am i obsessing too much about plasma over lcd?

D

Dome

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let me preface this post by saying i've yet to go look at the difference b/w the two at my local electronics store.

i've been reading reviews about plasmas lately and i've really been wanting to buy one of the new panisonic plasmas. i've read that the old cons of plasma (burn-in, lifespan) have really been addressed, and that the image is better, but for someone who watches almost no tv, and really would use the screen for movies (standard def, not buying blu-ray for a while) and video games, should i look at LCDs and try to save myself some money?

i'm in the market for a 50 incher, but i want to spend money on something that'll last, i don't want a cheapo unit that i'm going to regret buying in a year or two...

now i know i'm just kindling the plasma vs lcd debate, but i feel like atm i've chosen plasma for no apparent reason
 
If you can control the ambient lighting and/or find one with a superior anti-glare coating, the best plasmas offer deeper blacks and a vastly superior native contrast ratio. And also better viewing angles.

However, for a bright room, an LCD can be superior. They have traditionally been brighter and have had better anti-glare performance. And you shouldn't have to worry about permanent image retention damage with LCD, which I still think is a concern with computer use and possibly games...
 
I'm no expert, but I'd say the Plasma's for the most part should make regular def movies look better. Contract ratio, color saturation.

My roommates DVD collection looks pretty dem good on his Samsung 42" 720p Plasma. X360 on it is to die for! Worth every penny, it's not a top-end set, but for $800 bux, I think it's unbeatable for similar units costing double.

The Panasonics were real nice, but a bit more pricy for a real nice set, and if you stayed in the $1000 bracket, at Fry's, the Samsungs looked better every time.
 
I was just about to start a thread on this and ask you guys for advice. Sorry Dome , I am not hijacking your thread, but I think We are looking for the same information :)

I was all set to buy an LCD (the samsung 6 series) when the sales guy in the store said the best TV He had in the shop was a Panasonic Plasma. I told him that I was afraid of getting a plasma becuase I was going to be using mainly as a computer monitor for work, then PC games, HD movies, then console games. He claimed that this was no problem and that Burn in was not a problem for Plasma's anymore. He was so sure of himself that He offered me a free 5 year warrenty on any Plasma that I wanted to buy.

Is He right? I mean I have read threads, but they are all about console gaming, not so much Pc gaming or general PC use. I would buy a plasma in an instant if I was just console gaming and watching movies.
 
I'm using one of the new 42" 1080P Panasonic Plasmas and can relate some experiences.
My screen is in use up to 16hrs a day (most days) mainly for PC use + movies and TV on top so has to cope with a fair amount of static images but does get a fair amount of full screen video too

When I first got the 42PZ80B, it looked bloody crap, colours were washed out, an old 37" LCD I got looked way better. I was cursing.
However by the next day, it had started to settle in and colours looked fantastic and have got better and better each day (I swear!)
Now it blows away the LCD I had in a big way and I considered that to be very good (it was a 5mS S-IPS).

For the first week I wasnt aware of burnin issues so did very little to help prevent it happening.
Despite what I consider to be grave abuse in this regard, the TV didnt suffer AT ALL !
After reading up I have observed some common sense precautions and suffered no issues with it, now 4 weeks into its life.
Bear in mind that the first 200 hours are the most crucial for looking after a Plasma and it has passed through them with flying colours (pun intended :D).
note: it is recommended to take good care of a Plasma up to 1000hrs

This morning I awoke on the sofa. I had fallen asleep while watching a film on full power and found the TV still on but now with my PC desktop on the screen at full power!
I minimised everything to the black background and was horrified to see what looked like extremely intense burnin wherever there was a PC window open.
All the small text that was previously displayed was clearly readable!!!
Very quickly I put it on TV mode to help even the wear out and hoped this was the temporary type of burnin.
Well, after 10 mins, it was almost gone, very hard to see.
After 1/2hr, it was gone completely, I cannot see any burnin even with the room dark, superb.
This TV seems to be very hardy, even when abused at such an early stage in its life!


Onto the image quality:
SD looks great using Freesat HDs satellite decoder. The TVs built in Freeview decoder looks very nearly as good.
You cant expect SD to look like HD but it is the most agreeable SD picture I have seen on a big screen and I view from only 1.5 metres away :)
Playing back SD movies using a PC to upscale looks as good as it can get.

Freesat HD 1080i is something to behold, I am over awed by the image quality.
The same with PC gaming at 1080p and viewing 1080p and 720p video using my PC, just magic.


To Reaper12,
The guy in the store is a shit and I wouldnt go back to him.
Panasonic offer a free 5 year warranty with the new Plasmas as long as you view it in store and get a stamp on the 5 year warranty leaflet.
The warranty doesnt cover burnin as far as I am aware.
I would still be cautious about minimising burnin but dont consider it a reason to not get a plasma unless you know it will be abused.

A Plasma can suffer permanent burnin if you display the same static images constantly and do not vary the type of media it displays.
You can greatly reduce the effect that static images have by reducing the brightness and contrast for PC desktop/browsing use.
Playing movies and/or TV evens out the wear too.
For Browsing I use Eco mode with 1/3 brightness and contrast.
You'd think this would look bad but its actually easier on the eyes for longterm web browsing and is much preferred to full power.
In Eco mode, I never see anything that looks like permanent burnin and am very happy to keep using it this way.

So its a little more effort to have a Plasma but the results are more than worth it.
I am surprised just how resiliant this new set is.
 
Thanks very much Nenu for the very detailed answer :) It's exactly what I was looking for.

It's just basically looking after it a bit more than an LCD TV. Does that mean switching modes and what I am displaying often? Or does it mean use it with all the brightness, contrast, colour etc. turned down lower than normal? Or both?

In fairness to the salesguy, He did say Panasonics had a five year warrenty, but, He offered me a five year warrenty on any Plasma I will buy, not just Panasonic.

Do you ever play first person shooters on your Plasma Nenu? Like CS:Source? I am thinking of getting the exact model you have. Will pick it up on Wednesday if I go ahead with it :)
 
For PC browsing I use Eco mode with lowered contrast/brightness, everything else is left alone.
Luckily it stores the settings for each input so when I switch to Satellite, it is automatically set to Normal power just as I want it.
Switching back to PC mode automatically goes back to Eco mode or whatever it was last set to.
Forgot to mention earlier that I have also set a blank black screen screensaver to run after 1 minute idle. (its not much use when you fall asleep on the mouse though!!)
I will keep to 1 minute until at least the first 1000hrs are over.

When Gaming or watching movies on the PC, I switch from Eco to Normal power mode, this is the only level switching required.
Another bonus is that the "Eco" and "Normal" power settings store their own contrast and brightness levels so when switching mode, you only need do one operation. This feature made me smile.

And yes, lots of FPS games played here :)
I'm currently playing Bioshock, Crysis, Jade Empire, Guitar Hero III, COD 4, Call of Juarez, Rainbow 6 Vegas 2...
I darent buy Mass Effect yet or I wont finish some of the above!
Very soon to have an XBox 360 on it too if I get to the bank in time today!

So to sum up, when using the PC for browsing and then movies/games, I only make a change from Eco mode to Normal mode each time and back again after.
Thats it :)

If you think you might tank it (fall asleep) after some beer and leave the TV running, you can set the Off Timer in increments of 15mins, up to 90 mins.
 
Nenu, Again thanks very much, you have been a big help and really set my mind at ease.

One of the reasons I was deciding on the Plasma was that the response time is as good as a CRT monitor. And you seem to be very happy with yours, so, that is a relief as well.

It's just great that I can go into the store now and buy either a Plasma or an LCD and know that either will be good. Lots of people still warning me about burn-in since I will be using it on the PC so much, but, I would take your advice over most of theirs as You actually own the exact TV I was thinking of and have nearly the same uses :)

changing the settings fro normal to eco will not be a big deal for me. I don't mind the extra effort as long as I get great picture and zero input lag :D

Can't wait now to go to the store on Wednesday :cool:
 
np :)

There isnt zero input lag but it is very low and doesnt impact my gameplay.
Plasmas have a green/yellow trail if spinning round very fast but I only ever notice it when a near black and white image is displayed and I spin round.
ie I can see the yellow trail a bit when playing Assassins Creed but it didnt spoil the experience.
Overall for gaming and movies, this is the best experience I have had, even better than a projector I built with a very wide gamut light.

For me, what Plasma has over LCD comes mostly down to the colour depth.
Colour gradients are much smoother, its harder to see when colours blend into each other and its as if there is a much broader range of colours
Anything that should glow like Flourescent paint / jackets... really does glow!.
The sheer range of colours displayed is above that of my old CRT which was a damn good one.
Panasonic quote the set uses 110% of the NTSC colour gamut.
Facial tones give one of the largest improvements, they look so natural.

Another nice extra is a glass screen cover so you will struggle to hurt the screen and cleaning is a breeze.
The base is extremely solid and is spread well making it hard to knock over.

Some info I picked up.
From reading [H] reader reports, it seems there are a few PZ80 models in the US and some have what appears (from the descriptions I read) to be a filter over the screen that dulls the image.
Be very sure that what you are ordering is exactly the set you want.
 
Well Nenu and Dome I rang Panasonic presales and asked them directly about burn-in and about the break in period and about using Plasma TV as a Pc monitor. The guy just said this was no problem and just said that I don't have to worry too much about it with the latest plasma's. He claimed that the break in period isn't really needed anymore either. As long as I used sensible brighness and contrast when using windows, and that I didn't have any really bright colours as the taskbar or the icons then there will never be a problem. He said that 4 or 5 hour sessions were not really going to cause a problem. Just watch a movie or some TV or play a full screen game for an hour or two every so often.

So basically He Just said what you had already told me Nenu, that, as long as I use it sensibly I will never have any Ir or Burn inn problems.
 
Hmm that does back up my experience very well.
I'd get it in writing though ;)

heh just kidding, thanks for the info, its good to know.
When I first got my set I spoke to Panasonic on the phone and the guy paused for a moment when I told him I was using it on a PC.
However he didnt warn me about its usage pattern so maybe it is as your engineer said.

I wish to point out the wording in the warranty booklet though:
"The guarantee shall not apply to damage caused through fire, accident, misuse, wear and tear, neglect, incorrect adjustment or repair, to damage caused through installation, adaption, modifications, or use in an improper manner or inconsistent blah blah...."

Burn in could be classed as "improper use", "wear and tear" or "neglect" if they want to be awkward.
Best to play it safe still if using a Plasma until more is known for definite.
I am hopeful though.


ps I am using a black theme so my taskbar is black and is set to autohide too.

edit:
just found this in the Warranty which opens a can of worms:
"The image retention on the Plasma TV resulting from fixed image use is not an operating defect and as such is not covered by the guarantee."
You may want to speak to the engineer again to get this clarified.
 
"The image retention on the Plasma TV resulting from fixed image use is not an operating defect and as such is not covered by the guarantee."

Yeah, that was the bit that scared me off for dedicated computer monitor use...
 
i won't be using it for computer monitor use. the only thing i might do is setup a fileserver so i can watch movies off of a server
 
I dont mind reporting back on the TVs condition in a month or so if you can wait before purchasing.

@Dome
you'll love it :)
 
I do not know your budget but I would suggest to take a look at the Pioneer Kuro Plasmas. There is no better HDTV!
 
RadXge said:
I do not know your budget but I would suggest to take a look at the Pioneer Kuro Plasmas. There is no better HDTV!
Click to expand...

I think the new Panasonics will be better during the daytime or anytime there's a lot of light, cause the new 8/80/800's have very high contrast ratio's, and there's not much diff between the black levels.

I saw both the 42 and the 50in 80 768's playing DVD.......it was a Robbie Williams DVD, and he never looked so good.
 
Well after reading everything here and all the good ipnut from Nenu with advice from Panasonic themselves, I decided to buy the PZ80, the 42 inch version.

I only have it setup about 2 hours, but already I am well impressed.

I have done no calibration or anything on it and the picture looks amazing. There is a night and day difference between this and my two year old Samsung LCD which it is replacing. and they say that the picture will get better after a break in period!! WOW, I mean I can't wait until I see what that picture looks like :D

I have it connected like this

PS3 - HDMI
PC - HDMI
Xbox360 - Component

I am not too worried about image retention or burn in after a long talk with a panasonic engineer today. There is an option in the menu for side panel, you can set it to off, low, med or high. It stops IR, so I have set it to high because I don't see any difference in PQ with it off or high. what have you this at Nenu?

I have a few issues though, but, maybe it's just me not been used to plasma or the fact that the TV needs some time to settle in.

the first issue is that there is a really loud buzzing from the TV, it's in every mode. I haven't played around too much with the settings, but maybe someone (nenu;) ) can tell me does this noise go away? I can hear it over the hum of my computer.

the second issue is the PC input, it only accepts up to 1366 * 768. It doesn't do 1920*1080, so I can't hook my Xbox360 up to it.

The other problem is when I am using the PC, like now. There is a really annoying flicker, it reminds me most of when I was using a CRT monitor. If you ever have connected your PC to a CRT monitor you will now the flicker that I am talking about. It happens when you set the refresh rate to 60Hz, but if you change it to a higher refresh rate like 85hz the flicker goes away. So I take it that becasue the Plasma is most like a CRT, that I am seeing the same flickering at 60Hz? Or does Plasma handle the refresh rates like an LCD?

Nenu, you have you PC connected using VGA, can you tell me if is possible to set refresh rates higher than 60hz through VGA??

Thanks!!
 
Hey nice one, well done :)
The picture does improve, I found the colours became deeper over time.
If you can watch 1080i HD TV, you will be amazed.
That reminds me, if your sat / cable box gives you the choice of 1080i or 720p, choose 1080i.
I have seen 3 different plasmas recently and they all benefit more from 1080i, 2 were 720p sets the other is my 1080p set.

I dont use the TVs own grey side panels on the edge of 4:3 images etc because the HD satellite decoder gives out a full 1080i signal.
The Sat box gets to add the side bars and sadly they are just black.
Its not really a problem though as most transmissions are in widescreen and those that arent can be zoomed in.
As long as its not an ultra shite video feed, the TV does a good job of keeping the image watchable.
I do view some 4:3 material with black borders and havent seen any issues yet.

When I did use the side panels I set them set to mid level.
They are strange though, at first you notice them but soon after you find they are just about the right colour to become semi invisible.


The buzzing noise makes it sound like you have a set thats out of spec/faulty I'm afraid.
I cant tell when my set is on or off when running a black screensaver, its that quiet. It has fooled me a few times.
If its really bad, I would get in touch with Panasonic and ask for advice and/or a replacement TV that they can verify is quiet before shipping.
One thing that is useful to know, when the black screen saver is on, the set only uses 60W :)


My VGA PC input is missing, we must have slightly different models.
I did read previously that the PC input is limited to 1366 res and the TV cannot accept inputs higher than 60Hz.
Mine has 3 HDMI ports for 1080p on 3 devices, hopefully yours has too. My third port is under the flap on the front of the TV.
If stuck, you can get a HDMI switch box or use a hifi amplifier that accepts HDMI in/out.

The XBox 360 cant really use 1080p for games anyway, it upscales nearly everything from 720p or just under 720p.
If you dont intend on using your 360 as a 1080p media center, the VGA 720p input should be just the ticket.


Yes I noticed a slight flicker in PC mode on white screens when I first got the TV, just like a CRT at low refresh rate.
It wasnt noticable while playing movies or games from my PC, only while browsing the web with a white background.
My friends said they couldnt see any flicker at all so I assumed it was just me.
After a few days I stopped noticing it too and it now it isnt an issue.
I may have adjusted to it or the TV may have bedded in, dunno which.
To answer your question, plasma cells are refreshed like a TV not kept lit like an LCD.

The TV has a 100Hz engine to clean up the picture on TV type sources and I have to say it does a good job.
A Computer source cannot use the 100Hz engine, it may only work on interlaced sources.

If you do decide to ask for a replacement set because of the buzz and your set only has 2 hdmi ports, ask them about a 3 hdmi port version.
It may be that you need to go back to the retailer for a replacement so take Panasonics phone number and the name of the engineer you spoke to so they can confirm any problems if needed.

Good luck getting it sorted.
 
Dome said:
let me preface this post by saying i've yet to go look at the difference b/w the two at my local electronics store.

i've been reading reviews about plasmas lately and i've really been wanting to buy one of the new panisonic plasmas. i've read that the old cons of plasma (burn-in, lifespan) have really been addressed, and that the image is better, but for someone who watches almost no tv, and really would use the screen for movies (standard def, not buying blu-ray for a while) and video games, should i look at LCDs and try to save myself some money?

i'm in the market for a 50 incher, but i want to spend money on something that'll last, i don't want a cheapo unit that i'm going to regret buying in a year or two...

now i know i'm just kindling the plasma vs lcd debate, but i feel like atm i've chosen plasma for no apparent reason
Click to expand...


I have several plasmas and lcd's at work, despite what people say, plasmas still suffer burn in troubles, all of ours have ESPN logo burned into them, not so with the lcds, I would stay away from plasma........FAR AWAY......and yes both our lcd's and plasmas are new, in fact the plasmas are only a few months old, LG's latest model. While plasmas may have improved slightly over older models, their inherent problems remain the same while LCD's on the other hand have dramatically improved.

GO WITH LCD or DLP
 
Reaper12....Drop both the contrast and the brightness down a bit, that might reduce the buzzing.


CONG......it's an LG, nuff said.......try and find a Panasonic or Pioneer owner with burn in{perm}
 
conghelach said:
I have several plasmas and lcd's at work, despite what people say, plasmas still suffer burn in troubles, all of ours have ESPN logo burned into them, not so with the lcds, I would stay away from plasma........FAR AWAY......and yes both our lcd's and plasmas are new, in fact the plasmas are only a few months old, LG's latest model. While plasmas may have improved slightly over older models, their inherent problems remain the same while LCD's on the other hand have dramatically improved.

GO WITH LCD or DLP
Click to expand...

Well nearly all the reviews of the latest model plasma's from LG say that image retention is a real big problem and you really have to mind these TV's to avoid Burn-in. They looked very good, but, even the salesguy in the shop were I bought my TV said that the LG TV's were very prone to burn in.

I was stuck between buying the Samsung A656, the sony W4000 and the Panasonic PZ80. I rang the store on Monday and said I would be there on thursday to demo these TV's would it be possible to set them up side by side with the same feed going to all 3. Well when I went in yesterday with a few friends and he had the three TV's setup the way I wanted. I watch bluray, SD, Football and an ordinary DVD. All three TV's give a great picture. We played with different settings on each TV and spent about 2 hours there watching stuff. After all that all of us agreed that the Panasonic was the best. I was a die hard LCD fan, but even I could see that the PZ80 was much better to watch than either LCD.

Nenu about the noise level, damn, I might have to return the TV. Luckily the shop is only about 15 minutes away. I have 3 HDMI ports on my set and a VGA input. I am from Ireland. I was hoping that maybe the noise might be just something that occurs while the TV is settling in.

I tried turning down the brightness and contrast low, but it made the same noise. In fact I turned everything down the whole way, it still made noise!!
 
Thanks for telling us about your LCD comparison.
I wanted to do similar but got to the shop after it should have closed on a Bank Holiday Friday (due to bad traffic).
Luckily the shop owner hung around for me but there was no time to do anything except buy the TV.
I'm glad you found it better than the W4000, that was one of my candidates too :)

I agree that the Pioneers and Panasonics are reputed to be the best for resisting burn in.
I'm not surprised to hear the LGs suffer badly, it fits with what I came across on my travels round the web.
However, it is wise to display un-logo'd movie / TV type material after long periods of static image use, to blend any extra wear.
I bet the LGs were left permanently with static logos on screen.


Sadly I dont think your TVs buzz is going away.
It is most likely from the mains power transformer so what you are hearing should be mains hum or clatter.
This is caused by a transformer that is not made to spec and has gaps in the metalwork or loose plates which rattle.
It wont get better and is more likely to get worse.

Thats lucky your shop is 15 mins away, mine is 2 1/2hrs and £50 in petrol !!
I'm a spanner for getting one so early before everywhere had stock.

Since you have 3 HDMI ports you can use the 360 on one of those if you get the lead.
I'm about to order (in 10 mins :)) a 360 myself with an HDMI port, wooo.

Ooh yes, did you get the free dealer stamped 5 year warranty leaflet?
According to the document you only qualify for it if you buy the TV in store not online.
So as you did collect the TV, you should have one.
You need to send the stamped leaflet and proof of purchase to Panasonic to get the full warranty soon after buying the TV.
 
Oh wow, Nenu, I am glad you are reading this thread :)

I would have never realised you had to send the receipt and stamp to Panasonic. I can can that sorted out when I bring the TV back for replacement.
 
conghelach said:
I have several plasmas and lcd's at work, despite what people say, plasmas still suffer burn in troubles, all of ours have ESPN logo burned into them, not so with the lcds, I would stay away from plasma........FAR AWAY......and yes both our lcd's and plasmas are new, in fact the plasmas are only a few months old, LG's latest model. While plasmas may have improved slightly over older models, their inherent problems remain the same while LCD's on the other hand have dramatically improved.

GO WITH LCD or DLP
Click to expand...

This is a crock. :rolleyes: I've had a plasma for almost 2 years and I have never had any burn in. I also leave it on pretty much 14 hours a day as well. It is a different brand though (Philips). I love this TV with a burning passion. :)

LCD's still have their own issues. Neither are perfect but I would choose a plasma over an LCD given the choice all over again (and probably will upgrade to another plasma in the future). But it will probably be a Philips again (ambilight really isn't useless if you're a night owl).

Mine makes no buzzing noise in case anyone wants to know. It boiled down to Panasonic or Philips, we went with the Philips because the picture was better. Ordered it from a Circuit City 40 mins away and they delivered it for free!

Edit: now that I read this again, why would ANYONE recommend a DLP? That's laughable, worst picture out of the 3.
 
I've had a samsung 42" 720p plasma since around this time in 2004(one of their first "long-life" plasma panels. I use it daily (anywhere from 4-8hrs). Most of the times for TV/video and very occasionally computer/game use. Countless sport programmes were viewed on this panel with many friends over the years.

My thoughts:

screen burn-in: I've never experienced this. Maybe because I mostly just watch videos and TV.

Color: Plasma, imo, definitely offers better color than LCD -- which to me looks washed out, even the higher end ones. One thing to remember thou -- it is VITAL that you calibrate the color of your screen when you get it. This makes a HUGE of difference. You can buy calibration dvd discs or have it professionally done. Either way this is highly recommended.

Contrast: this number really doesn't mean much for LCDs, so don't use it! Any company can drop a 2000 lumen lamp behind a panel and suddenly you got yourself 1,000,000:1 contrast ratio. All it means is probably the black looks kinda gray-ish, and the whites will make you go blind.

Demo: Don't go by the demo in the stores -- most of the times the signal store uses is very much degraded, and the panels are almost never properly calibrated. Plus the lighting condition is very different. You probably do need to do some homework, and perhaps lug a few units back and forth between the stores, if you are picky.

cheers,

yass
 
While plasmas may have improved slightly over older models, their inherent problems remain the same while LCD's on the other hand have dramatically improved.
Click to expand...

High end LCD's have dramatically improved but their still inferior to high end plasma! My brother bought recently a Sharp 46" LCD and was happy ...until he saw my Pioneer Kuro which is vastly superior. The LCD looks very dull in comparison and black is semi-dark gray.

I have been playing many video games on my Plasma and I never encountered any image retention. Pioneer has developed a technology that is called orbiter that prevents burn-in.

I strongly suggest to pay a visit at www.avsforum.com. This website contains a lot of information about the LCD and Plasma technologies.
 
Well I have this TV a few days and I don't know if the buzzing got less or I have gotten more used to it, but It's not annoying me as a much now :)

And after playing around with settings and connections and everything I have found out something that makes this TV one of the best TV's for my PC and for Counter strike source I could have bought.

The best resolution for me with CS:S is 1024*768. With all new LCD's and plasma's and monitors it's all gone widescreen and 1024*768 looks crap and very poor for aiming, if you play at the native resolution of the monitor it looks great but it's harder to get as accurate as you would with the 4:3 resolutions. Also there is a 60Hz limit on refresh rate.

Why is the PZ80 so good? Well it can 1024*768 perfectly over VGA, it looks perfect. Not only can it do 1024*768, it can do 1024*768 at 85hz and that makes a huge difference for gaming. It's like been back in front of a CRT without all the flickering and with a much better picture :D

This is the best TV/monitor I have ever purchased :D
 
Avareyne said:
...Edit: now that I read this again, why would ANYONE recommend a DLP? That's laughable, worst picture out of the 3.
Click to expand...

Because you can get a massively bigger DLP for less money and the picture can be very good if set up properly...
 
Generally if someone is considering a plasma or even LCD, a DLP will be quite the disappointment for them.
 
Avareyne said:
Generally if someone is considering a plasma or even LCD, a DLP will be quite the disappointment for them.
Click to expand...

Generalities are almost worthless...

(You have to take into consideration: usage, cost, size, viewing distance, ambient lighting, space requirements, etc...)
 
Well, you can't argue fact. You can't get the plasma picture from an LCD and most definitely not a DLP. The OP said, "i'm in the market for a 50 incher, but i want to spend money on something that'll last, i don't want a cheapo unit that i'm going to regret buying in a year or two..." which is the key point in suggestions here, a plasma or LCD should work well for him and those are what he is considering as well.

I know no one with a DLP anymore, they all upgraded to plasma's/LCD's since they have significantly dropped in price over the last 1-2 years and have a far superior picture. DLP's are not that cost effective in the long run. I've seen quite a few complaints about bulb replacement, watch warranties for this, looks like 1 is generally covered.

My bf, not the most tech interested guy, would not even look at a DLP due to picture quality vs plasma and LCD. I know when non-picky people dislike it, something is wrong.

DLP is also not good for smaller area's, they are huge, not easy to move. The price differences are far from *massive* as you put it (by massive I think at least double). I've had no issue with my Philip's plasma and daylight. Viewing angles and distances are better with plasma and some LCD by far. Selection of DLP sets have gone down significantly for reason, with the lowering prices of LCD/Plasma displays most people aren't considering them any longer. The benefits of plasma/LCD can make up for the few hundred dollar price difference, especially if you want a long term display. :)

This guy should go too a brick and mortar store to see, I'm assuming he has and is why he is set on plasma vs lcd.
 
Your statement made it sound like all DLP is bad (or worse "laughable" as a choice). I responded accordingly. In fact, DLP offers picture quality superior to many LCDs still on sale in 2008.

However, in 2008, for a 50 inch screen, I'd recommend:

For TV -- A Pioneer or Panasonic plasma
For computer or TV/computer use -- an LCD, due to burn-in concerns with plasma. The choice of brand/model, the focus of many discussions, is less clear cut.

Against the latest plasmas, my recommendation of DLP would be limited to the largest screen sizes, where it still holds quite an edge in price/performance...

My bf, not the most tech interested guy, would not even look at a DLP due to picture quality vs plasma and LCD. I know when non-picky people dislike it, something is wrong.

What looks good to videophiles and the average consumer are not the same, which is one reason why a manufacturer's default TV settings can be so frustrating. For example, if accurate color sold TV sets, the wildly inaccurate, pick me, colors, would not be so prevalent on the showroom floor...

You're here on this forum. Obviously you care. I'd also suggest checking out AVS forums as well, if you haven't...
 
Uhm, AVS forums were the place that made me decide in the end to go plasma.

Plasma>LCD>DLP for picture quality overall.

"What looks good to videophiles and the average consumer are not the same"

So you've got both saying go the plasma route. and...? point?

Are people dense? You can adjust the settings on TV's in the store, the salesman won't bite your head off if you do, especially if it would effect them getting a big fat commission check. I'm not so sure where you people live and shop that you can't test out any products, I don't see how any company would make good sales with such a policy.
 
Plasma>LCD>DLP for picture quality overall.

The best plasmas are the champs. However, LCD>DLP, well, that is often not the case...(e.g., viewing angle for a corner placement, filmlike smoothness)...

In any case, were my remarks really that cryptic? Look at the prices for the big screen flat panels:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...-currentprice+skuid&sc=TVVideoSP&id=pcat17080

As for caring what a non-picky person thinks, well, I'm very picky when it comes to tech, especially displays, so maybe that is not the approach one should expect me to take... :)
 
Well, recent LCD's, though considering the guy is not worried about cash, he can get the 2008's.

Well, I'm overly picky, if my non-picky bf hates it then I get surprised. He's most concerned with price/performance.

Linking 60+ TV's is useless in this thread, no they weren't cryptic, just wrong, the guy wants a 50". And I'm guessing you haven't seen any 60" plasma's IRL as they are absolutely gorgeous (next upgrade).

Bigger isn't better if you are sacrificing quality in the process. Just words of advice. :)
 
dlp hasnt grown much favor in tv's because they arent 3" thin, but dlp basically dominates the projector market
 
Avareyne said:
Well, recent LCD's, though considering the guy is not worried about cash, he can get the 2008's.

Well, I'm overly picky, if my non-picky bf hates it then I get surprised. He's most concerned with price/performance.

Linking 60+ TV's is useless in this thread, no they weren't cryptic, just wrong, the guy wants a 50". And I'm guessing you haven't seen any 60" plasma's IRL as they are absolutely gorgeous (next upgrade).

Bigger isn't better if you are sacrificing quality in the process. Just words of advice. :)
Click to expand...

OK...but I had already told you my picks for 50" earlier:

For TV -- A Pioneer or Panasonic plasma
For computer or TV/computer use -- an LCD, due to burn-in concerns with plasma. The choice of brand/model, the focus of many discussions, is less clear cut.

I agree that smaller, but with better PQ, can certainly be superior. That's why I stuck with a small, but spectacular, CRT for several years. However, size is also a key PQ factor when it comes to being able to really enjoy 1080P resolution at a given distance.

I got an excellent deal on a very large DLP, about which, only yesterday, a non-techie guest remarked had a very nice picture. :)

(The default settings were horrible, but with a switch to "movie mode, warm2" and a minor tweak to the Service menu, now the picture is indeed very nice.) Would I have preferred an LCD? No, because even in 2008, the viewing angles are too restrictive for my corner placement of the set. Would have loved a plasma though, especially one with the darkest blacks, however the size I could have afforded would have been more regular TV and less home theatre, which wasn't what I was going for...
 
krupted said:
dlp hasnt grown much favor in tv's because they arent 3" thin, but dlp basically dominates the projector market
Click to expand...

Yeah, thin and thinner, is certainly what it's all about. Saw the Sony OLED set the other day and wow...(and a great picture too)....
 
Dogmapog said:
Reaper12....Drop both the contrast and the brightness down a bit, that might reduce the buzzing.


CONG......it's an LG, nuff said.......try and find a Panasonic or Pioneer owner with burn in{perm}
Click to expand...


bottom line with plasma, the picture quality degrades over time, and we arent talking ten years more like two to four, the negatives associated with plasma displays do not outweigh the positives, a similar lcd panel is going to look better alot longer than its plasma siblings will sony's xbr line? lcds with 120hz puts both plasma and all other lcd's to shame
 
conghelach said:
bottom line with plasma, the picture quality degrades over time, and we arent talking ten years more like two to four, the negatives associated with plasma displays do not outweigh the positives, a similar lcd panel is going to look better alot longer than its plasma siblings will sony's xbr line? lcds with 120hz puts both plasma and all other lcd's to shame
Click to expand...

Can you provide some evidence that the picture quality degrades please.
Is it a problem with all Plasmas, old ones or certain manufacturers?
My friends have Plasmas that are over 2 years old and dont have any image quality problems.
I have also not a heard mention of that when researching Plasma TVs.

My Plasma is over 2 months now and it has proved to be the perfect display for everything :)
Its also a 100Hz set (UK) so I'm not sure what you mean about LCDs being better in this regard.

Prior to this set (4 months ago) I had one of the new Philips panel 5mS S-IPS 37" 1080p LCDs.
I was fairly impressed with it for computer use but black was a shade of grey so some colour emphasis was lost. This didnt make it as immersive for movies as I hoped.
Satellite and TV looked a bit blocky/noisy, especially on poor quality feeds.
It was just about fast enough for gaming, with a tiny bit of ghosting.

The Plasma makes satellite and TV look great, a big difference from the LCD.
Blacks are really black, the colour definition is fantastic. All video is much more immersive, including games.
Its not til you see the difference that you realise just how smooth everything looks.
Gaming is simply a dream on a 1080p Plasma.

If I hadnt seen a 1080p Plasma I would have been content with a 1080p LCD.
I couldnt go back now though :)
 
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