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asp.net or .PHP

T

twoblueeyes78

n00b
Joined
Dec 18, 2006
Messages
43
I'm going to learn a new language. I currently know html. Which of these should I teach myself. The purpose of this is to gain employment and make some better money.

What say ye?
 
Either should land you a decent job. PHP would allow you to find "work" easily through open source channels to build up your portfolio if you end up not finding a paying job immediately.
 
Either will help. From some people I know working for IT contracting agencies, they say that they get a lot more requests for ASP.Net (and Java) than PHP. But both are good to know.
 
I would go with ASP.NET.

Chances are with good knowledge within the area and subsequent areas that go a long with it, you'd land a better job than that with PHP. Especially with many enterprise and government services switching to .NET applications.
 
why not both? A good rule of thumb is that big enterprises are more likely to use .NET (or Java), while smaller tech companies are more likely to use PHP. So if you want to work for a large bank, hospital or gov't agency learn .NET (or Java), if you like working for the next hot start-up, media company or web shop, then learn PHP (also consider Ruby or Python)
 
WHAT SAY YOU?

I can't help but think of Aragorn.

From what I've seen, .NET is more marketable (and Java is slightly more marketable than that). But PHP is simpler, and might be a better start. Either of these is a real programming language vs. markup language, and would be good if you're looking for a job. I wouldn't think there would be many places where simply knowing HTML would cut it, unless you were a wizard working at a pure design shop.
 
Start with php, its a bit easier and I might even suggest learning JavaScript or something of that nature first. Here is a link to Alicehttp://www.aliceprogramming.net/, it is used to give people a general idea of programming, and programming practices. This is not real world experience but its a simple way to learn.
 
the problem I find with php is that it has a tendency to be really ugly cause a lot of the people who write it have no experience with any language with standards. If you look at too much shitty code you may go insane. Although I do quite like simple xml (Yes I am too scared to actually write it).
 
shitty code can be written in any language. PHP is just far more forgiving of shitty practices, but that doesn't mean an experienced programmer can't write beautiful code with it.

to the OP: A well rounded career in web development today will also require knowledge of Javascript/AJAX, CSS, and SQL. Some Flash, Photoshop, Illustrator skills wouldn't hurt either.
 
maw said:
shitty code can be written in any language. PHP is just far more forgiving of shitty practices, but that doesn't mean an experienced programmer can't write beautiful code with it.

to the OP: A well rounded career in web development today will also require knowledge of Javascript/AJAX, CSS, and SQL. Some Flash, Photoshop, Illustrator skills wouldn't hurt either.
Click to expand...

This.

I have a few friends that fancy themselves PHP gurus, but they all code as hobbyists. One of them develops websites for people (he's just a graphics artist that knows enough to install Wordpress and customize it) and he makes a killing working w/ clients.

If you want to work in enterprise, you'll be better off with ASP.NET. Luckily for you ASP.NET written in VB winds up being very verbose and is easy to learn.


Anyways, before you move to server side code I recommend that you familiarize yourself with CSS and Javascript first. PHP will be a walk in the park once you know Javascript.
 
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ASP.Net is a framework not a language.
You can choose whatever language you want to use with .Net.
I believe PHP is even supported is some ways now.

Most popular are VB and C#.

I think you can Java (or Microsoft java whatever it's called, I can't remember)

I personally like VB and C# with the .NET framework, it's easy to use and understand and robust enough with all the extra classes, controls, etc that you can add without much work.

I don't remember jack about PHP, it's been YEARS since I've touched it.
 
Bigbacon said:
ASP.Net is a framework not a language.
You can choose whatever language you want to use with .Net.
I believe PHP is even supported is some ways now.

Most popular are VB and C#.

I think you can Java (or Microsoft java whatever it's called, I can't remember)

I personally like VB and C# with the .NET framework, it's easy to use and understand and robust enough with all the extra classes, controls, etc that you can add without much work.

I don't remember jack about PHP, it's been YEARS since I've touched it.
Click to expand...
You're absolutely right... I must be working too hard :p
 
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I still write in both. PHP I find works great for small, quick, and dirty. If I want to do anything resembling a decent UI without doing a ton of manual javascript/scripting I use ASP.net with C#.
 
maw said:
shitty code can be written in any language. PHP is just far more forgiving of shitty practices, but that doesn't mean an experienced programmer can't write beautiful code with it.

to the OP: A well rounded career in web development today will also require knowledge of Javascript/AJAX, CSS, and SQL. Some Flash, Photoshop, Illustrator skills wouldn't hurt either.
Click to expand...

I am very sorry if my earlier statement was misconstrued as saying that all PHP is shitty. I was just trying to point out that many people who use PHP write it in an incredibly ugly fashion not that it cannot be beautiful. you illustrated my point much better than I. many apologies.
 
Well, I don't know asp.net, so I can't offer any advise as to which is better- but i'm very fond of PHP, it is very forgiving, has wide support, good documentation, and you can make a lot of useful things with it very easily.

Just figured i'd chime in.
 
WhiskeyJoe said:
Well, I don't know asp.net, so I can't offer any advise as to which is better- but i'm very fond of PHP, it is very forgiving, has wide support, good documentation, and you can make a lot of useful things with it very easily.

Just figured i'd chime in.
Click to expand...

Forgiving as in easy-to-use?
 
It's forgiving in that you do not need to explicitly define a data type. For example you can write:

$foo = 15;

PHP will automatically figure that it's a integer.

With ASP.Net and C#, you would need to declare the type:

int foo = 15;


Personally I prefer languages that require explicitly defined data types so there is less confusion.

There may be some flexibility within the languages and I'm sure others here could explain better than I... I really have not written much web code.
 
PHP will also allow things like

$x(y) which will only produce a notice when it should really be $x('y')

I lets you be sloppy when more structured languages force you to be cleaner with your code. As others have said, that doesn't mean you have to be sloppy though. It just doesn't do as much forced checking.
 
you guys know you're really arguing about nothing right? :p

Whether or not a language is strongly typed or uses curly braces has nothing to do with it's usefulness in the big scheme of things. ;)
 
KingKaeru said:
you guys know you're really arguing about nothing right? :p

Whether or not a language is strongly typed or uses curly braces has nothing to do with it's usefulness in the big scheme of things. ;)
Click to expand...

yeah, at the end of the day, you still have a web app.
 
I have considered this many times before. Seems everyone and their mother knows PHP because it has a much lower learning curve than ASP.net (well in C# at least). But the funny thing is that I see more and more commercial sites adopting PHP where they only used to do ASP.net since it is "more professional" and takes more talent to develop in.

Either is fine but ASP.net will probably impress a potential employer more since there is a hellava lot more to know if you want to build web apps.
 
twoblueeyes78 said:
I'm going to learn a new language. I currently know html. Which of these should I teach myself. The purpose of this is to gain employment and make some better money.

What say ye?
Click to expand...

As someone who has been looking for a PHP or ASP.NET job since January, my experience is that right now there are far more .NET jobs out there. I've spent the past 3-4 years doing PHP web development, but the PHP openings have been few and far between. I got a .NET 2.0 Web Applications cert in hopes of moving away from PHP, but given the current economy, most jobs I see are going after more senior level .NET developers so that hasn't helped me too much. But anyway, I would go with .NET if you're looking to do this long term. Just my opinion.
 
If you're just a beginner with web programming, I would start with PHP. ASP.NET is a bit easier to get started with, but its programming model hides a lot of "stuff" that you as a web developer should absolutely know (but then again, I'm the type to recommend C as a starting language as opposed to C# or Java)

You can also start by learning ASP Classic first (but that involves learning VBS ewww)
 
There are just so many other things a well-rounded web developer must know besides a server-side scripting language. Unless your employer is a big web shop with separate graphic designers, DBAs, security and usability experts, then you're going to have to learn a LOT more.
Heck, I could easily argue that just mastering CSS takes a lot longer than mastering a scripting language.
 
Want work that pays real money? ASP.NET.
Want to contribute to open source? PHP.

(By the way, if you properly learn .NET fundamentals, you can apply them to either Windows or ASP.)
 
InorganicMatter said:
Want work that pays real money? ASP.NET.
Want to contribute to open source? PHP.

(By the way, if you properly learn .NET fundamentals, you can apply them to either Windows or ASP.)
Click to expand...

heh, that's funny, I just happen to make "real money" using PHP for some reason...;)
 
From careerbuilder.net:
searched for 'php' in IT left location open, returned 727 jobs.
searched for 'asp.net' in IT left location open, returned 1,314 jobs.

Make your own conclusion.
 
maw said:
heh, that's funny, I just happen to make "real money" using PHP for some reason...;)
Click to expand...

Well out of 25 posts in this thread, you're the only one. :p Like the above said, search Careerbuilder for PHP, then search for .NET, and see who's making the money.
 
[H]exx;1034288712 said:
Don't be an idiot...that is the most general statement I have heard in a while. It's like saying buy Intel because everyone is, so it must be good.

I will say learn PHP...I make money as a PHP developer and love my job...this isn't script kiddie stuff I work with either...it is enterprise application design (also DB design, CSS, JS, and anything else that ends in S ;-) )
Click to expand...

Sorry I hurt your feelings, but it's true. As has been said, there's more .NET jobs available, and learning .NET will allow him to interchangeably apply his skills to either Windows apps or ASP.NET. Serious PHP developer jobs are far and few between. Guess what language the software we sell for $100,000 a license is written in. Hint: not PHP. ;)

(And by the way, you can wrap it in all the DB, CSS, and AJAX you want, but at the end of the day, PHP, Perl, Ruby, et. all are still script kiddie languages. Fancy script kiddie languages, but still script kiddie languages. :p)
 
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maw said:
heh, that's funny, I just happen to make "real money" using PHP for some reason...;)
Click to expand...

And as a ASP.net/winforms architecht, I bet I make more "real money" than you ;)

It's all relative.

I do programming in both(I used to do a ton of php, but I am asp.net centric now), you simply cannot beat the code seperation of .net, and thats just the tip of the iceburg when it comes to featuresof these two.
 
InorganicMatter said:
Sorry I hurt your feelings, but it's true. As has been said, there's more .NET jobs available, and learning .NET will allow him to interchangeably apply his skills to either Windows apps or ASP.NET. Serious PHP developer jobs are far and few between. Guess what language the software we sell for $100,000 a license is written in. Hint: not PHP. ;)

(And by the way, you can wrap it in all the DB, CSS, and AJAX you want, but at the end of the day, PHP, Perl, Ruby, et. all are still script kiddie languages. Fancy script kiddie languages, but still script kiddie languages. :p)
Click to expand...

I somewhat agree. PHP and ASP.net CAN get the same job done. I would say I could do a full ASP.net site a lot faster than php. Also, php IS a scripting language, ASP.net is object-oriented, higher overhead on the learning, but the payoff is much better
 
sigh... how did this thread degenerate into a PHP vs. ASP.NET penis comparison fight? Guess what? Neither of them are that f*&king hard to learn, so drop it already.

Like I said earlier, there is a LOT more to being a web developer than the server-side language of choice. I happen to prefer using PHP, though I also do ASP.NET when the need arises. But those choices make up about 20% of the overall skills I need to bring to any web project I work on.

I spend a lot more time on site design, DB design, Javascript/AJAX UI elements, cross-browser CSS layout, graphical elements, content presentation, color schemes. usability testing, accessibility testing, and security. That's what makes me the "real money".

The ability to bring all those skills together is what separates the "script kiddies" from the pros.
 
v6maro said:
And as a ASP.net/winforms architecht, I bet I make more "real money" than you ;)
.
Click to expand...
me: looks out window at his new Audi A5 while making plans for vacation in Hawaii and thinks, meh, PHP isn't so bad after all... ;)
 
tgabe213 said:
Enough of the dick wagging contest...
Click to expand...
I didn't start it, but I agree, let's end it, the points have been made.

To the OP, to summarize:
- it doesn't really matter that much which server-side language you learn
- both ASP.NET and PHP are fairly easy for anyone with programming skills to pick up.
- you may also want to look into other server-side solutions such as Ruby, Python, etc...
- there are plenty of well-paying career opportunities available for both PHP and ASP.NET developers
- .NET is technically a framework, there are frameworks available for other server-sdie languages as well (E.g Ruby on Rails, Django, CakePHP, etc...), it may be advantageous to learn one of the popular frameworks for your language of choice.
- however, to be a really good web developer, you need many more skills than just a server-side language.
 
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