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$499 isn't beyond the price point of the average gamer. The CD-I was $700 in 1991 and the 3DO was $700 in 1993. Both of those adjusted for inflation would be slightly over $1100, which is more than twice the Xbox One.

MS made a lot of bad choices for the console, but I'll let time play itself out. I would agree that Sony will come back into major popularity, but I wouldn't think the Xbox will crash and burn.
 
Their blunder is not the price. Gamers bought the $600 PS3 and would've bought this.

But they systematically alienated hardcore gamers at every step, positioned the XBOne towards casuals, watching tv etc, then priced it out of their reach, and failed to show a single use of Kinect in games.

It really is a masterclass in how not to do a launch.
 
It all boils down to the used game and drm. Same thing happened with music. The standard barer always takes the hit.
 
sharknice said:
LOLWUT There aren't any similarities there. If anything it would be the opposite.
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Yeah I mean I understand what hes trying to say but no dreamcast was the pro gamer good guy console at the time. They didn't do what microsoft is doing.

I forget the name of the company or what the format was but they brought DRM in music I think to the forefront. They were lambasted for it but of course Itunes came along after the dust had settled and did fine. Microsoft is just being the front runner. By the end of its life cycle PS4 will be doing the same.
 
piscian18 said:
Yeah I mean I understand what hes trying to say but no dreamcast was the pro gamer good guy console at the time. They didn't do what microsoft is doing.

I forget the name of the company or what the format was but they brought DRM in music I think to the forefront. They were lambasted for it but of course Itunes came along after the dust had settled and did fine. Microsoft is just being the front runner. By the end of its life cycle PS4 will be doing the same.
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iTunes did well because the songs were at a fair price 99 cents. Its like this with Steam as well, Steam is doing well because of all the sales are at a fair price. Microsoft doesn't have fair prices, it might work if Microsoft have all their new release titles at $5 with DRM.

If they release new AAA games at $5, I bet you people would have an easier time getting over DRM and not really care much for used games at that point because its already dirt cheap. People buy used games because its cheaper not because they want to, if its already cheap to begin with, it might not be a problem. Look at smart phone apps, most of them are 99 cents and its DRM.
 
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K10 said:
Both 3DO and Philips CD-I failed because they tried to do too much beyond gaming, and with a price point that was unaffordable for the average gamer.

Sega Saturn crashed and burned in orbit because it was $100 more than PS1.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExaAYIKsDBI

Is Xbox One and done going to repeat gaming history?
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The answer is no. The reason is that the 3DO failed due to pricing and poor marketing, and the CD-I failed due to the fact that that it was marketed even worse as some sort of entertainment box, but not necessarily a gaming console when pure gaming consoles were still very hot. The Xbox One isn't attempting to do much more than it did before with the 360, its just forcing some new business model decisions down our throats that wasn't the case with the 360. I don't see the Xbox One failing by any means, it simply won't be as popular as the PS4 this generation.
 
At that price, with those exclusives, and with that ridiculous level of DRM, the only people I can see buying an Xbox One are: a) Halo and Forza fanboys; and b) people who think paying $500 plus $10/month to use Skype, watch TV, watch Netflix and screw around with fantasy league football is a good deal. I honestly don't know how much more anti-consumer a console can get after the Xbox One.

The PS4 simply offers more for the core gamer - better sense of product ownership, slightly faster hardware, cheaper online fees (even though paying MS/Sony to use your Internet connection is fucking retarded, regardless of how many free games and blowjobs they spam at you), and a better stable of in-house developers. Unless MS can bring out some really brilliant exclusives (which it hasn't done to a great extent through the 360's lifespan compared to Sony), there is nothing here that the PS4 and PC can't do.
 
Gold is different than PSN Plus, paying for THAT was complete bullshit, however the amount of value PSN Plus offers is Insane (even more if you have a Vita along with PS3/PS4), a lot of people aren't even aware about it, early adopters have access to a HUGE library of games that are tied to their account which they downloaded over time unless they unsubscribe. You don't even have to fully download a game when it's up, just add it to the queue (can be done on PC too via SEN website) and you're good to go to download/install it anytime you want.

With that said, I do feel for the people who only care about a game or two and exclusively play those online, kinda sucks for them because the PSN Plus advantages will be kinda useless for 'em.

Sony lost A LOT of money with the PS3, I understand this paywall decision to make this console a financial success that the PS3 wasn't (even though PS3 is an excellent console for gamers), Sony IS a business after all and that's their main goal, it doesn't hurt that they're giving us excellent value in the process and I'm sure with the extra $ they'll be getting it only means we'll have a smoother PSN experience.
 
If paying for online multiplayer is not acceptable when Microsoft does it, then it is not acceptable when Sony does it.

Double-think is rife at the Kids' Table of [H].
 
I do not approve of paying to play MP, but I however understand that decision. I would have been in complete rage mode if PSN Plus only gave me MP access, but that's not the case.

I already want to use PSN Plus because of what it offers Besides MP access, I was even considering paying for Both PSN US AND Euro because the free lineup is different and Euro tends to have better games, but like I said this DOES suck for people who couldn't care less about what PSN Plus has to offer, forcing stuff upon everyone will always suck.
 
Well, just read the list of countries where the console will be released in 2013. It seems that MS "forgot" about whole Middle and Eastern Europe. So, if I want to play new games on next gen in holiday season, I've only one choice. Getting PS4 and not even looking back.
 
MorgothPl said:
Well, just read the list of countries where the console will be released in 2013. It seems that MS "forgot" about whole Middle and Eastern Europe. So, if I want to play new games on next gen in holiday season, I've only one choice. Getting PS4 and not even looking back.
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MS also forgot about parts of Canada that don't have broadband.
 
It would not surprise me if more parents bought console A over console B simply because it was cheaper. Not sure how M$ marketing may have missed that as they probably benefited from it last round.
 
RaZoRbLaDeD said:
oh sorry bro, I only meant in terms of it getting crushed and put out of the game
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Actually between Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo, only Sony is in any financial distress. Microsoft is the most likely to have made the biggest screw up this generation, but that alone won't put them "out of the game".
 
okay I didn't mean for it to be picked apart. I simply meant PS2 went on to be one of the best consoles ever made and Dreamcast flopped hard. IT FEELS LIKE THE SAME THING IS HAPPENIN NOW KINDA, COOL? KNOW WHAT IM SAYIN MAN?
 
RaZoRbLaDeD said:
okay I didn't mean for it to be picked apart. I simply meant PS2 went on to be one of the best consoles ever made and Dreamcast flopped hard. IT FEELS LIKE THE SAME THING IS HAPPENIN NOW KINDA, COOL? KNOW WHAT IM SAYIN MAN?
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Objectively and without the context of the support that followed, the Dreamcast was the better console with better hardware and groundbreaking features that weren't availabe until years further. It still failed due to time-to-market, marketing and distribution issues and lack of developer support.

The difference here, to the detriment of MSFT, is the Xbox One is not as powerful as its competitor, more expensive and all of the "features" are veiled tools to bilk the consumer out of more money and restrict usage.
 
3DO and CD-i failed because they had little to no 3rd party support, and the "games" that they had were fairly poor in quality.

Saturn failed because Sega tried to put out too many Genesis add-ons and by the time the Saturn came out, people didn't think Sega was that good anymore. Keep in mind the Saturn launch was faked; they were available months before they were supposed to be. Sega also had issues with 3rd party support in the US, and most of the good import titles never made it out of Japan. One of the best titles for the platform, PDS, didn't get released until the thing was already dead in the US.

XBO will have games, 3rd party support, and advertising. The thing they have to fight and overcome now is bad PR and at this point I don't think they're ever going to do that. If Sony had announced Ps4 for the same price, I think they'd have a chance. Undercutting MS on cost I think is the final nail in the coffin. Unless they change their tune on EVERYTHING, lower the price to match, and possibly even do MORE - they're screwed. The diehards will buy one....but I think the fence-sitters have already decided to buy a Ps4 instead.
 
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Is it me, or does it feel like they took a giant runny shit over deployed armed services with the 24 check-in? I think that's what pisses me off the most about it.

Funny that, MS being of domestic origin and Sony being of foreign.
 
MrCrispy said:
Their blunder is not the price. Gamers bought the $600 PS3 and would've bought this.

But they systematically alienated hardcore gamers at every step, positioned the XBOne towards casuals, watching tv etc, then priced it out of their reach, and failed to show a single use of Kinect in games.

It really is a masterclass in how not to do a launch.
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It is the price, gamers bought the $600 PS3 because it was the cheapest option for a BR drive, plus no requirement for PS+ which is now required fro MP, and other issues like support of Linux and backwards compatibility, but even at that it took sony years before the PS3 really gained traction. And all that time MS was raking in the cash on XBL and a bigger user base.

The reason SONY is so aggressive this time is because in their minds and many they were last place in the last console race and profitability suffered.

The $100 difference is HUGE, everything else is bad as well but it could all be argued and come down to more exclusives ETC if both consoles were priced equally.

BTW apparently in Australia the consoles are much closer in price. 599 vs 549. Which is very odd / interesting why screw the aussies? Is it because they think they have them in the bag anyway?
 
While in the past they could have pitched exclusives to make their console worthwhile - we're in the era of multiplatform. In the case of both MS and Sony, almost every game either used to show off their new system is also on the other system (and probably the PC, 3DS, Vita, etc.) as well.

MS really needed to come in at the same price. I think that will hurt them more than all of this PR.
For their sake, hopefully it isn't too late to go back and lower it.
 
This is kind of pompous, no? What do you all think?

http://www.engadget.com/2013/06/12/don-mattrick-xbox-360-offline/

MATTRICK: "Some of the advantages that you get, of having, a box that is designed to use an online state, so, that, uh, to me is the future-proof choice, and I think people, could've arguably gone the other way if we didn't do it and fortunately we have a product for people who aren't able to get some form of connectivity, it's called Xbox 360."

KEIGHLEY: "Right, so stick with 360, that's your message if you don't [inaudible] like it?"

MATTRICK: "Well, if you have zero access to the internet, that is an offline device, I mean, seriously, when I read the blogs, and thought about who's really the most impacted, there was a person who said 'hey, I'm on a nuclear sub,' and I don't even know what it means to be on a nuclear sub but I've gotta imagine it's not easy to get an internet connection."

KEIGHLEY: "[inaudible] playing call of duty multiplayer"

MATTRICK: "Hey, I can empathize, if I was on a nuclear sub, I'd be disappointed."
 
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