24" Widescreen CRT (FW900) From Ebay arrived,Comments.

Rock&Roll said:
Unkle Vito (he's on these forums) is one source for one pre calibrated

Or there's acurate IT selling "refurbs" which means they've been slapped on bench, tested if they work, and had a quickie calibration done to them. http://www.accurateit.com/details.asp?iid=468
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What do you mean by "calibration" in this context?

I'm dreaming of the idea of an Eyefinity setup with this monitor as the centerpiece (and two 24" LCDs for the sides -- the true "have your cake and eat it too" gamer config). Currently planning my budget accordingly - hopefully AccurateIT or other places have this thing in a few months from now.
 
Let me give you my take on the monitor.

I just got one, and it really is an awesome monitor! The colors are beyond anything I have seen!

Now, the downside, and reason I could never make it my main display is the text. I run it at 1920x1200, and text is not nearly as sharp as an LCD. Not sure if there is anything I can do to fix this either.

Now that I think about it though, gaming would be top notch, and you could always use the monitors on either side for browsing.....hmmmmm.

Still, anyone know how to make the text sharper?
 
CaptainMorgan89 said:
Let me give you my take on the monitor.

I just got one, and it really is an awesome monitor! The colors are beyond anything I have seen!

Now, the downside, and reason I could never make it my main display is the text. I run it at 1920x1200, and text is not nearly as sharp as an LCD. Not sure if there is anything I can do to fix this either.

Now that I think about it though, gaming would be top notch, and you could always use the monitors on either side for browsing.....hmmmmm.

Still, anyone know how to make the text sharper?
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I don't think that you will ever get the text as sharp as you will with a good LCD.
I understand exactly what you mean though...I have tweaked mine to be pretty damn clear, but its still not LCD clear....I can live with it though..cause the gaming and colors are amazing.
 
CaptainMorgan89 said:
... Now that I think about it though, gaming would be top notch, and you could always use the monitors on either side for browsing.....hmmmmm. ...
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Yes. Basically, I'd do all my browsing and typing on the two side LCDs.

Potential problems do indeed include sharpness and input lag differences. Games these days are written for LCDs, therefore sometimes text is unreadable on CRTs, especially in RTS and RPG games. Maybe game font mods can help that.

It might be disorienting if the two side LCDs significantly input lag behind the CRT: On-screen action will not sync perfectly. I could mitigate this by simply getting LCDs with the lowest input lag available (1-2ms), perhaps also 120hz, so that they can display just as many frames as the 85hz central CRT.

To start with, though, I'm just going to be reusing my BenQ FP241VW as one of the three monitors until I can get something better. I'm extremely sensitive to input lag and it was the BenQ's input lag which drove me to researching a CRT-based Eyefinity setup.

Finding this monitor was like a dream come true. Now I just have to find one in good condition.

I am very concerned about the reports in this thread of Counter-Strike Source claiming a resolution of 1600 x 1024 instead of 1920x1200. Does this monitor have issues achieving maximum resolution in games?
 
GregBFM said:
What do you mean by "calibration" in this context?

I'm dreaming of the idea of an Eyefinity setup with this monitor as the centerpiece (and two 24" LCDs for the sides -- the true "have your cake and eat it too" gamer config). Currently planning my budget accordingly - hopefully AccurateIT or other places have this thing in a few months from now.
Click to expand...

Your idea wont work of blend with a FW900 in the center. Tried it personally when I had the chance. quickie config is basically just making sure the monitor looks in the balpark of being correct. Basically, a image restore.
 
GregBFM said:
I am very concerned about the reports in this thread of Counter-Strike Source claiming a resolution of 1600 x 1024 instead of 1920x1200. Does this monitor have issues achieving maximum resolution in games?
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text wont be LCD-good, but it can get pretty damn close. you just need a screwdriver, good eyes and lots of material with which to calibrate. ive been calibrating the thing every other day for a good 2 weeks now. a new combination of color and text will show me my previous results were a little off, so i gently readjust.

also, even though MS ClearType was made for LCDs, i like what it does with this CRT as well. i keep it on.

and the last 15 games ive played have been at 2304x1440. there should be no reason you cant run at least 1920x1200. nvidia card here (gtx 470).
 
Rock&Roll said:
Your idea wont work of blend with a FW900 in the center. Tried it personally when I had the chance. quickie config is basically just making sure the monitor looks in the balpark of being correct. Basically, a image restore.
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Thanks for the info re. calibration. But what do you mean, a blend won't work? As far as I understand it, Eyefinity just requires three monitors of the same resolution (in this case, 1920x1200). Whether they are LCDs or CRTs shouldn't matter. I've found a number of videos and forum posts online of people mixing VGA CRTs with DVI LCDs for Eyefinity. So I don't see how the FW900 wouldn't work. What went wrong when you tried it?

As a reminder, I intend to pair the FW900 with two LCDs both using 1920x1200 and both being 24" to match the FW900's size.

cinnamonandgravy said:
there should be no reason you cant run at least 1920x1200. nvidia card here (gtx 470).
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Good :)
 
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CaptainMorgan89 said:
anyone know how to make the text sharper?
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#1 is fix your convergence. Use this image and try to get the dots so that you cant see the individual Red Green and BLue dots. They should line up and make a single white dot.

If you cant get them all don't worry. Sometimes a corner or edge will just not line up with the standard adjustments.

#2 is adjust your sharpness. This is done with 2 flathead screws located inside the monitor. You can get to them with very narrow screwdrivers through the vent holes on top. Here is a picture of where they are when you have the cover off.

One is vertical and one horizontal If you look with a flashlight you should see them through the top. I made this pattern to help with the adjustment.

That should be all you need. My text is as sharp as any LCD. And I would take a picture to prove it but that would probably come out blurry.

As for triplehead with Eyefinity it will only output 60Hz when in a 3 screen setup. I have 3 of these FW900's and one day even as a joke would love to get them going in a triplehead. But not if I have to go to 60Hz.

I don't see why multiple cards wouldn't solve this. I am willing to buy another two 4890's if it means I can do 3x1920x1200@85hz
In the mean time. Just look at this sunset.
http://www.outerra.com/shots/ocean3.jpg
 
GregBFM said:
Thanks for the info re. calibration. But what do you mean, a blend won't work? As far as I understand it, Eyefinity just requires three monitors of the same resolution (in this case, 1920x1200). Whether they are LCDs or CRTs shouldn't matter. I've found a number of videos and forum posts online of people mixing VGA CRTs with DVI LCDs for Eyefinity. So I don't see how the FW900 wouldn't work. What went wrong when you tried it?

As a reminder, I intend to pair the FW900 with two LCDs both using 1920x1200 and both being 24" to match the FW900's size.



Good :)
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I should have clarified, I tried with NV surround not eyefinity. It compliained about not having the same sync signal for each monitor (1920x1200x60hz LCDs on outside). SoftTH would undoubtedly work. Eyefinity, I dunno.
 
What about for current ATI 5800/6000 series users? Say if I want to run 1680x1050@ 100hz, do I need to enable\disable a setting in CCC or just run a 3rd party program like Powerstrip? Is there guide anywhere that list the FW900's max refresh rates at each resolution?
 
There's info on that several pages back. Someone posted a custom .inf file for our monitor which bypasses the EDID and specifies the supported resolutions. There's also a BNC->DVI cable mod where you remove 2 pins to disable EDID.

The monitors specs can be found in the manual and service manual. They might be somewhere in the thread, else you can find them via google.
 
I used the Saphire Active Displayport to vga adapter and Got my 3 monitor Eyefinity setup to work and have no flickering. Using a XFX 5870, 2 V7 22" LCD monitors (one on the Displayport adapter), and the FW-900 for the center monitor. No flickering whatsoever. Each monitor is running 1680x1050, and runs in eyefinity at 5040x1050 or 5260x1050 with bezel compensation. Catalyst 10.6 drivers.

Also to note: My trinitron is running 85hz and the lcds are running 60hz in the eyefinity group. So it appears that eyefinity groups just need to run the same resolution on each monitor, but the monitors can run different refresh rates.

Note: I could not get my CRT to run all the resolutions it supports on the displayport adapter for some reason (i think max was 1280x1024 or something close to that, but can run the 22" LCD at its native 1680x1050 on the displayport adapter. Might have something to do with running higher refresh rates on the CRT. It seemed as if it wasn't reading all the EDID info for supported resolutions on the CRT. Plugging it into the DVI port with vga adapter worked fine. One LCD is plugged into the other DVI port and the other is into the DP adapter.

Along with the EDID info... I had to change the EDID info for the FW900 and set the physical dimentions set for the FW900 to match those of my 22" LCDs in order to be able to enable bezel compensation. I used Powerstrip to do this. No special cables needed. EDID can be updated through the VGA cable.
 
Hey guys. Thanks for all the info provided in this thread. I thought I would share some concerning people who want to use the utility Powerstrip to "force" GPU to output your desired resolution and refresh rate.

This page explains Powerstrip's functionality.--> http://forums.entechtaiwan.com/index.php?topic=21.0

Basically there are many people who are having trouble running DX 11 games at refresh rates higher than 60hz. I had this problem with Crysis when running DX 10 last year. The developer recently released a new version of Powerstrip that supports the 58XX series but does NOT support the 6XXX series because Nvidia and ATI have not released their lower level settings which he needs to make it work on the newer cards. More info here-->http://forums.entechtaiwan.com/index.php?topic=7103.120

Can you guys run DX 11 material over 60hz?
 
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Does anyone know the correct advanced timings for FW900 custom modes?

My target resolution is 1280x800@120Hz. Nvidia CPL has a Manual timing option, Auto option, then these options: GTF, DMT, CVT and CVT reduced blank.

I've read CVT reduced blank is for non-CRTs so I'm ruling that one out.

If I set the basic mode fields to 1280x800x32@120Hz, the Auto/GTF/DMT/CVT options will fill in the advanced timing fields. GTF and CVT give a similar picture but DMT is way off with very cropped sides. Auto gives a picture that also looks a bit off. Of the lot GTF seems to be the most correct.

I'm guessing Front porch and Sync width are some kind of offsets that have to do with where the picture begins and ends? It seems very different in the DMT timing than in the others, DMT also has reverse polarity compared to the others.

Pixel clock seems important to avoid degrading the monitor and I'd like to run it as correctly as possible but I'm not sure how to set these timings properly.

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I'm guessing there are manual timings for FW900 that are more correct than the Auto/GTF/CVT timings which are very similar and look about right but are probably sub-optimal. If anyone knows about this please post.
 
That's not your issue. Your issue is EDID problems. Disable EDID by breaking a pin from your cable (Guide's abound elsewhere) and get yourself a modded INF to install the monitor. You'll have your 1200x800x32 @ 120Hz (or 140, or 144 hz)
 
Yeah, I'm using the testingmon modded INF that headless posted a while back and it seems to be working, using a regular VGA to DVI-A cable without pin mods, I do get 1280x800@120Hz as confirmed by pressing the menu stick in, but the advanced timings in Nvidia Control Panel are still a mystery to me. Are you running your advanced timings on Auto? Have you tried the other options to see how it affects your picture?
 
jdof, how did you add that NewEDID.dat INF file? Should I use Powerstrip to add it? Will it work on my monitor even though it is not a true FW900. Mine is the HP branded HP A7217A but basically the same I think.
 
I actually use the testingmon.inf since it sets native resolution to 1280x800. To add it go to Device Manager, right click on the monitor > Update driver > Browse computer > Let me pick > Have disk, then give it the path to the inf.
 
Ok cool thanks. So before I try this, is there a way I can backup my current INF file before I switch to this new one? I guess it would be located in the registry or Windows System Folder?
I'm using Windows 7 64bit.
 
Not sure about backing up, but usually you're running the default inf that Windows picked automatically, so if you ever want to go back to that you can just click the Roll back driver in Device Manager or delete the monitor then click Scan for hardware changes and Windows will load the default driver again. I believe if you click Driver details you can see the location of the inf you're currently using then you can go to its path and copy the file to back it up if you want.
 
You'll be fine without worrying about a backup. If you get issues, boot into safe mode and uninstall your graphics driver. When you reinstall your graphics driver, the monitor driver will automatically go back to generic plug-n-play.
 
This worked great! Thanks jdof. Now I can run my monitor in 1680x1050. Thank god cause i think Crysis 2 would kill my 5850 at 1920x1200.
 
Question: If my geometry is off and I'm unable to get it right using windas, would a degauss wand/coil be worth checking out? Has anyone used one on a fw900 and what were your results?
 
jdof said:
My target resolution is 1280x800@120Hz. Nvidia CPL has a Manual timing option, Auto option, then these options: GTF, DMT, CVT and CVT reduced blank.
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These CRTs were designed to use GTF compliant timings, so that is what you want to use if creating a custom resolution in Nvidia CPL.
 
Hi,

I've been reading this topic for a long time. And I decided to get one of theses monsters.
I got a fw900, but it has a very bad contrast, blacks are red... I tried to get the .dat file with windas but I get an error when I want to load into the monitor. I don't know how to do... Could someone send me his .dat file.

Thank you very much.
This topic is very useful.
 
Furorento said:
Hi,

I've been reading this topic for a long time. And I decided to get one of theses monsters.
I got a fw900, but it has a very bad contrast, blacks are red... I tried to get the .dat file with windas but I get an error when I want to load into the monitor. I don't know how to do... Could someone send me his .dat file.

Thank you very much.
This topic is very useful.
Click to expand...

Try an image reset. Wait for the monitor to warm up for 30 minutes. Then go to your color settings and run the "Image Restore". Should do wonders for the image.
 
It turns out that my problem with no red component had to with the cable not being attached properly. The monitor is now working almost perfectly. :)

I'm just wondering if a sudden power outage could somehow damage the monitor? I have the impression that colors are less vivid and that contrast/black levels are not as good after this happened but I might just be imagining it.
 
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Not sure if this is the nature of the display or if it happens with anyone else. I have noticed that if you have the display on around 30 minutes to an hour then turn the display off for about 5 seconds and turn it back on again it will recalibrate itself and adjust the size and position to where you had it set previously.

I know that the Sony TV's also recalibrate after they have been on for a period of time as well.

To better explain this.

1. leave monitor on for an hour
2. turn the display off for 5 seconds
3. turn the display back on
4. calibrate it.
5. save
6. turn off the display for a few hours
7. turn the display on for about an hour (It will not look exactly like it did when you first calibrated it no matter how long you leave it on)
8. turn the display off for 5 seconds
9. turn the display back on (now it should look correct)
 
CRT_LoverBoy said:
Not sure if this is the nature of the display or if it happens with anyone else. I have noticed that if you have the display on around 30 minutes to an hour then turn the display off for about 5 seconds and turn it back on again it will recalibrate itself and adjust the size and position to where you had it set previously.

I know that the Sony TV's also recalibrate after they have been on for a period of time as well.
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Never noticed mine doing that when i had it.. now my nephew has it and i'm sure if it did that i'd get a email real quick.
 
I just wanted to post about my brief foray into the LCD world lately...

I found a good deal on a Dell u2410 (24" WUXGA IPS panel). No dead/stuck pixels, minimal backlight issues. However...after using it for a few days, seeing that it had some slight color uniformity issues, and finding out that it gave me headaches....well..it's up for sale again :p

Don't even get me started on the input lag/motion blur issues. I've been completely spoiled by my fw900, it seems.

Now I'm back to my old fw900...hopefully it doesn't kick the bucket until the tech improves and/or I can afford a REALLY nice monitor.

It makes me sad that CRT's have been phased out by what to me seems like inferior tech :(
 
dusty_fox said:
It makes me sad that CRT's have been phased out by what to me seems like inferior tech :(
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Yeah. I could do a 24" plasma. If only they made something like that. They used to have 37" plasmas, but they are long gone also. And SED never made it.

:(
 
dusty_fox said:
I just wanted to post about my brief foray into the LCD world lately...

I found a good deal on a Dell u2410 (24" WUXGA IPS panel). No dead/stuck pixels, minimal backlight issues. However...after using it for a few days, seeing that it had some slight color uniformity issues, and finding out that it gave me headaches....well..it's up for sale again :p

Don't even get me started on the input lag/motion blur issues. I've been completely spoiled by my fw900, it seems.

Now I'm back to my old fw900...hopefully it doesn't kick the bucket until the tech improves and/or I can afford a REALLY nice monitor.

It makes me sad that CRT's have been phased out by what to me seems like inferior tech :(
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You'll have to use one for a month or so and get used to it. Most monitors now do not have noticeable ghosting, and input lag can be eliminated by researching and buy one that has none.

As much as I loved CRT back in the day, the geometry issues, weight, heat and size are pretty significant downsides. You don't appear to be open to liking LCD at all, so I wouldn't even bother with them until you're willing to give it a few months to make the adjustment.

I would try a 120hz LCD. it'll be TN, but if you are sitting in one spot it shouldn't matter too much unless you are a professional photographer, or heavy into Photoshop and stuff.

They're not that bad when you give them a chance.
 
TomGreen321 said:
You'll have to use one for a month or so and get used to it. Most monitors now do not have noticeable ghosting, and input lag can be eliminated by researching and buy one that has none.

As much as I loved CRT back in the day, the geometry issues, weight, heat and size are pretty significant downsides. You don't appear to be open to liking LCD at all, so I wouldn't even bother with them until you're willing to give it a few months to make the adjustment.

I would try a 120hz LCD. it'll be TN, but if you are sitting in one spot it shouldn't matter too much unless you are a professional photographer, or heavy into Photoshop and stuff.

They're not that bad when you give them a chance.
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Don't get me wrong - there are a lot of things to like about LCD's. It's just that in the things that matter most to me (responsiveness and color reproduction in the same display) CRT's are decidedly better. So, to me, they do seem like an inferior technology.

The first computer I bought for myself in 2005 included a Dell 2405fpw as part of its build. After that I used a 42" 1080p tv for a bit (I had to sit pretty far back), followed by a much smaller 21" TN 1080p panel that I used for about a year. The fw900 is the first "nice" CRT that I've used.

So, I do have experience with using LCD's...the 2405fpw probably would be my favorite out of all the ones I've used (but it's been a while, so who knows if I'd get annoyed with any response time lag, etc if I used it again)

As for what you said about ghosting and 120hz displays....I like how responsive TN panels are, but the viewing angles and color reproduction on the ones I've used make those advantages not worth it (in my opinion)

Of course, from an apples to oranges perspective - I am using what was a really high end CRT in its day. I might change my tune on LCD's if I got to use a really high end LCD.
 
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It's going to be very hard to move on from a high end Sony CRT, especially in a light controlled environment, or at night, where the tech's deep blacks and big dynamic range will be evident.

If I had to move back to LCD, then I'd go with a really big display or multiple monitors or such, something cool as a trade off...
 
Here's my CRT to TFT transition over the course of 6-8 years.

1. 22" Mitsubishi CRT
2. A few 8ms 19"-22" tfts - returned them all
3. Sony FW900 (1) - died after 2 years faithful service
4. Dell 2209wa - 60hz gaming, oew, searched high and low for another fw900
5. Sony FW900 (2) - yay, gaming heaven again, but had the upgrade itch 2 years later
6. Samsung 2233rz (1) - sold within a month due to lag etc, back to fw900
7. Sony FW900 (2) - died, bah
8. Samsung 2233rz (2) - bought another and making do. brain can compensate for lag when gaming, but eyes are not happy with choppyness

In between I've also experimented with various 32" TVs over the past 2 years (Samsung, Song, LG, Panasonic etc). They all sucked for PC gaming.

Now on the lookout for another FW900. They don't seem to last more than 2 years with me :)
 
sadbuttrue said:
Here's my CRT to TFT transition over the course of 6-8 years.

1. 22" Mitsubishi CRT
2. A few 8ms 19"-22" tfts - returned them all
3. Sony FW900 (1) - died after 2 years faithful service
4. Dell 2209wa - 60hz gaming, oew, searched high and low for another fw900
5. Sony FW900 (2) - yay, gaming heaven again, but had the upgrade itch 2 years later
6. Samsung 2233rz (1) - sold within a month due to lag etc, back to fw900
7. Sony FW900 (2) - died, bah
8. Samsung 2233rz (2) - bought another and making do. brain can compensate for lag when gaming, but eyes are not happy with choppyness

In between I've also experimented with various 32" TVs over the past 2 years (Samsung, Song, LG, Panasonic etc). They all sucked for PC gaming.

Now on the lookout for another FW900. They don't seem to last more than 2 years with me :)
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Dammit! I hope that doesn't mean I only have 8 months left on mine :(
My condolences to you for your 2 fallen fw900's...

edit: I do have a 20"ish UXGA NEC crt waiting if the fw900 dies. Not as good as the Sony, but eh...I can live with it for a while until I can find another CRT or a *good* LCD.
 
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