PS3 Hacker Expects Jail Sentence

Sad state of justice that he goes to jail, while a criminal organization like Sony can get away with illegally installing rootkits on tens of millions of computers and not a single person from Sony spent a single night in jail.
 
Helicopter said:
I posted a picture of the back of the box, and no, it's not on there anywhere, neither Linux, or Other OS is anywhere to be found on the pictures I've seen, which is why I was asking if someone had a picture of one with it on there, or a link to an advertisement mentioning either. And yes, when someone makes the claim that they had an advertised feature taken away, that was in fact not advertised, then it kind of makes their claim invalid. One thing is definitely does say on the box is "Design and specifications subject to change without notice".
Click to expand...

I'm sorry for your loss.
 
BladeVenom said:
Sad state of justice that he goes to jail, while a criminal organization like Sony can get away with illegally installing rootkits on tens of millions of computers and not a single person from Sony spent a single night in jail.
Click to expand...

They got the wrong guy. Lulzsec however, they all deserve it.

Also, don't blame Sony, blame the "game" and the American law.
 
You don't got to jail as a result of civil litigation. Even if Sony wins a bazillion dollars in a civil suit
Any criminal charges brought will entitle him to access the public defender's office.
 
Helicopter said:
I posted a picture of the back of the box, and no, it's not on there anywhere, neither Linux, or Other OS is anywhere to be found on the pictures I've seen, which is why I was asking if someone had a picture of one with it on there, or a link to an advertisement mentioning either. And yes, when someone makes the claim that they had an advertised feature taken away, that was in fact not advertised, then it kind of makes their claim invalid. One thing is definitely does say on the box is "Design and specifications subject to change without notice".
Click to expand...

How is all this:

http://kotaku.com/235049/20-questions-with-phil-harrison-at-dice

"One of the most powerful things about the PS3 is the "Install Other OS" option. It won't be Vista. It'll be Linux."



http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

"There is more to the PLAYSTATION®3 (PS3™) computer entertainment system than you may have assumed. In addition to playing games, watching movies, listening to music, and viewing photos, you can use the PS3™ system to run the Linux operating system.
By installing the Linux operating system, you can use the PS3™ system not only as an entry-level personal computer with hundreds of familiar applications for home and office use, but also as a complete development environment for the Cell Broadband Engine™ (Cell/B.E.).

There are many flavors of Linux available, which are developed, managed, and distributed by the respective companies and development communities."
 
So why don't people just buy a cheap ass laptop and put Linux on there? So they can play games on their PS3, and have a Linux box. Or buy an old PS3, restore the factory settings so that they can install Linux, and have two PS3s? It's either pay a little bit for something, or a lot for fighting a fight they can't win.
 
"Originally Posted by ml_paladin888 View Post
kind of sucks that corporations have to put up with twats like this guy. hope he gets to know Bubba *real* well"

Hard to believe idiots like this are allowed to post garbage like this on the Hard Forums.

Whats up Kyle?
 
Wish I could edit here....

"One of the most powerful things about the PS3 is the "Install Other OS" option. It won't be Vista. It'll be Linux."

Phil Harrison
Executive Vice President of Sony Computer Entertainment Europe (SCEE)
 
scojer said:
So why don't people just buy a cheap ass laptop and put Linux on there?
Click to expand...

For the same reason that a person would build mechanical calculator out of legos instead of buying a TI89 or for the same reason that most people here would rather overclock a lower end CPU than buy the top of the line. Probably for the challenge and to say that he did.
 
wizdum said:
I'm sorry for your loss.
Click to expand...

Um, yea ...ok.

pgaster said:
How is all this:

http://kotaku.com/235049/20-questions-with-phil-harrison-at-dice

"One of the most powerful things about the PS3 is the "Install Other OS" option. It won't be Vista. It'll be Linux."



http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

"There is more to the PLAYSTATION®3 (PS3™) computer entertainment system than you may have assumed. In addition to playing games, watching movies, listening to music, and viewing photos, you can use the PS3™ system to run the Linux operating system.
By installing the Linux operating system, you can use the PS3™ system not only as an entry-level personal computer with hundreds of familiar applications for home and office use, but also as a complete development environment for the Cell Broadband Engine™ (Cell/B.E.).

There are many flavors of Linux available, which are developed, managed, and distributed by the respective companies and development communities."
Click to expand...

It's something, though I would really like to see an actual advertisement, or an older box that mentioned it, something that Joe Blow would see if he didn't search the internet for some obscure interview, or have to dig through Playstation's site. Something that listed it as a selling feature.
 
Prison. Prison.

With thieves, murderers, thugs, and other lowlifes.

"What are you in for?"

"I stabbed two guys at a bar. How about you?"

"I altered some code so I could run any software I wanted on my PS3".

"HOLY SHIT YOU FUCKING PSYCHO I WANT A NEW CELLMATE"
 
Sony convinced German authorities to knock down his door and take his gear on two occasions. The reason why he faces jail time is for defying the court's orders, by releasing his "hypervisor bible" to the public. The courts are in the business of making money by exploiting the desperate, and if you can't pay up, you lose buckwheat.

I hope he gets out of this mess soon.
 
That's too bad. It's how corporations can ruin an individual if they target you, they can sue you and tie it up in court long enough to deplete your funds to fight. It's like a modern day siege battle between a small village and a Roman army.
 
Helicopter said:
Um, yea ...ok.



It's something, though I would really like to see an actual advertisement, or an older box that mentioned it, something that Joe Blow would see if he didn't search the internet for some obscure interview, or have to dig through Playstation's site. Something that listed it as a selling feature.
Click to expand...
Obscure interview? That was a Sony executive at E3.
dig though the Playstation website? It's also in the manual: http://manuals.playstation.net/document/en/ps3/current/settings/osinstall.html

Also go here and start reading at page 4: http://ps3movies.ign.com/ps3/document/article/108/1086720/gov.uscourts.cand.226894.1.0.pdf

There is more. Lots of good quotes and info.
 
Spidey329 said:
That's too bad. It's how corporations can ruin an individual if they target you, they can sue you and tie it up in court long enough to deplete your funds to fight. It's like a modern day siege battle between a small village and a Roman army.
Click to expand...
It sucks that even if the individual wins, it ruins their life. I bet they'd think twice if the stakes were just as high for them. Like if they lose, the corporation goes up for auction.
 
pgaster said:
Obscure interview? That was a Sony executive at E3.
dig though the Playstation website? It's also in the manual: http://manuals.playstation.net/document/en/ps3/current/settings/osinstall.html

Also go here and start reading at page 4: http://ps3movies.ign.com/ps3/document/article/108/1086720/gov.uscourts.cand.226894.1.0.pdf

There is more. Lots of good quotes and info.
Click to expand...

You do realize there is a big difference between an exec talking about features at an electronics conference, and an advertised feature right? What I am looking for is advertisements for the PS3 running Linux that back up the "we lost advertised features" banter, something the average consumer would see and read, and expect. Even a picture of a retail box that mentions Linux, or the ability to run an other OS. Maybe something that conflicts with the "Design and specifications subject to change without notice" that actually is printed on the actual box.
 
I want to make a product, sell it with a 12,359 page long EULA that nobody can possibly read and that charges you with all kinds of charges and is so filled with legalese that you will be sued, thrown in jail, taken to court, and executed just for buying my product and being caught up in my EULA.

Sounds like justice to me.
 
pgaster said:
Also go here and start reading at page 4: http://ps3movies.ign.com/ps3/document/article/108/1086720/gov.uscourts.cand.226894.1.0.pdf

There is more. Lots of good quotes and info.
Click to expand...

Can't edit post? :rolleyes:

Anyway, thanks for the link to the lawsuit, according to their claims it should be really easy to find something advertising the Other OS feature. Besides the plaintiff trying to make it sound like everyone wanted a PS3 for the same reasons he did, I don't really see him having a case, I mean it says right on the box, not in some online interview that only people looking are going to see, or buried in their website, but right there on the box that everyone that bought one new would see, that the "Design and specifications subject to change without notice". There's also the fact that he could have indeed continued to use the Other OS feature, just don't update.
 
fattypants said:
It sucks that even if the individual wins, it ruins their life. I bet they'd think twice if the stakes were just as high for them. Like if they lose, the corporation goes up for auction.
Click to expand...

Hehe, spend all your money THEN go to jail. Pretty brutal. Hehe.
 
Helicopter said:
Can't edit post? :rolleyes:

Anyway, thanks for the link to the lawsuit, according to their claims it should be really easy to find something advertising the Other OS feature. Besides the plaintiff trying to make it sound like everyone wanted a PS3 for the same reasons he did, I don't really see him having a case, I mean it says right on the box, not in some online interview that only people looking are going to see, or buried in their website, but right there on the box that everyone that bought one new would see, that the "Design and specifications subject to change without notice". There's also the fact that he could have indeed continued to use the Other OS feature, just don't update.
Click to expand...
I don't know why I bother to reply to you with your attitude. First here is a cut and paste from bottom left of my screen:
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

No, I can't edit.

Next, you don't seem to get a few things. If you do not update, you cannot play new movies or get on PSN or play new games, so not updating means you lose features. Not a good option.

SCEA’s decision to implement Update 3.21 placed Plaintiffs and Class members in a “Hobson’s Choice.” PS3 owners who chose not to install Update 3.21 could no longer access many of the other important PS3 features including the PSN, the ability to play games online, the ability to access online features, or the ability to play newer PS3 games and/or Blu-ray discs that required Update 3.21. On the other hand, PS3 owners who did install Update 3.21 lost all access to the computer functionality of the PS3’s “Other OS” feature.


"Design and specifications subject to change without notice" - So technically Sony can issue an update, for claimed security reasons of course, that stops the PS3 from playing games or movies, and that would be fine since they posted this little disclaimer line, correct?


And again, don't you understand how large E3 is? Is wasn't an obscure online only interview. Hundreds were witnesses. The interview was also on video and is still available if you want to search for it.

More:

leaked Sony Q&A paper:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=109226

Q29. Will Linux OS be adopted as you have planned ?
A29. Yes. PS3 is a computer system and Linux OS is adopted as one of the standard OSes.


Sony Computer Entertainment Inc.:
"In addition to playing games, watching movies, listening to music, and viewing photos, you can use the PS3™ system to run the Linux operating system. By installing the Linux operating system, you can use the PS3™ system not only as an entry-level personal computer with hundreds of familiar applications for home and office use, but also as a complete development environment for the Cell Broadband Engine™ (Cell/B.E.)."
http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

Phil Harrison, February 2007,
President of Sony Computer Entertainment Worldwide Studios 2005-2008:
"One of the most powerful things about the PS3 is the 'Install Other OS' option."
http://kotaku.com/235049/20-questions-with-phil-harrison-at-dice

Sony Computer Entertainment Inc., 2006-2009:
"The Linux Distributor's Starter Kit provides information, binary and source codes to Linux Distribution developers who wants to make their distro support PS3."
http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux

Izumi Kawanishi, Sony, May 2006:
"Because we have plans for having Linux on board [the PS3], we also recognize Linux programming activities... Other than game studios tied to official developer licenses, we'd like to see various individuals participate in content creation for the PS3."
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=9290

Geoffrey Levand, August 2009,
Principal Software Engineer at Sony Corporation:
"Please be assured that SCE is committed to continue the support for previously sold models that have the "Install Other OS" feature and that this feature will not be disabled in future firmware releases."
mailing list to PS3 customers using Linux

Phil Harrison, May 2006,
President of Sony Computer Entertainment Worldwide Studios 2005-2008:
"The Playstation 3 is a computer. We do not need the PC."
http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/0,1518,418642,00.html

Izumi Kawanishi, ~May 12, 2006
Sony executive?
"Because we have plans for having Linux on board [the PS3], we also recognize Linux programming activities... Other than game studios tied to official developer licenses, we'd like to see various individuals participate in content creation for the PS3. ... When a game studio enacts development on a PS3 by entering a license contract, SDK libraries... will be presented, and various technical support given. In contrast, when using Linux World on the PS3... support will fall to the lowest level required, and you must solve and work on things by yourselves."
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=9290


Ken Kutaragi,~June 7, 2006
President and CEO of Sony Computer Entertainment
"We don't say it's a game console (*laugh*) - PlayStation 3 is clearly a computer, unlike the PlayStations [released] so far."
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/9642/blogs/rss/




And again, this is still out there:

http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

There is more to the PLAYSTATION®3 (PS3™) computer entertainment system than you may have assumed. In addition to playing games, watching movies, listening to music, and viewing photos, you can use the PS3™ system to run the Linux operating system.
By installing the Linux operating system, you can use the PS3™ system not only as an entry-level personal computer with hundreds of familiar applications for home and office use, but also as a complete development environment for the Cell Broadband Engine™ (Cell/B.E.).
There are many flavors of Linux available, which are developed, managed, and distributed by the respective companies and development communities.

That is a Sony website. http://whois.domaintools.com/playstation.com
What more do you want?
 
pgaster said:
I don't know why I bother to reply to you with your attitude. First here is a cut and paste from bottom left of my screen:
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

No, I can't edit.
Click to expand...

I was rolling my eyes because I couldn't edit my own post.

Next, you don't seem to get a few things. If you do not update, you cannot play new movies or get on PSN or play new games, so not updating means you lose features. Not a good option.
Click to expand...

May not be any good options, but that's something that can happen when you buy something that clearly says on the box that "Design and specifications subject to change without notice".

"Design and specifications subject to change without notice" - So technically Sony can issue an update, for claimed security reasons of course, that stops the PS3 from playing games or movies, and that would be fine since they posted this little disclaimer line, correct?
Click to expand...

Hyperbole aside, yes, that is correct, though it would be pretty stupid to make their game system not play ...games.

And again, don't you understand how large E3 is? Is wasn't an obscure online only interview. Hundreds were witnesses. The interview was also on video and is still available if you want to search for it.
Click to expand...

And? How many people attended? Hundreds of witnesses? Hundreds isn't even a percentage of customers that bought PS3's that is worth figuring.

More:

Phil Harrison, February 2007,
President of Sony Computer Entertainment Worldwide Studios 2005-2008:
"One of the most powerful things about the PS3 is the 'Install Other OS' option."
http://kotaku.com/235049/20-questions-with-phil-harrison-at-dice
Click to expand...

A single reference in an interview?

Sony Computer Entertainment Inc., 2006-2009:
"The Linux Distributor's Starter Kit provides information, binary and source codes to Linux Distribution developers who wants to make their distro support PS3."
http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux

Geoffrey Levand, August 2009,
Principal Software Engineer at Sony Corporation:
"Please be assured that SCE is committed to continue the support for previously sold models that have the "Install Other OS" feature and that this feature will not be disabled in future firmware releases."
mailing list to PS3 customers using Linux

Phil Harrison, May 2006,
President of Sony Computer Entertainment Worldwide Studios 2005-2008:
"The Playstation 3 is a computer. We do not need the PC."
http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/0,1518,418642,00.html

Ken Kutaragi,~June 7, 2006
President and CEO of Sony Computer Entertainment
"We don't say it's a game console (*laugh*) - PlayStation 3 is clearly a computer, unlike the PlayStations [released] so far."
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/9642/blogs/rss/
Click to expand...

A couple lines from random internet interviews, and a couple comments on the systems power?

Izumi Kawanishi, ~May 12, 2006
Sony executive?
"Because we have plans for having Linux on board [the PS3], we also recognize Linux programming activities... Other than game studios tied to official developer licenses, we'd like to see various individuals participate in content creation for the PS3. ... When a game studio enacts development on a PS3 by entering a license contract, SDK libraries... will be presented, and various technical support given. In contrast, when using Linux World on the PS3... support will fall to the lowest level required, and you must solve and work on things by yourselves."
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=9290

Izumi Kawanishi, Sony, May 2006:
"Because we have plans for having Linux on board [the PS3], we also recognize Linux programming activities... Other than game studios tied to official developer licenses, we'd like to see various individuals participate in content creation for the PS3."
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=9290
Click to expand...

And again, this is still out there:

http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

There is more to the PLAYSTATION®3 (PS3™) computer entertainment system than you may have assumed. In addition to playing games, watching movies, listening to music, and viewing photos, you can use the PS3™ system to run the Linux operating system.
By installing the Linux operating system, you can use the PS3™ system not only as an entry-level personal computer with hundreds of familiar applications for home and office use, but also as a complete development environment for the Cell Broadband Engine™ (Cell/B.E.).
There are many flavors of Linux available, which are developed, managed, and distributed by the respective companies and development communities.

Sony Computer Entertainment Inc.:
"In addition to playing games, watching movies, listening to music, and viewing photos, you can use the PS3™ system to run the Linux operating system. By installing the Linux operating system, you can use the PS3™ system not only as an entry-level personal computer with hundreds of familiar applications for home and office use, but also as a complete development environment for the Cell Broadband Engine™ (Cell/B.E.)."
http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

That is a Sony website. http://whois.domaintools.com/playstation.com
Click to expand...

It is the Sony website

What more do you want?
Click to expand...

Like I said, I'd like an ad, or picture of the retail box, something that everyone that buys one, or see's while watching TV, reading magazine/newspaper ad, is going to see as an "advertised feature", not just tech savvy people that surf the internet, something more than a hand full of references to it. Something like how people knew that it supported DTS/Dolby playback, had an internet browser, etc, seems that if it was as big a deal as it's being made to be, this shouldn't be a problem, yet I can't even find a picture of a PS3 box that even mentions this feature.

Here's a little something for you, from your link ...

To use the Linux operating system, you must update the PS3™ system software to version 1.60 or later.
Click to expand...

So it appears that for the first 5-6 months it didn't even have the feature.

v1.60

Settings changes
Added Remote Play support for the 20 GB model.
Support for Bluetooth keyboards and mice.
Added Support for [Install Other OS]
Disc changes
Support for playback of BD-RE (Blu-ray Disc recordable) ver 3.0.
Game changes
First version to support software emulation on PS1/PS2 games for PAL units.PS3 playback improved
Network changes
Added Folding@home client.
Added background downloading feature (ability to download while doing something else).
Added an on-screen QWERTY keyboard in addition to the standard PlayStation on-screen keyboard.
Click to expand...


Just so you know, I understand why some people were put out, and anger over this, it is crappy to lose a function of a piece of hardware, but really who should you be blaming? Sony? Or the guys that went and made their cracking of the PS3 public? If you were to go to an art museum, and the paintings were right there in front of you, then the next day went back and there was a twenty foot stand off because some kid was able to hit them with a stick, or some managed to slip one off the wall and steal it, would you be mad at the museum for trying to protect their paintings? Or the people that screwed up you ability to enjoy a nice close up viewing of some masterpieces?
 
As much as I agree these hackers need to be punished, I don't think any hacker should ever go to jail. Jail should be for people who pose a physical threat such as rapers and murderers. Hackers should get some kind of probation where they can't touch a computer or own any electronic device for a few years. This would be a pretty bad punishment for them.
 
My launch PS3 320, received as a Christmas gift, has nothing on the box regarding Other OS.

Still, EULA or no, it is my PS3. I will hack, crack, or otherwise do what I want with it. It is no different than jail breaking an iphone or rooting/rom switching on an Android. The courts seem to not agree with me, but I have a hard time condemning a guy for fixing his PS3, and for showing others how to fix theirs.
That said, I also have no issue with Sony kicking fixed/hacked PS3's off their network. It is their network after all, just like the PS3 in the box in the closet across the room from me, is my PS3...
 
Diriel said:
Seems obvious that Helicopter is a straight up troll.

Do Not Feed The Trolls!
Click to expand...

Hahaha, what a brilliant, insightful comment. I guess you an post a link showing Other OS advertised somewhere? Or maybe your one of those that blames Sony for someone hacking their product? The only "straight up troll" I see is you.
 
Helicopter said:
Hyperbole aside, yes, that is correct, though it would be pretty stupid to make their game system not play ...games.
Click to expand...

To reiterate::

Ken Kutaragi,~June 7, 2006
President and CEO of Sony Computer Entertainment
"We don't say it's a game console (*laugh*) - PlayStation 3 is clearly a computer, unlike the PlayStations [released] so far."
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/9642/blogs/rss/
Click to expand...

So essentially what they did was turn around and make their computer system not play...computer stuff. ;)
 
refraxion said:
They got the wrong guy. Lulzsec however, they all deserve it.

Also, don't blame Sony, blame the "game" and the American law.
Click to expand...

Don't forget the law makers! But no... you should probably blame Sony too... it's not only Americans that would be affected in this way. Or at least governments that bend over like America seems to do a lot lately... probably for cash up the ass.

Bolded because there are occurences that doesn't support this... so it's not all one way.
 
Not only are EULAs not Laws, for the most part they are not even enforcable. Frankly Sony should be subjected to a class action suit and charged criminally with conversion. As far as the prosecution of htese individuals go, what should happen is that some SOny executives shoudl be spending some jail time for wrongful and malicious prosecution.
 
Helicopter said:
Hahaha, what a brilliant, insightful comment. I guess you an post a link showing Other OS advertised somewhere? Or maybe your one of those that blames Sony for someone hacking their product? The only "straight up troll" I see is you.
Click to expand...

Direct statements from CEO's on a product are advertising. Quit trying to use a technicality. Just because it wasn't in a commercial doesn't suddenly make it not an advertisement of features. You should quit before you embarrass yourself further, you were proven wrong on every point with direct statements from Sony.
 
Dekoth-E- said:
Direct statements from CEO's on a product are advertising. Quit trying to use a technicality. Just because it wasn't in a commercial doesn't suddenly make it not an advertisement of features. You should quit before you embarrass yourself further, you were proven wrong on every point with direct statements from Sony.
Click to expand...

No, they are not advertising, not even close. They apparently didn't even think Other OS was important enough to put on the box, yet just about everything else that it does is.
 
I guess I haven't been following this story much. How could this guy end up going to jail? What would he be charged with? Violating DMCA?
 
HOCP4ME said:
I guess I haven't been following this story much. How could this guy end up going to jail? What would he be charged with? Violating DMCA?
Click to expand...

This is in Germany... not the US.

I'm not sure what the exact details of the case are at this point, other than whats been made public. It could be that he leaked his 'PS3 bible' (although, if this was the case, I would of assumed that he'd already be in the slammer)... or it could be that, since he can't pay his fines, he'll have to do time.


I'm sure the details will come out eventually.
 
I like how Helicopter gets called a troll for making valid points, albeit unpopular.

I disagree with how this guy is being treated, and I hate how the legal system can be used to financially destroy the little guy. That being said, he is in the wrong. His workaround for Other OS enables many others to pirate games, which could easily cost Sony millions of dollars.

I know it's easy to hate on the big corporations, lord knows I do it often enough. But you have to look at all the issues, not just Other OS.
 
TwistedAegis said:
I like how Helicopter gets called a troll for making valid points, albeit unpopular.

I disagree with how this guy is being treated, and I hate how the legal system can be used to financially destroy the little guy. That being said, he is in the wrong. His workaround for Other OS enables many others to pirate games, which could easily cost Sony millions of dollars.

I know it's easy to hate on the big corporations, lord knows I do it often enough. But you have to look at all the issues, not just Other OS.
Click to expand...

I don't buy that argument.

What Graf is doing is NOT enabling piracy... he's allowing linux to be installed with low level permissions (giving users access to the GPU, for instance) on consoles that are already jailbroken, both slim and fat. He's not providing the jailbreak nor the tools to do so.... those are already out in the wild.
 
TwistedAegis said:
I like how Helicopter gets called a troll for making valid points, albeit unpopular.

I disagree with how this guy is being treated, and I hate how the legal system can be used to financially destroy the little guy. That being said, he is in the wrong. His workaround for Other OS enables many others to pirate games, which could easily cost Sony millions of dollars.

I know it's easy to hate on the big corporations, lord knows I do it often enough. But you have to look at all the issues, not just Other OS.
Click to expand...

So, his work-around is a "gateway" evil?
 
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