A few words about external hard drives

SEALTeamSix

2[H]4U
Joined
Aug 15, 2003
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Hey folks,

I'd like to talk about something that some of us
have considered at one point or another - storing your data on an external
hard drive. There are several pros, the most important of which being data
portability/share-ability, and also much-increased storage capacity for
laptop users. I myself am tempted by the idea of dropping a 250GB drive
into an external enclosure and being able to easily share my data between my
laptop, desktop, and all my friends. Before diving into an external setup,
there are a few things to consider:

External Vs. Internal:
How well do external drives perform compared to internal drives? Does
ATA-133 give internal drives a signficant advantage?

USB 2.0 has a maximum transfer speed of 60 MB/s, and that of Firewire is 50
MB/s. At first glance, 50-60 MB/sec interface appears to be a severe
bottleneck; however, under many usage conditions, even modern drives will
not be able to push out more than 60MB/sec. For instance, here are some
speed specs for a 200GB DiamondMax Plus 9 SATA drive:

http://www.thetechlounge.com/review.php?REVIEWDIR=maxtor_200_7200 said:
PCMark02
Uncached File Write - 42.9 MB/s
Cached File Write - 52.8 MB/s
Uncached File Read - 44.9 MB/s
Cached File Read - 51.8 MB/s
File Copy - 23.8 MB/s

As you can see, none of these speeds touches the 60 MB/s theoretical speed
of USB 2.0, and only starts to tax the 50 MB/s limit of Firewire. While you
might not be able to acheive the full theoretical rate of Firewire, it
appears the performance will be somewhere between 5 and 20% slower compared
to an IDE drive.

Interface:
While the HD will still spin as fast, the interfaces available to those
seeking an external HD solution are USB 2.0 and Firewire. Here is a quick
breakdown of each:

http://www.digit-life.com/articles/usb20vsfirewire said:
USB 2.0
Max theoretical 480 Mbit/s (60 MB/s) rate supported.
USB controller is required to control the bus and data transfer.
Cable up to 5 m.
Power supply to external devices is 500 mA/5V (max).
Full compatibility with USB 1.1 devices.
Much more commonly included on motherboards than Firewire.
Uses more system resources than Firewire.

Firewire (IEEE1394)
Max theoretical 400 Mbit/s (50 MB/s) rate supported.
Works without control, devices communicate peer-to-peer.
Cable up to 4.5 m.
Power supply to external devices is 1.25A/12V (max.).
The only computer bus used in digital video cameras.
All Macs come with integrated Firewire.
Uses less system resources than USB 2.0.

File Copying
Connection........................Direct........USB 2.0......Firewire
400

1GB in 1 file ....................58.7 sec.....114.6 sec.......69.6 sec
1GB in 9226 files..............84.1 sec.....119.4 sec.......90.1 sec

As you can see, the architectural differences between these interfaces plays
an important role in performance. In this and other tests, Firewire
out-performs USB 2.0, due to the more efficient control of data flow across
the bus. For external hard drives, Firewire is clearly superior to USB.
However, for devices like CD/DVD-RW drives that don't need a blazing-fast
interface, the difference between two is almost negligible.

Conclusion:
External drives are not for everyone. They cannot be RAIDed, they cost more
than an internal drive, they will perform somewhere between 5-20% slower at
most tasks, and on motherboards that can't boot from USB you still have to
have a system drive installed. However, there are also some obvious
benefits to an external drive. When considering an external drive, the
fastest and least system-intensive interface is Firewire, though USB 2.0 is
by far the more common interface. The best solution would be a USB
2.0/Firewire combo drive, which would give the user the availability of USB
2.0 with the option of the speedier Firewire.

As with everything, with added functionality comes added cost. The most
cost-effective way to get an external drive is to buy the enclosure and the
drive separately and then put them together. Given that there are some
crazy-cheap deals on 3.5-inch hard drives nowadays, this tactic makes great
sense. Pair it with a combo enclosure found at NewEgg for $35 shipped, and
you're good to go. If your mobo doesn't have Firewire support, a PCI card
will run you another $7-8 shipped, but it will be money well-spent.

-SEAL
 
I just purchased a Bytecc Hard Drive Enclosure and a 120Gb 7200.7 Seagate Barracuda drive.

Everything went pretty damn easily. Within two hours it was installed, formatted, and had 20Gb worth of MP3's and pictures on it.

It is pretty noisy though.
 
You can RAID (aggregate as they call it) these external hard drives (I have the 160GB one). http://www.ximeta.com Don't know if its via ethernet only or if you can do it via USB, I only have one drive so I can't test. Its been nice though.
 
Good article, I was thinkin about slapping a 250 gb hdd into one of those enclosures, going to have to pick up a firewire card it seems.

-Mike

PS you made the front page :cool:
 
Anyone know if the firewire included as part of the SoundBlaster Audigy2 cards is any better/worse than a separate PCI firewire card?
 
Lezmaka said:
Anyone know if the firewire included as part of the SoundBlaster Audigy2 cards is any better/worse than a separate PCI firewire card?

I've used the firewire on the audigy 1 & 2 and also a seperate PCI card. I havent noticed any kind of increase or decrease in speed or performance.
 
There is simply no difference between the Audigy 2 and PCI firewire connection.
 
Hi, first time poster, long time reader....
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-145-745&depa=0

This enclosure is probably one of the best external hard drive enclosures I have seen. It's aluminum (instead of cheap plastic), It's thinner than the average enclosure (no fans; the aluminum sides act as a heat sink and the black mesh allows air flow) and it's both USB and FW400 so all your bases are covered. I've seen other sites that have this in other colors, newegg has a SATA version, etc but this is the one I have and it rocks.
I got a Western Digital WD2000BB and it burns (I am only moving/installing apps and moving .dmgs and .iso around so the 8mb buffer doesn't bother me that much). $173 for 200gb external drive USB 2.0/firewire 400 shipping included. Newegg.rocks.com!!!
 
Sorry it's Speeze and the drive listed has a 2mb buffer. The lack of the 8mb doesn't hurt much.
 
You can RAID external drives, but it will have to be a software raid or an enclosure with a built in raid controller. However, I wouldnt recommend either,
 
http://www.homestarrunner.com/dween_tgs.htmlFirewire 800 is around, it just isnt very popular yet. I've yet to see a motherboard with 1394b capabilties, which makes it hard for the standard to take off. You can certainly buy Firewire 800 devices however as a search on google for Firewire 800 or 1394B can show.
 
I had problems with the firewire on my SB Audigy as opposed to the onboard from my Mobo. Theoretically there is no difference but your milage may vary, mine did. By the way the problems were encountered when using my 2G Apple iPod. It's been a little over a year ago but as I remember I had very slow performance from the Audigy Firewire.
 
Caffeinatedsoap said:
make sure it has a fan beacause I just bought one and its hot as hell.

If your are doing video editing, audio composition/editing, etc it's not the best enclosure for you. If you are doing quick and dirty backups, troubleshooting (using as a boot disk), using as a vehicle to install apps, etc this enclosure works. It gets hot because the enclosure itself is the heatsink. Never too hot to touch though. I doubt a drive in this enclosure gets any hotter that the cheap plastic enclosures with the two 1 inch fans.
 
sc28 said:
Hi, first time poster, long time reader....
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-145-745&depa=0

This enclosure is probably one of the best external hard drive enclosures I have seen. It's aluminum (instead of cheap plastic), It's thinner than the average enclosure (no fans; the aluminum sides act as a heat sink and the black mesh allows air flow) and it's both USB and FW400 so all your bases are covered. I've seen other sites that have this in other colors, newegg has a SATA version, etc but this is the one I have and it rocks.
I got a Western Digital WD2000BB and it burns (I am only moving/installing apps and moving .dmgs and .iso around so the 8mb buffer doesn't bother me that much). $173 for 200gb external drive USB 2.0/firewire 400 shipping included. Newegg.rocks.com!!!

I have the usb/SATA version and It works great for me( SATA) using a WD2000Jb.
8mb buffer doesnt make a difrence unless its a boot drive and the psu has no prob
spinning it up(an issue posted in the reviews on newegg).
pci SATA cards are only 25bux and PCMCIA SATA are only $32
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=15-115-051&depa=0
only downside to SATA is that cables are fragle and errr, I think Ice Czar explains it
best in his faq
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=742083
 
I didn't mention Firewire 800 because there are almost no non-Mac motherboards that have any support for them, and the PCI cards start at $42. Also, there are relatively few external enclosures that will do Firewire 800, and they are all pretty expensive. However, once it catches on, Firewire 800 will be the way to go for external hard drives (it will be as fast as an ATA-100 interface), assuming external SATA doesn't catch on before that.

-SEAL
 
I think this just might be the thing I need for my laptop for LANparties. My laptop's specs aren't that bad (Centrino 1.4, 640 PC2100, Radeon 9200), but the 4200RPM hard drive just KILLS games. My laptop has both a firewire and a USB2.0 port. I wonder if I were to install all my games on an external drive, and carry it around with my laptop to LANs, if it would help my problem or not. I'd guess it would.
 
foreignkid said:
You can RAID external drives, but it will have to be a software raid or an enclosure with a built in raid controller. However, I wouldnt recommend either,

It might be hard to find a good software raid solution for external/removable drives. One of the most common ways in Windows 2000 and XP is to create dynamic disks and set up a raid partition on fixed drives, but they won't do it with removable drives, which USB drives most certainly are.

Although, if you can find suitable Raid software, some of of the Bytec USB 2.0 enclosures can run two drives from it's controler in master/slave. I've only tried it with my Bytec USB 2.0 enclosure, likely works with many of them and likely some other brands, but shouldn't hurt anything to try. A pair of the thin Maxtor DiamondMax drives can fit in the 5.25' case easily and be secured with just a simple fabricated bracket (could use extra cooling though.) The internal power supply seems to run the drives just fine, but I don't think I'd try a pair of anything that's going to pull a lot of power. Of course this is usefull for much more than just raid functions. If someone happened to have an old dual 5.25" SCSI case, it could be a nice and easy way to put seperate burner/cdrom/dvd/zip/whatever right on the desktop, or any combination of ATA devices in a nice convienient portable case.
 
Two things:

1) To me, the huge brick power supplies are a deal-breaker, although some of them have integrated PS's. Be sure to check for integrated PS's before you buy, as those bricks are a pain to lug around.

2) External SATA. How far away can standard SATA ports in front of cases be? Anybody hear about this lately? How about this baby:
ValueDisk’s External SATA Hard Drive Case Kit
Compliant with the SATA 1.5 Gb/s standard with up to 150 Mbytes/sec.
Windows 98, ME, 2000, and XP uses built-in driver, so the driver CD is not needed.
True SATA Hard Drive (Not SATA to IDE Conversion)
Easy Windows Plug-n-Play
Self-powered, AC adapter included :(
​
Anyone use one of these? This place has them for $78, but I have to believe they can/will be found cheaper.

Interesting review here. Although a pre-assembled external SATA, it's numbers are impressive (beats internal 800JB).
 
I guess this proves it once again.... Microsoft's USB drivers still suck :)
 
Adango said:
It is pretty noisy though.

Is it the fan from the external enclosure making most of the noise or is it the harddrive?

If it's the drive, have you thought about turn on the acoustic management on the drive itself? I have done it with a Seagate drive and I can hardly hear it.
 
I have the same external enclosure as sc28 except I bought the enclosure seperately and added my own hard drive. The main reason I got one is for backups, Its actually quicker than I thought it would be at backing up and it sure beats using a bunch of dvd-rw's.

I bought mine at www.iocombo.com, they have the Eumax enclosure (same as sc28's) for 39.95. If you already have a hd you can use just getting the enclosure is the better deal. Link: http://iocombo.com/main/configurator2.php?system_id=00Y4 . If you want to see the ones with hd's installed then just go to iocombo.com and search for 'Eumax'
 
If you want to add an external drive to your home LAN I would recommend a network attached hard drive. Dlink offers two such devices that even offer RAID1 functionality. IOdata here in Japan will soon offer a similar solution called the "LAN tank". With the LAN Tank you simply buy the enclosure and add your own 3.5" drive...nice. This way you can simply share files with anyone on your LAN or even over the internet if you like (you can then access your home files remotely!). Forget USB/IE1394..blah.

IOdata will also soon offer another very cool device called the Movie Tank. It is a 3.5" drive enclosure that you can add any 3.5" IDE HDD to. It connects to your PC via USB2.0 and can act as a simple external drive. On top of this you can connect it to your TV+stereo without a PC and play mp3/ogg files, slideshow image files - bmp/gif/jpg, and watch movie files - MPG, AVI, DivX, XviD, etc... very cool! Now, you can take your movies to a friend's place hook it up t their TV and watch...even to the cottage or where-ever....300GB of fun! Good for those in the home video editing scene too. Why don't they have anything like this in North America yet?
 
GotNoRice said:
I think this just might be the thing I need for my laptop for LANparties. My laptop's specs aren't that bad (Centrino 1.4, 640 PC2100, Radeon 9200), but the 4200RPM hard drive just KILLS games. My laptop has both a firewire and a USB2.0 port. I wonder if I were to install all my games on an external drive, and carry it around with my laptop to LANs, if it would help my problem or not. I'd guess it would.
Way back in 2000 a couple of my mates came round for some Quake and Starcraft. One of them had a laptop and we found that Quake (yes 1) barely ran, even though he had a 200+MHz CPU in his laptop. I mapped a network drive over 100BaseT to my rig and he ran Quake off there perfectly :)

I would have thought you'd get a performance increase by "externalising" your drive for games.
 
Lezmaka said:
Anyone know if the firewire included as part of the SoundBlaster Audigy2 cards is any better/worse than a separate PCI firewire card?

I don't know if there's any difference in speed, but I do know that if I attempt to capture video from my DV camcorder through the Audigy's Firewire port vs. the built in one on the motherboard, I drop frames LIKE CRAZY (to the tune of 15-30% dropped frames)! Yet I can put it in the onboard and not drop a single frame.
 
Thanks a bunch for the guide. Been thinking about getting an external to backup one of my internal drives before I sell my system.

Anyone know how much power an external drive draws?

And are the enclosures EM shielded?
 
Do you know if any of the casings will support both USB and Firewire simultaneously? I ask because I have a Maxorbital LCD display that needs a USB connection and I would like to mount it in the front of one of these enclosures with the drive behind it?
 
sdattilo said:
Do you know if any of the casings will support both USB and Firewire simultaneously? I ask because I have a Maxorbital LCD display that needs a USB connection and I would like to mount it in the front of one of these enclosures with the drive behind it?

Yes this case:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-145-745&depa=1

"Speeze USB 2.0/IEEE1394 External Hard Drive Enclosure - 780U2FL"


We use a bunch of these with 160GB Seagate drives in them for backups of our SCSI Raid array. Cheaper than tape drives and a heck of a lot faster.
 
Something that wasn't mentioned is that Firewire uses almost 0% CPU utilization on good controllers.

I know this is great because whenever i'm running things off of my external drive, I see almost no usage by my CPU.

I also run external drives on an FTP through my computer. When someone is doing 5-6 meg/s transfers off of my external drives, I don't even notice a slowdown using normal programs on my IDE drives/CPU is barely used (just for network transfer).
 
Xrave said:
Something that wasn't mentioned is that Firewire uses almost 0% CPU utilization on good controllers.

I mentioned it very briefly, but I suppose I should say a little more. Due to its architecture a Firewire drive actually hits the CPU less than an IDE drive.

-SEAL
 
Koz said:
http://www.homestarrunner.com/dween_tgs.htmlFirewire 800 is around, it just isnt very popular yet. I've yet to see a motherboard with 1394b capabilties, which makes it hard for the standard to take off. You can certainly buy Firewire 800 devices however as a search on google for Firewire 800 or 1394B can show.

A few Gigabyte Athlon64 boards have 1394b
GA-K8NSNXP-939 and GA-K8NSNXP to name two (yes I know they're the same board with different sockets...)
There are also a few PCI cards. Most are marketed to Mac users, but will work on PCs with a recent OS. (Sorry Win9x users :rolleyes: )
Lastly, the latest G4 Powerbooks, all G5s, and I think the last G4 towers have 1394b ports standard.

That said, with the exception of a few expensive HDs, 1394b devices are rare.

/me drools over a Bigger Disk Extreme

Xrave said:
Something that wasn't mentioned is that Firewire uses almost 0% CPU utilization on good controllers.

This is because 1394 is a subset of SCSI-3. Unlike USB, 1394 cards have a dedicated processor on them. USB on the other hand is very CPU dependent. This is also why USB devices are cheaper than 1394. Think Winmodem (USB) vs. hardware-controlled modem (1394).
 
I bought the Speese Metal Gear Box USB/Firewire version from newegg. I put a Maxtor 200GB 7200rpm,8MB cache HDD. With Sandra 2004 it benchmarks 26Mb/s on USB and 25Gb/s on firewire. That's on a Compaq Pesario AMD64 3000+ laptop with 512MB of memory. I ran it on my desktop which is a Athlon 3200+ with 1 GB memory and it benchmarked about the same. Seems like that's slow compared to what others are getting on external HDDs.Am I confused?
 
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