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AMD BF4 Mantle Delay

Porter_ said:
that would require confidence that people are able to discern the difference between BF4 being bugging and Mantle being buggy. it's easy to imagine all the threads popping up across the web titled "wow Mantle is a buggy piece of shit". if Mantle is ready and BF4 is truly the hold-up, then it's a smart move by AMD. a delay has less impact than public outcry about how buggy Mantle is.
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Agreed. This is a great reason for the delay.
 
Oh noes not the precious Mantle!!! I guess I need a 4 jigawatt vram grahics card to run BF4 at 1080P now. Damnit!!!
 
Why not just release it on the impossible release date that they announced months ago? Worked great for the main game... no issues at all!
 
Won't Mantle be just a simple slider in Catalyst Control Center? (Off - On - Application controlled)

BF4 runs as it runs, i don't see why Mantle has to be delayed for this.
 
Apple740 said:
Won't Mantle be just a simple slider in Catalyst Control Center? (Off - On - Application controlled)

BF4 runs as it runs, i don't see why Mantle has to be delayed for this.
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No, it's not a setting or toggle and won't be, it's a complete API like Direct3D or OpenGL.
 
socK said:
No, it's not a setting or toggle and won't be, it's a complete API like Direct3D or OpenGL.
Click to expand...


So I'm guessing it won't matter when mantle support shows up for BF4, we would need drivers with included mantle files anyways, correct?
 
re-Release BF2 as BF 4.5 fixed and win. Then I'll use one of the hundred coupons i've acquired to play it. as it stands now.. dis-Mantle.
 
Venomous said:
So I'm guessing it won't matter when mantle support shows up for BF4, we would need drivers with included mantle files anyways, correct?
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That's my guess, unless it snuck in at some point.
 
im sure it will just be included in the patch.

There is no user controled settings, so no reason to include it with drivers
 
magoo said:
Don't get me wrong, I own a bunch of AMD stuff, including two 290X GPUs, but it seems to me like AMD is treating BF4 and this Mantle thing just like their drivers.......a day late and a dollar short.

It gets old after a while.
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Everyone keeps saying. Wait for better drivers, wait for after market coolers, wait for mantle, etc.

How about they just release a product that works correctly out of the box.
 
I hope it doesn't get delayed again. I cancelled my pre-order for a Gigabyte 780 Ti GHz edition just to see how Mantle plays out. Since I pretty much only play BF4 these days Mantle is going to be a deciding factor for me.
 
All these people bitching about delays. Isn't this what happens when you pay to play on the bleeding edge of hardware tech? It's nothing out of the norm. Get over it.
 
PRIME1 said:
Everyone keeps saying. Wait for better drivers, wait for after market coolers, wait for mantle, etc.

How about they just release a product that works correctly out of the box.
Click to expand...

they did, and they do, and have done so for quite some time.
 
What the hell is the point of Mantle now anyway, when the majority of the cards sold are being used to mine? I think they would be wise to hold off, not just because BF4 is a pile of garbage, but because the cards are not going to be in the hands of people that would actually use it.
 
Sodapopjones said:
What the hell is the point of Mantle now anyway, when the majority of the cards sold are being used to mine? I think they would be wise to hold off, not just because BF4 is a pile of garbage, but because the cards are not going to be in the hands of people that would actually use it.
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You don't really think that all GCN-based card owners have abandoned gaming for mining do you? We're still here gaming :). I personally haven't mined at all, ever. Kudos to those that are making money with it though.
 
Sodapopjones said:
What the hell is the point of Mantle now anyway, when the majority of the cards sold are being used to mine? I think they would be wise to hold off, not just because BF4 is a pile of garbage, but because the cards are not going to be in the hands of people that would actually use it.
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Personally, I look forward to mantle being integrated into BF4.

I have an XFX 290 flashed to a 290x and I use it for gaming on a daily basis and mining while I am at work.

Initially had a ton of issues with BF4(mostly random crashes and DirectX errors). Last week I decided to install Windows 8.1... and I haven't had any issues since. It has made the game enjoyable, ha.
 
Sodapopjones said:
What the hell is the point of Mantle now anyway, when the majority of the cards sold are being used to mine? I think they would be wise to hold off, not just because BF4 is a pile of garbage, but because the cards are not going to be in the hands of people that would actually use it.
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A decent perspective will help you.
Did you ever wonder how new technology became a reality?
Does cards being used for more than one purpose make new technology for them less useful?
 
Nenu said:
A decent perspective will help you.
Did you ever wonder how new technology became a reality?
Does cards being used for more than one purpose make new technology for them less useful?
Click to expand...

Mantle's current perspective is a marketing ploy for gamer's, more performance for less, nothing else. At this juncture, Mantle is even less important than the heap known as 'Phys-X'..

I understand there's 3 of you that actually use your R9's to game with, and there are some older 7xxx series owners, but going forward the marketing ploy of more for less doesn't matter for gamer's, there's no way AMD is going to force retailers to back down on the gouging.
 
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Sodapopjones said:
Mantle's current perspective is a marketing ploy for gamer's, more performance for less, nothing else. At this juncture, Mantle is even less important than the heap known as 'Phys-X'..

I understand there's 3 of you that actually use your R9's to game with, and there are some older 7xxx series owners, but going forward the marketing ploy of more for less doesn't matter for gamer's, there's no way AMD is going to force retailers to back down on the gouging.
Click to expand...

If you haven't noticed prices are heading back to normal.

I got two R9 290's coming for gaming and mining, $430 each shipped.
 
thebufenator said:
If you haven't noticed prices are heading back to normal.

I got two R9 290's coming for gaming and mining, $430 each shipped.
Click to expand...

Like I said, at this juncture, its unimportant, there will hopefully be a time that they come back down to MSRP, *Probably will dip well below MSRP* but its not going to benefit AMD if they release Mantle at this point in time.
 
Sodapopjones said:
Mantle's current perspective is a marketing ploy for gamer's, more performance for less, nothing else. At this juncture, Mantle is even less important than the heap known as 'Phys-X'..

I understand there's 3 of you that actually use your R9's to game with, and there are some older 7xxx series owners, but going forward the marketing ploy of more for less doesn't matter for gamer's, there's no way AMD is going to force retailers to back down on the gouging.
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How do you expect them to present what mantle can do if they dont say what it can do?
They have reduced the overall CPU load and made it easier to spread the load over more cores.
They have also reduced the restrictions of the number of objects that can be processed per second.

Mantle has nothing to do with the trend of using AMD cards for mining.
You seem to have them confused.

GCN cards are still being sold to gamers and production will have ramped up to compensate for demand, this takes time.
The situation as it is right now isnt going to be the same forever.
 
Nenu said:
How do you expect them to present what mantle can do if they dont say what it can do?
They have reduced the overall CPU load and made it easier to spread the load over more cores.
They have also reduced the restrictions of the number of objects that can be processed per second.

Mantle has nothing to do with the trend of using AMD cards for mining.
You seem to have them confused.

GCN cards are still being sold to gamers and production will have ramped up to compensate for demand, this takes time.
The situation as it is right now isnt going to be the same forever.
Click to expand...

What gamer in their right mind, is buying an inflated 290 over a 780 Lighting for less money?

I understand what the potential is, and I understand moving technology further, but releasing Mantle now, isn't going to benefit AMD, I really don't know how many times I need to say this.

Production ramping up isn't going to drop demand in a month, or 2, maybe 3, AMD has all the time in the world to hold onto Mantle.

Besides isn't everyone and their mother on oft claiming that nobody understands supply, demand and price gouging.
 
Sodapopjones said:
I understand what the potential is, and I understand moving technology further, but releasing Mantle now, isn't going to benefit AMD, I really don't know how many times I need to say this.
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A huge portion of PC players own 7xxx series cards. If they get a massive bump in performance for BF4, then AMD is going to continue to sell tons of GCN cards. Theysaid they've ramped up production to meet the high demand. You will see prices go down when these hit the market.

So if it's ready, there is certainly no reason to hold off.
 
Sodapopjones said:
What gamer in their right mind, is buying an inflated 290 over a 780 Lighting for less money?
Click to expand...
Those that are impatient or have to purchase right now.
This was covered in my last post.
Market economics are what they are, having a tantrum changes nothing.

I understand what the potential is, and I understand moving technology further, but releasing Mantle now, isn't going to benefit AMD, I really don't know how many times I need to say this.
Click to expand...
On the contrary, if there are issues with Mantle, surely its better to get them ironed out earlier.
You keep repeating the same crap with no foundation.

Production ramping up isn't going to drop demand in a month, or 2, maybe 3, AMD has all the time in the world to hold onto Mantle.
Click to expand...
All the better for AMD.
The market is what it is, when demand increases production is ramped up.
It wasnt easy to predict what happened, so there was not much else they could do.
Are you expecting some kind of miracle?

Besides isn't everyone and their mother on oft claiming that nobody understands supply, demand and price gouging.
Click to expand...

It seems you are part of that.
 
Nenu said:
Those that are impatient or have to purchase right now.
This was covered in my last post.
Market economics are what they are, having a tantrum changes nothing.


On the contrary, if there are issues with Mantle, surely its better to get them ironed out earlier.
You keep repeating the same crap with no foundation.


All the better for AMD.
The market is what it is, when demand increases production is ramped up.
It wasnt easy to predict what happened, so there was not much else they could do.
Are you expecting some kind of miracle?


It seems you are part of that.
Click to expand...

LOL I'm not having a tantrum, I'm being a realist.

If anything AMD learned from EA/DICE not to release an unfinished polished product, I'm sure some of the delays were AMD realizing this.

My points are not being understood it seems, AMD has adapted to the mining craze, and I'm saying they themselves have probably thought the same thing as a part in weighing the decision to delay Mantle.
 
Sodapopjones said:
If anything AMD learned from EA/DICE not to release an unfinished polished product, I'm sure some of the delays were AMD realizing this.
.
Click to expand...

That's pure speculation, we've had no information showing that the API itself is not on schedule. I think the most up to date information we have about Mantle is from Oxide Games' presentation.

All signs point to the delay being 100% related to the buggy state of BF4 in late 2013.

Edit: Yep, I'm correct:

According to an AMD representative, "the cause of the delay is due to EA's recent decision to halt game development in favor of bug stomping."
Click to expand...

http://www.polygon.com/2013/12/30/5258254/battlefield-4-amd-mantle-patch-delayed-to-january
 
Sodapopjones said:
LOL I'm not having a tantrum, I'm being a realist.

If anything AMD learned from EA/DICE not to release an unfinished polished product, I'm sure some of the delays were AMD realizing this.

My points are not being understood it seems, AMD has adapted to the mining craze, and I'm saying they themselves have probably thought the same thing as a part in weighing the decision to delay Mantle.
Click to expand...

The reality is that it takes time to ramp up production.
Being the Christmas period, demand would have been high anyway, there was not much room for extra demand.
Retailers lapped it up, to be expected.
What was surprising was some cards still being sold around retail price.

Your points are understood, but theres nothing that could have been done.
When you want to purchase and its put beyond your comfort price level, that is understandable. You should make it clear that is your complaint, not drag other things in that are co-incidental.

We dont know the full reason"s" why Mantle has been delayed.
Speculation is one thing, assumption is another and having a mood over an assumption is...
it gave me a laugh :)
 
good god, a voice of reason

all this rampant the markets are crashing nonsense is giving me a headache.
 
well after the past week or so of trying to play BF4 on my crossfire 290s, I'd downgrade my expectations and just ask that they fix the Crossfire issues / flickering that are STILL occurring.

Yes, I know the released a patch for it, it "helped" but didn't eliminate all the flickering/Xfire issues. I have to keep my 290's with crossfire "disabled' to get any sort of consistent and good performance while gaming.

What kind of messed up world is this where the longer a game is out the more major bugs appear? i love my AMD cards for mining of course, but overall if I was going to sum up the experience it's that everytime one bug is fixed, one or two more pop up.
 
In Dice's defence, it is a new engine.

remember how buggy the UE3 engine was when it first came out?
 
The Mac said:
In Dice's defence, it is a new engine.

remember how buggy the UE3 engine was when it first came out?
Click to expand...

This is my biggest peeve with the gaming industry... Excuses, rush jobs and lack of pride. Before you may encounter a few bugs when a game came out, but was patched and fixed within a month or so...

Now I understand adding multi GPU support and everything else we have today complicates games in development. However, it's no excuse to release a damn buggy game and continue to allow customers to find all of your bugs because you wanted to sell a game for the holidays.

Adobe started this trend 13 yrs ago by instead of fixing photoshop, the answer is to simply upgrade to the new version... They do a half ass job addressing any issues with the current version. This is the same attitude game studios have been having and I'm getting tired of it.

EA needs to go away like cancer... They ruined PC gaming as far as I'm concerned.
 
Venomous said:
This is my biggest peeve with the gaming industry... Excuses, rush jobs and lack of pride. Before you may encounter a few bugs when a game came out, but was patched and fixed within a month or so...

Now I understand adding multi GPU support and everything else we have today complicates games in development. However, it's no excuse to release a damn buggy game and continue to allow customers to find all of your bugs because you wanted to sell a game for the holidays.

Adobe started this trend 13 yrs ago by instead of fixing photoshop, the answer is to simply upgrade to the new version... They do a half ass job addressing any issues with the current version. This is the same attitude game studios have been having and I'm getting tired of it.

EA needs to go away like cancer... They ruined PC gaming as far as I'm concerned.
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Being a programmer(web... not gaming) that has had to deal with shitty project management in the past, I just wanted to point out and hope people realize that the programmers more than likely do take great pride in the code they are writing... it just more than likely isn't where they want it yet. It isn't always our choice when a product is released, what code goes into production, and when deadlines are changed. We are the "grunts" it's the big-wigs that are not developers that usually decide these things.
 
Shyne151 said:
Being a programmer(web... not gaming) that has had to deal with shitty project management in the past, I just wanted to point out and hope people realize that the programmers more than likely do take great pride in the code they are writing... it just more than likely isn't where they want it yet. It isn't always our choice when a product is released, what code goes into production, and when deadlines are changed. We are the "grunts" it's the big-wigs that are not developers that usually decide these things.
Click to expand...

I understand what you are saying. It just doesn't look good on the dev's part because of the business decision. The buck gets passed and I'm not sure when the industry deemed this an acceptable practice. It's not acceptable from a customers standpoint and I'm sure as a programmer, it's not by your standard either.
 
Some of the posts in here are either from retards or shills. Let's nail it down step by step for those that caught the short bus to the thread;

Things that are factual:

1) BF4 is buggier than a cheap Chinese buffet

2) Mantle has not been released, but has been demonstrated by Oxide in their game engine and basically described as Jesus on a stick (according to them, but the demo looked amazing)

3) AMD has announced that Mantle has been delayed due to Dice focusing on "bug stomping" before development.

4) Dice has not refuted point 3

Of course AMD are not going to compound the shitfight caused by EA/Dice by trying to repeat history and rush to release, even a simpleton should be able to see what's going on here.
 
one point everyone keeps forgetting.

there isnt anything to release.

Its an API set.

They are included with what ever game uses them.

there is no "release" by amd.
 
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