Apple Turns Its Back on Customers and NVIDIA with macOS Mojave

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by Megalith, Dec 15, 2018.

  1. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    Mac users who prefer NVIDIA cards are calling on Apple to relinquish their iron grip on green team’s drivers and what GPUs are supported. The company’s latest OS, macOS 10.14 Mojave, reduced official support to just two cards, the Quadro K5000 and GeForce GTX 680, but that’s just part of the problem: “NVIDIA currently cannot release a driver unless it is approved by Apple,” so users encountering problems must wait even longer for a solution.

    “Developers using Macs with NVIDIA graphics cards are reporting that after upgrading from 10.13 to 10.14 (Mojave) they are experiencing rendering regressions and slow performance. Apple fully controls drivers for Mac OS. Unfortunately, NVIDIA currently cannot release a driver unless it is approved by Apple.” Additional posts on the site say NVIDIA is working with Apple on Mojave support, but no clear timetable is mentioned.
     
  2. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    *Shrug * 10.13 still works fine.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2018
  3. Shadowed

    Shadowed Limp Gawd

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    I am on 10.13.6 for my GT 650M and GTX 1070.

    The GT 650M is a discrete GPU inside my Macbook from 2012. Is that somehow not supported?

    I bet my Mac will work fine on 10.14, but I will not be able to install Nvidia's own driver.

    On 10.13 (using Nvidia's driver), there is an Nvidia Control Panel that lets users toggle which driver they want to use; Nvidia's or Apple's.

    Using Apple's driver turns my 1070 into something slower than integrated graphics and using Nvidia's boosts gaming performance on the 'supported' GT 650.

    I regret getting a 1070 over a 980 ti because of MacOS.

    I had to wait over a year just for NV and Apple to allow Pascal support whereas Maxwell was supported on earlier versions of MacOS.

    The Hackintosh world is severely affected, and AMD is becoming the preferred choice. Having 1 GPU option really sucks.
     
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  4. DigitalPanhandler

    DigitalPanhandler Limp Gawd

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    who cares... apple can eat a pile a shit


    oh and nvidia is pretty damn close to getting the same response at this point
     
  5. FlawleZ

    FlawleZ Gawd

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    Not really sure why anyone is surprised. This is the epitome of the Apple Experience: Apple's way or the highway.
     
  6. ir0nw0lf

    ir0nw0lf [H]ardness Supreme

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    I think it's more that Apple zealots don't want to accept it. :D
     
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  7. Darrell262

    Darrell262 [H]Lite

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    Its a feature boys. Working as intended.
     
  8. Master_shake_

    Master_shake_ [H]ardForum Junkie

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  9. EODetroit

    EODetroit [H]ard|Gawd

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    Hey Microsoft, this is an example of what NOT to do. Before you get any ideas.
     
  10. ole-m

    ole-m Limp Gawd

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    Macos makes pc's, they are not something you simply customize, it's their configuration and that's how you use it and not a single person should buy it unless you explicitly accept that nothing except apple hardware will work cause it's always been that way.

    Apple hates Nvidia, and if you are a dev just buy a damn PC! devs who develop for apple should be using an amd gpu or intel cause that is what they use, problem solved :)
     
  11. dR.Jester

    dR.Jester 2[H]4U

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  12. Upgrayedd

    Upgrayedd Limp Gawd

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    I wonder how much smarter the general pop is in the alt universe where Apple doesn't exist
     
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  13. hurleybird

    hurleybird [H]Lite

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    Ironically enough, that's also Nvidia's philosophy. It's amazing how long Apple can hold a grudge though.
     
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  14. Spaceninja

    Spaceninja [H]ard|Gawd

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    Which machine can you actually put a GPU in that is supported by this OS? Sounds like this is aimed more at the Hackintosh community than anything else.
     
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  15. travisty

    travisty Gawd

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    Or idk, just avoid Apple like the plague it is?
     
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  16. Azrak

    Azrak Gawd

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    You are GPUing it wrong.
     
  17. Mega6

    Mega6 [H]ard|Gawd

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    You want a toy or a computer? Choose and live with it.
     
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  18. next-Jin

    next-Jin [H]ardness Supreme

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    That’s my thought as well, but external gpu support will be the excuse.
     
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  19. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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    A large part of the community still use the cMP (Cheese grater Mac Pro 4,1's and 5,1's) as they're still very capable machines with quite a bit of life left in them yet. Basically the best Mac's ever made.

    As can safely be assumed, Apple don't like this and would rather they spent $2500,00 on a Mac Mini!
     
  20. Night_Hawk-19

    Night_Hawk-19 Gawd

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    Good way to kill market share.
     
  21. alamox

    alamox Gawd

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    wow what's amazing is the macs that are still working after 6 years, beside didn't nvidia drop support for those cards anyway ?
     
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  22. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    What ideas can they get, since they do not build their own desktop computers?
     
  23. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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  24. Brian_B

    Brian_B 2[H]4U

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    For all two models where you can replace the GPU, which are about 15 years old by now.

    Or the 14 people who are running OS X with an eGPU adapter...
     
  25. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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    I'm still running a dual LGA1366 system, no need to upgrade. 12C/24T is great and tonnes of ram is great.
     
  26. Nolan7689

    Nolan7689 [H]ard|Gawd

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  27. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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    What?!

    I'm not in disagreement with you, but your comment makes no logical sense at all?
     
  28. Nolan7689

    Nolan7689 [H]ard|Gawd

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    I'm being facetious
     
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  29. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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    Ah! ;)
     
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  30. McCartney

    McCartney Gawd

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    can't agree more. really happy i bought the mid 2012 with 128gb from owc.

    put in x5690s earlier this year, and i couldn't be happier.

    only thing that sucks about the dual lga1366 system is that the intel math kernel library (MKL) has a cutting-edge eigensolver that cannot split across physical CPUs (it seems), as i could only get 50% loadcap.

    maybe they've fixed it by now, but i couldn't imagine this being a priority when i originally inquired 5 or so years ago.

    small gripe, but worth sharing.
     
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  31. idiomatic

    idiomatic n00b

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    This is targeted at all the die-hard pro users using eGPU's. Why won't they take the hint? Apple isn't abusing you, you are abusing yourself.
     
  32. GoodBoy

    GoodBoy [H]ard|Gawd

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    You don't buy Apple for high end desktop, or gaming, those use cases where the GPU matters...

    If you bought one for those use cases, you chose... poorly.
     
  33. DTN107

    DTN107 [H]ardness Supreme

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    Apple hasn't forgiven Nvidia for that catastrophe with their G84 and G86S mobile gpus that pretty much crippled every single laptop that had it worldwide.
     
  34. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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    I think this is a bit over the top.

    Quite a few users of certain creative applications have always preferred Apple as their platform of choice over anything else. In the past it was actually how Apple built their desktop market share. In many of these scenario's the GPU is a very important and very utilized component.

    Sure, you wouldn't buy a Mac for gaming, but I see very few people actually gaming on Mac's.
     
  35. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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    Bear in mind that the cMP 4,1/5,1 isn't NUMA capable, both CPU's have their own memory isolated from each other. My particular LGA1366 platform is NUMA capable so memory can be pooled and accessed by both processors.

    I'm not too sure if this has an effect on your particular issues or not.
     
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  36. McCartney

    McCartney Gawd

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    it would make a lot of sense. i really appreciated the design of the mid 2010. the x58 with two sockets was going to have some drawbacks, i guess.

    in many use cases, i could saturate memory and CPU without issue, but i think for the eigensolver it's a bit more strict for its working memory allocation that is used to find the optimal solution.

    and since the optimal solution is deemed as such after evaluating many possibilities, where the state space of these candidate solutions is typically big (for my real world cases), i think you're correct that the lack of NUMA probably relegates it to one cpu.

    the northbridge being on a separate pcb from the southbridge still gives cool feels, though.

    edit: found this interesting
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2018
  37. Mazzspeed

    Mazzspeed [H]ard|Gawd

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    I love the 4,1/5,1 cMP. A beautifully designed machine that still holds it's own even today. Even if the EFI supported NUMA, I don't think the OS does? Although I could be wrong.

    EDIT:

    Depending on application, there's pro's and cons to NUMA vs SMP. However, these days with applications coded the way they are, NUMA generally holds a slight performance advantage as we move to more cores over outright clock speed.

    Having said that, the advantage is minimal.
     
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  38. maxius

    maxius 2[H]4U

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    apple does not want that trash running on their os
     
  39. theBrownLlama

    theBrownLlama Gawd

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    we know Apples does it, but have anyone ever know of 'why' they do it?
     
  40. Chebsy

    Chebsy Gawd

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    And that's just one of the reasons why I don't buy Mac's
     
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