754 or 939

H

Herulach

Gawd
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Messages
997
I know theres a bit of a stigma attached to buying a 754, but seeing as how it wont be upgraded for a good long while anyway is there any major advantage of buying 939? I can get SATA on a 754 board, and i dont need PCI express, at least not until i get a new graphics card, and that will be a good long while i think.

Im probably gonna go with another epox board, is the NF3 250 or the VIA chipset the better? Have my eye on this NF3 250. But any suggestions would be welcome. Paired with a clawhammer 3700+ (1MB cache version). That i can get for ~£300 as opposed to £400 for the 512KB 3800+ on a 939 socket. Clawhammers use standard DDR as well right? or would i need to get registered?
Cheers
 
Hello,

My advise would be to go for the s939, simply because it supports Dual RAM, and the heat generated seems to be less than S754 when overclocked.

However if you are going to opt for the s754 and wish to overlock I would hit the DFI Lanparty mobo, if you plan on just leaving the CPU at stock speeds, the ASUS A8V is a good choice.

I have the AMD64 3200+ s939 and it seems to overlock very well and the mobo - Abit AV8 comes with nice price.

There is a review over at Rage3d
 
The thing is im in the market for spending a bit more money than on a 3200, and for the same price as a 3800 i can get the 3700 s754 and a motherboard. What im basically after an answer to is is the extra cache enough to offset the lack of bandwidth on the older proc. I cant seem to find any comparisons after about 15 mins googling, so i thought id see if any of you guys knew.
 
Woohaaaa....

If youre willing to spend that kind of money go with a MSI Neo2 and a s939 3200+ 90nm

Then U get the same speed (with a small oc), same price and better upgradebility and U will also have the Dual Channel Memory thrown in for free. And if U still decide to go 754 go for the DFI 250 Gb it has had VERY good feedback (especially for overclockers). or if Ure really need the extra multiplyer go for the 939 3500+ 90 nm. Or wait for a while and pickup the rest stores of the 754 stuff when the stores prepare to get rid of it in half a year or so.
 
How is the 3200+ the same speed as the 3700? I mean, clock maybe, but surely the cache counts for something, i would have thought amd would at least be internally consistent with their naming. As far as motherboards go, ive had an msi before, and it was a complete pos, admittedly that was a while ago, so theyve probably improved by then. Is the nforce 3 the one to go for? Ive heard good things about the A8V. If i was gonna go 939 itd prob be 3500+, A8V/Neo and a 1GB matched pair of TwinX (2 512s)
 
The 3200+ Winnie is easy to get to 220-240 fsb thereby upping the speed on 9* or even 10* with 10-20%+ and youre pretty much there. Winnies are highly clockable and it is not uncommon to see 2600 MHz on air. And if U get some good RAM U might even hit 250-270 with tight timings on the RAM. Basically any TCCD chips with a upped rating will help U there. And yes the nF3 is the one now and among the MoBos out there Id read up on the Neo2 if I were U it is well known and so are the issues and incompatibilities that might arise.

GL
 
The Neo 2/Platinum is a great board, but it is picky and you have to do your research regarding BIOS settings to get the most from the board. I agree with everyone else, if you're gong the S754 route, get the DFI board with the NF3 chipset. Stay away from VIA chipset boards.
 
If you are in the market for a new board/cpu I would say go with the 939...
 
freeloader1969 said:
The Neo 2/Platinum is a great board, but it is picky and you have to do your research regarding BIOS settings to get the most from the board. I agree with everyone else, if you're gong the S754 route, get the DFI board with the NF3 chipset. Stay away from VIA chipset boards.
Click to expand...
quoted for truth.
to go with it, get a 3200+ or 3500+ if you have the money. just make sure that it's a winchester, not newcastle.
(winchester = 90nm, runs cooler, oc's better)
 
Looks like i am gonna have to put a bit more research into it then, seen as the general consensus seems to be 939, and ive just read a post that says the dual core cpus are gonna be 939 too then i think 939 it is. Any links to threads on the Neo2 boards? re what ram etc is best? Is it worth paying the premium for ddr 433+ ram? im only gonna be running on air cooling, prob a 7700 cu.
 
Do a search for "939 neo2 tccd overclock" and you won't go far wrong! Just be aware issues have been had with non-TCCD memory. I'm very happy with my sig rig, but it did take an age to get it working (with PC3200 Ballistix).
 
I was recently evaluating this same purchase as I'm sure a lot of people are.
I decided that I should go with the DFI 754 and a 3400+ (2.4 GHz) My total outlay was $333.

I don't think there is a bad decision here but to me it made more sense to go 754 because of several reasons:
1.) Stability. The DFI board is rock solid. I do plan to overclock and this board has the goods to do it in spades. Some may argue that the 939's are stable but I've seen too many problems and flaky board complaints around the forums I frequent and lurk.
2.) Performance. 754 is not at a noticeable disadvantage per clock in most applications aside from synthetic memory and 3dmark. Quantifiable? Yes. Noticeable? Unlikely.
3.) AGP I have a 6800GT AGP and I don't plan to upgrade until next year. There is little reason to. (I would love to have a high end ATI card but they are vaporware and PCI-E only until mid year)
4.) Dual Core. With flaky boards comes flaky performance. And to count on a currently flaky board to support an upcoming new technology with a bios update is not something I'm going to rely on.
5.) NF4. There will be a whole slew of 939 NF4 boards on the market soon enough. Most with PCI-E / SLI and a few with AGP. Who is to say that you will get a regular bios update with the boards that are out now? Most companies don't like to support an older board unless the user base is pulling their hair out.
6.) Price. The equivalent of the 3400+ 754 would be the 3500+ 939. The price difference of the CPU alone (retail PIB) is $46. The difference in price of the boards that I would consider is very close to the same. If I'm going to be buying a new video card in a year and going to have to upgrade to a PCI-E board to do so then why do I want to spend more money now? I think I'll take the extra $100 I saved and put towards my new HDTV or a new pair of shoes.

Again, this is my opinion and view. Though it may be an irrational mess to you, it seems logical to me.
</my $0.02>

edit: forgot to add that I'm very happy with my new 3400+ and DFI 754, arrived 1/7. I love that it's stable and I don't have to listen to a vaccum cleaner to have a fast computer (CPU/MOBO was NF7 and m2500+ sure it was nice clocking to 2.6GHz but girls don't understand why your computer is so loud)
 
Good choice, but I would have gone with the 939 Because I upgrade alot.. And i Hate swapping mobos..
:p
 
I agree with the DFI Lanparty and the 3400+ Necastle

It cheap fast out of the box

I mean in the past when i upgrade I upgrade both at the same time the proc and the mobo and by the time my 3400+ and X800XT get slow am sure there will be something better and newer then soket 939 :)

And soket 939 speed increase wasnt too impressive for me

But we all have our own opinions ;)
 
There is no question, go 939. If you want good stock performance, get yourself a 3500+ 90nm or higher. If you're willing to roll the dice, go with a 3200+; there's a pretty good chance of getting it into the 3800+ range.

The performance benefit of running dual-channel memory is not to be underestimated.
 
wow 3% or so for Dual Chanel if it was 30% it would make sense but 3 :rolleyes:
 
Since dual channel ram doesn't help very much right now, even in benchmarks, does that mean that it will never matter on Athlon64s?
 
Since dual channel ram doesn't help very much right now, even in benchmarks, does that mean that it will never matter on Athlon64s?
Click to expand...

I would think that when AMD goes to dual cores, you'll see a much more noticeable difference between single and dual channel systems. Dual channel being better of course. The only reason being that a dual core on a S939 board is going to share the same ram. Anything that's not in the L1 or L2 cache of the cores is going to have to go to main memory. If you have two processors accessing the memory at the same time, I'm assuming faster bandwidth "may" help this situation. Don't forget that latency will play a big part in this equation as well.
 
All I know is that with my Abit 754 board with a 3000+ with a 240mhz FSB overclock gets about a 28% lower 3dmark05 scores with an x800XT-PE as my Abit 939 board with a 3400+ at stock speed gets with the same x800XT-PE.

Arguably a 3000+ at 240mhz should be about the same speed as a 3400+, and it should also benefit from the faster RAM and other system parts speed increases.

So I would have to STRONGLY recommend you get the 939 over the 754.
 
Look, here is the bottom line:

The markup going from a good 754 mobo and a 754 A64, to a good 939 mobo and a 939 A64, just ain't that much. I looked at the prices, it was a pretty mediocre savings. In return you get:

-Dual channel RAM. This isn't a huge deal, but it IS an advantage nonetheless. Furthermore, we can assume that the higher-end processors benefit from this more. And all the higher-end processors will be... socket 939.

-Upgrade path. I don't know why people just brush this off like it is nothing. The 754 goes up to 3700+, and that will probalby be the end of the road for 754. Meanwhile, 939 goes up to 4000+ and FX-55 (4200+ equivalent?) already. At least FX-57 (4400+ equivalent?) will be for 939 too, along with dual-core CPUs that will work on current 939 mobos with just a BIOS flash. That's got to be worth a couple bucks.

-90nm Winchester cores = more performance clock-for-clock, lower power consumption, and less heat to deal with, which = better overclocking... or just better efficiency. AFAIK these are all, and will be, only 939.

-If you get one of the nforce 4 PCI-e 939 mobos, your are about as future-resistant as anybody is going to get. AGP 8x won't even be obsolete for a couple years yet, and PCI-e 16x will last some indeterminate time after that. But in fairness, AGP will probalby be around for so much longer that it will hardly be an issue either way.
 
If you've got LITERALLY matched sticks of ram, then a 939 would be fine. In my experience, none but will work safely in Dual Channel mode. My experiences with 939 in general have been exceptionally poor, I'd stick with 754.

And, despite anyhting CastleBravo says, I'd certainly avoid the Winchester cores... unless you really have time to spend fucking with it.

If you can't tell, I've had a pure hell experience with these setups. It almost permanently turned me off of everything AMD related, excepting the older NF2 and the 754 setups. 3 months, and AMD/Corsair/Abit/Kingston/Gigabyte still can't figure out how to make parts that are stable...

/rant

(I may have had a little much to drink tonight...)

EDIT: 754 goes to 3900, IIRC, as 64 bit, and 939.940 will go on for a LONG time past. The forseeable future, for sure.
 
i have a 754 3200 + and asus mobo.
and its just as fast as my friends 939 3500 rig.
he just has better memory.
 
My vote's for 939. Six months ago going for 754 was a no-brainer, but now that we stepped up 2 core revisions (Newcastle and Winchester) and now that the price difference is marginal at best (here in Canada the 3000+ 754 & 939 are at the same price) I don't see any reasons not to go 939.

Edit: 754 goes up to 3700+ iirc, and their availability isn't getting better.
 
I agree with Decelerate. Why not go s939 if your buying new. Later on you can get an fx processor, and in the mean time you have dual channel and support for the 90mm winchester processors which have marginal performance difference (slightly better), but are run a bit cooler. Amd will be supporting this socket for a while when s754 is destined to be phased out, as amd has said. A lot of s754 owners say that they get the same performance and similar overclocks though. Either way you are probably looking at a pretty fast comp, so happy hunting.
 
This is kindof off topic, however is the Asus A8V a lousy overclocking board, or has anyone had good luck overclocking?

Just wondering
 
i have the ASUS KNE-8 DEXLUE.
its an awsome mobo very stable.
mine cpu is over clocked
 
NF4 boards are hitting now and some will be very affordable yet still great like Chaintech one (NF4 Ultra) going for only $129 at newegg. I would go 939 with an NF4 Ultra board. Its not much more but you GET a lot more for now and the future (SATA2, PCIe, Nvidia nTune & Network Armor, etc.). Especially since the end of 754 (though it still has plenty of time) has actually been announced and there will be no more chips for it other then more Semprons.
 
go 939 the 754 chip set will soon go out the 939 is newest so in a little bit they will prob quit making 754 jus a suggestion
 
go 754. why?

1. Dual Channel makes little to no difference in performance on a64 chips
2. 939 chips are lower clocked than their 754 brethren cuase AMD thought that would be made for with the dual channel ram, which is not really true
3. the 1MB will help much, much more than dual channel will, and its running faster.
4. the only 2.4ghz chip for 939 is the 4000+ or the FX53, which are rather expensive compared to the 3700+
5. winchesters do NOT always OC well, some only hit 2.3ghz, which would leave you wanting more performance
6. the newer revision clawhammers (CG) do OC rather well, and if you get a mobile 3700+, you are in an even better position to OC FROM 2.4ghz and 1MB, not 2.0ghz (3200+) and 512kb.
7. you said you wont be upgrading anytime soon, so you wont need the upgradability ability when dual core comes along
8. even if you want to go PCIe, there are NF4 based 754 boards coming out, so you can keep your chip, which BTW, the 3700+ is still a kickass chip.
9. and if you want to upgrade your chip, there will always be Turion! (which if you dont know, are LV a64's, along the same lines as the 35w aXP mobiles)
 
lithium726 said:
9. and if you want to upgrade your chip, there will always be Turion! (which if you dont know, are LV a64's, along the same lines as the 35w aXP mobiles)
Click to expand...
amen to that :D

also, when considering 754, having a cheap way to get 1mb of cache is what i think it's all about. buy a DTR, or even better yet, the 3400+ mobile.
 
arcanetripwire said:
This is kindof off topic, however is the Asus A8V a lousy overclocking board, or has anyone had good luck overclocking?

Just wondering
Click to expand...

I did OK with an A8V Deluxe 2.0. Got my 3500+ Winchester from 2.2 to 2.6 on air, 260 FSB, Prime95 stable for 11+ hours without any errors or warnings, 51C under load. But the MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum has a better rep for overclocking really high, and the new nForce4 boards appear to be monsters.
 
actually the nf4 board appear to suck right now.
dfi = sudden death syndrome
msi = 220mhz bug with winchester
asus = ram overclocking issues

:(



edit: note that this doesn't apply to all boards. just enough to make me worried ;)
 
well i have an asus a8n-sli deluxe with winnie 3000+ (rest is in sig)
i have been able to push it up to about 2508 mhz prime stable. i have crappy ddr3200 ram and was able to push it up to ddr4000 at one point. i can get the proc up to about 2700 mhz windows bootable . asus isnt bad, the winnies arent bad, so theres my 2 cents
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top