7800X3D new build, help please?

D

Deimos

[H]ard|Gawd
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Aug 10, 2004
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I'm testing a new build before I put it in to its home with full watercooling.
7800X3D
Gigabyte Aorus X670 Elite AX
RTX 4090
4 x 16GB ram (6000mhz?)
Samsung 990Pro 2TB

I can't seem to get it stable on my bench. I'm running the ram at 4800Mhz becuase EXPO at 6000 and 5600 just outright fail. The only issue is that I'm getting random reboots.

I set the ram to default JEDEC and the system trained some extremely tight timings without me doing anything at all and I loosened them a little, versus the EXPO timings:
1699695140242.png
1699695175738.png


I skipped a few generations, my previous system was X99 so I really have no idea what I'm doing. Just aiming for stable at this stage.

I'm in the process of testing the PSU with a multimeter to rule out any power issues. I'll report back. Any assistance would be great.
 
So those memory timings were definitely anomolous, I have no idea how this system selected them. After some tinkering it went back to normal.

Also, the PSU is definitely fine. Running an RDR2 bench the 12v rail only drops to 11.98v so it isn't my test PSU causing any issues.
 
Reset cmos ,reenter bios and set xmp memory profile to apply xmp memory timings then incrementally lower memory speed before exiting bios setup , save exit and if it boots test for stability. Start at 5600 and lower from there if necessary in increments of 200. So 5600 ,5400 ,5200 etc. and make sure the xmp timings are applied at every increment. No guarantee this will work but it's the easiest way.
 
Deimos said:
4 x 16GB ram (6000mhz?)
Click to expand...
Oof. Like others have commented 4 sticks is not the play, it stresses the CPU's IMC too much. I'd suggest returning it. DDR5 is available in single sticks in sizes of 8/16/24/32/48 GB. On AM5 I think you need to be on a relatively new BIOS to get the 24/48GB DIMM support. Go with a 2 stick layout.

Try updating the BIOS to the latest anyway and see if that helps at all.
 
Deimos said:
I'm testing a new build before I put it in to its home with full watercooling.
7800X3D
Gigabyte Aorus X670 Elite AX
RTX 4090
4 x 16GB ram (6000mhz?)
Samsung 990Pro 2TB

I can't seem to get it stable on my bench. I'm running the ram at 4800Mhz becuase EXPO at 6000 and 5600 just outright fail. The only issue is that I'm getting random reboots.

I set the ram to default JEDEC and the system trained some extremely tight timings without me doing anything at all and I loosened them a little, versus the EXPO timings:
View attachment 612567View attachment 612568

I skipped a few generations, my previous system was X99 so I really have no idea what I'm doing. Just aiming for stable at this stage.

I'm in the process of testing the PSU with a multimeter to rule out any power issues. I'll report back. Any assistance would be great.
Click to expand...
You are running at 4800MHz because you might as well be running eight modules. DDR5 modules have to channels each. So you are trying to run eight channels and neither Intel nor AMD can do that and achieve decent clocks. You should only ever use four DIMMs with DDR5 if you absolutely need more physical RAM for your applications and the loss of clock speed is worth it simply to have more physical RAM. DDR5 runs so bad in a four module configuration that two of the slots might as well be vestigial. They are basically useless for most people.
 
Dopamin3 said:
Oof. Like others have commented 4 sticks is not the play, it stresses the CPU's IMC too much. I'd suggest returning it. DDR5 is available in single sticks in sizes of 8/16/24/32/48 GB. On AM5 I think you need to be on a relatively new BIOS to get the 24/48GB DIMM support. Go with a 2 stick layout.

Try updating the BIOS to the latest anyway and see if that helps at all.
Click to expand...
Also buy EXPO DDR5, I'm using gskill cas30 with good results (2 stick 32GB total)
https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb/p/N82E16820374457?Item=N82E16820374457
 
Deimos said:
4 x 16GB ram (6000mhz?)


I can't seem to get it stable on my bench. I'm running the ram at 4800Mhz becuase EXPO at 6000 and 5600 just outright fail. The only issue is that I'm getting random reboots.
Click to expand...

Man, I'm sorry they got you with the DDR5 trap as others have pointed out. They really need to put a warning on the box because I've seen countless negative reviews on Intel and AMD alike about not being able to run 4 sticks at the desired speed. A lot of people want to build a rig to last 5-6 years and think they can just slap 128GB on there like previous generations only to be bitterly disappointed.

With 4x16 SR, you might be able to get away with 5600 if you spend a lot of time tweaking voltages and timings.

Deimos said:
So those memory timings were definitely anomolous, I have no idea how this system selected them. After some tinkering it went back to normal.

Also, the PSU is definitely fine. Running an RDR2 bench the 12v rail only drops to 11.98v so it isn't my test PSU causing any issues.
Click to expand...

Those JEDEC timings are actually pretty close to good for Hynix A or M dies. Just two sticks at 1.35V would probably get you 32-38-38-30-68 at 6200-6400mt/s, although most of the go juice is still left in the subtimings.
 
I appreciate the input guys.

I'll see if I can RMA the ram and get 2x32GB sticks instead. I picked 4x16 because I couldn't find a dual channel 64GB kit where I am at the arsehole of the world. In the meantime it seems to be stable with EXPO timings at 4800mhz.

Can anyone recommend a dual channel kit?
 
It turns out that the retailer's website is semi-broken. They don't show any 64GB kits under the 'kit size' link, but there are tons of 64GB kits under the 'DDR5' link. I would have ordered one if I had seen it.

I sent a message to the retailer to see if they will RMA.
 
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Still not stable at 4800mhz. I left it idle and came back, checked the logs and there is an error "rebooted from a bugcheck". I'm pulling two sticks for now to see what happens.

I think that is pretty much the same, or at least similar to the ram I was just looking at
 
Deimos said:
Still not stable at 4800mhz. I left it idle and came back, checked the logs and there is an error "rebooted from a bugcheck". I'm pulling two sticks for now to see what happens.

I think that is pretty much the same, or at least similar to the ram I was just looking at
Click to expand...
I'm not familiar with Zen 4, but on Zen 1 - 3 typically you can raise the vSOC voltage to help stabilize higher freqency memory. Don't expect miracles with 4 sticks but it might help somewhat.
 
Mega6 said:
I'm using this in my new rig. Works fine.. there may be newer, better but at the time (6/23) it was the fastest 64GB DDR5 Kit from G.Skill. I've always used the MEMORY CONFIGURATOR to find G.Skill RAM.

G.SKILL Trident Z5 Neo Series (AMD Expo) DDR5 RAM 64GB (2x32GB) 6000MT/s CL30-40-40-96 1.40V Desktop Computer Memory UDIMM - Matte Black (F5-6000J3040G32GX2-TZ5N)
Click to expand...
It doesn't look like that one is available locally but this one is available:

F5-6000J3040G32GX2-TZ5NR​

https://www.gskill.com/product/165/390/1665020865/F5-6000J3040G32GX2-TZ5NR

It is probably the same apart from the RGB nonsense.

The shop got back to me and said I can do an RMA, so looks like this is the route I'm going.
 
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maybe try the timings and voltage that the above gskill kit has(that mega6 posted)
 
Dan_D said:
You are running at 4800MHz because you might as well be running eight modules. DDR5 modules have to channels each. So you are trying to run eight channels and neither Intel nor AMD can do that and achieve decent clocks. You should only ever use four DIMMs with DDR5 if you absolutely need more physical RAM for your applications and the loss of clock speed is worth it simply to have more physical RAM. DDR5 runs so bad in a four module configuration that two of the slots might as well be vestigial. They are basically useless for most people.
Click to expand...
So is this always the case with DDR5? Even with the new threadrippers coming soon? How can you more RAM if you can't or doesn't want to use 4 DIMMS?
 
sram said:
So is this always the case with DDR5? Even with the new threadrippers coming soon? How can you more RAM if you can't or doesn't want to use 4 DIMMS?
Click to expand...

You can run four DIMMs, but you always loose clockspeed while doing so. It's an unfortunate limitation of the technology. With Threadripper, clock speed isn't going to be as big a deal as it is for gaming rigs.
 
sram said:
So is this always the case with DDR5? Even with the new threadrippers coming soon? How can you more RAM if you can't or doesn't want to use 4 DIMMS?
Click to expand...

You can run 4 sticks, just not at 6000mt/s EXPO settings (usually) unless you have a unicorn chip.
 
sram said:
So is this always the case with DDR5? Even with the new threadrippers coming soon? How can you more RAM if you can't or doesn't want to use 4 DIMMS?
Click to expand...

I believe the Threadrippers are also quad-channel, so 4 RAM slots would be 1 stick per channel as opposed to the 2 sticks per channel that you'd be trying to do with 4 RAM slots on desktop. Should be a ton more tolerant.
 
Mega6 said:
I'm using this in my new rig. Works fine.. there may be newer, better but at the time (6/23) it was the fastest 64GB DDR5 Kit from G.Skill. I've always used the MEMORY CONFIGURATOR to find G.Skill RAM.

G.SKILL Trident Z5 Neo Series (AMD Expo) DDR5 RAM 64GB (2x32GB) 6000MT/s CL30-40-40-96 1.40V Desktop Computer Memory UDIMM - Matte Black (F5-6000J3040G32GX2-TZ5N)
Click to expand...

FWIW, there are occasionally sticks that are on that site that say they're compatible with a motherboard, but then you go to the actual motherboard memory page and they're not listed as compatible with the motherboard. Had a case of that last week when i was reading a thread.

I'm running this:
https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-64gb/p/N82E16820374445?Item=N82E16820374445
Which I think is just the RGB variant of that set you linked. It came in with Hynix M die and I've got it at 6000 with tightened subtimings. Very stable. But I'm on a different motherboard. And they do seem to actually be listed as compatible with my motherboard:

1699841315512.png


Edit: Actually... that's not what I'm running at all, when I look at the cardboard box they came in. Huh.
... I'm running this:
https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-64gb-288-pin-ddr5-sdram/p/N82E16820374383?Item=N82E16820374383
And it's not even listed on my motherboard page. Oh well. Lmao.
 
Last edited:
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Deimos said:
I'm testing a new build before I put it in to its home with full watercooling.
7800X3D
Gigabyte Aorus X670 Elite AX
RTX 4090
4 x 16GB ram (6000mhz?)
Samsung 990Pro 2TB

I can't seem to get it stable on my bench. I'm running the ram at 4800Mhz becuase EXPO at 6000 and 5600 just outright fail. The only issue is that I'm getting random reboots.

I set the ram to default JEDEC and the system trained some extremely tight timings without me doing anything at all and I loosened them a little, versus the EXPO timings:
View attachment 612567View attachment 612568

I skipped a few generations, my previous system was X99 so I really have no idea what I'm doing. Just aiming for stable at this stage.

I'm in the process of testing the PSU with a multimeter to rule out any power issues. I'll report back. Any assistance would be great.
Click to expand...
I didn't see it anywhere in this thread. Maybe I missed it. But.....did you update the bios? Because AMD has made some huge memory compatibility improvements, over several bios updates. Its pretty much the first thing you should do with a Zen 4 system.
 
pendragon1 said:
usually. possibly. bigger sticks or accept a lower speed/timings with 4 sticks.
Click to expand...

Dan_D said:
You can run four DIMMs, but you always loose clockspeed while doing so. It's an unfortunate limitation of the technology. With Threadripper, clock speed isn't going to be as big a deal as it is for gaming rigs.
Click to expand...

LigTasm said:
You can run 4 sticks, just not at 6000mt/s EXPO settings (usually) unless you have a unicorn chip.
Click to expand...
So with 48 GB sticks the maximum I can go is 96 GB if I want speed. Any chance there will be 64 GB sticks soon so that I can have 128 GB of RAM?
 
mvmiller12 said:
I believe the Threadrippers are also quad-channel, so 4 RAM slots would be 1 stick per channel as opposed to the 2 sticks per channel that you'd be trying to do with 4 RAM slots on desktop. Should be a ton more tolerant.
Click to expand...
Yes, threadrippers are quad-channel. But what does that mean in terms of performance? 2 or 4 sticks ? Sorry for being ignorant.
 
sram said:
Yes, threadrippers are quad-channel. But what does that mean in terms of performance? 2 or 4 sticks ? Sorry for being ignorant.
Click to expand...

4 sticks all in parallel, double the bandwidth of dual channel. However, you need registered RAM for the new threadripper, which adds a tiny bit of latency.
 
sram said:
So with 48 GB sticks the maximum I can go is 96 GB if I want speed. Any chance there will be 64 GB sticks soon so that I can have 128 GB of RAM?
Click to expand...

I'm struggling to imagine a scenario where you would want to use that much RAM with an AM5 platform. Are you trying to hack together some kind of workstation?
 
LigTasm said:
I'm struggling to imagine a scenario where you would want to use that much RAM with an AM5 platform.
Click to expand...
Same. And with that much memory for most workloads you would probably strongly consider ECC anyway.
 
Hack? Maybe. I want to run multiple VM's (Probably 10) in this workstation for a pentesting lab. They become less responsive when I run many of them in my current system. But actually, it is mostly for bragging rights.
 
sram said:
Hack? Maybe. I want to run multiple VM's (Probably 10) in this workstation for a pentesting lab. They become less responsive when I run many of them in my current system. But actually, it is mostly for bragging rights.
Click to expand...

Well, there are people that have done it. It depends how much effort you want to put in and VERY much depends on your board choice more than CPU. Here is a guy that managed it:

https://linustechtips.com/topic/1521887-stable-128gb4x32gb-ddr5-6000-cl30-on-am5-agesa-1007b/
 
sram said:
So is this always the case with DDR5? Even with the new threadrippers coming soon? How can you more RAM if you can't or doesn't want to use 4 DIMMS?
Click to expand...
I have been talking about threadrippers ever since I posted in this thread. I saw where we got confused.
 
chameleoneel said:
I didn't see it anywhere in this thread. Maybe I missed it. But.....did you update the bios? Because AMD has made some huge memory compatibility improvements, over several bios updates. Its pretty much the first thing you should do with a Zen 4 system.
Click to expand...
I didn't say. Yes, it was literally the first thing I did after assembling it on my bench.

The new memory kit should be arriving today. I ended up going for the G.Skill Trident Z5 Neo RGB 64GB kit:
https://www.gskill.com/product/165/390/1665020865/F5-6000J3040G32GX2-TZ5NR

G.Skill validation report was with a 7800X3D on this same board and BIOS at 6000 so hopefully it will be all good, fingers crossed.
 
New ram arrived. loaded EXPO and it seems to be totally fine. Also, the RGB is less obnoxious on the G.Skill.

I got a wierd message from the store yesterday. I hope they aren't dicks about returning the Kingston RAM.
 
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