Rylan
Gawd
- Joined
- Jul 23, 2011
- Messages
- 937
My wife came home to her laptop automatically installing Windows 10 on Friday. Nobody was home to accept any prompts for the installation.
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WADR, I find this hard to believe. You likely accidentally mashed a confirmation box you didn't realize. I've dealt with several computers re the Win 10 upgrade, and it is NOT an automatic step. in fact there are SEVERAL steps that require user intervention, including the scrolling and agreeing to the EULA.
I'm calling bullshit as well. While Win 10 will auto download the update if you have everything enabled. It absolutely will NOT auto install. There are multiple prompts for the install to happen. I get that people don't like Win 10 and MS certainly hasn't helped that. I am getting more than a little tired of all the absolute FUD and outright bullshit being posted though.
This is kind of the antithesis of automatic.Sure, I suppose at that point there's an EULA that has to be agreed to, but as a fairly basic computer user in his mid 60's, he doesn't really know that there's an option NOT to click OK when all he wants to do is start his work day and check email on his computer.
This is kind of the antithesis of automatic.
I don't blame Microsoft for users who don't read the screen before them, age or attention paid included.
My wife came home to her laptop automatically installing Windows 10 on Friday. Nobody was home to accept any prompts for the installation.
This is kind of the antithesis of automatic.
I don't blame Microsoft for users who don't read the screen before them, age or attention paid included.
But it appears that no matter what MS had done it wouldn't have worked. YOU told him not to upgrade and he still did. If he's not going to listen to YOU, why would he listen to ANYTHING MS said?As far as he knows though, once you upgrade to a new version of Windows, there's no going back. That's the reality that he's lived in until now (as upgrades have historically been a one way trip to the new version or a BSOD) - he would associate clicking "no" with potentially messing something up or not being able to do anything with his computer until the whole thing could be redone.
Yes, Microsoft is covering their rear end with mice-type, but no, they're not being fair how they are going about socially engineering folks to upgrade to Windows 10, especially those that will lose critical functionality as a result of the upgrade.
Which is not what anyone is claiming.Yes blame the victim. "LOL you can click Upgrade Now or Upgrade Tonight, you had a choice! LOL"
But it appears that no matter what MS had done it wouldn't have worked. YOU told him not to upgrade and he still did. If he's not going to listen to YOU, why would he listen to ANYTHING MS said?
But
Look, unless you guys are claiming that MS is sending out special executables ONLY to some people where the update installs automatically, it's just not automatic.
If WIN10 ends up on someone's computer that doesn't want it, PEBCAK. Pure and simple.
I wouldn't be so dismissive. It seems like >something< happened recently to spawn the topic direction in this thread, this high participation thread on reddit titled "PSA: Windows 7 computers are being reported as automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade without permission." and I've seen some friends of friends on Facebook complaining about the same thing.Look, unless you guys are claiming that MS is sending out special executables ONLY to some people where the update installs automatically, it's just not automatic.
If WIN10 ends up on someone's computer that doesn't want it, PEBCAK. Pure and simple.
I moved all my computers to Win 8.1 Enterprise just to stop getting the stupid Win 10 update prompts.
I wonder how many Win 10 upgrades were done, where the customer just wanted to get rid of the prompts. Like how many Win 10 upgrades were legitimate customers who wanted it.
Citation required.Nobody needs to claim anything when MS already admitted that automatic installs are happening in some cases.
WADR to Reddit, i give the masses there about as much credit as a cheeseburger.I wouldn't be so dismissive. It seems like >something< happened recently to spawn the topic direction in this thread, this high participation thread on reddit titled "PSA: Windows 7 computers are being reported as automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade without permission." and I've seen some friends of friends on Facebook complaining about the same thing.
I wouldn't doubt that Microsoft is really pushing to upgrade all their computers.
NO!Look guys. There are multiple reported cases of Windows 10 automatically installing without consent. You can do a 3-second search on google and validate these findings. Good grief! Here, let me help you... you know... because it was SO hard... LOL
My wife came home to her laptop automatically installing Windows 10 on Friday. Nobody was home to accept any prompts for the installation.
NO!
Look, even back, DURING THE FIRST FEW DAYS of Windows 10 availability, when the optional update was checked,(which was, iirc, fixed within a week):
1- If you don't review the optional updates, that's on you, YOU clicked "Install" on those updates.
2- The process STILL required user intervention during the course of the update and could be cancelled at multiple points.
Again, with all the dumbass users that I've worked with (friends and family), those that I have told NOT to upgrade have successfully avoided it. And all I told them was, "Don't upgrade when Windows asks you to." Apparently they were capable of figuring out how to do that. And windows 10 has never "automatically" installed for any of them.
So, no, Windows 10 is not "automatically" installing. And it never has.
Actually, yes. Like I said, unless there is some evidence that MS is sending out multiple versions of the update (some that "automatically" install and some that don't), then those 20 people reflect the same update that EVERYONE received. If someone can give me evidence that there is an update out there that automatically went through the Windows 10 installation process without requiring a EULA agreement and the other click-through boxes I've hit on every single Windows 10 install I've ever done, then I'm more than willing to hold MS accountable for hat kind of crap.So your limited audience of people (5? 10? 20?) gives valid proof that no machine in the world has ever automatically installed win10?
So you expect us to research each and every single update?
They never have. And yea, I kind of hate it that the updates within the Windows Update app don't give specific changelog like descriptions of what they do, but let's be real honest here, the number of people that would actually READ them if available would be negligible.Give me a break. Microshaft doesn't even put the info in the updates themselves. You have to do research to find out. And even then they don't explain it in clear English. Just this last batch of updates... they didn't even release the information on what they did until AFTER everyone's computers had already updated!!! (The second day after release!)... Really?!
Still doesnt stop the fact that it auto downloads the installer on your pc without any notification. And it has happened to me a few times. Happened when the first time this shit show of an update cycle happened and then again this time around. And no i didnt install any updates and i run the DWS utility that uninstalls and hides all annoying updates. Somehow though the 5583 update became unhidden and wanted me to install it again. Nice try MSActually, yes. Like I said, unless there is some evidence that MS is sending out multiple versions of the update (some that "automatically" install and some that don't), then those 20 people reflect the same update that EVERYONE received. If someone can give me evidence that there is an update out there that automatically went through the Windows 10 installation process without requiring a EULA agreement and the other click-through boxes I've hit on every single Windows 10 install I've ever done, then I'm more than willing to hold MS accountable for hat kind of crap.
But no such evidence exists.
And you don't have to go through every install. Just one. Find me ONE Win 10 update file/installer that does it automatically. Just one.
They never have. And yea, I kind of hate it that the updates within the Windows Update app don't give specific changelog like descriptions of what they do, but let's be real honest here, the number of people that would actually READ them if available would be negligible.
The nature of this conversation provides proof: people clicked on and agreed to the Windows 10 update (likely multiple times!) without reading it. I mean, hell, the Ars article from your link shows what the update screen looked like:
If people were incapable or uninterested in reading the TITLE of the update, what makes you think they would read a more in-depth description?
Well, hell. That's not the same thing as automatically installing Windows 10 AT ALL. And many devices do that these days. All Apple products do. Android lets you choose the time and date for the download, but it nags the shit out of you do do so. It's essentially SOP for the industry.Still doesnt stop the fact that it auto downloads the installer on your pc without any notification. And it has happened to me a few times. Happened when the first time this shit show of an update cycle happened and then again this time around. And no i didnt install any updates and i run the DWS utility that uninstalls and hides all annoying updates. Somehow though the 5583 update became unhidden and wanted me to install it again. Nice try MS
Well, hell. That's not the same thing as automatically installing Windows 10 AT ALL. And many devices do that these days. All Apple products do. Android lets you choose the time and date for the download, but it nags the shit out of you do do so. It's essentially SOP for the industry.
But that is NOT automatic installation.
Actually, yes. Like I said, unless there is some evidence that MS is sending out multiple versions of the update (some that "automatically" install and some that don't), then those 20 people reflect the same update that EVERYONE received. If someone can give me evidence that there is an update out there that automatically went through the Windows 10 installation process without requiring a EULA agreement and the other click-through boxes I've hit on every single Windows 10 install I've ever done, then I'm more than willing to hold MS accountable for hat kind of crap.
But no such evidence exists.
And you don't have to go through every install. Just one. Find me ONE Win 10 update file/installer that does it automatically. Just one.
They never have. And yea, I kind of hate it that the updates within the Windows Update app don't give specific changelog like descriptions of what they do, but let's be real honest here, the number of people that would actually READ them if available would be negligible.
The nature of this conversation provides proof: people clicked on and agreed to the Windows 10 update (likely multiple times!) without reading it. I mean, hell, the Ars article from your link shows what the update screen looked like:
If people were incapable or uninterested in reading the TITLE of the update, what makes you think they would read a more in-depth description?
Download != Install. I'm not sure how much clearer I can be.Again, you ignored the reports of multiple instances of automatic updates in a google search. I guess we are done here. Keep your hand over your eyes.
I personally have witnessed WIndows 10 downloading itself multiple times on the same computers in my own house. I guess you would probably call me a liar on that if it never happened to your ~20(?) people. If you haven't seen something personally, it never happened to anyone? hahaha
I have worked in IT for 20+ years and have managed environments of 20,000+ computers. You can't pull one over on me.
Download != Install. I'm not sure how much clearer I can be.
And MS fixed the optional update checkbox back in October... Microsoft says it will no longer check Windows 10 upgrade option by default in Windows Update
I still maintain that if a computer is upgraded to Windows 10, it's because the user instructed it to be. David_Schroth, fwiw, I can remember multiple times that optional updates have been offered and checked in the past. Driver updates etc (usually networking)...
I think downloading a 3GB folder unbenounced to me is kind of shitty, granted i have fast internet so i didnt notice it. But my boot drive is a smaller SSD and thats where it store the WindowsBT folder. I dont want that shit on there so why download it for me. And the sad thing is, if i didnt have hidden folders shown i would have never noticed it.Well, hell. That's not the same thing as automatically installing Windows 10 AT ALL. And many devices do that these days. All Apple products do. Android lets you choose the time and date for the download, but it nags the shit out of you do do so. It's essentially SOP for the industry.
But that is NOT automatic installation.
Can't agree more. Auto-downloading stuff that size sucks, and has screwed me on my work iPhone several times now.I think downloading a 3GB folder unbenounced to me is kind of shitty, granted i have fast internet so i didnt notice it. But my boot drive is a smaller SSD and thats where it store the WindowsBT folder. I dont want that shit on there so why download it for me. And the sad thing is, if i didnt have hidden folders shown i would have never noticed it.
Did... did you miss the part where I pulled an image from an article several items down on your linked google search. And mentioned that's where I pulled it from?I think downloading a 3GB folder unbenounced to me is kind of shitty, granted i have fast internet so i didnt notice it. But my boot drive is a smaller SSD and thats where it store the WindowsBT folder. I dont want that shit on there so why download it for me. And the sad thing is, if i didnt have hidden folders shown i would have never noticed it.
I mean, hell, the Ars article from your link shows what the update screen looked like:
If people were incapable or uninterested in reading the TITLE of the update, what makes you think they would read a more in-depth description?
I didnt accept any download though, even that screen grab that shows windows 10, i right clicked and hid that. I actually did that when this shit happened the first time. I also have auto updates off, i only have it set to check but i choose what to download and install. Also when this crap first happened i removed all the updates that cause it, namely the 5583. I installed DWS Lite which removes and hides those updates including the GWX panel. Everything was fine for a while then i saw articles about Win 10 auto installing again and then a day or two later i saw the GWX panel again and sure enough the WindowsBT folder was there. Unless they are hiding it in another update or something then idk how it got on there. I ran the DWS tool again and then deleted the WindowsBT folder and i havent had problems since then. But its only a matter of time they do this again to bump adoption rates so they can show investors how fast people are upgrading to win 10.Can't agree more. Auto-downloading stuff that size sucks, and has screwed me on my work iPhone several times now.
Did... did you miss the part where I pulled an image from an article several items down on your linked google search. And mentioned that's where I pulled it from?
No, I read a few of the links and I understand what happened completely. And I've referenced it several times here: MS set the box to autocheck for like the first week and then reverted it (several places they claimed it was a mistake, I think we can speculate as to whether it was a PR or a coding mistake). Anyone unlucky enough to have auto-updates checked AND in the first wave of updates (a small number) AND left their computers in the correct state would have received it. Again, that was by THEIR decision. They explicitly told MS to give them ALL THE UPDATES, no matter what when they set those settings.
But even then, that's such a minute number of people that it just doesn't apply to these sweeping claims of automatically-installing Windows 10 upgrades. Don't fall for the tech echo chamber on the internet. A few loud people can cause a real rukus where no problem exists.
So... it sounds like you are upset with a third party program's inability to block the update? I'm not sure how this is MS's fault, nor how this constitutes an automatic installation. As MS finds bugs in the update, they are going to roll out new versions of it. That's a GOOD thing. So DWS tool wasn't written to deal with that. I don't think that's MS's problem.I didnt accept any download though, even that screen grab that shows windows 10, i right clicked and hid that. I actually did that when this shit happened the first time. I also have auto updates off, i only have it set to check but i choose what to download and install. Also when this crap first happened i removed all the updates that cause it, namely the 5583. I installed DWS Lite which removes and hides those updates including the GWX panel. Everything was fine for a while then i saw articles about Win 10 auto installing again and then a day or two later i saw the GWX panel again and sure enough the WindowsBT folder was there. Unless they are hiding it in another update or something then idk how it got on there. I ran the DWS tool again and then deleted the WindowsBT folder and i havent had problems since then. But its only a matter of time they do this again to bump adoption rates so they can show investors how fast people are upgrading to win 10.
I've referenced it several times here: MS set the box to autocheck for like the first week and then reverted it (several places they claimed it was a mistake, I think we can speculate as to whether it was a PR or a coding mistake).
Why would I know? But from every indication on every search I did, that is exactly what was done.Then why is the checkbox on my daily driver still checked every time I load Windows Update?
But all of the articles date back to October of last year, AND the situation was predicated upon you registering for the update when the pop up first appeared on systems.As part of our effort to bring Windows 10 to existing genuine Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 customers, the Windows 10 upgrade may appear as an optional update in the Windows Update (WU) control panel,” a Microsoft spokesperson told VentureBeat. “This is an intuitive and trusted place people go to find Recommended and Optional updates to Windows. In the recent Windows update, this option was checked as default; this was a mistake and we are removing Windows 10 from Windows Update for users that have not reserved a copy of Windows 10.
Did... did you miss the part where I pulled an image from an article several items down on your linked google search. And mentioned that's where I pulled it from?
Its not really a program that actively blocks the updates, it more or less and automation program that uninstall and hides updates and adds IP's to the host file. I have hidden and uninstalled the 5583 update, yet it still comes back and last week i got the option to install windows 10. I know that if i had automatic updates turned on i would have windows 10 on my machine without me asking. If there was a bug fix for an update wouldn't you think they would release it as a new KB and not the same one?So... it sounds like you are upset with a third party program's inability to block the update? I'm not sure how this is MS's fault, nor how this constitutes an automatic installation. As MS finds bugs in the update, they are going to roll out new versions of it. That's a GOOD thing. So DWS tool wasn't written to deal with that. I don't think that's MS's problem.
That said, I think I've been clear that I am not a fan of companies automatically downloading updates, particularly new OS revisions, without asking as it chews through disk space on what can sometimes be small storage devices.
Why would I know? But from every indication on every search I did, that is exactly what was done.
But all of the articles date back to October of last year, AND the situation was predicated upon you registering for the update when the pop up first appeared on systems.
This is what I mean: Do you see how many things the USER had to do to cause any of these possibilities to happen?
I beleive its still random, but i think they released something that unhides the KB5583 update which allows the download and install if windows 10. I have automatic updates off and when i did a scan i saw that update was available and so was the option of installing windows 10 and sure enough i had the GWX panel and the windowsBT folder on my pc without me allowing anything....The automatic update of Windows 10 seems extremely random from what I have been experiencing. I wonder what set of prerequisites causes this to happen. Yes, it is random because otherwise, everyone single eligible computer would have had it occur already.
WADR, I find this hard to believe. You likely accidentally mashed a confirmation box you didn't realize. I've dealt with several computers re the Win 10 upgrade, and it is NOT an automatic step. in fact there are SEVERAL steps that require user intervention, including the scrolling and agreeing to the EULA.
Remember, the revert option has been pretty well recieved, so you don't have to go through the reinstall, AND I think, you won't get any more nags...I have been closing those nag screens for months now. Pretty SOP for running the machine anymore. I promise no popups were visible on the screen or were clicked on naively. I will concede that an accidental click or enter is plausible. The game froze first, and I assumed that the update caused the freeze, but maybe the freeze happened and the enter or click was accepted on a popup window hiding behind the frozen game. I haven't heard of enters or clicks working like this though.
To the "several steps that require user intervention" No. There were none. I didn't confirm anything, and I didn't configure anything. When I turned my computer back on it kept on upgrading and only AFTER windows 10 was installed did it give me the option to accept or decline the EULA.
Damage was done at that point. I accepted the ELUA and I am now running Windows 10. If I like it, it will stay. Otherwise, I will just install windows 7 again.