360 or PS3?

[FMX]

Calm down Azn... up until your posts everything was going smooth and people wasn't trying to start a fight .If you'd just take a minute to think about what he meant you might not of posted that. He most likely meant the G25 beats the Microsoft Wheel (since Logitech's 360 wheel isn't as good as the MS one) but the G25 he is saying, is better to him than MS's wheel.

Warhawk is the only good game? Please... have you played any games on the PS3? Surely you havn't played Uncharted. There's no way.

I love how an OP starts threads like these and doens't even come back to read what people have said and post about it. 2nd poster was right, in that he had his mind made up!

On another note, people REALLY need to stop bringing games up as a strong factor on the 360.

Ok, the 360 has... Halo 3 and GOW... Those are the TWO MAIN games that people praise all the time and actually have replay value. I don't consider Bioshock an amazing exclusive because it has poor replay value (no online). Bioshock isn't even exclusive. Now, both systems have COD4 and both systems will have UT3. Look at 2008... 360 doesn't have jack crap coming to it. PS3 is where 2008 is at. That said, I own BOTH systems and I am not biased to either one of them... I simply tell it as it is.

Online MP? Live is better... you can't disagree. More people are on it, and that is it's biggest perk. Its easier to communicate with your friends on it, imo. Also, while ive never played any PS3 game online ive seen games like Resistance and it shows SONY in everyone's name... WTF IS THAT? I hope thats not in COD4.

Right now though if you were buying a new system and had to pick one first (regardless if you were gonna get the other later on) I would say PS3 if you want to watch Blu-rays and have the option for more space. If you don't care about all that, then go 360 and I am pretty much saying that just because of Gears of War. But if you have a PC capable, and care nothing about Halo 3... Then I don't see a big reason to get a 360.

All that said ... Get BOTH! Seriously it sounds like alot of money but its really not. Set aside some money for both and eventually you'll have them both! Anyone with a JOB I am confident can have a 360 and PS3.

 

[Roufuss]

I love how an OP starts threads like these and doens't even come back to read what people have said and post about it. 2nd poster was right, in that he had his mind made up!
.

Haha, I've seen so many of these on [H] that it's easy to predict how they will turn out

If we just ignore them, they will go away!

Anyone with half a brain can do their own research on the two systems and decide which one is better for them, there is never a point to these open ended threads where people somehow can't decide which of the two systems better suits their lifestyle.

 

[Exar Jun]

The systems are nearly the same in power. You just need to decide what you want to do on it. Xbox is more proven for online gaming. With the BR probably killing HD DVD soon, PS3 will have an advantage there.

Just look at the games, and put the controllers in your hands. That is a big one for me. I just don't like the PS3 controller in my hands.

 

[Tigerblade]

(And, dammit, TigerBlade, could you possibly be a bigger Sony fanboy? Just look at that sig! )

Totally OT but glad you like my home theatre setup! May look like I prefer Sony but they represented the best value for money when I came to buy. Tell me where I can get a a 55" 1080p tv with the quality the sxrd has for less than £900 in the uk? You can't. Tell me where I can get a DTS amp/multi region DVD player + 5.1 speaker setup for less than £60? You can't. If I was a fanboy, I wouldn't own a Panasonic Viera Plasma or an Apple I-Mac would I? A Nintendo Wii and 2 DS's? Sony fanboy? Nahh

The SE p1i isn't the best phone out there but it's a damn site better than the POS Nokia n95 I used to own!!

When combined, the userbase for UT3+Warhawk is about 15% of Halo 3 by itself.

I won't argue with that but they are still popular for the network. CoD4 (which I like how you ignore ) is insanely popular, shown by the shambles of the double XP weekend and subsequent server region split. One thing I do wish they'd do with that game is add rumble, would add so much to the experience imho, but that's by the by

 

[erwos]

I don't think anyone is suggesting the PS3 is an order of magnitude more powerful. But from my reading, the consensus amongst experts is the PS3 has more potential. Sony certainly proved how far they push HW last generation. One of the lead engineers at IBM stated Cell may offer up to 2.5x the real world performance of Xenon. Since they designed both, I'll take their word for it.

Well, you asked for it.

The PS3 has four fundamental hardware disadvantages:
1. The Cell is bitch-hard to program for compared to Xenos. (And don't argue with me about this, I know more about real-time multi-threaded programming than any of you are likely to (I wrote soft-real-time guidance sims for NASA)).
2. The GPU is not as good as the one in the 360.
3. The memory is hard-divided into 256mb for graphics and 256mb for the system, versus the 360's more flexible allotment of 512mb to where-ever you feel like it.
4. The BR-D drive is not that fast compared to the 360's DVD drive.

Of those, number one is the biggest problem for the PS3, yet it's probably the most overlooked when it comes to fanboys arguing about consoles. Compared to writing good multi-threaded code for Xenos, it is much, much more difficult. This is not a learning curve that can magically go away with a library or "more time" - it is radically different than SMP, and since it's unique to the Cell, it's not something taught in many CS programs (read: very few). Devs are starting with a huge disadvantage when writing PS3 code, and every new programmer they hire will need to be trained in how to use the Cell properly.

Same situation as the EE, really, except worse. At least the GPU is relatively familiar ground. I guarantee you this will haunt the PS3 for the rest of its life.

Number two matters, but I doubt it's a really huge problem right now.

Number three will bite the PS3 in the ass when it comes to writing memory-intensive stuff like MMORPGs.

I don't think number four is that big a deal, provided you're willing to force installs.

It has three fundamental hardware advantages:
1. The Cell, when given the right programming and very specific kinds of tasks, is much faster than the Xenos.
2. It can assume there's a hard drive present (which partially overcomes limitation 4).
3. The BR-D drive can store lots of information.

The Cell, when you give it nice streams of numbers to crunch that fit in each SPU's cache, will kill the 360. That doesn't happen that often, but when it does, it can be damned impressive. Unfortunately, the rest of the time, programmers will get more use out of Xenos, which is better in more generalized situations.

Two and three mean more game data can be present, but it seems this has mostly been used for localization so far. Remember that even the prettiest PC games fit all on one DVD disc. I suspect we'll see this become more important in the future, but remember: with only 512mb of RAM, there's only so much game data you can use at a time, even streaming off the HDD.

 

[Stereophile]

4. The BR-D drive is not that fast compared to the 360's DVD drive.

False.
BD reads at a constant speed across the disc. DVD is slower around the edge. Overall its faster with single layer and slower than BD on dual layer. Most X360 games are DVD-9.
I'm not sure about seek times, but that's the advantage of replicating data on BD games.

See this thread:

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=42157

Thanks for the rest of your insight.

3. The memory is hard-divided into 256mb for graphics and 256mb for the system, versus the 360's more flexible allotment of 512mb to where-ever you feel like it.

Maybe you can explain it to me. I'd read somewhere that using a unified memory pool causes some bandwidth issues since it's on the same bus ?

 

[Defective]

Warhawk is the only good game? Please... have you played any games on the PS3? Surely you havn't played Uncharted. There's no way.

I love how an OP starts threads like these and doens't even come back to read what people have said and post about it. 2nd poster was right, in that he had his mind made up!

On another note, people REALLY need to stop bringing games up as a strong factor on the 360.

Ok, the 360 has... Halo 3 and GOW... Those are the TWO MAIN games that people praise all the time and actually have replay value. I don't consider Bioshock an amazing exclusive because it has poor replay value (no online). Bioshock isn't even exclusive. Now, both systems have COD4 and both systems will have UT3. Look at 2008... 360 doesn't have jack crap coming to it. PS3 is where 2008 is at. That said, I own BOTH systems and I am not biased to either one of them... I simply tell it as it is.

The level to which you understated the 360's game library is amazing. No Forza 2? Dead Rising? Mass Effect? Crackdown?

Also, be careful about saying the 360 doesn't have anything comng in '08. Microsoft hasn't been promoting it's 08 line up while Sony's titles have recieved alot of press. Banjo-Kazooie 3, Alan Wake, Fable 2, Ninja Gaiden 2, are all supposed to come out next year. I think Microsoft is going to try and assault this year's E3. I'm not saying that they blow away Sony. I'm just saying that Microsoft is not empty for 2008.

You may own both systems, but you either have a limited range of games that you like or you just haven't done any reading.

 

[Kahnvex]

I won't argue with that but they are still popular for the network. CoD4 (which I like how you ignore ) is insanely popular, shown by the shambles of the double XP weekend and subsequent server region split.

totally OT, but the OP hasn't been back, so who cares right?

You guys got region split? Does that mean that you limeys can't play with us yanks any more?

One of my favorite aspects of CoD4 on the 360 is that when I'm up in the early am's playing, I get paired up with people from the UK, Austraila, and New Zealand quite a bit. The cultural exchange more than makes up for the lag, and the chat is always priceless.

Um, OT: My PS3 is my Blu Ray player, period. Oh, and Rampart. God I love Rampart.

I've got so many games to play on the 360 from 2007 right now I'm not even going to think about the PS3's upcoming titles, and, this doesn't get mentioned enough in my eyes, the controller sucks ass.

I have always hated the dual shock design and not using it for 2 years now, I absolutely do not miss it. The 360 pad fits my hand perfectly.

 

[aznknife]

Calm down Azn... up until your posts everything was going smooth and people wasn't trying to start a fight .If you'd just take a minute to think about what he meant you might not of posted that. He most likely meant the G25 beats the Microsoft Wheel (since Logitech's 360 wheel isn't as good as the MS one) but the G25 he is saying, is better to him than MS's wheel.

Warhawk is the only good game? Please... have you played any games on the PS3? Surely you havn't played Uncharted. There's no way.

I love how an OP starts threads like these and doens't even come back to read what people have said and post about it. 2nd poster was right, in that he had his mind made up!

On another note, people REALLY need to stop bringing games up as a strong factor on the 360.

Ok, the 360 has... Halo 3 and GOW... Those are the TWO MAIN games that people praise all the time and actually have replay value. I don't consider Bioshock an amazing exclusive because it has poor replay value (no online). Bioshock isn't even exclusive. Now, both systems have COD4 and both systems will have UT3. Look at 2008... 360 doesn't have jack crap coming to it. PS3 is where 2008 is at. That said, I own BOTH systems and I am not biased to either one of them... I simply tell it as it is.

Online MP? Live is better... you can't disagree. More people are on it, and that is it's biggest perk. Its easier to communicate with your friends on it, imo. Also, while ive never played any PS3 game online ive seen games like Resistance and it shows SONY in everyone's name... WTF IS THAT? I hope thats not in COD4.

Right now though if you were buying a new system and had to pick one first (regardless if you were gonna get the other later on) I would say PS3 if you want to watch Blu-rays and have the option for more space. If you don't care about all that, then go 360 and I am pretty much saying that just because of Gears of War. But if you have a PC capable, and care nothing about Halo 3... Then I don't see a big reason to get a 360.

All that said ... Get BOTH! Seriously it sounds like alot of money but its really not. Set aside some money for both and eventually you'll have them both! Anyone with a JOB I am confident can have a 360 and PS3.

Believe it or not, I do have a PS3 40GB. But I dont like it at all. I got it for free so I could care less, but I would never imagine my self buying it. I have played Uncharted, and it does not really impress me that much. UT3 is great, but its only a timed exclusive, so once again it will be better on 360 because of many more players. Right now my PS3 sits like a paper weigh next to my Elite.

 

[erwos]

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=42157

Replication erodes the space advantages of BR-D, though, which isn't a very fun price to pay - seek time when trying to stream off a disc in certain games. Interesting thread, I must say, and it does change the way I see the issue. However, I also pointed out very specifically that this wasn't really a serious problem in any case.

Maybe you can explain it to me. I'd read somewhere that using a unified memory pool causes some bandwidth issues since it's on the same bus ?

Depends on whether memory bus saturation is a real problem, and I've not seen that particular issue raised by devs. I'm guessing that this isn't as much of an issue as the _amount_ of memory, and where it can be used.

 

[Tigerblade]

You guys got region split? Does that mean that you limeys can't play with us yanks any more?

One of my favorite aspects of CoD4 on the 360 is that when I'm up in the early am's playing, I get paired up with people from the UK, Austraila, and New Zealand quite a bit. The cultural exchange more than makes up for the lag, and the chat is always priceless.

Indeed it does mean that, before the double xp weekend everything seemed to run fine on open servers so it seems a bit of a knee jerk reaction to me. Can't say I miss the 12 yr old Americans screaming like little bitches tho

I have played Uncharted, and it does not really impress me that much. UT3 is great, but its only a timed exclusive, so once again it will be better on 360 because of many more players. Right now my PS3 sits like a paper weigh next to my Elite.

Once again! Love it! Having more players doesn't make a game better in my book, if anything all the signs are pointing to the 360 version being the inferior version in terms of no kb/mouse, no user created content.

Not impressed by Uncharted? I'd hate to think what you think of the vast majority of other games on any other machine then I'm sure that Elite keeps you warm in bed at night tho......

What you should do is stop bitching and sell the fuckin thing to someone that'd appreciate it, everyone would be happier then

 

[Kahnvex]

Can't say I miss the 12 yr old Americans screaming like little bitches tho

I get some of those from your side of the pond when I'm on around 4-5am CST. I think being 12 and annoying is something thats coded into the age and not the country of origin.

Cheeky lil' fuckers too, some of em'