Opinions? 24".

D

Deeky

Gawd
Joined
Feb 7, 2008
Messages
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Currently rocking a 22" Samsung 226BW. Looking to move into 24" territory. I'm ultimately interested in an IPS panel, but I'd consider a TN if the price and the overall performance rock my block. I hope to avoid P/MVA panels, as I consider them a poor overall choice for gaming.

I'm currently eyeballing the NEC MultiSync LCD2470WNX for about $800. This is all before taxes, shipping, etc. Any thoughts? I'm a little out of touch with new models. Is there any other brand/model you'd suggest?

Cheers.
 
I'd seriously consider the Hewlett Packard LP2475w were I you. You can get them refurbished (1 year warranty from HP) for ~$500 shipped, ~$600 shipped for a new one. I'd probably go for the new one, as it has a 5 year warranty. That's still ~$150 less than it was 2-3 months ago.
 
Thanks for the reply. Should have noted, the pricing is in Canadian dollars. The NEC is $800CDN, I can see the LP2475w for $748CDN (prior to taxes and shipping). Is there a major difference between the two?

EDIT: Found an in-depth review on TFT Central: http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/hp_lp2475w.htm

EDIT2: Hmm. H-IPS? Seems to be a major boon to black levels. Awesome.
 
Sorry -- as a stupid American I am contractually obligated to assume everyone lives here and uses my odd looking money.

Can you get the Dell refurbished 3007wfp 30" there for a reasonable price? Comes with the normal 3 year warranty through Dell. They're ~$750 here. IPS, reasonably low input lag, not bad on the ghosting as I understand. Only real issue with those is properly driving the thing -- anything less than a 4870x2 or GTX 295 (or GTX 280 SLI / 4870 1GB CrossfireX) can't really pull it off so well.
 
Back when I was a wide-eyed dreamer, considering a 30" display before I realized I had no where near the horsepower to do it justice, both the Dell 3007wfp and the LP3065 30" were my objects of affection. Of course, the 3008wfp was on my radar, but the absurd pricing puts it in a ballpark I'm not willing to visit. The 3007wfp-hc is still available on Dell.ca for $1,299.99 before taxes/ship. No sign of a refurb. I'd have to call Dell and talk to someone in India for details. I'm certain the additional $500 puts it out of my reach. The refurb would have to be markedly cheaper, if one even exists.

I'm actually considering an upgrade to a 295gtx, if not one of the 200-series re-spin GPUs due to drop in the next few months. I've long considered 1920x1200 to be the sweetspot in terms of resolution ... but I'm not immune. 2560 x 1600 is sick and tempting. The 295gtx actually suffers at that resolution compared to to the 4870x2 due to the differences in memory, but it wins quite handily in 19x12 - but that's another topic. Regardless, the extra $500 required to jump to 30" would cripple my GPU upgrade budget and make the entire operation pointless. Unless I can swing a miracle ...

What's your take on the Samsung 305t? Oh wait. It's PVA, isn't it?
 
Best I can do on a LP2475W is $871.36 CDN after taxes and shipping. Not too horrible for what looks to be an excellent 24" display. I'll definitely be giving it some thought. Thanks for your help, silent!

If anyone has any additional thoughts regarding the LP2475W versus the LCD2470WNX, I'd be more than willing to listen! :D

EDIT: Wait, barf. Is the NEC a PVA panel? For some reason, I thought it was IPS! Boooo! That might make my decision for me.
 
So ... is the LP2475W H-IPS or no? The TFT Central review says it is, PRAD says S-IPS.

Also, what's the word on HP's dead pixel policy? I've heard they have zero tolerance for dead pixels, but I haven't been able to find anything recent.

And, what's the word on the NEC MultiSync 24WMGX?
 
Deeky said:
So ... is the LP2475W H-IPS or no? The TFT Central review says it is, PRAD says S-IPS.

Also, what's the word on HP's dead pixel policy? I've heard they have zero tolerance for dead pixels, but I haven't been able to find anything recent.

And, what's the word on the NEC MultiSync 24WMGX?
Click to expand...

Yes, the LP2475W is definitely H-IPS. I believe it is one of the newest LG panels.
 
Has anyone experienced the supposed inverse ghosting on the LP2475W? Is it a big deal? PRAD and TFT Central seem to be at odds over quite a bit, most importantly input lag. TFT claims 25ms average, PRAD quite a bit higher. Naturally, this is my biggest concern with the IPS panel. Can anyone bring end user experience to the table?
 
Okay. I've just about reached a decision. Opinions welcome!

It's between the BenQ G2400WD and the LP2475W. There's no need to go into the ups and downs of TN versus IPS, I'm all up to speed. But, the jury is still out on a few issues:

1) Calibration. While the majority of monitors tend to be ass out of the box, the LP2475W is quite terrible. I've found a Spyder2 for less than $100. I realize the new Spyder3 is available, but I'm looking to spend as little as possible on calibration. Would an old Spyder2 be worth the investment? Is it still capable?

2) DisplayPort. I know nothing about it. The HP's got it, the BenQ doesn't. Is this something I should be looking to future-proof?

3) Wide gamut. This is a tough one, with regard to the LP2475W. I have no idea how offended I will ultimately be by a calibrated wide gamut display. I've seen plenty of horrid uncalibrated examples on store shelves, but I refuse to consider those as a point of reference (though I do appreciate the more vivid red seen in the "Future Shop" logo, if that says anything). I've heard people say they're happy after turning the brightness down to 10% and adjusting the RGB to values found on TFT, but then I hear others complaining even after using expensive calibration equipment. To be honest, this one scares me a little. If I knew for a fact that Windows 7 supported extended gamut ... but no one seems to know either way ...

Of course, there's also the classic input lag versus color accuracy concerns. Viewing angles ...? My current Sammy 22" has 160/160 angles and it's never bothered me, but I'm concerned that the jump to 24" will really highlight this particular BenQ weakness.

So? Cheap and easy with the BenQ? No input lag concern, that's a big plus. Or, ultimate PQ with H-IPS, but the wide gamut gamble and the potential for uneven backlighting, bad text, color shift from left to right, etc. The price tag is steep, but the potential payoff is high.

Final thoughts?
 
Display Port is basically the next iteration of DVI, from what I've seen. DVI is likely to be around for quite a while, but if you intend to keep the monitor for more than three or so years I would be considering Display Port a plus.

The TFTCentral profile has been reported as very accurate by the majority of users, but if you want to calibrate yourself the Spyder2 would be more than sufficient.

Wide gamut is really a personal preference thing. It doesn't bother me, but that's very much up to you. Support is, as you've said, improving, but people still bitch loudly about something that I personally don't feel is a problem in the first place.

Uneven backlighting / bad text / color shift? I didn't notice any of these issues, but as the example I saw and played with was one of the more recently manufactured models, and as it's not mine so I'm working from a limited amount of experience, I'm not entirely sure.

I would never go back to a TN. Never. On the other hand, I don't have any major issues with my current P-MVA, so we're clearly not all that similar in what we look for. Good luck.
 
Deeky said:
1) Calibration. While the majority of monitors tend to be ass out of the box, the LP2475W is quite terrible. I've found a Spyder2 for less than $100. I realize the new Spyder3 is available, but I'm looking to spend as little as possible on calibration. Would an old Spyder2 be worth the investment? Is it still capable?
Click to expand...
It's almost certainly better than no calibration at all, but I expect it won't completely handle the wide gamut. I'll know soon enough though, as I'm borrowing a friend's Spyder2 again to calibrate my new 2475 -- as soon as he can get it back from the last guy he loaned it too.

Deeky said:
2) DisplayPort. I know nothing about it. The HP's got it, the BenQ doesn't. Is this something I should be looking to future-proof?
Click to expand...
I wouldn't be too concerned about it. DisplayPort hasn't caught on much, and if/when it does, I expect it to ramp up on the consumer video side first and not on computer monitors. If you expect to connect some next-gen BluRay player or other device that is DP only, then it might be a concern, but I don't know of any that don't have HDMI (which the 2475 also supports). IOW, I personally would disregard DisplayPort for anything other than perhaps a "bonus" feature.

Deeky said:
3) Wide gamut. This is a tough one, with regard to the LP2475W. I have no idea how offended I will ultimately be by a calibrated wide gamut display. I've seen plenty of horrid uncalibrated examples on store shelves, but I refuse to consider those as a point of reference (though I do appreciate the more vivid red seen in the "Future Shop" logo, if that says anything). I've heard people say they're happy after turning the brightness down to 10% and adjusting the RGB to values found on TFT, but then I hear others complaining even after using expensive calibration equipment. To be honest, this one scares me a little. If I knew for a fact that Windows 7 supported extended gamut ... but no one seems to know either way ...
Click to expand...
Again, I find no problem with wide gamut. I think it looks great, and makes my 2407 beside it look pretty drab. I'm thinking of replacing the 2407 with a matching LP2475 in fact. If I had to gripe about wide gamut, that would be my only complaint -- that BOTH of my monitors weren't wide. It's a bit distracting to look back and forth between them, but tweaking up Nvidia's Digital Vibrance on the 2407 helps.

From all I've heard Win7 will include the same color management support as Vista, which is pretty doggone good compared to XP (which basically has nothing out of the box). Perhaps Vista is the reason that the LP2475 looks so good to me, since I've never seen it on a stock XP install. I read on another site discussing wide gamut issues that Vista PCs do look better than XP machines, at least without a lot of help and tweaking.

For my primary rig I've only owned IPS and PVA panels (Dell 2001FP, Dell 2407WFP, HP LP2475W) and I don't think I could stomach a couple of large TN's due to viewing angle issues and whatnot. I have some TN's that are used in a server console or office role that I can tolerate for that sort of thing, but certainly not for gaming and dual-monitor activity. Had I not started out with higher-end panels I probably wouldn't know any better, but I'm spoiled now.

Deeky said:
Of course, there's also the classic input lag versus color accuracy concerns. Viewing angles ...? My current Sammy 22" has 160/160 angles and it's never bothered me, but I'm concerned that the jump to 24" will really highlight this particular BenQ weakness.
Click to expand...
I gamed a bit (UT3) on the 2475 this past weekend, and I had no lag issues. Again, I'm not used to gaming on TN panels so maybe I'm not used to how fast one *can* be. But my first post-CRT LCD was a Dell 2001FP (IPS) followed by the 2407 (PVA) and the lag on either didn't bother me. YMMV of course...

Deeky said:
So? Cheap and easy with the BenQ? No input lag concern, that's a big plus. Or, ultimate PQ with H-IPS, but the wide gamut gamble and the potential for uneven backlighting, bad text, color shift from left to right, etc. The price tag is steep, but the potential payoff is high.
Click to expand...
The LP2475 and BenQ are in completely different classes. From all I hear the BenQ is a top choice in TN panels, so if you're looking for TN it sounds like a good choice, but I would take the LP2475 any day. It's like comparing a top-of-the-line Honda Civic to a BMW M3.
 
silent-circuit said:
On the other hand, I don't have any major issues with my current P-MVA, so we're clearly not all that similar in what we look for. Good luck.
Click to expand...

I'm not hating on P/MVA, I'm simply not a fan of the black crush I tend to see. While the black levels are excellent, they kill detail. As well, MVA traditionally have the worst input lag compared to TN and IPS, but this is starting to change with newer panels.

Malatov said:
It's almost certainly better than no calibration at all, but I expect it won't completely handle the wide gamut.
Click to expand...

Ooooh. Good point. That's a concern ... what's the least expensive wide gamut calibration hardware? Or is $200 the basement?

Malatov said:
The LP2475 and BenQ are in completely different classes. From all I hear the BenQ is a top choice in TN panels, so if you're looking for TN it sounds like a good choice, but I would take the LP2475 any day. It's like comparing a top-of-the-line Honda Civic to a BMW M3.
Click to expand...
Yeah. I realize it's no contest in terms of pure PQ, but I've been gaming/Photoshopping on a 22" TN panel for years and I've never had any serious qualms (nothing I do is extremely color sensitive). Part of me feels like it's time to go IPS, but the other part of me thinks, considering the price premium, that I should wait until the technology really sorts itself out - but who knows if that will ever happen?

Thanks silent-circuit and Malatov for the detailed responses! :cool:
 
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