get a T-amp or any other 2.0 amplifier, then you will need a splitter to send the signal to your sub. At least in my sound card this was the case since it only did 2.0, 5.1 and 7.1 setups and so I had to do 2.0 for my 2.1 setup. If you want to expand to a 3.1 or 5.1 later, then you may want to look at a receiver setup for driving multiple speakers as astrallite mentions. This was the option I took. If you want to go cheap, you can check out the Onkyo TX-sr307 at A4L.

http://www.accessories4less.com/mak...r307-5.1-channel-Home-Theater-Receiver/1.html

Or you can check for a good deal on something like Craigslist in your local area.

Also as astrallite mentions, if you are in a dorm or apt (2nd floor or higher) you may want to nix the sub since you may get complaints from the neighbors. Sorry, I forgot about this issue.

Also, if you want to see if you really need a sub, since you are getting all components from different vendors, you can get the bookshelf speakers first, listen to them and see if you want to add more bass later. No need to buy everything at once.

Again, this is just one possibility out of many.


Good luck!

 

[J Macker]

My friend in portland is purchasing a used Onkyo TX-SR701 receiver for $120 on craigslist. 100w per channel. Great deal, more than enough power. Receivers without hdmi are selling for cheap used, and there's no need for hdmi for computer use with s/pdif. He will also be purchasing the Dayton BR-1 speaker kit (as I did) and assembling them himself.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1397901

The Bic Venturi V1020 at $160 shipped looks promising.
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=303-430

 

[Zenshi]

Nice thread JMacker and nice system. Those DIY Daytons look nice. What brand drivers are they using? If I recall Dayton had some that used HiVi drivers that were supposed to be really nice.

LOL, I like your comment.

""I'm probably not going to be able to convince the wife to let me buy another subwoofer since these have such great bass.""

And then you got an Epik sub.

 

[J Macker]

Well, to be honest, the Epik is not mine.... yet. It just has a semi-permanent rent free space next to my TV. It's true owner is my good friend (a day trader) who lives in an apartment and really loves bass but already has some good gear. He just bought it last summer because I pressured him into it and he knows my wife needs the time to be worn down before I can finally pay him for it.

kinda like a layaway plan, but I still haven't paid him for it because of the wife. I'd really like to sell my Hsu VTF2-MK3 since it has no purpose being plugged into the same system as the Dynasty.

The Dayton BR-1 kit was a very fun experience, but was very quick. The only thing I know about the driver is what it says here. I see that there are many other more expensive drivers (albeit not much more), and would not hesitate to build more speakers if I need another pair.