Advice for configuration

P

pavel

Gawd
Joined
Apr 8, 2014
Messages
928
I currently have Ubuntu 18.04 and Windows 7 on my current computer.

I'm planning a new build on a modern architecture so either Ryzen/AMD or Intel.

I'm leaning towards a R5 2600 and a B450 mobo. Is there anything to keep in mind using Windows 10 and Linux on such a system?

I guess I will dual boot. Do any of you dual boot? I was considering two OS - each on a different SSD. But, I only get one M.2 slot/port that will run at the full PCIe 3.0 x 4 speed. So, I could buy a 500/512 GB drive and partition it 'in half?'

I suspect this is a pretty common setup?

I would use my current computer for an extra computer, Kodi etc.

Does this sound like a reasonable plan or should I do something else? I looked into selling my current components but they don't have much value? It might make more sense to just use it as a 2nd computer?

I was even thinking of getting Windows 10 on this current computer. My Win 7 has been buggy for a while and I need to get MS Office some time. I guess I need 2 if I want them on both computers?

I use Linux (Ubuntu) most of the time so I thought maybe even a cheap SATA SSD for my old computer - if I want a new Windows OS it and a NVME M.2. SSD in the new build?

Comments? Advice? Thanks.
 
I am not a fan of dual-booting at all. Given the hardware you plan to use, my recommendation would be to virtualize. You stated that Linux is your primary OS, so I'd install that natively, and then run something like VirtualBox or VMWare Player for Windows.
 
It comes down to what you are going to use Windows for. If you are using it for gaming, dual booting would be a better option unless you want to dive into gpu passthrough. You could always take a hard look at what games you wanted to play and see if there are viable options to get them to work on Linux. Steam is making huge advances in making things simpler to get non native games running in Linux. With DXVK, things are looking even better. I think there has been more progress in making games available to Linux users in the last year than the rest of the Linux lifespan combined.
 
+1 on not dual-booting if you don't have to. Install one OS directly to the hardware based on your usage (e.g., which is used more, Windows gaming, etc.), and run the second within a virtual machine under VMware Player (Windows or Linux, free, far better than VirutalBox crap), or KVM/QEMU (Linux).

If you do need to dual-boot, a single large SSD is fine. Just partition it in half. SATA is just fine (and cheaper), NVMe provides no real-life benefit for typical desktop/office/internet/gaming usage. Install Windows first, as its installer will wipe out the Linux Grub bootloader and give no option to boot Linux.
 
BlueLineSwinger said:
... and run the second within a virtual machine under VMware Player (Windows or Linux, free, far better than VirutalBox crap), or KVM/QEMU (Linux).
Click to expand...

Question about the above. Is VMWare Player free? Can I use it to create "simple" VMs, nothing fancy? I don't see myself using VMs enough to justify the $$$ to buy VMWare for Windows 10. What about the VM features that are built-in to Windows Pro, and therefore free?

And why don't you like VirtualBox? Friend of mine runs Linux Mint native, but he also needs to run Win 7, which he does in VirtualBox. He's totally satisfied with it.

x509
 
x509 said:
Question about the above. Is VMWare Player free? Can I use it to create "simple" VMs, nothing fancy? I don't see myself using VMs enough to justify the $$$ to buy VMWare for Windows 10. What about the VM features that are built-in to Windows Pro, and therefore free?
Click to expand...


Yes and yes. And yeah, if you have Win10 Pro already give Hyper-V a shot, though I can't see upgrading from Home just for that.


x509 said:
And why don't you like VirtualBox? Friend of mine runs Linux Mint native, but he also needs to run Win 7, which he does in VirtualBox. He's totally satisfied with it.
Click to expand...


Slow and buggy in my experience. Plus, I try to avoid anything Oracle whenever possible, especially when there are better options available.
 
  • Like
Reactions: x509
like this
I'd never run through the hassle of dualbooting from a single drive anymore. I use multiboot but from different physical drives and use the BIOS utility (F8 for me) to pick a drive to boot from.
Using VM for an OS you use more than for rare testing is not a feasible solution.
VMware is better overall in almost all areas, especially graphics performance. Last time I checked Virtualbox, it was very buggy as well.
VMWare player will allow you to run just one VM at one time.
If that would be me, buy another small sata SSD for the second OS. Virtualization on the other hand gives you the benefit to be able to run the second OS simultaneously on top of the main OS and you can use them both. With vmware you could also imitate running guest OS's programs in the host (they can appear in host os's taskbar etc.).
 
  • Like
Reactions: x509
like this
tedych said:
Using VM for an OS you use more than for rare testing is not a feasible solution.
Click to expand...


This is patently false. Especially in these days of SSDs and CPU virtualization extensions that allow the guest to run well north of 90% of bare-metal.


tedych said:
VMWare player will allow you to run just one VM at one time.
Click to expand...


Also false. An instance of Player can run only a single guest, but there's nothing preventing launching of multiple instances.
 
Why bother with windows at all. Do you need it for some reason ?

If its games your mostly running windows 7 for now... install your favorite Linux distro first and see how the games YOU play handle steam play. I know for myself 90% of my steam list has native Linux builds anyway... I know most peoples lists aren't that Linux heavy, but the few windows titles I do play are running just fine with steam play right now. I am giving up some performance, and to be honest I have a windows drive around I keep around for one title for the odd time I PvP in that game. However if I built a brand new system with a more powerful CPU/GPU today I wouldn't bother setting a windows drive up again at all.

So my vote would be dual boot if you really feel the need to keep windows around.

Your already dual booting so imagine you have a good idea what to expect. I have never had any issue dual booting.... just remember to do some of the basics.

Fix Microsofts stupid default time keeping setup. So you don't have to deal with the wrong time.... I just shut windows auto time update off and add this. To windows Reg... as far as I know win 10 still doesn't know how to keep UTC time.
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\TimeZoneInformation]
"RealTimeIsUniversal"=dword:00000001

And if you plan to browse your windows drives files from Linux then disable hyberfil.sys in windows. Although if your building from new... if you really need some files in both OS just store them in a universally readable part or something. For instance at one point I keep a small part readable by both... and would save things like .torrent files there and auto load them in either OS using shared external storage for the downloads.

The VM route... ehh why bother really. Running Linux in a windows VM is very backwards. Windows in Linux VM works just fine for most things. If your planning to game in windows from a Linux based VM though you will have to engage some form of GPU pass through which requires a second video card, and is often more PITA then its worth. I would try steam play first... and if that isn't cutting it, dual boot until steam plays performance gets to a point where you can accept it and burn windows with fire.
 
Official VMware Player comparison.
I haven't used Player for many years, only Workstation, but this is the link to their own website. Multiple VMs at once is not stated for Player. I admit, I even don't remember when I used Player for the last time, and multiple Player instnces running different VMs could be possible.

As to the use of VM for everyday tasks... maybe I was a bit extreme in my opinion but my experience with VMs for desktop's normal tasks is not the best. Disk subsystem is slower than native, graphics are slower (by default, even with vmware tools) - you only have 128MB VRAM even if you set it to 1GB in settings. Working with USB devices is somewhat clunky and it interferes with normal USB interaction with devices on host OS.. I can continue with other smaller issues..
It all depends on what he'll be using both OSes for and how often.

I second ChadD's post above.
 
Yep, everyone should support Steam play as it is a beacon of light in the darkness. A real chance for many to break out of the MS oppression.
 
tedych said:
Official VMware Player comparison.
I haven't used Player for many years, only Workstation, but this is the link to their own website. Multiple VMs at once is not stated for Player. I admit, I even don't remember when I used Player for the last time, and multiple Player instnces running different VMs could be possible.

As to the use of VM for everyday tasks... maybe I was a bit extreme in my opinion but my experience with VMs for desktop's normal tasks is not the best. Disk subsystem is slower than native, graphics are slower (by default, even with vmware tools) - you only have 128MB VRAM even if you set it to 1GB in settings. Working with USB devices is somewhat clunky and it interferes with normal USB interaction with devices on host OS.. I can continue with other smaller issues..
It all depends on what he'll be using both OSes for and how often.

I second ChadD's post above.
Click to expand...

My solution has been to dedicate a few computers for games only. I don't do anything else with them but play games. Everything else happens on OSX and linux. I just don't trust Windows with any important files, online activity and especially not with my credit card / bank credentials. Imagine having something important on your computer and get hit by one of the plentiful Windows ransomwares lol.
 
Apple hardware/softwares (ecosystem) is not something to wave as standard for privacy and security :D . Yes, ransomwares are written primarily for the most widespread OS but it all depends on how you use your machine. I have never had any incidents with viruses for the last 16 years (last wa Blaster under unpatched XP with temporarily disabled firewall) and my machines run 24/7 for the last 8-9 years.

And yes, dedicated machines for gaming only is Ok if you are Ok to have such machines idle (off) most of the time while you work on work computers :) . One powerful machine to work on, with another OS for games only is the way to go IF you are the only person who will game when not using the machine for work.
As to ransomwares again - making regular backups is rule #1 no matter what OS you're using, given "something important" is really important :) . Viruses are just one possible problem out of pletora of problems with computers.
I trust WIndows for my most important data :) . There are too many things that can go wrong with Linux/macos as well.
So I guess it's up to OP to determine which OS is more important for him based on preference/usage/money, and whether he can afford two SSDs for both OS in dualboot. Dualboot on one drive begs for problems, and two drives is safer for me.
 
Dunno. When I switched from Windows to Macs my problem rate reduced astronomically. In the 7 year period I've used a Mac daily I've had one single OS related problem. One. And even that was because I was in the beta tester program. With Windows there was always something breaking up.

Now I have windows as a virtual machine and snapshots that enable me to roll back changes if something causes a problem. The setup has worked very well, Windows keeps working due to it being used only momentarily and then hibernated in the VM.
 
BlueLineSwinger said:
An instance of Player can run only a single guest, but there's nothing preventing launching of multiple instances.
Click to expand...
OK, so I am a complete noob about VMWare. Let me see if I understand this. VMPlayer is the executable program. If I run the executable once, I can run only one VM under that executable. But I can run VMPlayer 2-3-4 or more times, and it will launch that many windows, which each allow only 1 VM each. Am I right? Question: Can I network between all these different VMs? Or cut-and-paste?
 
x509 said:
OK, so I am a complete noob about VMWare. Let me see if I understand this. VMPlayer is the executable program. If I run the executable once, I can run only one VM under that executable. But I can run VMPlayer 2-3-4 or more times, and it will launch that many windows, which each allow only 1 VM each. Am I right? Question: Can I network between all these different VMs? Or cut-and-paste?
Click to expand...


Yep, that should all work just fine.

I know for certain from my own usage that the current Windows version will launch multiple instances. Last I knew the Linux version will as well, though it's been a little bit since I've run that and I would be surprised if they've changed it and differentiated from the Windows version.

Player uses the exact same virtualization engine as Workstation. It's just the GUI and some features (e.g., snapshots) that are different. The VMware installer sets up the various network interfaces (NAT, host-only) in the host OS itself (with some assistance from VMware for DHCP and such), so there's no real connectivity limits there.

C&P between two guests shouldn't be a problem, as it's technically it's between the guest and host. Copy copies the data from the first guest's clipboard to the host's, and then pasting copies it from there to the second guest's.
 
On linux it's easiest to use KVM / libvirtd and virtman.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top