$3000 Titan AI

rabidz7

rabidz7

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RGT also tells us that the RTX 5090 will be a 48% uplift over the 4090, and the RTX 5080 will be around 29% quicker than the RTX 4080 Super. Similarly, the RTX 5070 will apparently be 26% faster compared to the RTX 4070 Super.
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Well, that's a lot less than everyone was expecting. We'll see if this holds true, but if it does it's a bit disappointing... well depending on prices, of course. If the prices aren't too steep, there's not much to complain about. But....
 
Depends on the VRAM of the Titan, and the price of the 5090. If the 5090 had an MSRP of $2500 with 28GB of VRAM, but the Titan released at $3000 with 48GB of VRAM with a 768bit bus, I would buy the Titan to have the top card. But if the 5090 is $1800, I'm not dropping an additional $1200 for 15% more game performance because I would see the 5090 as poorly priced. All assuming the Titan was compatible with the Game Ready Driver, yea 48GB of VRAM would be overkill, but I would imagine it having zero issues at 8K. With the way Nvidia stock has been over the past year, dropping $3000 on a new GPU wouldn't affect my living situation at all. It might be considered stupid money management though ;), not as dumb as buying a yacht though.
 
Depends on performance, price and availability (which could impact price). I'm looking at a 5090, but as others mentioned, if performance and price are in line, it may be worth it to get a titan.

Use case is key, tho. As a hobbyist/enthusiast, I don't make money running my local Llama 3 and stable diffusion model on my 3090Ti. But, it will get a 4090 when I make my next main system upgrade. So, a 5090 versus Titan could be of interest to me looking 3 years down the road, knowing I may use them for mostly gaming/rendering near term and AI/compute in the next stage of its life with me.

I can see professionals who make money with better gear eating these things up, for sure. So, we lowly enthusiasts may never get the chance.
 
wareyore said:
Depends on performance, price and availability (which could impact price). I'm looking at a 5090, but as others mentioned, if performance and price are in line, it may be worth it to get a titan.

Use case is key, tho. As a hobbyist/enthusiast, I don't make money running my local Llama 3 and stable diffusion model on my 3090Ti. But, it will get a 4090 when I make my next main system upgrade. So, a 5090 versus Titan could be of interest to me looking 3 years down the road, knowing I may use them for mostly gaming/rendering near term and AI/compute in the next stage of its life with me.

I can see professionals who make money with better gear eating these things up, for sure. So, we lowly enthusiasts may never get the chance.
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Go and get one! Moar firepower for the team, lol.
 
5090 for me. I'll match it up with the fastest CPU available next year.
 
Not sure why Nvidia would go back to releasing Titan GPUs when they didn't even bother with a 4090 Ti. Why sell a full Blackwell for "only" $3000 when you can put that same full die into an AI GPU for 2-3 times as much?
 
I've skipped all the other titans but I'm looking forward to finally getting one if this is true. Sign me up!
 
Sure, Nvidia may plan on a full die Blackwell Titan on the condition AI Blackwell chips are not sold out and no one wants to pay $40,000 for them. I would also think a full die Titan, even with 32gb would go more than $3000. While the professional version would come with 64gb. Looks possible but will wait and decide when reality hits. A slightly cutdown Titan I also think is more likely for failed 101 dies.
 
the occasional Topaz Ai upscale project comes along now and then i could def get behind this as mixed use for gaming / contract work. though to justify $3000 to wife :LOL:
 
Nvidia probably doesn't want to sell the 5090 let a lone a Titan for $3000. Just look at their earnings report and you can see that they will completely neglect the consumer market until AI demand dies down.
 
noko said:
Sure, Nvidia may plan on a full die Blackwell Titan on the condition AI Blackwell chips are not sold out and no one wants to pay $40,000 for them. I would also think a full die Titan, even with 32gb would go more than $3000. While the professional version would come with 64gb. Looks possible but will wait and decide when reality hits. A slightly cutdown Titan I also think is more likely for failed 101 dies.
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That has been more the H100 with HBM memory type of offer than the RTX 6000-L40 video card, the full version of the die 5090 used would be for the those cards replacement, the B100 gpu being again on 810mm die (or what the max is around now).

RTX 6000 ada and L40 class type tend peak around $10,000 I think.

I imagine they always work and try those (would it be just for fun or moreso to know the performance of a full die and have some notion of the diminishing return and where the sweet spot would be) every gen, be ready if AMD force them to release one, etc.., it has almost no link with will they release one or not.

I am sure a full 4090 was made and tested.
 
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Titan? I'll have to see price, perf and specs. If I get one it'll mean I convinced myself I'll use it to play around with AI stuff. It'll have to have lots of vram for that, like 64GB, otherwise it won't be enough better than a 5090. Then I'll proceed to just game on it. :D
 
As far as AI stuff, I wonder what the generation speed in Stable Diffusion of the new Titan will be vs the 4090. The 4090 is already quite fast. The 50 series better not have any forced limits on AI use, or otherwise they lose a lot of value for me in general. Not that Nvidia cares at the moment, with companies paying hand over first to get their cards in their workstations anyway.
 
The amount of money spent on a highly depreciating asset for the sole purpose of playing computer games is truly mind boggling! It's like crack but legal. Well unless you steal it. ;-)
 
StoleMyOwnCar said:
The 50 series better not have any forced limits on AI use,
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If they want to sell them intl and not get them banned, I am not sure how much they have a choice, a lot of 40 series are already being sold just because they are getting an exception.
 
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LukeTbk said:
If they want to sell them intl and not get them banned, I am not sure how much they have a choice, a lot of 40 series are already being sold just because they are getting an exception.
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Hmmm, 5090 maybe AI limited similar to the non Nvidia Crypto cards (that got breached anyways :D)? In order for Nvidia to sell them to China let say. Titan with a bigger price tag and maybe some more vram and less AI restricted? All speculation at this point.
 
noko said:
Hmmm, 5090 maybe AI limited similar to the non Nvidia Crypto cards (that got breached anyways :D)? In order for Nvidia to sell them to China let say. Titan with a bigger price tag and maybe some more vram and less AI restricted? All speculation at this point.
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If they do something like the mining limiter it'll probably be China, etc. only and not most of the rest of the world.

I can't imagine NV will gimp AI performance on desktop cards sold in the west. It's the hot thing right now. Qualcomm, AMD and Intel all have AI accelerators (TPUs) built into their latest/upcoming latop CPUs. Discreet GPUs are much faster. I can't imagine NV wants to walk out of a party that could make discreet GPUs relevant in work/office/etc. laptops and desktops. Push comes to shove NV will just do something like they did with Turing when they ripped out ray tracing and the tensor cores to make the GTX 1600 cards and make a China special. Maybe not this generation though. So far only the 4090 and a bunch of datacenter chips have been impacted. The 5080 might be, but if the leaks are correct it might not be or will be so close to the line they'll just cut it down a little.
 
zandor said:
If they do something like the mining limiter it'll probably be China, etc. only and not most of the rest of the world.

I can't imagine NV will gimp AI performance on desktop cards sold in the west. It's the hot thing right now. Qualcomm, AMD and Intel all have AI accelerators (TPUs) built into their latest/upcoming latop CPUs. Discreet GPUs are much faster. I can't imagine NV wants to walk out of a party that could make discreet GPUs relevant in work/office/etc. laptops and desktops. Push comes to shove NV will just do something like they did with Turing when they ripped out ray tracing and the tensor cores to make the GTX 1600 cards and make a China special. Maybe not this generation though. So far only the 4090 and a bunch of datacenter chips have been impacted. The 5080 might be, but if the leaks are correct it might not be or will be so close to the line they'll just cut it down a little.
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No idea what mine field Nvidia has to step over on this. If USA sanctions on this will change or will get modified. What if the AI performance of the 5080 is greater than the 4090, while being more vram limited unless modified with higher capacity modules. How can the same hardware be regional lock reliably while maintaining same game performance using AI? I could see the FTC potentially looking into Nvidia AI monopoly as another thought.
 
noko said:
Hmmm, 5090 maybe AI limited similar to the non Nvidia Crypto cards (that got breached anyways :D)? In order for Nvidia to sell them to China let say. Titan with a bigger price tag and maybe some more vram and less AI restricted? All speculation at this point.
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For the 5090 they could easily just forget the china market and not even try and give it all, but for the 5080 and under they could try to stay under the sanction limit which would be way lower than what they could do, specially if they would have launched 4 bits specialized acceleration stuff on those.

The 4080 for example has 390 FP8 TFLOPS for a 390 mm die, that a perfomence density (TPP/mm) of 8.2, way above the 6.0 limit TPP/mm², that did let it go for the 4080 and the 4090D, considering them both under the 4,800 raw power limit and not datacenter cards, but it is playing a bit with fire and I will imagine they will keep the 5080 just below the 4800 tflops limits like the 4090D.
 
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MistaSparkul said:
Not sure why Nvidia would go back to releasing Titan GPUs when they didn't even bother with a 4090 Ti. Why sell a full Blackwell for "only" $3000 when you can put that same full die into an AI GPU for 2-3 times as much?
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They don't *have* to sell this to the public. It's more of a contingency plan if AI demand goes down. The Nvidia also designed Titan skus for Lovelace including creating custom coolers for it; they just never needed to release it because AI and datacenter demand was so high this gen.
 
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And AMD did not release something challenging the 4090, we can Imagine Nvidia like the aura of always having the top GPU at all time if they can, cannot have a 6950xt matching the 3090 and not respond type of situation.
 
pippenainteasy said:
They don't *have* to sell this to the public. It's more of a contingency plan if AI demand goes down. The Nvidia also designed Titan skus for Lovelace including creating custom coolers for it; they just never needed to release it because AI and datacenter demand was so high this gen.
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Then I expect there to be no Titan next gen either. I don't think AI demand will go down any time soon and it's obvious that AMD has nothing in RDNA 4 that can even remotely touch a 5090.
 
MistaSparkul said:
that AMD has nothing in RDNA 4 that can even remotely touch a 5090.
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There a chance that when RDNA 5 launch the 5090 will still be Nvidia top dog and blackwell successor will be out on the pro-line, both are rumored and would make a lot of sense to be really quick turnaround (pro line will love to go on TSMC 2 or 3 and AMD to compete at the high end)
 
LukeTbk said:
There a chance that when RDNA 5 launch the 5090 will still be Nvidia top dog and blackwell successor will be out on the pro-line, both are rumored and would make a lot of sense to be really quick turnaround (pro line will love to go on TSMC 2 or 3 and AMD to compete at the high end)
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Ok but I wasn't talking about RDNA 5. And having a next gen AMD part to compete with an older Nvidia part isn't exactly impressive. RDNA 5 would need to be A LOT faster than a 5090 to be impressive and at that point not even a Titan Blackwell would be a competitor. I'm not going to speculate on what's after the 5090 because that's pointless right now.
 
LukeTbk said:
For the 5090 they could easily just forget the china market and not even try and give it all, but for the 5080 and under they could try to stay under the sanction limit which would be way lower than what they could do, specially if they would have launched 4 bits specialized acceleration stuff on those.

The 4080 for example has 390 FP8 TFLOPS for a 390 mm die, that a perfomence density (TPP/mm) of 8.2, way above the 6.0 limit TPP/mm², that did let it go for the 4080 and the 4090D, considering them both under the 4,800 raw power limit and not datacenter cards, but it is playing a bit with fire and I will imagine they will keep the 5080 just below the 4800 tflops limits like the 4090D.
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Yep, playing with fire when the restrictions can also change for the better or worst. Could be a mess too if AIBs migrate them to China anyways. Unless Nvidia will have AI performance restricted by decoupling units for gaming cards, as in designed laser cut points. Don’t know, but having a Titan with better AI would make it a class of its own for charging extra bucks and product segment with Nvidia the only one selling the cards. Becoming a pointless speculation now, Nvidia would be working with US Department of Commerce on this.
 
MistaSparkul said:
Ok but I wasn't talking about RDNA 5. And having a next gen AMD part to compete with an older Nvidia part isn't exactly impressive. RDNA 5 would need to be A LOT faster than a 5090 to be impressive and at that point not even a Titan Blackwell would be a competitor. I'm not going to speculate on what's after the 5090 because that's pointless right now.
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Yes, not sure how my message imply you were talking about RDNA 5 or anything being impressive, the message was simply that it could be that not only RDNA 4 matter if a titan is to be ever launch it possible that the 6090 series is only a 2027 card and the competition for the 5000s is rdna 5 and 6.

RDNA 5 would not need to be a lot faster than the 5090 (like you say than the Titan is irrelevant to be impressive and do not need to be impressive at all), it just need to be close say like the 6950xt with the 3090.

If a 5090Ti/Titan ever happen, it could be like the 3090TI, long after the initial launch and in reaction to something AMD launched.

Everything being said here is completely speculative, we have very little idea about the 5090 or RDNA 4.
 
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LukeTbk said:
Yes, not sure how my message imply you were talking about RDNA 5 or anything being impressive, the message was simply that it could be that not only RDNA 4 matter if a titan is to be ever launch it possible that the 6090 series is only a 2027 card and the competition for the 5000s is rdna 5 and 6.

RDNA 5 would not need to be a lot faster than the 5090 (like you say than the Titan is irrelevant to be impressive and do not need to be impressive at all), it just need to be close say like the 6950xt with the 3090.

If a 5090Ti/Titan ever happen, it could be like the 3090TI, long after the initial launch and in reaction to something AMD launched.

Everything being said here is completely speculative, we have very little idea about the 5090 or RDNA 4.
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We have a decent amount of information regarding RDNA 4 and the 5090 so I just kept speculation about a Titan BW based on that. I think speculation beyond the upcoming gen that's when you are entering uncharted territory. Just based on how RDNA 4 is looking I do not think we will see a Titan BW but if you want to include RDNA 5 in the discussion well of course idk what would happen then.
 
It's like throwing darts on board. Not so sure Nvidia will release it but for nostalgia sake maybe. Rtx 5090 seems to be slate for beginning of next year.
 
Night_Hawk-19 said:
It's like throwing darts on board. Not so sure Nvidia will release it but for nostalgia sake maybe. Rtx 5090 seems to be slate for beginning of next year.
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Or marketing reasons. Past Titans always seemed like halo/show off cards to me. Or maybe we're done with Titans now that they've figured out they can sell $1500+ cards in decent volumes. Still, I think we will get something a bit faster than a 5090 next round if the 5090 leaks are true, though it could easily be a 5090 Ti or Super as a mid-cycle refresh. The 5090 leaks/rumors claim it'll use 448 bits out of the 512 bits the chip supports for the memory bus. If that's true a full 512 is likely coming eventually. Of course they could make a 5090, 5090Ti, 5080Ti and a Titan all with that same chip. Titan 512-bit 64GB, 5090Ti 512-bit 32GB, 5090 448-bit 28GB and 5080Ti 384-bit 24GB. Different numbers of cores enabled on each of course.
 
I don’t see a use case for gaming on a $3,000.00 graphics card right now, because you know that inevitably the card will be obsolete in two years. We are at the tail end of a console generation as well, and you WILL start to see a step up in system requirements on the PC side, probably starting in 2-3 years, as consoles play catch up again. You don’t want to spend $3,000.00 on a card whose ray tracing capability and features will be dwarfed in two years or so. I submit there may be a time when a Titan makes sense, but not now.

The only scenario where that would make sense would be if Titan put minimum frames comfortably above a certain threshold, at a specific resolution, in a specific title, at max settings, and RTX 5090 did not.

Say for example, you love game X at 4K and want 120fps minimum. You know that if you hit that target, you probably are set for some years. I’d personally want to see frames well above 120 to shell out $3,000.00. Perhaps the Titan is worth it if will last you 3-4 years without worrying about the card.

On the other hand, what happens when you buy the $3,000 card and then in two years the 6090 is out and beats the Titan by 30% or whatever? That is not a good feeling.

Assuming every aspect of your system is impeccable, including top of the line oled display and peripherals, everything, room set up just the way you want it, and you still have money to burn, sure, go for it. I suspect for most that money is needed elsewhere.
 
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