2x120.1mm Rads vs. 1x120.2 Rad

cornelious0_0

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Just wondering what people's thoughts are on this topic.

I'm looking at starting (very) early planning for a project and am exploring my options. What I'm planning is setting up a watercooling setup using the Silverstone TJ08 mATX case.

As far as I can see it my options are either a 120.2 rad mounted on top of the case or a pair of 120.1 rads using the cases 120mm fan mounts. Aside from issues with flow restriction I just need to know if I'd really be shooting myself in the foot if I wanted to use the dual rad setup to keep everything internal. The case is so small that I don't see flow being a huge issue with a decent pump, just not sure if the cooling properties of say a pair of Thermochill 120.1's would be grossly inferior to a 120.2 of the same radiator.

There is still the chance that I'll get really adventurous and use a pair of 120.1's AND a 120.2 outside to cool the whole system but we'll leave that for another day. ;)
 

MrE

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When dealing with Rads, its all about surface area. The more surface area you have to cool, the more heat your Rad can handle. If you ran with a pair of 120x2's as opposed to running single 120x1's, you are allowing the water a better chance of heat dissipation. Where as running 120x1's, you'd need to run a high CFM fan for each Rad adding a lot of noise to compensate for the lack of surface area to cool.

What exactly will you be cooling in your TJ08? If its just the CPU and you aren't overclocking, then yes, you can get OK performance with a single 120x1 Rad. CPU/GPU, then 120x2 really is the best solution.
 

cornelious0_0

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What about if I found a creative enough way to make use of a top mounted 120.2 rad as well as two 120.1 rads using the two case fans...would I be gaining much cooling potential to make it worth it?

I would be transplanting my current system into the TJ08 along with whatever the best mATX board available at the time is, as this project may be drawn out for awhile.

I'd like to be able to watercool the CPU and GPU if possible.

I plan on replacing my Q6600 with a Q9450 which will bring down the heat load a bit but basically I'm looking at watercooling an overclocked Q9450 as well as a (potentially) overclocked HD4870.

With that in mind would I ideally need more then the single 120.2? I think it'd be kinda cool if I could get it work work (layout wise) with all three rads but if you think I'd be fine with the single 120.2 I can plan around that.

It would be nice if i could get away with using slower fans though so I might end up needing the extra rad or two...whatcha think?
 

MrE

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Well, you could run a single 120x2 to the CPU, go to the GPU, then run to a 120x2 and back to the pump/res. In other words, you have the largest rad before the CPU, and have the 120x2 act as an equalizer so you aren't dumping all the heat back into the res before running through the pump and back to the 120x2. You want to drop the water temp down as much as possible so you aren't storing up a lot of heat. The northbridge shouldn't be too too bad.

I'm actually running this setup now. I have my orientation as such: Pump -> 120x2 -> CPU -> GPU -> 120x1 ->Res back to the pump. I'm not WCing the northbridge (single fan) and heat on the Q9450 is 37c idle, GPU 32c idle. I'm running Yate Loons at 1200RPM with good results, but my case is the larger ATX variety so ventilation isn't a problem.
 

cornelious0_0

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Another question, do you think that the Apogee Drive with it's 330LPH pump would be enough to effectively make use of a 120.2 rad?

The TJ08 is small enough that if I can get away from needing a seperate pump it'd really clean things up and would probably persuade me to only use the single 120.2 rad and maybe just watercool the CPU.

Think the Apogee Drive would be enough for a CPU loop with a 120.2 rad?

Here's a link: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=199&products_id=22719
 

MrE

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The Apogee is using a modified MCP350 pump so, it should be able to handle it, but it will limit your tubing to 3/8" since the barbs are fixed to the block. I can tell you, the pump is very quiet, and there isn't a lot of heat dump from the pump from my experience.
 

cornelious0_0

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I'm really hoping it might work.

Thing is a part of me wants it to be a clean loop using the Apogee Drive and a single 120.2 rad for the CPU but the other side of me wants to setup an additional 1 or 2 120.1 rads and cool the GPU as well...dunno if I should do it nice and clean or take the extra time to try and create something that'll turn heads. :)

Looking at this picture do you think there'd be room to run tubing to and from blocks/pump/res/rads? I've outlined where the rads would be but I dunno how to layout the tubing and where the res/pump might fit.

251zz0.jpg


The top radiator is the 120.2 and would be raised up with the fans between the rad and the case, just didn't have room in the picture. The optical drive will be in the second bay and I'll probably have to use elbow joints to get around the drive but that aside what do you think? I know it'll be a challenge but I think that if I could pull it off it'd look pretty sweet, whether it be with the top 120.2 or all three rads.

I mainly need help trying to figure out where to place the pump/res as there isn't a lot of room once you account for the HD4870 being installed and reaching towards the front of the case.
 

cornelious0_0

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Beyond that I guess if you could recommend what res/pump might work best in that amount of space it'd be very appreciated.

EDIT: Think I could get away with watercooling an overclocked Q9450 and stock HD4870 with the single 120.2 rad with some faster fans?

EDIT: Actually might be possible to mount a 120.3 rad ontop...as long as the fans fit the worst that would happen is that the ends of the rad would hang over the front and back of the case a bit but I'd want the barbs pointing down in the back of the case anyways so it wouldn't really matter.

Sorry for rambling and bouncing back and forth with so many ideas but there's a lot running through my head and I wanna make the most of this (future) project.
 

cornelious0_0

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Alright...this is how it's gonna happen...120.3 rad up for the CPU/GPU. The rad will be raised up a half inch or so and the fans will be above the rad blowing down on it. This works out great because there is a space above the rear 120mm fan to cut out for the tubing to enter the case.

Overall I think this thing'll have a lot of potential, just gotta start picking up pieces one by one as I can.

There will be a new thread started when the time comes to start piecing things together, I just needed a place to get some thoughts out in the public.

Thanks MrE for your quick input but after some more serious consideration and time spent browsing around XS I've decided on the 120.3 setup.

If anyone else has any comments or suggestions I'm always open to listen so we might as well keep the thread open just in case. ;)
 

MrE

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Damn, that case is tight for space. You could go with a 120x3 on top, but you might lose both 5 1/4" bays. If you do go this route, keep us up to date on how this turns out. I'd really like to see if you can cram all that into this mATX case.
 

cornelious0_0

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Gonna be doing something like this:

25fu1.jpg


The rad would be raised up a half inch or so with the fans ontop of it blowing down. What type of fans do you think I could get away with with the 120.3 mounted externally?

Assuming I go with the 120.3 what fans/pump would be best in a case this small where there won't be a lot of tubing and the CPU/GPU being cooled?

I can't wait to get this thing started, definitely gonna add an aggressive look to this little mATX case! :D
 

MrE

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Well, for Fans, the Yates are hard to beat for performance/noise ratio. I'd recommend ordering them from Petra's as he seems to get the best hand picked Yates.

You really don't have room for a Res in that case, so it might be better to run a T line out for filling. Tubing with short runs might be tough because you don't want to kink when doing short tight runs. As far as pumps, if you went with your original plan for the Apogee block and run 3/8" tubing, it would fit. If you went with 1/2" tubing, then I'd recommend running with a DDC 3.1 pump maybe with a Petra top in conjunction with a nice D-Tek Fuzion CPU block and a D-Tek GFX2 GPU block. Either way this should be a nice setup what ever you choose. Keep us updated.
 

cornelious0_0

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I'll keep updates coming for sure, don't worry about that.

I'm not TOO worried about the tubing situation, as I ended up going with 7/16 tubing for a watercooled system I'm building for someone else and it actually has a LOT of flex to it before it starts to kink, should work out fine.

Only issue is gonna be the res, I'm thinking I might have to hang something external off the back of the case like this:

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=318&products_id=4529

Or better yet...a combo unit like this:

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=367&products_id=23047

Think the pump that comes with that combo would be strong enough?
 

MrE

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The pump specs claim Pump-performance: 750 lph. Seems highly unlikely since a DDC pump pushed 2 gallons per minute, or 454 lph, but I have no experience with this setup. The external res looks great in the first link. I've always liked cylindrical reservoirs.
 
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