access point keeps renewing/disconnecting

[knoximator]

so, i have a dlink dap 1150 access point intalled in my house to work as a repeater
http://www.dlink.com.au/Products.aspx?Sec=1&Sub1=18&Sub2=82&PID=356
seemingly it's only available in europe and the midle and far east.

i've got it working as a repeater so as to extend my wireless network to the upper floor.
there are only two laptops connected to this AP to access the internet.
my problem is that both laptops (msi wind and dell inspiron) keep disconnecting/renewing their connection to the internet.

i've updated both wireless drivers with no different results.
i've concluded that the problems come from the AP, since i've tried both laptops at other places (coffee shops, university, friends) without getting disconnected/renew.
tried updating the firmware of the AP but it made no difference.
i'm not sure if it might make any difference, but i'm going to try to set the wireless channel to a different station (the current being 11) to see if this might affect the performance of the AP. oh, and i have wep encryption working.

i'll be happy to get some input.

 

[gimp]

are the laptops showing they get disconnected from the AP? or do they consistently show a good wireless connection to the AP?

I'm kinda confused on that part.

 

[knoximator]

well the msi wind (windows xp) will just disconnect and need renewing of connection.
the dell (windows 7) will just momentarily get a "warning sign" on the wireless icon for about 10 second and then regain normal connectivity

 

[gimp]

ok, so they get the "Limited or no connectivity" error message?

in that case, it sounds like the AP could be losing connectivity to the router.... does the AP have any sort of log?

 

[Electrofreak]

The repeater should be repeating on a non-overlapping channel with the channel the AP is transmitting on I believe, otherwise you're generating your own interference. It's also possible that the computer is trying to connect to the original WiFi signal and disconnecting.

Make sure the repeater is on a non-overlapping channel (1, 6, or 11) with the AP, so if one is on 6, put the other on 11, etc.

 

[knoximator]

ok, so they get the "Limited or no connectivity" error message?

the wind will lose connectivity, and will need a "renew" (win xp option that disables and then enables the card) to get it working properly.

the dell will just get that sign for around 10 second, have no connectivity for that duration, and then return to normal as if nothing happened.

Make sure the repeater is on a non-overlapping channel (1, 6, or 11) with the AP, so if one is on 6, put the other on 11, etc.

if i'm not mistaken, you can't have the repeater at a different channel.
when i configured the AP (dlink dap 1150) to act as a repeater, it showed me a list of available wifi networks, i chose my own network, and that was it.
both are working on the same channel (11)

 

[gimp]

I've never messed with repeater mode on anything myself, but... from the manual

Make sure that all clients,
APs, and the wireless router all use the same SSID (wireless network name) and channel.

have you looked at the log on the repeater? does it show a loss of connectivity to the router?

 

[Electrofreak]

Huh. The repeater operates on the same channel? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. WiFi (and I'm assuming the repeater,) uses CSMA/CA, which means that the repeater should be waiting for quiet moments before transmitting data, but as radio traffic increases, it would significantly reduce throughput to have both communicating on the same channel. To prevent this problem, the repeater would have to have to be able to receive on one channel and transmit on another via two separate antennas would have to be a dual-band device, which I'm assuming it is not.

And whatever manual is telling you to make all the APs communicate on the same channel has got to be just plain wrong... it is correct that you would want the same SSID so that you wouldn't have to set up a ton of automatic SSID connections on the devices on the network (it allows device roaming under one configured SSID), but you don't want APs overlapping on the same channel (or even channels that overlap the same area of the wireless band) or you create wireless interference problems (or, at the least, if CSMA/CA is working properly, performance problems). It's WLAN 101...

Anyhow, this is speculation on my part since I'm not an expert on WiFi... I just have a reasonable understanding (as far as I'm aware) of how it works in theory... perhaps someone can step in and enlighten us further?

 

[gimp]

Huh. The repeater operates on the same channel? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. WiFi (and I'm assuming the repeater,) uses CSMA/CA, which means that the repeater should be waiting for quiet moments before transmitting data, but as radio traffic increases, it would significantly reduce throughput to have both communicating on the same channel. To prevent this problem, the repeater would have to have to be able to receive on one channel and transmit on another via two separate antennas would have to be a dual-band device, which I'm assuming it is not.

And whatever manual is telling you to make all the APs communicate on the same channel has got to be just plain wrong... it is correct that you would want the same SSID so that you wouldn't have to set up a ton of automatic SSID connections on the devices on the network (it allows device roaming under one configured SSID), but you don't want APs overlapping on the same channel (or even channels that overlap the same area of the wireless band) or you create wireless interference problems (or, at the least, if CSMA/CA is working properly, performance problems). It's WLAN 101...

Anyhow, this is speculation on my part since I'm not an expert on WiFi... I just have a reasonable understanding (as far as I'm aware) of how it works in theory... perhaps someone can step in and enlighten us further?

with it being in repeater mode and not AP mode, there's no SSID to set since it's just repeating the signal.

it is strange that it must use the same channel, though

but that's why I've been asking for the log... it may help pinpoint where the issue is

 

[Concentric]

Why not set it up as a separate AP, not a repeater.

 

[knoximator]

Why not set it up as a separate AP, not a repeater.

it's physically far from the router and on different floors, therefore connecting them with wires would be tedious and messy.

have you looked at the log on the repeater? does it show a loss of connectivity to the router?

i haven't done that yet, been a bit busy. for some reason this AP kinda "disappears" from my network. what i mean is, that i can't access it though the web based configuration tools. to access it and the log i'd have to reset the configuration and connect it back to the router as per the manual to be able to access it. for some reason, there is no ip access address to this ap, only a "name" address (in the manual the basic first access address is: dlinkap not an ip address). therefore as you might understand, i've left this option for last.

Huh. The repeater operates on the same channel? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. WiFi (and I'm assuming the repeater,) uses CSMA/CA, which means that the repeater should be waiting for quiet moments before transmitting data, but as radio traffic increases, it would significantly reduce throughput to have both communicating on the same channel. To prevent this problem, the repeater would have to have to be able to receive on one channel and transmit on another via two separate antennas would have to be a dual-band device, which I'm assuming it is not.

And whatever manual is telling you to make all the APs communicate on the same channel has got to be just plain wrong... it is correct that you would want the same SSID so that you wouldn't have to set up a ton of automatic SSID connections on the devices on the network (it allows device roaming under one configured SSID), but you don't want APs overlapping on the same channel (or even channels that overlap the same area of the wireless band) or you create wireless interference problems (or, at the least, if CSMA/CA is working properly, performance problems). It's WLAN 101...

Anyhow, this is speculation on my part since I'm not an expert on WiFi... I just have a reasonable understanding (as far as I'm aware) of how it works in theory... perhaps someone can step in and enlighten us further?

Electrofreak, i have to say that despite my moderate experience with AP's and repeaters specifically, you argument makes quite a lot of sense. although if i'm not mistaken, most manuals if not all advice to put the repeater at the same channel as the router.
while i'm at it, i will try to reconfigure the AP at a different channel and see how that might affect things.

but i have to ask you, would a repeater work differently from say a normal wifi pci card that receives and transmits at the same time, the same for the router, and both are working on the same channel??

 

[gimp]

it should still be accessible.
Even some netgear routers' manual says to go to "netgearsetup.com" (or something like that) to access the router.

maybe before you do the repeater config, change the LAN setting to static IP setting and put in an IP?

The IP address and subnet mask will fallback to 192.168.0.50 and 255.255.255.0, if don’t get IP address from DHCP server exceed 30 seconds.

side note: they need to hire somebody with better grammar to write these!

 

[knoximator]

ok, so i managed to give it an ip address after hocking it up to the router to reconfigure it.

i found out the logging was disabled???
there were no logs, so i had it enabled now in the hopes of getting some sort of info in the next couple of days.

and here is an image to show you that i can't change the channel when the AP is working in repeater mode:

i don't know yet but i might just consider another AP that has repeater mode capabilities.
if any of you have a good solid recommendation, please do!!!