nVidia: "We expected more from the Radeon 7900 series"

too bad Nvidia is once again well behind in getting its competing products out the door. at this point it does not matter if they will have the faster card if nobody will be able to buy it anytime soon.
 
Without hardware in hand and reviews to read, this is all PR spin. Think "Bulldozer".

Fact: AMD released the HD7970. It is a beast. It OC's like noone's business. It is top dog. Reviews and user's experiences are posted for all to read and make their own decisions. It is stocked.

Fact: Nvidia has no new card out in the public purview.
 
by the time kepler comes out AMD could already have the HD8k series out.. so yeah they can bitch and whine all they want but they don't have a single product that can compete with it on the market..

why do i have a feeling the next 6 months is going to turn into the same bullcrap fermi marketing.. oh oh look at us, we will talk shit about our competition and tell you what kepler can theoretically do but we don't actually have a product available..


c3k said:
Without hardware in hand and reviews to read, this is all PR spin. Think "Bulldozer"..
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yeah bulldozers marketing was pretty bad and also reminded me of the fermi marketing tactics as well.
 
c3k said:
Without hardware in hand and reviews to read, this is all PR spin. Think "Bulldozer".

Fact: AMD released the HD7970. It is a beast. It OC's like noone's business. It is top dog. Reviews and user's experiences are posted for all to read and make their own decisions. It is stocked.

Fact: Nvidia has no new card out in the public purview.
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for a next gen product, its not a beast at all. IMO overclocking is the only thing keeping it from being a total joke for a $550+ next gen card. and sadly not all of them can oc well. a couple of reviews could not even get to 1100mhz.
 
I sure hope this article is true. Just wish the release date wasnt so far away. My 560 Ti can handle almost anything I play. If any more games like BF3 come out an upgrade sure would be nice though. With this late of a release date like it sounds, the card should be faster. If AMD waited till nivida released their card im sure it would have been faster. Its all one big game.
 
We all know Nvidia will come out with something better. They're not going to release a card with equal or lesser performance than this generations current best. The question is when and at what cost. Nvidia has been releasing later and at higher cost than AMD for the last 3 years. Also Nvidia needs to take a tip from AMD, Power Consumption ≠ Performance. If they can release a card better than AMD at near the same or lesser cost then great. But don't charge $650 for a card that sucks up 600w per GPU for only 15% gain.
 
AMD/Nvidia has had staggered releases since the beginning of time it seems and you guys are acting like this is something new. AMD's card that just shipped is only slightly faster than Nvidia's that shipped what, a year ago? And you guys are dogging on Nvidia.
 
bigdogchris said:
AMD/Nvidia has had staggered releases since the beginning of time it seems and you guys are acting like this is something new. AMD's card that just shipped is only slightly faster than Nvidia's that shipped what, a year ago? And you guys are dogging on Nvidia.
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Why do you people keep saying slightly faster? The 7970 so far has blown away the GTX580.
 
NickJames said:
Why do you people keep saying slightly faster? The 7970 so far has blown away the GTX580.
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Then when the 6 series Nvidia launches it will "blow away" the 7970, then the 8000 series AMD will "Blow away" the Nvidia 6 series. Get it?:rolleyes: Staggered releases....
 
NickJames said:
Why do you people keep saying slightly faster? The 7970 so far has blown away the GTX580.
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no it hasn't. it beats the gtx580 by just over 20% at 1920 with 4x AA. that's a JOKE for a next gen card. on top of that its $550-$600 which is more expensive than the previous gen gtx580 which was already a horrible value.
 
Eh now I know why I don't post in this section. Blind fanboyism going on in here. I'm out.
 
cannondale06 said:
no it hasn't. it beats the gtx580 by just over 20% at 1920 with 4x AA. that's a JOKE for a next gen card. on top of that its $550-$600 which is more expensive than the previous gen gtx580 which was already a horrible value.
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Flagship cards are usually at that price, it's nothing new.
 
NickJames said:
Eh now I know why I don't post in this section. Blind fanboyism going on in here. I'm out.
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yeah that must be it.

here is a tip for you though...nearly every person here would be saying the same thing if Nvidia released a card just like the 7970.
 
BOOOGER!!!

Whatever, new card, released a bit early to get in some hype and sales before nvidia comes in with their answer. Who is to say that amd will not release a refresh in that time?

Anyway, early adopters got a somewhat faster card for a premium. Good on you. The card doesn't suck and some of them are pretty damn fast.

I am waiting for the settle down before I mosey down the hill to pick out my new girl.

You have heard of the parable of the old bull and the young bull looking down the hill at a bunch of cows right? Yeehaw!
 
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cannondale06 said:
no it hasn't. it beats the gtx580 by just over 20% at 1920 with 4x AA. that's a JOKE for a next gen card. on top of that its $550-$600 which is more expensive than the previous gen gtx580 which was already a horrible value.
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http://www.hardocp.com/images/articles/1325889231KTNbsOX8Vr_7_1.gif

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130751

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131452



Green goggles, makes you blind to all those links.

That is the performance comparison overclocked, the lowest priced 580 3GB and the lowest price 7970 3GB.
 
cannondale06 said:
and AGAIN I can post links so showing just over 20% difference using way more games than what Hard did.
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When you dont overclock the cards at all, which they have way more potential for OC than any card previous except some 460's.

And still, the price is exactly the same, new better tech == price to the older slower tech, not more expensive, EXACTLY THE SAME.
 
cannondale06 said:
yeah that must be it.

here is a tip for you though...nearly every person here would be saying the same thing if Nvidia released a card just like the 7970.
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no they wouldn't.. Nvidia is a god just like Intel, nothing they do could be wrong, nothing they do could be bad.. ahem, GTX 400 series.. total piece of garbage series, but nope it some how was still the greatest thing ever created and the fact that it used an asinine amount of electricity compared to the HD5k series while just barely being faster then it meant absolutely nothing.

i mean for fuck sakes the fact that people are bitching and crying about AMD's pricing on the 7970 is fact enough that as long as its AMD they will bitch about something, but if it was Nvidia they wouldn't say a dang thing other then its a great price.. look at the GTX 580 3GB.. thats proof alone with its original 600+ price tag it was the greatest thing since sliced bread and not a single person complained about the price. hell even the GTX 580 1.5GB when it was over 500 dollars, no one complained. but no AMD releases a card that beats both of them by 20%+ and prices it 50 dollars lower then the GTX 580 3GB and 50 dollars more then the GTX 580 1.5GB and all hell breaks loose about AMD being satan for pricing their crap to make a profit while being competitive. but of course the GTX 580 3GB hasn't dropped in price and no one complains about it at all. if you can't see that as a problem then you are blind to reality dude.

cannondale06 said:
no it hasn't. it beats the gtx580 by just over 20% at 1920 with 4x AA. that's a JOKE for a next gen card. on top of that its $550-$600 which is more expensive than the previous gen gtx580 which was already a horrible value.
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oh really.. 20% faster then a GTX 580.. lets see last i checked, it was 20% FASTER THEN AN OVERCLOCKED GTX 580 3GB CARD WHEN IT WAS STOCK. sorry dude but you should of stopped while you were still ahead. go check your numbers against a STOCK GTX 580 3GB and 1.5GB and come back with some better facts next time.. not to mention this is a comparison of a new architecture vs an architecture that has already reached the end of the line for optimizations. fermi was a total joke when it came out and didn't even start to show its true potential for another 4-6 months after it was released. maybe instead of complaining about why AMD did this or didn't do that you should be looking at why Nvidia seems to screw up so much when it comes to an architecture change and the fact all of a sudden they magically have a problem with GK100 right before AMD released their 7970 which happened to be the exact same thing with the GF100 right before the 5k series was released. in my opinion that says a lot more behind fermi and kepler then the bs they are spewing about the 7970 not meeting their expectations.

cannondale06 said:
and AGAIN I can post links so showing just over 20% difference using way more games than what Hard did.
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ok go find us some links where reviewers actually tested a HD7970 vs a stock clock GTX 580 1.5GB and 3GB card and it has to be from a legitimate review site.
 
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Sounds like the 5870 days all over again. NV just needs to put up or shut up, IMO. Talk is cheap, release Kepler already.

Same thing happened with 5870. 5870 released, ATI takes performance crown. NV makes the fight dirty by making exaggerated claims on the internet about how GTX 480 would be 3x faster, meanwhile GTX 480 is released 7 months later and is 15% faster. Whatever NV, whatever. I'll buy Kepler if its good but just shut up and release it.
 
Revdarian said:
When you dont overclock the cards at all, which they have way more potential for OC than any card previous except some 460's.

And still, the price is exactly the same, new better tech == price to the older slower tech, not more expensive, EXACTLY THE SAME.
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and when reviews oced the gtx460 to compare to AMD cards, the AMD boys cried foul. lol, sometimes you guys crack me up but if you want to spend 550-600 bucks on the 7970 then I am sure AMD will appreciate it. they need the money and if Nvidia is going to take this long then they deserve to lose sales to AMD.
 
sirmonkey1985 said:
no they wouldn't.. Nvidia is a god just like Intel, nothing they do could be wrong, nothing they do could be bad.. ahem, GTX 400 series.. total piece of garbage series, but nope it some how was still the greatest thing ever created and the fact that it used an asinine amount of electricity compared to the HD5k series while just barely being faster then it meant absolutely nothing.

i mean for fuck sakes the fact that people are bitching and crying about AMD's pricing on the 7970 is fact enough that as long as its AMD they will bitch about something, but if it was Nvidia they wouldn't say a dang thing other then its a great price.. look at the GTX 580 3GB.. thats proof alone with its original 600+ price tag it was the greatest thing since sliced bread and not a single person complained about the price. hell even the GTX 580 1.5GB when it was over 500 dollars, no one complained. but no AMD releases a card that beats both of them by 20%+ and prices it 50 dollars lower then the GTX 580 3GB and 50 dollars more then the GTX 580 1.5GB and all hell breaks loose about AMD being satan for pricing their crap to make a profit while being competitive. but of course the GTX 580 3GB hasn't dropped in price and no one complains about it at all. if you can't see that as a problem then you are blind to reality dude.
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nonsense. I most certainly complain if Nvidia does something similar. plenty of people have complained about the poor value of the gtx580. heck if you actually pay attention that's why many of us are bitching about the 7970. for a next gen card the 7970 is not much faster then a card that was already a very poor value of the previous gen.

heck I bitched about the ridiculously priced 8800gtx and release prices for the gtx280/gtx260 too.
 
PR fail, desperate attempt to stay in the limelight. Talk is cheap nVidia, makes you look like a tool without anything to back it up. Get your card out there and beat the Radeon, give us a choice as to where to spend our $. Save face and clamp it until then...
 
This is a joke. Nvidia "expected more" from a product that beats the pants off its flagship, while they are struggling to bring another late, rushed, overpriced, and likely electrically inefficient product to market.

Those idiots should leave the politics to the professionals.
 
cannondale06 said:
and when reviews oced the gtx460 to compare to AMD cards, the AMD boys cried foul. lol, sometimes you guys crack me up but if you want to spend 550-600 bucks on the 7970 then I am sure AMD will appreciate it. they need the money and if Nvidia is going to take this long then they deserve to lose sales to AMD.
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It was OC 7970 standard vs oced 580's on HardOCP's review.

And well, you crack everyone up buddy.

ALSO you forget that the 460 in question was a special edition. Not something readily available, and the links i put are the average 7970 overclock one, not the special HardOCP got, because those haven't been achieved by everyone (although by a healthy ammount of peeps).
 
I hate when people say "not to mention", but then go on to mention whatever it was anyways. Grammar issues, you have them.

Oh, and all this speculation over an article is a waste. Hardware is what we need, not more speculation and smoke & mirrors crap. Nvidia better drop some samples in peoples hands for review. I can only imagine that AMD is not sitting around twiddling their thumbs. By the time Keplar releases I'd lay money that AMD has something ready that will compete.
 
Revdarian said:
It was OC 7970 vs oced 580's on HardOCP's review.

And well, you crack everyone up buddy.
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yes we know the 7970 oc well. AGAIN I have said over and over that's the only thing that makes the 7970 not a complete joke for a 550-600 buck next gen card. look at other reviews though because its quite sad when a stock next gen 7970 can barley beat a poor value card from last gen.
 
cannondale06 said:
yes we know the 7970 oc well. AGAIN I have said over and over that's the only thing that makes the 7970 not a complete joke for a 550-600 buck next gen card. look at other reviews though because its quite sad when a stock next gen 7970 can barley beat a poor value card from last gen.
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If you look at the OC review on this very site the 7970 beats an *overclocked* GTX 580 by 50-79% in some of the tests. At stock the 7970 is 20-25% faster, but it pulls away when oc'ed by a ton.

High end GPU's are without exception a poor value. Its like a top end sports car. You don't buy the best looking for value. If you want value get a 7950 or GTX 570. Period. Don't get me wrong -- I love NV and still use them, and still own my 580s from yesteryear. However, they are the ones that started the precedent of ridiculously priced GPU's. 8800ultra, GTX 480, etc.
 
xoleras said:
If you look at the OC review on this very site the 7970 beats an *overclocked* GTX 580 by 50-79% in some of the tests. At stock the 7970 is 20-25% faster, but it pulls away when oc'ed by a ton.

High end GPU's are without exception a poor value. Its like a top end sports car. You don't buy the best looking for value. If you want value get a 7950 or GTX 570. Period.
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if ALL reviews reflected that then you would have a point. the fact remains that no other site came close to having that big of difference when testing a wide selection of games. in fact the 7970 was slower than the stock gtx580 in a couple of cases on xbits review.

and it looks like the 7950 will be very pricey too so I do not see that as being a value card by an means. the only reason I got the gtx570 was because it was just 260 bucks plus it came with Batman AC.
 
cannondale06 said:
nonsense. I most certainly complain if Nvidia does something similar. plenty of people have complained about the poor value of the gtx580. heck if you actually pay attention that's why many of us are bitching about the 7970. for a next gen card the 7970 is not much faster then a card that was already a very poor value of the previous gen.

heck I bitched about the ridiculously priced 8800gtx and release prices for the gtx280/gtx260 too.
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so again like i've said multiple times, bitch at and about Nvidia for their shitty prices and not AMD. if Nvidia wants to use ridiculous prices then why shouldn't AMD which its priced between both cards and out performs them. only a moron would price the card considerably lower then the only competition they currently have right now. you and people just like you seem to think its AMD's job to give hand outs to people, it doesn't work like that. you price your products in comparison to your competition. they have tried the undercutting the competition route when it came to pricing, people were still willing to spend the extra 100+ dollars on a nvidia card for a 10% performance gain.. theres no reason to keep doing that as long as there are people willing to pay those stupid prices. so again, the problem is Nvidia and the idiots willing to pay Nvidia's stupid price premiums not AMD.

hell i don't even know why i bother with this.. 90% of the people that complain about the price don't even have enough common sense to look at it as a business and instead insist on looking at it as an ignorant consumer..




cannondale06 said:
if ALL reviews reflected that then you would have a point. the fact remains that no other site came close to having that big of difference when testing a wide selection of games. in fact the 7970 was slower than the stock gtx580 in a couple of cases on xbits review.

and it looks like the 7950 will be very pricey too so I do not see that as being a value card by an means. the only reason I got the gtx570 was because it was just 260 bucks plus it came with Batman AC.
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yup and all those sites that found it slower were using retardedly low settings and not even remotely coming close to using half or more of the 3GB of vram.. so yeah lets benchmark a card but instead of actually pushing the card to find its limit we will continue to use our garbage generic 4xAA and 16xAF benchmarking system that has existed for the last 12 years.. seriously, every site that has found the 7970 lower then 20% of the GTX 580 has used that stupid system and it doesn't work anymore. most of the performance gains of current cards has more to do with the fact that they DON'T lose performance the more AA you throw at it and unless you do so you don't even notice the performance difference.. go look at the AA numbers for the 7970 and even the GTX 580 3GB. the one advantage both cards have is that the percentage of performance lose between 2xAA 4xAA 8xAA is very minimal. thats what makes the biggest difference. not the fact that the card can do 200fps in some stupid game that no one would even bother running 200fps, but the fact that it could do 50-60fps while using an insane amount of AA where the older generation cards can't.
 
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LOL...NV fan boys butthurt cuz their precious cards are no longer the fastest. waaahhhhh their only 10,20,30,40,50,60,70% faster in xyz game at xyz resolution with xyz AA......blah, blah ,blah.
 
fps4ever said:
LOL...NV fan boys butthurt cuz their precious cards are no longer the fastest. waaahhhhh their only 10,20,30,40,50,60,70% faster in xyz game at xyz resolution with xyz AA......blah, blah ,blah.
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grow up. MOST people bitching still buy or recommend AMD cards too.
 
cannondale06 said:
yes we know the 7970 oc well. AGAIN I have said over and over that's the only thing that makes the 7970 not a complete joke for a 550-600 buck next gen card. look at other reviews though because its quite sad when a stock next gen 7970 can barley beat a poor value card from last gen.
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Its "quite sad" that nvidia doesnt have an answer to the 7970, OC'ed or not.

I think the most important thing to realize about the 7970 is that there is some untapped potential in their new architecture. The OC 7970 beats the brakes off of the 580.....

Ill believe nvidia when i see it....until then , nvidia can hold that "L".
 
Stock clock comparison here on the 580. Lots of good stuff.

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1327450545TTJicZSb5S_8_2.gif
 
"Radeon HD 7970 may be the leader of the pack right now, but it didn't quite bring the performance upgrade we are accustomed to during generation shifts."

i think everyone can agree with this. dont know why nvidia bother to say such things because unless they screw up big time kepler should definitely be faster. all this did was give them bad pr and bring the hate from the amd boys.
 
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