Phide, what do you think of the Waves Effects accelrators?
http://www.waves.com/Content.aspx?id=336
http://www.waves.com/Content.aspx?id=336
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Asus Xonar D2X
- Thread starter Neutrino
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alg7_munif
Supreme [H]ardness
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Probably very similar to what's used on HD Accel cards, but of course limited to running Waves plug-ins. From what I've been told, the algorithms used in the hardware racks (like the MaxxBass 107) are far more intensive than those in the software plug-ins, so theoretically, they end up sounding better.
The APAs run the same algorithms as the plug-ins, so there's no quality difference there. Good if you run a ton of Waves plug-ins, but most machines can handle a bevy already. Few of them are comparatively compute intensive. I'd rather sink $800 into a Mac Pro or something.
I'm not a tremendous fan of their plug-ins anyway.
These things aren't very powerful at all.
The APAs run the same algorithms as the plug-ins, so there's no quality difference there. Good if you run a ton of Waves plug-ins, but most machines can handle a bevy already. Few of them are comparatively compute intensive. I'd rather sink $800 into a Mac Pro or something.
I'm not a tremendous fan of their plug-ins anyway.
Doesn't really matter. The transport will wait for external units. It's not as if you're going to be using this stuff while tracking, and setting a higher latency (or forcing a wait) gives you a little extra breathing room on the chips.
These things aren't very powerful at all.
alg7_munif
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Games' audio is simple because most of the sound are already mixed beforehand, the musics are already mixed and other sounds too. If the musics need to be mixed during gameplay, I don't think that X-Fi is up to the task too. Graphic in games is more complicated than sound, normally only the textures are ready beforehand. Vertices, shadows, reflections and etc are rendered by the GPU during gameplay. Compairing a GPU and a sound card's DSP in games is laughable.
Mixing is a fairly simple task. It requires adequate bandwidth, and adequate precision, but it's not compute intensive. DSP in itself is not intensive, but as precision goes up, and as the algorithms grow more complex, intensiveness rises exponentially.
Actually, games based on the Lithtech 2 engine (Shogo: Mobile Armor Division and Blood 2) mixed music in a semi-real-time manner, allowing for on-beat transitions during gameplay. This was a software process. As I said, mixing in itself isn't compute intensive.
That's probably why I didn't make that comparison. If you think you see me saying something stupid, make sure you read again, because I don't say stupid things. It simply doesn't happen.
I said it's very possible to use DSP that is equally as complex as the rendering in Crysis or Project Offset. Even if the complexity isn't comparable, the process is, however.
Don't pick a portion of my post to attack. If you read my post again, I said that the sound card hardware reduces the load on the CPU. I know that the sound card does not accelerate games but off loads the work from the CPU.
A sound card should be used to get better sound, not accelerate the game being played. Although DSP does take away clock cycles from the CPU so frame rates go up, what good would a DSP be if it did not help in creating good sound?
Another thing, its an opinion. You can disagree but why so righteous in your conviction that it should be done this way? I just feel that a sound card should do what it supposed to do which is give great sound effects whether it is using EAX or not. Who are you trying fight here? Not me because I am not interested. Chill out!
Kmat
Didn't ASUS say the purposly left EAX out of the card, opting instead for other technologies? I think they are figuring alot of game houses will be moving away from EAX for the PC only games and instead going for a game engine approach that can easily be moved between platforms for both audio and video. That is the way I understand things...
Ahriman4891
Gawd
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It's puzzling why your definition of "good sound" is so narrow
Good sound in music reproduction means flat FRC, correct transients, low THD and IMD and noise. Good sound in games would have all that PLUS real-time reverb, occlusion, elevation, diffraction, doppler and whatever else (including binaural mix for headphones). The requirements are broader, that's all. I also don't see how having a powerful DSP implies loss of sound waveform quality per se--Creative's implementation may not be ideal, so what? It's the first and only one. Sorry for using the video card analogy again, but does "good graphics" mean simply "high resolution and truecolor" to you?I'm not fighting anyone. You seemed to have based your opinion upon an incorrect assumption, so I wanted to make sure you understand exactly how it all works, so that you may possibly reevaluate your opinion. If you simply misspoke, then that's something else.
I'm also not being righteous, just making a point.
Truth be told, EAX or not Creative seems to have alot of competition latley for the soundcard market. There have been alot of great soundcard released latley just sound amazing. I am not a proponent of any manufacturer I just like sound so I like when the market is booming with competition, it is what drives the technology forward and forces advancment to be released into the marketplace.
LOL! I did the same but swore off NF4 motherboards
j/k Especially since that same card works great on my i965P and my old NF4.Seen if they said they'd support OpenAL?
Looks like your beloved Bluegears is in more trouble than Creative Labs. Even the Fatality Pro Gamer is cheaper than the XMeridian. If they're talking about the $89 X-Fi Xtreme Gamer, I'm on this card like a Fat man on a ham. Maybe Asus will make Bluegears cut prices? The prices of their cards have not been that great. Then you have to give up not only EAX but OpenAL as well. No real gamer would do that.
Phide, What do you think about EMI sheilding and/or RFI sheilding on a soundcard? I think it's a really good idea. This card comes with a sheild for this purpose, other cards do aswell. I personally think it's a good idea dn would help. I have some ERS paper on order, I am not sure if you know what that is but it's s thin composite paper that does this very thing. Quite a few guys I know have been using it on their cards. I guess I will have to wait and see when I get it.
I think it's nonsense, like those headphones that protect against EMI and devices that demagnetize CDs.
The plain and simple truth is that the card is sitting inside a cauldron of electricity, and it's not like the bus itself doesn't contribute to issues, so it's a lost cause. A semi-metallic shield isn't going to perform miracles. With PCIe 2.0, we'll be able to get these things where they belong -- outside of the case entirely.
The plain and simple truth is that the card is sitting inside a cauldron of electricity, and it's not like the bus itself doesn't contribute to issues, so it's a lost cause. A semi-metallic shield isn't going to perform miracles. With PCIe 2.0, we'll be able to get these things where they belong -- outside of the case entirely.
All that work and you missed one.
Kmat, I can understand what you are saying well enough. Stand alone sound cards should give us better sound. But why can't we ask for hardware accelerated audio as well? Remember, hardware acceleration of sound is not just to squeeze a few extra frames per second out of a game. With it you can have a large number of incredibly complex sounds playing all at once. I didn't really know what the big deal with X-Fi cards was until I played UT2004 with the X-Fi patch. It really makes for a more enjoyable experience; at least to me it does.
agreed.
I like the way the PC is evolving into the amiga model; i.e. dedicated hardware for specific functions. CPU, GPU, APU, PPU, network processors, raid controllers etc.
hardware acceleration is a good thing, and i want it.
now give me a linux X-Fi driver.
Partly, The Xonar is nothing more then another 8788 based card such as the B-Enspirer, Inferno etc. There is no info to suggest it is anything outside of a entry level 8788 card. If you like the features that's fine but you lose EAX over 2.0 if you like that sort of thing. Not everybody does. There is the X-Meridian or as suggested the new Prelude.
The Prelude should be a good all around card. The jury is out on If it will compare to the X-meridian for music and movies.
The Prelude should be a good all around card. The jury is out on If it will compare to the X-meridian for music and movies.
They said the released date is mid to end of June. It has already been pushed up from mid may. I already own the X-Meridian so I know what to expect from this company. They will not release anything until it is 100% ready for market. It's quite different from other manufacturers that rush thier crap to market and the user get's to spend the next 6-9 months patching their drivers to get basic function they paid for. As far as headphones go, I don't really know that much about different brands. I use Grado I have heard some Senn's but I am not a authority on cans. I would suggest checking www.headfi.com
He's an sound engineer, I'm simply a gamer. I've been tweaking computers since 1992 and using them since 1983.