AMD 3700, 2 7600GT's, enermax liberty 500

S

Shay Ken

Weaksauce
Joined
May 7, 2006
Messages
85
hello, I've been looking around these forums for a couple of days, and I saw a topic about almost the same set-up, didn't want to hijack it so I'll ask it here:

I hope to build a system with these components:
new specs are a few posts down!

since I read good reviews on the enermax liberty series I'd like to use that one, also I live in holland and the prices are a little higher here , atleast I think(99 euro = 126 USD)

so would the PSU be able to run everything stable?

Thanks in advance
 
You 'll be fine with your setup.
A good friend of mine has a similar SLI setup with 2X6800GT cards (way more power hungry than your 7600GTs) and it's running stable with a 400 watts Liberty PSU. Your 500 model will be an overkill!!!!

Just wondering though......

Why go SLI with 2X7600GTs and not buy one 7900GT for less money?

2X7600GTs in your country will cost you at least 400 Euros.
1X7900GT will go for about 340.

400 - 340 = 60 more Euros. Spend these to get a 620 Liberty model and get another 7900GT when the prices go down.

Just my 2 cents.
 
that would be a good idea, but I won't put everything in at the same time, since I need my parents to help me finance the first part so I have a pc of my own, then I'll save up again and buy the second vidcard and the second gig of RAM, if I would buy it all at the same time it would take more time for me to save up and a big chance of my parents telling me it's to expensive and I couldn't even get it.

thanks for the idea though.
 
hmmm, I saw that there are some people that get wrong enermax psu's, 12v rails being way to low and stuff alike, since I don't have the tools to measure those things, how would I find out if that would be the case?
 
Shay Ken said:
hello, I've been looking around these forums for a couple of days, and I saw a topic about almost the same set-up, didn't want to hijack it so I'll ask it here:

I hope to build a system with these components:
CPU: Amd Athlon 64 3700+ socket 939
CPU cooler: Thermaltake blue orb II
Mobo: Asus A8N SLI-SE socket 939
RAM: 2 gb OCZ premier (4*512 mb)
Graphics card: 2 XFX 7600GT XXX
HD: Samsung spinpoint P80SD 160 gb
DVD Drive: Samsung SH-D162C
PSU: Enermax liberty 500 watt

since I read good reviews on the enermax liberty series I'd like to use that one, also I live in holland and the prices are a little higher here , atleast I think(99 euro = 126 USD)

so would the PSU be able to run everything stable?

Thanks in advance
Click to expand...

Although this is the PSU section I will help you out on your system build as well as a PSU. You were right in looking at a Liberty, they are great PSUs. Here is what I have to say to the rest of your system (a little bit of a mess).

CPU: An X2 would be a great investment. Although if you want to stick at the plain A64, fine. But get a 3800+ model, they are better for OCing and more stable (Toledo, or San Diego core).

CPU cooler: 2 choises are good here, if you arn't OCing. Either the stock cooler or a AC Freezer 64 Pro. For light OCing the Freezer will suffice, but for heavier OCing then pickup a Scythe Ninja w/ 120mm slow-flow fan.

Mobo: Good choise

RAM: Patriot 2x 1GB DDR400, best bang for the buck, and you can run in duel channel while leaving slots open.

Video card: eVGA 7900GT, ONE as mensioned above, then another later.

HDD: WD makes great drives in that price range, I would recommend one. Use SATAII if the mobo has it, and their is very small price range to boost your drive to 250GB or higher!

PSU: If you want this to last you a couple upgrades, and can handle 2x 7900GT, the Enermax Liberty 500W is great, if you want a quieter PSU (the liberty can get loud at high load, although you will seldom reach this), then SeaSonic is the way to go.
 
thanks for your reply,

I'll give some reasons here why I picked those parts:

CPU: the 3700 is only 30 euro's more then the 3200, 3800 then is 90-100 euro's more then the 3700, way outta my league.

CPU cooler: I'll have a look at the AC 64 freezer pro

RAM: too bad Patrio isn't available here, but I asked around in the memory section of this forum and decided to go with this one
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820227209
and eventually buy another one of those and hopefully get em to run in dual channel

vidcard: the 7900GT is, again, way to expensive for me, I'm already maxed out on the budget, I'm not even sure if I can get what I stated before, my dad tries to push me to DELL because they have great service :(

HDD: the Samsung one should be SATAII if I remember correctly, I'll have a look at getting some more GB since I can save some euro with the AC freezer.

thanks for your help on this, I'll take the stuff into consideration
 
Shay Ken said:
thanks for your reply,

I'll give some reasons here why I picked those parts:

CPU: the 3700 is only 30 euro's more then the 3200, 3800 then is 90-100 euro's more then the 3700, way outta my league.

CPU cooler: I'll have a look at the AC 64 freezer pro

RAM: too bad Patrio isn't available here, but I asked around in the memory section of this forum and decided to go with this one
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820227209
and eventually buy another one of those and hopefully get em to run in dual channel

vidcard: the 7900GT is, again, way to expensive for me, I'm already maxed out on the budget, I'm not even sure if I can get what I stated before, my dad tries to push me to DELL because they have great service :(

HDD: the Samsung one should be SATAII if I remember correctly, I'll have a look at getting some more GB since I can save some euro with the AC freezer.

thanks for your help on this, I'll take the stuff into consideration
Click to expand...

CPU: If your budget is that tight, ok.
RAM: I was suggesting 2x 1GB, because it really helps in games and overall system performance. (I was also going to recommend the same RAM you just posted, only the 2x 1GB set)

Video Card: A single 7900GT is a lot less expensive then 2x 7600GT.
HD: Samsungs spinpoint series is supposed to be really quiet, just so you know.
 
Get a Samsung T133, not a P80. P80s won't set any performance records. I should know - I have 2 of them. P120 is also fine.
 
what is with you guys? HE SAID he can only afford a 7600gt. He can't afford anything better, he is at his max now. He can't afford a 7900gt. Sheesh guys comon don't make us look bad. Read what he writes. :D
 
thanks for that thecoldanddarkone,
tbh anything I'd use now would set a performance record for me, this pc is old and slow(geforce 2 and 512 mb RAM), but since I saved out 10 bucks on the cpu cooler, I was thinking a P120 SP2004C 200 gb
 
hmm, I noticed that the 3500+ is €60 cheaper then the 3700+, except for the cache advantage the 3700 has, how does the performance compare? is the increase worth € 60?
cause that € 60 euro can be spent on other stuff(better vidcard, perhaps even the 7900 Gt you all love so much)
 
Shay Ken said:
hmm, I noticed that the 3500+ is €60 cheaper then the 3700+, except for the cache advantage the 3700 has, how does the performance compare? is the increase worth € 60?
cause that € 60 euro can be spent on other stuff(better vidcard, perhaps even the 7900 Gt you all love so much)
Click to expand...
Hehe, I can't believe this question hasn't been brought up. Are you comfortable with overclocking or not?

If that's a yes, then this should be your setup for the amount of money you want to save:

AMD Opty 144- consider them as hand picked amd proccessors that overclock like beasts.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/CustRatingReview.asp?Item=N82E16819103600

Honestly though, I don't wanna search this stuff if your not into overclocking. So I will await your answer. BTW, the 144 is $170 compared to the 3700 minimum $235.

You're finding some good stuff, but remember if you're on a budget, it is really a wise choice to get quality low end products that can be easily tweaked to perform like high end expensive products.

K, im gonna do this again:

CPU: Amd Athlon 64 3700+ socket 939 - No, not what you're looking for if you wanna go low budget, 144 is cheapest and can exceed that speed
CPU cooler: Thermaltake blue orb II - I recommend a zalman
Mobo: Asus A8N SLI-SE socket 939 - if you want to overclock and have more features, you need a better one, believe me you will have money from the saving of the other components
RAM: 2 gb OCZ premier (4*512 mb)-VERY BAD IDEA, you will run them at 2t then, get 2x1gb ocz, ill talk abou that later
Graphics card: 2 XFX 7600GT XXX- not bad, i know you're only getting one first, but we'll help you find a better one if possible
HD: Samsung spinpoint P80SD 160 gb - too many variables to decide, You need space? speed? what tasks will be performed?
DVD Drive: Samsung SH-D162C- I recommend one of these http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...4697+4025+1037608017&Submit=ENE&SubCategory=5
PSU: Enermax liberty 500 watt might neeed to go higher, I recommend FSP group
 
cpu: opteron would be a nice idea, but the problem is that it's not reliable, it might overclock like a charm, it might stop at 2,0 ghz

cpu cooler: already decided to go with the AC freezer 64 pro over the blue orb

RAM: already decided to go with 1 gb OCZ EL platinum(1 stick) and buy another one later, also stated in an above post

HD: already decided on a P120 200 GB, that will be more then enough

DVD: I really don't need a burner since I haven't burned a cd/dvd in 9 years, I'll save that 30 euro and spend it on something else

so at this point I have € 510 left to spend on a mobo, vidcard, psu and a case, it would be great if the mobo was SLI, since I'm planning to run that

edit: almost forgot, I'm probably gonna overclock the cpu because I have a friend that has some experience with overclocking and he'll probably help me

and what do I do if the Opty 144 turns out to be one hell of a sucking oc'er?
 
now I have 2 options,
1) stick with the SLI-SE and get a 7900GT, either
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814150139
or
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814121006

2) I get a fancy mobo and buy a the best 7600GT

for a psu I was thinking about the Seasonic S12-600 or should I stick with the Enermax liberty 500 watt
which one would you pick and would the Seasonic take it(with 2 ghz RAM and 2 7900GT's) even though it only has 18 A 12v rails?

and what if I get a sucky stepping and the opteron 144 won't oc(I asked it again cause a lot of you guys seem to not like to read through the above posts ;) )

TIA
 
You should still get the opteron 144. That's what ebay's for ;) type in the stepping hehe and your guranteed high overclocks.

Check out the 146 optys up for $180 shipped http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?from=R40&satitle=cab2e

Nice hard drive, you can get an excellent dvd rom drive for under $20.

K so 510 euros is about $622. It acutally will be around $700 with the money saved from the cpu.

Lets get started-

MOBO- Lets just get something straight right away: THE ASUS A8N-SLI SE CANNOT PASS 1.45v FOR THE CPU . For overclocking I don't want you to be confused. So if you're half experienced then ASUS, if you think your a Gawd overclocker then go DFI. We will decide what model you need later, first we need to figure out your personal experience.

CASE- choose : http://xoxide.com/pccases.html

Video Card- K so you're thinking about getting the xfx 7900gt extreme which is the best 7900gt in the roundup for the performance. But you should consider features. The evga performs lower than the xfx at an average of 1.04 frames lower. So when the xfx has 41.04fps, the evga is doing 40.00fps which is not that big of a loss. Especially when you consider evga's lifetime warranty which also includes that if you overclock the card, you still have the lifetime warranty nonetheless against xfx's limited warranty. And it's about 8 euros cheaper :p
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814130015

PSU - Tough choice. You have more choices here than just seasonic and enermax. I recommend the FSP 600w psu. It's stable, great for overclocking for the price, and quiet with more than enough power. Don't worry if you haven't heard of this brand, trust me it's a quality product.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817104014

My estimate is you will spend:

MOBO- ~$150
CASE- <$100
Video Card- $289
PSU- $139

This will be less than the $700 which will be more than available in your pockets :p
 
the evga is kinda out of the question, the retards over here ask €356 :/

I'd rather get one of the 2 I already suggested cause they are 300 euro and I don't think I can find em any lower, maybe just the regular Asus EN7900GT and oc that, that would save me +/- 25 euro

on the mobo I don't think I need a DFI, I might do some overclocking but I'm not exspecting to be a total master at it, so we could have a look at an asus or abit, don't know which one would be best.

for some reason that FSP group thing isn't available here, some other options would be cool, maybe the Hiper 580 watt
nevermind that Hiper, read some bad stuff about it

and because of the budget it would be nice to know what stepping's are best for the 144 so I can have a look at that

thanks again
 
maybe one of you can add me on msn, my addie is in my profile, cause it's hard to do it all like this
 
Dell doesn't have great service, i sent in my laptop to have them replace the dvd burner and they gave me a new CPU instead lolz
 
I hear rumours of oc'ed cpu's/gpu's dying sooner? is this real or just fake stories of wussy's searching for excuses not to oc :p ?

msn add request on the new page :p msn address in my profile
 
Remember, your overclocks may vary. I have a 144 CABNE 0530. It doesn't even hit 2.5 ghz. And this is one of the best steppings you can get. I also have a 146 CABGE, and it does an easy 2.8

Your milage may vary.

For the mobo, i suggest an asrock 939dual-sata2. With a sinple vmod, you'll be getting 1.55 vcore, really high overclocks, upgradable to am2/ddr2, agp and pcie. Only $70 too.
 
volt modding on your parents dime? not that I've checked what that particular mod entails, but not something I'd do if I wanted to respect my folks..."Gee dad, the mobo burned out.."

I believe Seagate hard drives are still coming with a five year warranty. Pick the right one and they're right up there in terms of speed.

just my 2cents

BTW ocz is selling a psu that is the exact same as the Fortron Epsilon. I think it is the Xstream series, would need to verify which model it is.
 
I thought I read somewhere it's really unlikely to burn out something by overclocking, I might have used the wrong word when I said voltmodding, never really overclocked before but I have a couple of friends who have, so they'll know.
back to the mobo, would it work? and is SLI 32x really that much better, since it's only 11 euro's more I think it's not that big of a deal.

I'll have a look at those Seagate HD's

EDIT: I just read it is compatible with AM2, do they mean the new socket coming out some time this year or is it just socket 940 :confused:
 
If you're going to overclock be careful with bumping up voltages (by bios) and get good cooling. Zalman makes excellent stuff. You can also add little heatsinks to things like mosfets. People on this forum will help out on all that stuff. Also a good UPS with automatic voltage regulation (AVR) helps with stable voltages. Not entirely neccessary though. Just be sure you get a quality PSU.

Can't answer any of your other questions as I'm not up on those things.

Best of luck with it all!
 
Shay Ken said:
cpu: opteron would be a nice idea, but the problem is that it's not reliable, it might overclock like a charm, it might stop at 2,0 ghz

edit: almost forgot, I'm probably gonna overclock the cpu because I have a friend that has some experience with overclocking and he'll probably help me
Click to expand...
opterons are of a class of cpu meant for servers, as such they are meant to be reliable. a common theory these days is that AMD is taking chips that are known to be good at a certain speed and underclocking them to obtain some extra reliability (and so you can find good ocing chips). woopdy woop! sometimes a company will underclock chips to meet demand for less pricey chips, or to convince me to buy another chip I don't really need... EDIT: (which works AND puts a smile on my face)
-point is right now seems to be a good time to get an Opteron, unless you can order or find out things like steppings from your supplier it's the luck of the draw, more or less.

Shay Ken said:
and what do I do if the Opty 144 turns out to be one hell of a sucking oc'er?
Click to expand...
add more voltage and get water cooling

as for the mobo, Asrock sells Asus (reputation for quality/reliability) mobos, I think, and DFI is known for boards that overclock, in part at least because of the bios options.
I would check out what the difference beween the Asrock/Asus' and the DFI's bios are with your buddy and go from there.

There are at least few great sites in this search, err a lot of them :)

http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=939SLI32-eSATA2&btnG=Google+Search&meta=
 
You might want to ask around a few other forums too, pcperspective used to be amdmobo (or was that another, try that too)...lot's of great people around

P.S. I don't think you could go wrong with the Seasonic, that eighteen amps looks pretty good

"The ASRock 939SLI32-eSATA2 motherboard is based on the ULi M1697 and M1695 chipsets. ASRock has done a masterful job in utilizing these recently released chipsets to create a board that might make you think twice about spending any additional money for an NVIDIA nForce4 dual X16 SLI solution. In fact, this board fully supports NVIDIA SLI technology and it works seamlessly with the included ULi PowerExpress Engine Enabling driver. Of course, now that NVIDIA has completed their acquisition of ULi, we have to wonder how many manufacturers will be able to provide a similar solution utilizing these chipsets or how long this driver will be available. Source: AnandTech"

http://channels.lockergnome.com/hardware/archives/20060308_asrock_939sli32esata2_uli_dual_x16_sli.phtml



madshrimps

"The brand spanking new ASRock 939SLI32-eSATA2 motherboard is one of the future friendly motherboards, and it looks pretty sweet. Based around the ULi M1695 Northbridge and ULi M1697 Southbridge, the ASRock 939SLI32-eSATA2 motherboard supports all current Socket 939 AMD Athlon64/X2/FX processors. The four DDR DIMM slots can accommodate up to 4GB of PC3200 unbuffered non ECC memory"

"1st May 2006 20:46"

pcstats

"Many of ASRock's motherboards are compatible with upcoming CPU technologies through its yellow "Future CPU slots"."

wow, those heatsinks look like the ones on my Asus nf2, you might want to check them for flat, base contact area that is...they are great sinks, apparently the on one the south bridge may interfere with a second video card, no problem if you feel like replacing it with some other solution just be careful!

k, I'm done
 
whoa, thanks a lot for that info, really helpfull, yeah today at school someone told me about Asrock being Asus with different chipsets, that's good I guess, I'll probably go for the opteron 144 in a store or a 146 if I can find a good deal around here, again thanks a lot for the help people! :)
 
Just two things as far as the Asrock goes, I wouldn't put to much into the AM2 upgrade, after all you would have to pay for the daughter card in the future in addition to the new cpu (making the performance/price value questionable), and that's if you will be able to get it.

Also the AnandTech review points out the passive heatsink on one of the chipsets is insufficient. While it's easy enough to improve upon, (you could merely add a fan using nylon drywall plugs, however it would be much better to remove it, lap the base and use a superior thermal paste like arctic silver), it is equally as easy to damage the underside of the board (possibly rendering the mobo useless) while pushing the push pins back up through the board to remove it.

Other than that the board looks very impressive.
Presumably the board is at revision 1. Generally it is wiser to wait for later revisions of boards so that any possible issues have been discovered and fixed.

Best of luck Shay.
 
hmm, when you say lap the base, do you mean put some new Thermal paste on it and put the heatsink back or put thermal paste on it and get a new southbridge cooler heatsink(fan)(do they evenb exist?)

thanks again for the help!
 
No problem, I'm happy to help out! What comes around goes around as they say.

Lapping is flattening and smoothing. It is one of the first things a lot of people who overclock do to their heatsinks. Sometimes the sink and chip don't contact eachother 100% because the heatsink isn't flat.* There are plenty of guides around the forums, I bet there is one here some place.
Then they use a premium thermal paste like Arctic Silver 5 (follow the directions! if you use too much it can squeeze out and cause an electrical short) Do Not just add new thermal paste over top of the old. Remove the original stuff first.

Be warned, if they're still using the sticky pink stuff this could be a pain. You could try heating it a little with a hairdryer on low or medium to loosen it up a bit (do this before removing the sink from the board, there are stories of the chips pulling right off the board along with the sink). There are "push pins", these flare out on the under side of the board, to hold the heatsink on. Be very careful not to damage the board with the tweezers or pliers or whatever you use to squeeze the flared out part together so they will go back through the hole. The push pin can be pulled from the top as well. Look closely, you will see it has a flat head on it, it sits in a sleeve. Don't pull on the sleeve. The old paste can be scraped off with a credit card and cleaned up with 99% Isopropyl alcohol, or something like "Goof Off". Be aware that the Iso alcohol is harmless to touch and the Goof Off isn't.

Keep in mind that doing these things will more than likely void the warranty.

There are also aftermarket replacements you can use, but the original is pretty good, and you can always stick a little fan on top to help it out. The important thing is that it fully contact the chip and have quality paste used properly.
It's the one that could get in the way of your second video card that may have to be replaced. This could be tricky 'cause you're going to have to find one that won't be in the way, can't be too tall or touch things it shouldn't and will more than likely need a fan on it just because it is smaller. It will also have to have push pins or nut and bolt that match the original unless you want to use thermal adhesive instead of thermal paste. Remember that warranty!

*This is one of the things I like about Zalman. The base of their video card cooler I bought is not only flat it is smooth! Usually machining marks can be seen.
 
Seems I was wrong about one being round here, maybe there is but look here, better yet here

He suggests using laquer thinner. I suggest using water. Waterproof sandpaper and water. Emery or silicon carbide. Cheap at any hardware store.

That second one looks like maybe he used brasso to pretty it up a bit. Don't let anyone tell you to use brasso! lol
And the sink counter, wow, use a good flat piece of glass or mirror as suggested.
I've done it with spray on adhesive and no laquer thinner, just use as little as possible to keep the paper flat and smooth.
 
OK! I think I've got a solution. The biggest problem is finding something that can adapt to the mounting holes for those push pins. It should be low profile, needs a fan and should copper to help ensure sufficient cooling.

Without the actual measurements on the dimensions of the mounting holes on the board, and the corresponding dimensions of the cooler, I cannot guarantee that it will work. You will want to check other clearances like hieght (so it fits under you video card) and width. However the apparently adjustable nature of this cooler is the closest I could find. Perhaps an email to Evercool would answer the question.

Enter Evercool VC-RF VGA Cooler.
http://www.evercool.com.tw/products/vc_rf.htm
http://www.evercool.com.tw/install/instal_vcrf.htm
http://images.planetamd64.com/pyr0/Evercool/Cyclone/VC-RF%20assembled-t.jpg

I'm have a quick look over this thread to check that I'm answering the problem.

From the pcstats review.
"The ULi M1697 Southbridge generates a fair amount of heat, and because ASRock decided to go with passive cooling it requires a larger heatsink. Plus side: it's totally silent! This can pose problems to users with long PCI expansion cards, or even with the second PCI Express x16 SLI videocard if it has a dual slot cooler. Depending on the length of cards, or heatsinks there may be interference between the cooler and this aluminum heatsink on the Southbridge. Before slapping in a new card, do a test fit to make sure there is enough room first."

The dimensions on this cooler are 45mmx45mmx10mm. Should be plenty low enough. I can't say for sure if it will dissipate more heat than the stock heatsink, but I would expect it will. As a matter of fact, I'm now looking for one of these myself!:)

EDIT: must've forgot to enter the link to the dynatron
btw, there is also this. I'm sure it won't fit, but it will make great little sinks after I cut it up.:D

Oh, almost forgot, the waterproof sandpaper I mentioned is something autobody guys use, might not be in every hardware store, but still easy enough to find.

This would be my first choice, with a more reasonably sized fan of course.
http://www.twistedmods.com/article.php?artid=269
http://www.devhardware.com/c/a/PC-Cooling/Microcool-Northpole-Chipset-Cooling-Kit/
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/minoxewh.html
 
Read a few post about the Seasonic having some issues, having to let it cool down before reboots.
I'd get the Fortron/Sparkle/FSP~GLN Epsilon if you can
 
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