3930K or Haswell for 3D rendering?

loafer87gt

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Messages
440
I was planning on holding out for Ivy Bridge E for my new rendering box, but there seems to be just one delay after another and I have pretty much come to the realization that we won't be seeing this processor anytime soon, with a possible release towards the end of the year. I was ready to pull the trigger on a 3930K build, but after reading the reviews of Haswell and some of the buzz on the forums I am wondering if it is foolish to buy into the dead 2011 socket. I know I will get jumped on for using an overclocked processor in a work environment, but I have never had an stability issues and figure it is a waste to pass up free performance as long as voltages and temperatures are all in a safe range. That being said, I am torn between how a 3930K overclocked would stack up to an overclocked Haswell in 3DSMax rendering. It seems that it is quite normal to see stable OC's in the 4.4 - 4.5 range with the 3930K using a good cooling setup, while the rumor mills are abuzz with stories of Haswell hitting impressive overclocks, even while undervolted. Some users here on HardOCP are even saying that 6 Ghz is going to be the standard overclock, with 7 + Ghz possible with better cooling. I personally find this hard to believe without seeing with my own eyes, but I don't have any inside information either.

So here is my simple math, provided Haswell is about 15% faster architecturally than Sandy Bridge, then 4 x 5Ghz overclocked x 1.15 for architectural efficiency = 23 Ghz computing power; whereas a 3930 K running 6 x 4.5 Ghz overclocked would give me about 26.4 Ghz of computing muscle. Things change quite a bit if any of the rumors of 6 + Ghz rumors are valid, however, when at this point the Haswell 4 core should be a match for the 3930K.

I guess this whole topic might be a waste of space as without knowing fully what Haswell is capable of, it is tough to provide any answers with a lot of guesswork. I guess what I am wondering, is I was going to pull the trigger on my 3930K build this afternoon, but now I am really hesitant after reading about the possible overclocking power of the Haswell platform.

Should I continue my wait and hang onto my QX6700 a bit longer?
 

Tsumi

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Mar 18, 2010
Messages
13,551
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1039751003&postcount=15

Things are not that rosy with 12 threads. When that 3D rendering application would be efficient, the results would be the same as the above, VERY minimal improvement.

Stop posting your misinformation everywhere. Seriously. Stop. Now. Your single benchmark is not indicative of all the software out there, and every professional review of normal software that people use shows HT improving performance.

Edit:

OP... you really.. REALLY need to read up on how CPUs work. Ghz doesn't add up.

Also, Haswell is not overclocking to 6 ghz on normal cooling. Maybe 5.5 ghz on watercooling, but 6? Hell no. Unless Intel managed to pull off some miracle (not going to happen). There is absolutely no way Haswell can make up for a deficiency in core count for multithreaded applications.
 
Last edited:

brutalizer

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Oct 23, 2010
Messages
1,600
Sure, GHz does not add up. Example: IBMs POWER6 cpu running at 5GHz is very inefficient. You need 14 POWER6 cpus, to match four SPARC T2+ cpus running at 1.6GHz in official SIEBEL v8.0 benchmarks. You do the math, 14 POWER6 cpus @ 5GHz vs four SPARC T2+ @ 1.6GHz.

But, remember those are different architectures. Adding up GHz on the same architecture and comparing say, Ivy Bridge vs Haswell who are siblings, is quite ok I think. They are so close and do the same work. But in this case, 26GHz vs 24GHz does not say anything, it is almost the same number. The difference is within the error margins.
 

DejaWiz

Fully [H]
Joined
Apr 15, 2005
Messages
21,589
Do you have the budget for a dual LGA2011 setup? Perhaps start with one quad core Xeon and add another in the future?
 

loafer87gt

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Messages
440
Stop posting your misinformation everywhere. Seriously. Stop. Now. Your single benchmark is not indicative of all the software out there, and every professional review of normal software that people use shows HT improving performance.

Edit:

OP... you really.. REALLY need to read up on how CPUs work. Ghz doesn't add up.

Also, Haswell is not overclocking to 6 ghz on normal cooling. Maybe 5.5 ghz on watercooling, but 6? Hell no. Unless Intel managed to pull off some miracle (not going to happen). There is absolutely no way Haswell can make up for a deficiency in core count for multithreaded applications.

Thanks for all the info guys! The reason I "added up" the Ghz was because from everything I have read, Haswell is not a radical departure from it's predecessors, and early previews it peg it about 10 - 15% faster clock for clock. I tried to take this into account with my simplified computing power calculations.

As the X79 / 3930K platform is mature and proven, I am going to go down that road and see what Haswell E has to offer later in 2014. Hopefully when Haswell is finally released, I don't end up regretting my decision. Either way, it should be noticeably quicker than my current QX6700 system.
 

Araxie

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Feb 11, 2013
Messages
6,453
Go with the 3930K for sure... You said, still people are waiting for ivy bridge E, so you can imagine how much can late any haswellI-E, not matter how much good will be haswell... 39X0 (K or X) will be still better... That will be a HUGE performance boost over your QX6700..
 

BatJoe

Gawd
Joined
Apr 4, 2012
Messages
836
Go with the 3930K for sure... You said, still people are waiting for ivy bridge E, so you can imagine how much can late any haswellI-E, not matter how much good will be haswell... 39X0 (K or X) will be still better... That will be a HUGE performance boost over your QX6700..

Ivy E isn't expected until September. I wouldn't wait that long for at best 10% performance increase and the possibility of a hotter CPU.
 

loafer87gt

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Messages
440
System is ordered! This is what I ended up going with:

Asus P9X79 Pro motherboard
i7 3930K
Corsair Vengeance 32GB Quad Channel kit
Corsair Hydro Series H100i cooling
Corsair HX 750 Powersupply
Corsair Carbide 500R case
2 x Galaxy GTX 670 OC
Crucial M500 960GB SSD
2 x 2TB Western Digital Black storage drives
4TB External Western Digital
Bluray / DVD burner combo
Windows 8 Pro

Should be here within a week. As this is my first water cooled build, I hope I don't have too much difficulty figuring out how to connect the H100i cooler. If anything, it looks easier than my Tuniq tower install though!

Will post some before and after benchies. I am hoping for at least a two fold speed increase.
 

BatJoe

Gawd
Joined
Apr 4, 2012
Messages
836
As this is my first water cooled build, I hope I don't have too much difficulty figuring out how to connect the H100i cooler. If anything, it looks easier than my Tuniq tower install though!

The Hydro Series is easy to install on LGA2011. No backplate is required for the install.

I would have recommended the H80i. It actually has slightly better performance than the 100i due to its thicker radiator.

Otherwise, you made the right choice with the 3930k.
 

tonyftw

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 21, 2013
Messages
1,817
System is ordered! This is what I ended up going with:

Asus P9X79 Pro motherboard
i7 3930K
Corsair Vengeance 32GB Quad Channel kit
Corsair Hydro Series H100i cooling
Corsair HX 750 Powersupply
Corsair Carbide 500R case
2 x Galaxy GTX 670 OC
Crucial M500 960GB SSD
2 x 2TB Western Digital Black storage drives
4TB External Western Digital
Bluray / DVD burner combo
Windows 8 Pro

Should be here within a week. As this is my first water cooled build, I hope I don't have too much difficulty figuring out how to connect the H100i cooler. If anything, it looks easier than my Tuniq tower install though!

Will post some before and after benchies. I am hoping for at least a two fold speed increase.
It is very easy to install and great choice on the 3930k!
I would have recommended the H80i. It actually has slightly better performance than the 100i due to its thicker radiator.
Outside of anandtech, every other review has the 100i as being better.
 

rive22

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 10, 2004
Messages
4,646
The thing about Haswell is the AVX2. I don't know if 3dsmax utilizes it, but a couple of the programs I use on the 3770k that use AVX1 get a tremendous speed boost.

Either way, congrats on your new rig! new builds are always exciting :D I don't think you can go wrong with a 3930k at this point. It's a beast.
 

The Cobra

2[H]4U
Joined
Jun 19, 2003
Messages
2,976
I do rendering with 3DStudioMax, Maya3D and Adobe Premier/After Effects. Dual-Proc systems are no faster than a single 6 core CPU. Plus, overclocks and the above mentioned apps do not play well sometimes, ESP Maya3D. I will get a system freeze when I have my home system cranked up above 3.8Ghz. All of the above mentioned apps will chew thru a processor with multiple threads.

I use an HP 620 workstation with an 8 core Xeon running at 2.4Ghz at work, and I get wonderful performance out of it compared to some of the DP workstations that we have.
 

loafer87gt

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Messages
440
Looks like I have to wait a bit as the Crucial M500's are back ordered about a week and a half. Will be interested in seeing what sort of gains I see from the new machine once it arrives!
 

clownshoes

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 10, 2012
Messages
192
I'd go with the 3930k. It doesn't sound like Haswell will be much faster than the current Ivy Bridge chips. The additional 2 cores of the 3930k really shine with heavily multithreaded applications such as rendering. Additionally, when the Ivy Bride-E chips are released you can throw your 3930k on ebay and pick one up if you want the performance boost (all the current 2011 motherboards should support Ivy Bride-E with a bios update).

Edit: Sorry, didn't see that you already purchased the system. Anyway, I'm using an h100i to cool my 3930k and it works great. It's easy to install and runs silent. Be careful when you screw into the radiator though. It strips VERY easily.
 
Last edited:

shetu

Weaksauce
Joined
Jul 23, 2010
Messages
120
Great system.
I think using few render node will be helpful for speed up render time.
 
Top