Thermaltake Black Widow 850w vs. ToughPower 775w - which to keep?

C

cokeburglar

n00b
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
8
hi - haven't kept up on PSUs in a bit and making a new build, first build in about 3 years:

Asus P8P67 deluxe
2600k
Radeon 6870
16gb ripjaws
Antec Kuhler
CM HAF 922

is the basics + a bunch of little things.

Not a big gamer, just wanted a more powerful system.

I saw the black widow 850w for about $65 AR @ newegg the other day, so that sounded like a great deal so i jumped on that.

Then I was reading how many preferred the toughpower series to the black widows, and saw a TP 775w for about $47 after all is said and done @ Tigerdirect, so I figured might as well grab it and sell the other.

Which would you recommend keeping? Not going to be doing heavy duty gaming but might add another video card down the line as needed.

Thanks in advance from this board n00b ;)
 
cokeburglar said:
Not a big gamer, just wanted a more powerful system.

I saw the black widow 850w for about $65 AR @ newegg the other day, so that sounded like a great deal so i jumped on that.

Then I was reading how many preferred the toughpower series to the black widows, and saw a TP 775w for about $47 after all is said and done @ Tigerdirect, so I figured might as well grab it and sell the other.

Which would you recommend keeping? Not going to be doing heavy duty gaming but might add another video card down the line as needed.

Thanks in advance from this board n00b ;)
Click to expand...


I checked TD..no 775w toughpower for $50. For that price, it's probably a TR2, like the black widow you have and which I am currently using.

The TR2s are not well reviewed for good reason. I have had the misfortune of having two TR2s...I had a 600W TR2 years ago that failed...the RMA also failed. There are negative reviews on the net about the Black Widow also...dying as soon as fifteen minutes after install...to months or a year before it fails.

My black widow is now barely..and I mean barely keeping my i5 system running at all stock speeds. I can't even OC my video card bc it causes crashes. I played with settings for weeks to find the "sweet spot" if you can call it that, to keep it running stable. Otherwise, it will not BSOD, it will just hard shut-down, it seems, when it starts pulling more watts than the power supply can handle. I have yet to see a BSOD with my i5 system so I am guessing the hard shut-downs can only be power supply-related. RAM tests ok with Memtest and Memtest 86 and is compatible with my motherboard.

When the black widow was in my OEM HP build, I thought it was failing bc it started crashing and BSOD...turned-out it was the motherboard, which HP fixed. I continued to use it in the HP until recently..when I built my aforementioned i5 system.

OCCT reads the 12V line at under 6v, as does Hardware monitor. Not sure if this is a misreading or not...but when the black widow was in my HP, the reading was around 11.8V. It's either slowly failing or the i5 set-up is pulling more watts, causing it to fail.

I am guessing it will last for a few more weeks until I have the scratch to get another power supply, probably a EA 650 or Corsair enthusiast series 650 TX2, which can both be had under $90 dollars.

If you are not gaming and not running a video card that will pull 250+ watts, you might be okay with either that you have chosen...but if you are gaming with a strong video card...my advice would be to steer clear.

Also, the positive reviews you hearing about the "toughpower" series are the well regarded and far more expensive Toughpower XT TPX series. The 775w version of which is on New Egg for $120 bucks after $35 dollar discount.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153127
 
Last edited:
spacing guild said:
I checked TD..no 775w toughpower for $50. For that price, it's probably a TR2, like the black widow you have and which I am currently using.
Click to expand...
The only 775W Thermaltake PSU is the 775W Toughpower XT.
spacing guild said:
OCCT reads the 12V line at under 6v, as does Hardware monitor. Not sure if this is a misreading or not...but when the black widow was in my HP, the reading was around 11.8V.
Click to expand...
It's reading wrong. Your computer would not function at that voltage.
 
@ spacing guild:

Software/BIOS voltage readings are rarely anywhere near accurate. In fact, software readings can be off by as much as 50% to 75% from their nominal ratings (meaning that the software/BIOS reading of the +12V rail can be as low as 3V or as high as 21V even though the actual voltmeter readings of that same rail in that same system is actually out of spec by only 0.1 to 0.2 V).

@ cokeburglar:

I'd strongly recommend keeping the (CWT DSG-based) ToughPower XT 775W. The Black Widow 850W is actually just a black-painted edition of the really crappy TR2 RX 850W. Currently-manufactured revisions of the latter are based on a craptastic HEC platform that's barely capable of outputting 500W without getting the voltages and ripple out of spec. Early-production versions of the TR2 RX 850 (and the Black Widow 850) that were manufactured prior to 2010 were based on an early revision of the CWT PSH platform that had voltage regulation problems above 600W.

And based on the performance and quality of the Black Widow/TR2 RX 850W, the $65 AR price is still too high for what turned out to be just another mediocre-quality 500W PSU.
 
Last edited:
E4g1e said:
@ spacing guild:

Software/BIOS voltage readings are rarely anywhere near accurate. In fact, software readings can be off by as much as 50% to 75% from their nominal ratings (meaning that the software/BIOS reading of the +12V rail can be as low as 3V or as high as 21V even though the actual voltmeter readings of that same rail in that same system is actually out of spec by only 0.1 to 0.2 V).
Click to expand...

I know this already. I don't have a multimeter. Thanks, tho.


Zero82z said:
Because I do.
Click to expand...

Well prove it. What if my system is running exactly as it's reported? How would you know it's impossible?
 
6V on the 12V line would totally murder everything on that rail, the big ticket items being the videocards. If somehow at that voltage the cards managed to function it would likely trip over-current protection, as you would need to double the amperage to power things (or just blow up the PSU). But the weak potential difference of 6V would likely never even be able to reach that point anyway.

That's why Software is notorious for being a poor gauge of voltage readings. You need to pick up a multimeter to do any real kind of testing.

@OP -- As other people have stated in this thread, the black widow is reviewed horribly, the TR2 series is considered a very poor line of supplies and something you shouldn't trust any system you care about to. Not all Toughpowers are the same, the Toughpower XT and Toughpower Grand are good, other toughpowers... vary.
 
spacing guild said:
I checked TD..no 775w toughpower for $50. For that price, it's probably a TR2, like the black widow you have and which I am currently using.
[/url]
Click to expand...

It's a Toughpower XT:
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6624663

Same exact model that's currently listed as discounted @ newegg for $120.

My shopping & math skills managed to get it so low - here's how I got it down from the originally listed $99.99 price:


Tigerdirect:

1 HILIGHTER,SHARPIE,2PK,YEL $1.79 $1.79 (filler item to get it over $100, to use $10/$100 coupon:
1 T925-2426
Thermaltake Toughpower XT 775w Power Supply $90.19 $90.19
Net Product: $101.98
Sales Tax: $0.00
P & H: $0.00
Total Discount (minus): -$10.00
Total Shipment: $91.98

paid via ebillme which gives you 20% cashback on Tuesdays and Thursdays, so that knocks off about $18.39 from the PSU = $73.59 - $30 rebate = $43.59 + some freebie sharpies to fill out the rebate form :D

I'm also a member of their "free shipping" club ($40/year) which is why there is no postage charge (else it woulda been about $7) since I often order things on a whim that I see as a bargain, then figure out to do with it later - hence me having 2 new PSUs.


So since it's the XT and NOT a TR2, I probably definitely should keep this one rather than the Black Widow is what I am gathering from y'all, correct? Thanks everyone, and especially thx to E4g1e for breaking it down for me simplisticly. :D
 
Last edited:
spacing guild said:
Hey nice! :eek:

Man, I would be all over this. Rebate ends 5/31? I hope so...I'm in if it's still up when I have money later this month. I don't know why I didn't find this when I searched before...oh wells.
Click to expand...

Yeah, just be sure to use payment via Ebillme at checkout and order on a Tuesday or Thursday. Paying with ebillme (basically they sent you a e-bill, and you go into your bank account & pay a bill directly with that) gives you 10% cashback (max $20), but on Tuesday and Thursdays, it's doubled to 20% (still max $20).

So it's best to break up your orders into ~$100 increments, so you can get the max $20 back per order.

And Tigerdirect had a $10 off $100 coupon if you signed up for their mailing list (I don't know if it's there now because I can't get it to appear, but clean your cookies first) - when you go to the site, hopefully a popup appears for the email list signup & coupon.

If you don't get the coupon, it still works out to ~$60 when all is said and done with shipping, rebates, & cashback, which is still half of newegg's "discounted" price.

There's a TON of great deals that can be had @ Tigerdirect with Ebillme. I'm waiting til this Tuesday to grab a pair of 1.5tb WD Caviar Black Sata3 drives, which should end up at ~$75 each with the Ebillme deal. ;)
 
I'm pretty sure that 12V feeds some transistors, if not directly, then through a voltage divider. If you don't have enough voltage to drive the VCC of your power management IC's, stuff just isn't going to work. I.E you need to maintain a certain voltage for your current mirrors to provide the proper amount of current.
 
zaxour said:
I'm pretty sure that 12V feeds some transistors, if not directly, then through a voltage divider. If you don't have enough voltage to drive the VCC of your power management IC's, stuff just isn't going to work. I.E you need to maintain a certain voltage for your current mirrors to provide the proper amount of current.
Click to expand...
+12V feeds almost everything.
 
Thanks for the tip OP. Just got the 775w XT for $70 after rebate @ Tiger. Looking good so far. Seems like a nice unit. :)
 
WRX STI said:
Anything under 11.2v and your computer will keep restarting.
Click to expand...

lol it was kinda doing that @ 12.22v... my former power supply the lovely 850w Black Widow is a piece of junk. I'd love to blow it up...but I guess it will serve as a back-up emergency power supply.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top