Advice - upgrade from XP to Vista on this rig?

M

mccool

n00b
Joined
Aug 21, 2006
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16
Core 2 6600 @ 2.4 Ghz
2 GB RAM
Nvidia GeForce 8800 GTS

I would like to be able to play WoW and run misc. applications like MathCad and LabView.

If I should upgrade - should it be the 32 or 64 bit version? Which flavor of Vista should I purchase?

Thanks in advance!

Ryan
 
It'd make little sense NOT to go Vista on that rig. It'd handle your stated tasks with ease. Vista is today and tomorrow's OS, not yesterdays.

Makes little practical difference whether you install 32-bit or 64-bit with 2Gb RAM installed, but if there's a chance you might bump that up sometime in the near future (and given your application usage suggestiones there likely will be) then it'd make sense to go with the 64-bit install right from the outset, rather than making the migration later on.



That's unless, of course, you already HAVE XP installed. If you're already running an OS and it's doing the job then you should only change because you WANT to.
 
Ok - given that, should I upgrade to 3 Gb of RAM or 4? I haven't kept up to date w/ my PC knowledge, but I seem to remember that performance can actually slow down with too much RAM.

Suggestions?

Thanks for the timely response!
 
A quad-core rig with an 8800 series display adaptor? Hell, with the lowish price of RAM I'd go 4Gb and 64-bit Windows right from the outset. The 'reasons' for going to 3Gb and the 'problems' you refer to are 32-bit Windows related issues. With heavy-duty gaming and 'scientific' work in mind, why restrict a quad-core rig with a lesser environment to work in?
 
mccool said:
Ok - given that, should I upgrade to 3 Gb of RAM or 4? I haven't kept up to date w/ my PC knowledge, but I seem to remember that performance can actually slow down with too much RAM.

Suggestions?

Thanks for the timely response!
Click to expand...

Thats just silly. It will slow down at 3GB if you have 3X1GB sticks because they're not running in dual channel mode (You lose some memory bandwidth) but at 4GB you're golden. You will need 64bit OS to utilize 4gb ram though.
 
sounds great - see what happens when you use a Mac too much for too long!

=-)

cheers
 
Get Vista- it has tons of new stuff in it (albeit not many "huge" new features- although new interface/menu/navigation and vastly improved security are huge IMO). It's just the little differences that make you go "Sweet!". Using XP at work, and Vista at home- it's always a treat getting back home and using Vista... XP just lacks a ton in its "polished-ness" I guess- the little features collected make alot of difference.

The only thing I'd advise is to check out the game compatibility you have. About the biggest complaint there is with gaming in Vista is loss of FPS. Most of the time this is such a small difference you require tools just to see that there is any loss at all- a human can't tell the difference. But nonethless do your reasearch ahead of time.

I'd definately go with 64 bit. Two different systems:
32 BIT SYSTEM: Can play 32 bit stuff.
64 BIT SYSTEM: Can play 64 AND 32 bit stuff.

You aren't loosing any application compatibility. Nay- you are actually GAINING performance in the cases where you can choose between 64 and 32. Granted, 64 bit applications are not numerous right now, but they will soon be. Why make the change when it is more or less forced upon you (as 32 bit is on its way out the door) when you can switch over to 64 bit now (That goes for either XP or Vista)?

64 bit drivers are not much of an issue. If it is any sort of modern hardware- chances are there are drivers for it (Microsoft requires 64 bit drivers now). Still- do your homework and make sure you have drivers for all your hardware.

On my machine- I installed 64 bit Vista and it had drivers for everything right out of the box. I didn't have to go out and download a single thing.
 
Vista is not a supported OS with Mathlab.

Vista brings no benefit to your daily use whatsoever once you rule out gimmicks and eye candy. There's no sensible reason to upgrade to it just for the sakes of upgrading - and since there's no actual need for upgrading either you'd be silly to do it. Think of it: which functionality is there in Vista that you need in your daily work? DX10? :)

Remain on XP, enjoy it's faster speed and trouble free use. With Vista your performance will degrade and you might end up in trouble with Mathlab etc. software that does not support Vista.
 
zacdl said:
Get Vista- it has tons of new stuff in it (albeit not many "huge" new features- although new interface/menu/navigation and vastly improved security are huge IMO). It's just the little differences that make you go "Sweet!".
Click to expand...

Heh this guy is such a joker.. What he's describing in reality is that the new features contain mainly 1 feature, superfetch. Nothing else.

The improved security means UAC which only nags about the obvious in EVERY system change you want to make. A feature at its best turned OFF.

The new interface/menu/navigation in reality means you will first go 'Sweet!" and then WTF??!? Where is this and this menu, how do I regain ownership of my system files, why do I need to click 2-3 extra button clicks for the most basic of functions, where can I find item X that used to be in place Y, why does Vista keep altering my driver back to the old non-functioning one etc. etc. etc.

You're in for a huge amount of relearning, adapting and compromising.
 
Catweazle said:
MathCAD was the program mentioned and it's certainly Vista-compatible:

http://www.ptc.com/partners/hardware/current/support/mathcad14.htm

Gets awfully tedious to see the same tired "OMGZ! Vista sucks coz I can't see anything it it apart from eye candy pretties!" crap trotted out in thread after thread. Performance would be plenty good enough on that rig, as mentioned. :p
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Ok, looks like the latest version added support for it. Big deal.. There's still no REASON to move to Vista. It's just a large PITA.
 
Finn said:
The new interface/menu/navigation in reality means you will first go 'Sweet!" and then WTF??!? Where is this and this menu, how do I regain ownership of my system files, why do I need to click 2-3 extra button clicks for the most basic of functions, where can I find item X that used to be in place Y, why does Vista keep altering my driver back to the old non-functioning one etc. etc. etc.

You're in for a huge amount of relearning, adapting and compromising.
Click to expand...
You're absolutely right. I spend all my time these days just trying to get my OS to do what I want it to do. It's absolutely maddening! I only use it and evangalize it because Bill Gates sent Steve Ballmer to plant a subcutaneous explosive in my Mother, and told me they'd detonate it if I didn't use Vista 24/7 and tell all my friends it was the best thing since sliced bread. There's no meaning to my life anymore. I'm just a corporate shill, tooling around on forums extolling the virtues of the worst piece of software to hit the Earth since ME, hoping that today won't be the day my pathetic little world ends.

But hey, Ballmer told me about what Steve Jobs and Linus did to your mom...I feel your pain, man.
 
You know what? All Operating Systems have been a complete and utter disappointment since Be in the mid 90's... Even OS X. Yeah I said it :)

Seriously, a system like yours will only benefit from Vista, and if you're even just a little bit computer savvy, you should have no issues working with Vista's new security system. If you don't like UAC, then turn it off. The only thing I would advise is to make the decision before installing programs on top of the OS, as turning it off also turns off certain redirects for programs which put temp and user files into the C:\Program Files directory. This won't break anything, but if you setup and configure programs like Firefox or Trillian, then decide to turn off UAC, you may find yourself having to configure them again. Fortunately, UAC rears it's head most often when configuring the OS itself post installation, so you should be able to get a good sense of whether you can work with it before you install any applications.

As for all the nice new features, I agree there's no one huge feature that is super compelling (Win FS would've been it if it would've worked and worked fast,) but all the little features add up to create an OS user experience that's more than the sum of its parts. The general shell is much more mature, although one of its biggest new features (indexed search) is obtainable in XP via an add-in desktop search program.

The most significant changes to Vista, however, are under the hood. Memory management is far superior (note that it's also been the target of some criticism, but mostly by those who don't understand how it works.) Furthermore, the OS's stability underpinnings are far more advanced than it's predecessor's.

Overall, I would give the OS a go. If you don't like it, you can always go back. As for 64 or 32, decide if you are realistically going to increase your RAM to 4 gigs. If you are, then 64-bit is a must. Otherwise, 32-bit will do just fine. Lastly, don't be discouraged if the OS isn't performing as quickly as you would expect a new OS should. Unlike XP, who's operating speed is more-or-less reversely proportional to the amount of programs you've installed on top of it, Vista is slow at first due to its memory management system having to learn your usage patterns. Then, as you install more programs and use your computer in a consistent manner, Vista will speed up significantly. One of the best things about Vista is that (at least in my experience,) the system doesn't slow down like XP does as you add "gunk" to it.

Mark.
 
You guys are so funny..

When you run out of counter arguments (hard to argue facts..) you turn into a personal injury. While Vista may be new and exciting for someone who likes to doodle around OS'es and think any change is always change for the better, for someone who just wants the job to be done with minimum effort and reliably, it's a nightmare. Seriously, everything still looks kinda familiar but nothing works the same way anymore.. :) Just like having a bad dream.

Then, when you have a problem to solve.. you get unwillingly introduced to a myriad of restrictions and problems that didn't use to exist. For what?

Not so long ago I was troubleshooting a brand new Vista box that came straight out of the box but didn't work. It went back to the manufacturer for repair and returned broken again. I took a look at it and found out the device drivers were not installed properly. I install drivers and sound works again - all is good. Reboot later everything is still fine so I end the remote session and go to my business. A few hours later the friend calls that his audio is gone again... Vista had replaced it with the MS generic driver after a second reboot..

Now this kind of problems are a major PITA unless you're a wannabe script kiddie willing to tinker with your box for fun.

My suggestion is to get a copy of Vista somewhere, use the built-in ability to try it for a week without entering a serial code at all (yes it's possible) and see if it a) works in your box / software b) is worth the trouble.
If you get a single problem during testing (such as bad performance) you're bound to find only more in the future. I'd keep that in mind.
 
Finn said:
My suggestion is to get a copy of Vista somewhere, use the built-in ability to try it for a week without entering a serial code at all (yes it's possible) and see if it a) works in your box / software b) is worth the trouble.
If you get a single problem during testing (such as bad performance) you're bound to find only more in the future. I'd keep that in mind.
Click to expand...

Actually, you could use it for 120 days (30 days is default) without activating. Useful if going to upgrade hardware soon.
 
Finn said:
You guys are so funny..

When you run out of counter arguments (hard to argue facts..) you turn into a personal injury. While Vista may be new and exciting for someone who likes to doodle around OS'es and think any change is always change for the better, for someone who just wants the job to be done with minimum effort and reliably, it's a nightmare.
Click to expand...

Finn, if you really were putting forward "facts" you'd be correct. But you're not. Instead, you are consistently putting forward your own failures and illogical prejudices, and claiming that they represent the experience of everybody else. They don't. Were that true nobody would be able to use Vista productively, and the simple "fact" is that most people who use it are actually doing just that!

I try to avoid the 'name-calling' which is sometimes seen around here. I'd prefer to reserve any scorn or derision for the comments posted, rather than the people posting them. But I must acknowledge that you seem to invite such comments.

And, as they go, the comment posted by LstOfTheBrunnenG was one of the funniest I've seen in a long while!

:)


Seriously, everything still looks kinda familiar but nothing works the same way anymore.. :) Just like having a bad dream.
Click to expand...
That's the real source of the problems, isn't it? Resistance to change and unwillingness to accomodate it. The altered envirinment of vista isn't really difficult for even novice to medium lever users to adapt to. Competent folk shouldn't be experiencing any problems at all.
 
You just don't get it do you?

I have enough workload as it is and the last thing I need is to start to 'learn' a new GUI because 15000 incompetent familymembers designed it to be that way..

Why couldn't they leave the 'improvements' out of the business version. Why oh why..

And it naturally doesn't stop there. As if the GUI changes were not irritating enough, there is a myriad of new variables in the system with Vista. My work consists of troubleshooting mainly..

This job becomes a tenfold harder when Vista starts messing up the typical enviroment. All of the sudden there are problems with no apparent reason (except for having Vista naturally). They can be something simple such as fxed up user privileges out of the box and ending up to having to edit the registry to get simple friggin filesharing to work..

So, while you're working at MS propaganda department or whatnot, most people do _not_ want to have to study an OS all over again just because it has glitter and MPAA/RIAA wanted it to be restrictive. Now if it would introduce some real life benefits I would happily go for it. I would be the first one to endorse it to everyone providing it brings true benefit to the business enviroment.

But it doesn't. It's a visual upgrade that's being forced in on every new box you buy from the shop.

Ironically I have gained good business lately by selling custom boxes with XP installations far below the price the OEM providers can deliver (partly because the client is forced to pay Vista and XP licenses if they get an OEM with XP).
 
What I found funny is you constantly reference "most" people.

Most people like the new GUI. In fact, Microsoft collected opinions of over 100,000 random people and using those opinions, guess what they came up with? Vista.

The majority of people are suited for the new GUI: Everything is in a much more logical place. When I can't find something, I forget everything I knew about XP- and think of the logical section that setting would be in- and BINGO I find it. Just because you refuse to learn anything new does NOT mean that it is "broken".


As far as all your "facts" I have yet to seen them. The statements about Superfetch and memory management have all been true on here- yet you post ridiculous statements that have zero backup (or at least provide zero backup to them!).


As much as you may dislike it- Vista was designed for the masses- not for the slim minority techie crowd (Although as you can see on these forums- the majority of the techie crowd even likes it). Vista was designed for the end users who don't know squat about the OS. And it works. Once more- just because you don't want to change and learn the OS that will become dominant and mainstream for the next few years, does not mean your opinion represents that of "most people".
 
zacdl said:
What I found funny is you constantly reference "most" people.

Most people like the new GUI. In fact, Microsoft collected opinions of over 100,000 random people and using those opinions, guess what they came up with? Vista.

The majority of people are suited for the new GUI: Everything is in a much more logical place. When I can't find something, I forget everything I knew about XP- and think of the logical section that setting would be in- and BINGO I find it. Just because you refuse to learn anything new does NOT mean that it is "broken".


As far as all your "facts" I have yet to seen them. The statements about Superfetch and memory management have all been true on here- yet you post ridiculous statements that have zero backup (or at least provide zero backup to them!).


As much as you may dislike it- Vista was designed for the masses- not for the slim minority techie crowd (Although as you can see on these forums- the majority of the techie crowd even likes it). Vista was designed for the end users who don't know squat about the OS. And it works. Once more- just because you don't want to change and learn the OS that will become dominant and mainstream for the next few years, does not mean your opinion represents that of "most people".
Click to expand...

Just 4 minutes ago I talked to a business client who cursed Vista to the bottom. He had to buy a new laptop and had no choice except to have Vista preinstalled or pay for a double license / possibly have problems with proprietary driver support.

Your words contradict the real world experience heavily. Why is that? What's your motivation behind it?
 
Finn said:
Just 4 minutes ago I talked to a business client who cursed Vista to the bottom.
Click to expand...

I can see now. Than you for enlightening me :rolleyes:
I highly respect the opinion of your business client, and am switching back to XP immediately. I'll report back when I'm done formatting all the computers I've put Vista on.
 
zacdl said:
I can see now. Than you for enlightening me :rolleyes:
I highly respect the opinion of your business client, and am switching back to XP immediately. I'll report back when I'm done formatting all the computers I've put Vista on.
Click to expand...

Lol so typical. Guys like you probably do _not_ respect the opinnions and user experiences of the end-users and push through their personal fallacy. I've seen consultants like that pull whole systems down the tubes. You're a hilarious case. :D
 
I feel bad for opening this thread! =-)

well, i ordered some more ram and it should be here soon. i'll pop it in and an extra usb pci card so i can have a few of my extra thumb drives do that ram-drive thing i hear about.

we'll see how it works out!

thanks for all your opinions, for and against!

Ryan
 
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