$304 Million Apple Austin Campus "In Peril"

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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Travis County, Texas commissioners have held up a proposed deal with Apple that would eventually employ 3600 workers in the proposed $304 million dollar operations center in Austin. The snag is over the initial approval of $35M in incentives package for Apple.

The county decided to take another look at the incentives offer after questions about the deal were raised by opponents at the Commissioners Court meeting on Tuesday.
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texas gives so many breaks to big companies. when i was working in Plano at a major financial software company, i was a block away from a gigantic HP headquarters, siemens, and a bunch of other companies.
 
Them headquarters provide jobs. Texas is a very business friendly state. They will give up some tax income if it means employing people. The Plano and Richardson area has tons of HQ's.
 
It is amazing how often the tax, land, environmental regulation, and other incentives offered to the big business far outstrip the dollars earned for stimulating the economy with the extra payroll.
 
That "business friendly" environment is a double edged sword. Lack of regulation means Texas has amongst the worst air and water in the nation (I won't talk about S. California, which is its own festering cesspool). They have the highest insurance rates in the nation due to lack of regulation. Salaries are near the lowest, but thankfully property costs are not as ridiculous as other areas of the U.S. Their schools are ranked at the bottom. I considered moving my company to Texas, but I honestly couldn't see myself living there. It would be like living in Bakersfield, CA...except a whole lot bigger. There were a few nice spots, but ultimately I decided the inconveniences of having a business California was balanced by living there.
 
andrewbub said:
texas gives so many breaks to big companies. when i was working in Plano at a major financial software company, i was a block away from a gigantic HP headquarters, siemens, and a bunch of other companies.
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So true. Amazes me how people still can't put two and two together and realize that higher taxes = lost jobs from companies relocating. Haven't they ever played SimCity?!

EchtoGammut said:
That "business friendly" environment is a double edged sword. Lack of regulation means Texas has amongst the worst air and water in the nation (I won't talk about S. California, which is its own festering cesspool). They have the highest insurance rates in the nation due to lack of regulation. Salaries are near the lowest, but thankfully property costs are not as ridiculous as other areas of the U.S. Their schools are ranked at the bottom. I considered moving my company to Texas, but I honestly couldn't see myself living there. It would be like living in Bakersfield, CA...except a whole lot bigger. There were a few nice spots, but ultimately I decided the inconveniences of having a business California was balanced by living there.
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Easy to sound right when you totally make stuff up.
 
I should start negotiating a tax deal with the city that I live in. After all, I do spend my money here. I wonder if they would take me seriously?
 
If Apple wants this to happen, it will happen.

The world's most capitalized company will trump government at will.
 
sleepeeg3 said:
So true. Amazes me how people still can't put two and two together and realize that higher taxes = lost jobs from companies relocating. Haven't they ever played SimCity?!

Easy to sound right when you totally make stuff up.
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Except there's almost always going to be somewhere cheaper than you. which is basically what has happened over the past decade or so where a lot of jobs have shifted all over the country, but the amount of new ones overall has been somewhat low. The idea that lower taxes are always the answer is just as bad as people saying that "corporate welfare" should be abolished, it's incredibly short sighted.
 
That "business friendly" environment is a double edged sword. Lack of regulation means Texas has amongst the worst air and water in the nation (I won't talk about S. California, which is its own festering cesspool). They have the highest insurance rates in the nation due to lack of regulation. Salaries are near the lowest, but thankfully property costs are not as ridiculous as other areas of the U.S. Their schools are ranked at the bottom. I considered moving my company to Texas, but I honestly couldn't see myself living there. It would be like living in Bakersfield, CA...except a whole lot bigger. There were a few nice spots, but ultimately I decided the inconveniences of having a business California was balanced by living there.
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Well, it is not perfect, but Texas is a nice state. I havce lied there my whole life and it is not near as bad as you make it out. The water and air are fine, in fact the water where I live is fantastic. The school problem is there, but that is due to the size. Big cities have poor schools in every state, and Texas has more big cities than most, thus more poor schools. The schools in most of the towns are great, as much as the public school system can be great. It also has a decent economy despite the nation being in a recession. It is one of the few states not in debt.
 
jctusmc03 said:
Lol, its ridiculous. Someone making $40k a year gets little to no tax breaks and multi billion dollar per year companies get huge tax breaks.
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When the $40k a year person creates hundreds of jobs and benefits the local economy you'll have an argument. There is a reason for giving huge companies tax breaks, it's a "please come here and pay some taxes rather than not be here and pay none at all."

You really can't compare the two at all.
 
Apple, why not stay in California? Do they only build in new locations where they get big tax breaks?
 
California government is dead broke, and they are giving Apple $30+ million in tax incentives? You have got to be kidding me.
 
jctusmc03 said:
Lol, its ridiculous. Someone making $40k a year gets little to no tax breaks and multi billion dollar per year companies get huge tax breaks.
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The average person making $40,000 per year generally contributes very little to their immediate society as a whole, at least with respect to the work he or she likely does for that $40,000 per year.

As for the typical $40k/year earner receiving no tax breaks? Not a chance. Have you not perused the list of potential deductions recently?
 
RyanR100 said:
California government is dead broke, and they are giving Apple $30+ million in tax incentives? You have got to be kidding me.
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No this is concerning the expansion of Apple's customer service center in Austin. The city of Austin, Travis County and the state of Texas are the ones considering the tax breaks. Travis County is the hold up.

These types of deals happen all over the country in an effort to create jobs.
 
Deadly Ramon said:
So letting companies keep more of the money that they earn is now considered giving them taxpayer money (welfare)? What a curious concept.
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:rolleyes:

Yes, when there is a law somewhere that you have to pay X tax, but you lobby for a sweetheart deal that you don't have to pay the same as everyone else, that's welfare.

If you're having real trouble with this I suggest accounting classes.
 
Brak710 said:
When the $40k a year person creates hundreds of jobs and benefits the local economy you'll have an argument. There is a reason for giving huge companies tax breaks, it's a "please come here and pay some taxes rather than not be here and pay none at all."

You really can't compare the two at all.
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They get huge tax breaks because they lobby and threaten they will go elsewhere.

It's an obvious race to the bottom, with bumbling public officials everywhere cooperating.
 
Aluisious said:
:rolleyes:

Yes, when there is a law somewhere that you have to pay X tax, but you lobby for a sweetheart deal that you don't have to pay the same as everyone else, that's welfare.

If you're having real trouble with this I suggest accounting classes.
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:rolleyes:

There must also be laws that provide for some state discretion in apportioning taxes, otherwise these sweetheart deals that you envy or otherwise loathe would be illegal.

I think that giving taxpayer money to the idle, rather than letting workers keep more of what they earn, is the actual welfare.

If you're having trouble with this, then I suggest that you put down The Communist Manifesto. It's quite understandable that a local government might find it beneficial to set aside its avarice for taxpayer funds for the greater good of decreasing the local unemployment rate.
 
This idea that there's no negative consequences to taxes is the biggest load of bull I've heard in decades.

Taxes on corporations have always been low because when you tax them too much two things happened. They just passed the cost onto consumers who faced with bigger expenses, buy less. The effect is unemployment.

Today, its a bit different. You tax a company, facing foreign competition, they'll simply start to go out of business completely. The 'owners' long before that moved their investments over to the foreign company. Hell, at that point they'll want you to tax the domestic company to make it die sooner so they can get their payoff from their foreign investment sooner.
 
Deadly Ramon said:
:rolleyes:

There must also be laws that provide for some state discretion in apportioning taxes, otherwise these sweetheart deals that you envy or otherwise loathe would be illegal.
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blah blah blah Communist Manifesto blah blah blah
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Either you're terrifically rich or you're a pawn. When the wonderful beneficent corps do not pay taxes, you're the one getting stuck with the bill. Pay it now or have the govt float a bond and pay it in twenty years, or enjoy leaving a city/county/state/country to your kids that has regressed to third world standards in education and public health. It's not about "letting people keep what they earn" (and a corp isn't a person anyway), it's about having bills that need to be paid but the people who should be paying them are bribing their way out of it. Stop drinking the kool aide.
 
Deadly Ramon said:
otherwise these sweetheart deals that you envy or otherwise loathe would be illegal.
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Wouldn't that be a god damned shame.

blah blah blah Communist Manifesto blah blah blah
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Either you're terrifically rich or you're a pawn. When the wonderful beneficent corps do not pay taxes, you're the one getting stuck with the bill. Pay it now or have the govt float a bond and pay it in twenty years, or enjoy leaving a city/county/state/country to your kids that has regressed to third world standards in education and public health. It's not about "letting people keep what they earn" (and a corp isn't a person anyway), it's about having bills that need to be paid but the people who should be paying them are bribing their way out of it. Stop drinking the kool aide
 
jpm100 said:
This idea that there's no negative consequences to taxes is the biggest load of bull I've heard in decades.

Taxes on corporations have always been low because when you tax them too much two things happened. They just passed the cost onto consumers who faced with bigger expenses, buy less. The effect is unemployment.

Today, its a bit different. You tax a company, facing foreign competition, they'll simply start to go out of business completely. The 'owners' long before that moved their investments over to the foreign company. Hell, at that point they'll want you to tax the domestic company to make it die sooner so they can get their payoff from their foreign investment sooner.
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More neocon brainwashing BS.

There are bills that need to be paid. Make a choice: you can have public education, a military, health care for the elderly, and pay taxes, or you can sit around and watch the USA turn into Somalia, a perfect bastion of libertarian freedom with no government and basically a blight on civilized society everywhere else. There is no third choice where we get a bunch of great services and no one pays for it.

Anyone who thinks that the middle class should pay all the taxes but the rich and corporations shouldn't is either an incredible sucker or a thief. And people who think the poor should take up the burden left by the rich are merely stupid.
 
Dominus Anulorunm said:
Well, it is not perfect, but Texas is a nice state. I havce lied there my whole life and it is not near as bad as you make it out. The water and air are fine, in fact the water where I live is fantastic. The school problem is there, but that is due to the size. Big cities have poor schools in every state, and Texas has more big cities than most, thus more poor schools. The schools in most of the towns are great, as much as the public school system can be great. It also has a decent economy despite the nation being in a recession. It is one of the few states not in debt.
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i don't know how smell relates to water quality, but the water in Plano smells like a wet towel
 
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