Advice/Final Thoughts AGP question

F

fellows

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
180
Hi guys

Kind of a two-parter here.

1. Just joined the forum, would like to introduce myself...
Andy from vancouver, canada
20, student
Avid gamer, and pc 'rig' enthusiast.

2. My sort of issue...

Like many of you I'm sure you guys are the go-to people when your friends/family have computer questions.. even more so when they are hardware/software specific to gaming.
Fair enough I say, but I do get just a wee bit bitter, when I help (ohh who am I kidding, I do all the work) my friends build a killer gaming rig.
I got my system about 3 years ago, AGP based of course, Pent4 3.0ghz. Lets just say I thought it was preety good, and with a 9600xt suprisingly it was.
Its a little depressing though because I just helped a friend build a 4200+ D/C 7900GT based system for the same price.
Anyway back on topic, I've been steadily upgrading my machine... 1 gig of ram here, 320Gig HD there, and about I guess almost a year now, a Sapphire Radeon X850xt PE.
The card has been specatacular, but I have noticed the shortcomings of AGP vs. PCI-E
Although it was mesured up against a 7800GT.
I still want to be able to play the latest games, and cant afford to update both my mobo and my processor, all to PCI-E. Also it seems pointless with Direct X 10, Vista, and AMD's core 2 rivals on the horizon.

I've read forums exhaustingly (including this one) as well as
Yoon's Corner: 7800GS vs X850xt

What do you guys think... Is it worth getting.

The last I checked the X850xt pe is still going for around $300 on E-bay. And I got a good deal for the BFG 7800GS OC - $350.00 plus a $50 Mail In Rebate.

Can I cut my losses and actually sell the X850xt pe to cushion the blow. I know I can get a really good PCI-E card for that price, but im looking at another 400-500 to upgrade teh Mobo and CPU.

Any thoughts, Thanks guys, and Hi again.
 
Well, my own advice is to research to see if there is a possibility to have a PCI-E motherboard who support the current P4 your friend have and when you find one, then get a good PCI-E video card.

I was in the same boat recently and here is my findings :

AGP 7800GS = 350$ - 400$ easily with the Gainward 7800GS+ Bliss much much more expensive and hard to find...
AGP X850XT = 300$ approximately with old tech and no SM3.0 support.

versus

PCI-E 7900GS = 199$ at most places
PCI-E X850XT = 100-150$ top.

+

PCI-E s754 motherboard = 73$ with SLI support o_O

The latter choice get a total price less than the AGP counterpart and easily 2x - 3x faster.

So for you, without knowing what socket your P4 have, i'll have to guess and offer these 2 possible choices (assuming a 3 years old P4 is a s478 Northwood or early Prescott) :

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813123008 s478 motherboard with PCI-E for 45.99$ with VIA chipset

or

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813130539 MSI 915GM chipset and PCI-E for 129.99$

And if your friend have DDR memory, all it require is just a motherboard swap and a new PCI-E video card.
 
Welcome. Quickly scanned your post so please excuse me if my comprehension is off, but it seems like you want to get a 7800GS. If you are looking for a marked performance increase, forget about it. But if you are trying to get a lot of money for your x850xt pe (which I am sure can still fetch a nice amount), go for it. Instead of the 7800GS though, look into finding the AGP variant of the 7600GT by Leadtek. Newegg had it for a few days 2 weeks ago and now it's all on backorder, but I'm sure you can find it in other places. This card does as well as, and somethings better than, the 7800GS. Do a search for Leadtek A7600 GT review and you'll see what I mean.
 
You can save some money and gain futureproofing without losing much performance by going with the A7600 GT (but you will lose a small amount of performance). You can also get a new mobo and a PCI-e vid card, but installing new mobo's is a major pain in the ass. Either way, you're not really going to make huge performance gains. 3 GHz and an X850 XT PE is more than enough for some time to come unless you're into e-penis measuring rather than actual gaming, or unless you've got one of those big 1920 x 1200 native res monitors. If you're the kind of person who doesn't constantly upgrade and wants to see major gains when you do, you won't find them if you upgrade now. Wait a year, then upgrade.
 
fellows-andy welcome
the x850xt pe is the top dog agp card overall; which is to say you'd be making a lateral move going to the 7800GS [not recommended for the $ involved without any substantial performance gains]. You'll just have to ride out the wait until you overhaul for a multi-core, pci-e, vista system next year. Its a boat many of us with agp mobos are in. To truly upgrade we're going to have to get everything new: new cpu, mobo, ram, psu and maybe hard drive.
 
Good points raised all around.

On a Side, does Newegg ship to Canada

I looked around at my options, and My P4 CPU does not support any new PCI-E boards, and I probably wouldnt want one, as I would opt for the new Core 2, or Amd's new dual core technology.
The 7600GT seems like a good idea but I think I'll have a hard time finding one here in Canada.

I already have the BFG 7800GS OC, shrinkwrapped from Futureshop (your BestBuy)
got it for about $317.00 US ($272) after rebates.

So the question is do I return it and opt for a new mobo, cpu... I'd prolly want a new case in this case as well, so the switch to pci-e gets more and more expensive.

I've heard they may be releasing new AGP cards... Such as the X1650AGP, 7900 AGP (not counting the BLISS), and even a 1950AGP?

Anyone know if these are valid?
 
fellows,

Doubtful that any new AGP cards will be coming out that have any decent performance to be honest, I keep hearing these rumors also, but its just not likely at this point in time. I have kept my ear to the ground about this, and have only heard the rumors. Most Architectures now are native PCI-E and makers aren't going to want to do the research for bridge chips.
 
fellows again you cannot upgrade your agp systems video card performance. Nothing is better than your x850xt pe. Start saving for your Conroe system
 
Cool thanks gonzo, i figured that as well, but I wouldnt let it die, till i tried it out myself, and saw that there is no gain when u switch from x850xtpe to the 7800GS
 
Love my 7800 GS, but I do think you would be going laterally with the switch. I did hear about the X1950 AGp, that mofo will be a beast!!!!
 
belmicah said:
Love my 7800 GS, but I do think you would be going laterally with the switch. I did hear about the X1950 AGp, that mofo will be a beast!!!!
Click to expand...
If it actually sees the light of day
 
Xilikon said:
AGP X850XT = 300$ approximately with old tech and no SM3.0 support.
Click to expand...

I bought an X800 XT AIW for $180 at a brick & mortar a week ago that'll do X850XT speeds, no one in their right mind would pay 3 bills for an X850 XT. EDIT: Bah, wrong currency... damn internet.
 
Very tough to final a retail x850xt [pe or not] for agp these days. Best bet is online at ebay or the for sale forums. Otherwise there are still some AIW x800xt's floating around and some x850pro's. Each is just a half step behind the stock x850xt and with certain tweaks can be brought up to par with the 850xt
 
Thanks again guys for all your advice.

I ended up getting the BFG 7800GS from my local futureshop at around $315.00 (350.00 after taxes.) There is a 50 dollar mail in rebate so that tallies this guy at 300.00

I was able to sell my X850xtpe for $312.00 on ebay.

Which kind of puts me even after everything is said and done.
So it looks like I got a free cross-grade to something that supports SM 3.0, meaning I can play Splinter Cell 4. :D

Ok, so here is my final question
With x850xtpe: 3dmark 05 - 5555
with 7800GS: 3dmark 05 - 5690

Is that normal, keep in mind the 7800GS has been OC'd to 495core, 1450mem

Should I stick with this card, as it seems I won't loose money, and BFG offers Lifetime warranty, or should I save $110 and buy the 7600gt from leadtek (anyone know their warranty)
a7600gt for $240
 
fellows said:
Thanks again guys for all your advice.

I ended up getting the BFG 7800GS from my local futureshop at around $315.00 (350.00 after taxes.) There is a 50 dollar mail in rebate so that tallies this guy at 300.00

I was able to sell my X850xtpe for $312.00 on ebay.

Which kind of puts me even after everything is said and done.
So it looks like I got a free cross-grade to something that supports SM 3.0, meaning I can play Splinter Cell 4. :D

Ok, so here is my final question
With x850xtpe: 3dmark 05 - 5555
with 7800GS: 3dmark 05 - 5690

Is that normal, keep in mind the 7800GS has been OC'd to 495core, 1450mem

Should I stick with this card, as it seems I won't loose money, and BFG offers Lifetime warranty, or should I save $110 and buy the 7600gt from leadtek (anyone know their warranty)
a7600gt for $240
Click to expand...
Because you broke even finanically I'd say keep what you got now. 7800GS is a fine card. If you could get a 7600GT you could go that way and end of saving some $$. For what its worth to ya I score a hair under 6500 in 3DMark 05 with my 7600GT clocked at 610/1640.
Even moreso than 3Dmark how's your game play experience with the 7800GS; if you like it might as well stick with it.
 
OK,

I've been reading bout the 7800GS and 7600GT for what feels like ages now. I have a 6800XT (I know) and what I don't understand is what makes the 7600GT such a great card. I would think that it would be limited by its 128 bit interface while the 7800 GS has a 256 bit interface. Any light shedding would be appreciated before I make the decision to purchase the "wrong" card again.

Thanks,
LouP
 
The 128-bit interface only causes a problem at higher resolutions (1600x1200 and above) and high AntiAliasing settings. These use extra memory bandwidth, and when they are both enabled it really slows down a 128 bit card. Below that, I have a friend who runs Call of Duty 2 with 16xAF and 8xSAA at 1280x1024 on a 7600GT AGP and it's as smooth as my SLI...boo...
 
LouP said:
OK,

I've been reading bout the 7800GS and 7600GT for what feels like ages now. I have a 6800XT (I know) and what I don't understand is what makes the 7600GT such a great card. I would think that it would be limited by its 128 bit interface while the 7800 GS has a 256 bit interface. Any light shedding would be appreciated before I make the decision to purchase the "wrong" card again.

Thanks,
LouP
Click to expand...
There are lots of different aspects that make up a card's performance. The 7600 GT is indeed limited by its memory compared to the 7800 GS, but the 7800 GS is limited by a much lower clock speed. Memory bandwidth isn't everything, after all. Not on the GeForce 7 series, anyway.
 
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