MCW-60 Pics

[scwam]

I'm actually pretty impressed. Absolutely no shavings were in my block. There are about 3 or maybe 4 pins that seem to be missing on only one side. I believe this is because of the way it's cut and was done purposely because those pins would have been too thin to stay in, possible breaking off while in use. The way it's cut at an angle doesn't allow all those outer pins to be equal size. So as a result you can see small burs in their place instead. I really don't care because they are on the outer edge which I doubt will affect flow, turbulence or performance. I can honestly say that the finish on the base is WAY better than my MP-05 SP Limited Edition CPU block. Not only that the copper looks much brighter and shinier. The ramsinks looks like a bright new penny (I wonder if they are actually pure copper). I don't understand why my AquaXtreme cpu block isn't this shiny. So far I'm impressed with the quality of this block despite the small burs on the outer edge.

 

[DFI Daishi]

glad to hear that you got a good block.

swiftech has long been known for flat and well finished bases. it has been one of their selling points since some of their earliest blocks.

recent issues with their pins have been a glaring departure for what was previously an extremely high quality opperation. here's hoping that they get their act back together.........

not the greatest focus/anti-shake on that camera. have you tried using some kind of brace to stabilize while shooting?

 

[scwam]

I scrutinized the inside of this block closely. Even the inside of the block is sanded pretty shinny. I was specifically looking for those shavings, I couldn't find any at all. I didn't even see any copper dust coating the inside surface either. They include a lot of hardware within the box which is good. I couldn't see the mating surface being any better except if it were a mirror.

My camera just plain sucks, it was free from bellsouth. I'm a good photographer, but I no longer have tripods and such.

 

[scwam]

Temps reported are as follows, please let me know if these are good temps. I have no clue:

Running with a MP-05 SP LE CPU waterblock before the GPU waterblock I get idle temps on the swiftech of ~37c and load of 45C when card is overclocked at 495/1170. CPU is running at 2800mhz. I have not really broken 46c except maybe once or twice. This is with an open case and 21c ambient temp. Opinions?

 

[Budwise]

seems a little high... With my Storm and MCW55 and a 7800GT at 515/1270 it never went above 40C. My guess is its due to the massive restrictiveness of that CPU block...

 

[ExtraPickles]

If you blow into the inlet of the Storm and then into the inlet of the MP-05 SP LE you can easily tell the Storm is the more restrictive block... schwam, you get rid of the IHS yet?

-pickles

 

[DFI Daishi]

If you blow into the inlet of the Storm and then into the inlet of the MP-05 SP LE you can easily tell the Storm is the more restrictive block... schwam, you get rid of the IHS yet?

-pickles

air isn't quite the same as water, and resistance increases as flow increases: do you honestly know how whatever you can puff out stacks up against what a block is experiencing when a decent pump is moving water through it?

cathar tried working with microchannels.......and then abandoned them in favour or the nozzles and pits. he's human, to be sure, but the flow resistance of the microchannel approach is a major weakness to overcome.

the MP-05 has tested as a pretty restrictive block in reviews, and blocks using a similar desight have also been very high resistance. even if the storm isn't exactly free-flowing, compared to the MP-05, it's going to give better flow through the whole loop.

 

[ExtraPickles]

air isn't quite the same as water, and resistance increases as flow increases: do you honestly know how whatever you can puff out stacks up against what a block is experiencing when a decent pump is moving water through it?

cathar tried working with microchannels.......and then abandoned them in favour or the nozzles and pits. he's human, to be sure, but the flow resistance of the microchannel approach is a major weakness to overcome.

the MP-05 has tested as a pretty restrictive block in reviews, and blocks using a similar desight have also been very high resistance. even if the storm isn't exactly free-flowing, compared to the MP-05, it's going to give better flow through the whole loop.

I hear what you're saying but I've been swapping back and forth between the 2 blocks for a month and don't see it. With an Iwaki MD-20RZ I get more visual flow squirting into a res (not scientific I know) and slightly better load temps from the MP-05 SP LE. Though my testing is hardly scientific the MP-05 worked slightly better for me and I kept it and sold the Storm. I am not dissing the Storm, I use one in another box and it's a great block, but comparing the two as I've done I found the Storm more restrictive and as there has been no valid testing on the MP-05 SP LE everything else is just speculation and coulda woulda shoulda.

-pickles

.

 

[scwam]

Yeah, when I blew into it I thought it was not restrictive either. But I guess blowing into is just voodoo. I guess you could fill a tube up with water and blow the water out of each to get a better idea. As far as the IHS, I've not removed it. I'm really contemplating it though, I'm just afraid of ruining my warantee with such a good chip and screwing the chip up.

 

[DFI Daishi]

Yeah, when I blew into it I thought it was not restrictive either. But I guess blowing into is just voodoo. I guess you could fill a tube up with water and blow the water out of each to get a better idea. As far as the IHS, I've not removed it. I'm really contemplating it though, I'm just afraid of ruining my warantee with such a good chip and screwing the chip up.

90nm dual core......your warrenty is shot if you remove the IHS, not two ways about it, however if you are carefull while removing the IHS and carefull while installing the waterblock i don't see the problem: it's not all that different from working with a 130nm single core like an Athlon XP.

it's not quite the same, but taking the shim off of my x850XT was nervous business, but pretty easy all the same.

 

[DFI Daishi]

I hear what you're saying but I've been swapping back and forth between the 2 blocks for a month and don't see it. With an Iwaki MD-20RZ I get more visual flow squirting into a res (not scientific I know) and slightly better load temps from the MP-05 SP LE. Though my testing is hardly scientific the MP-05 worked slightly better for me and I kept it and sold the Storm. I am not dissing the Storm, I use one in another box and it's a great block, but comparing the two as I've done I found the Storm more restrictive and as there has been no valid testing on the MP-05 SP LE everything else is just speculation and coulda woulda shoulda..

i have pump envy.

i appreciate your testing. i'm not going to nock it. you admit that it's imperfect, and you're not trying to put it up as a professional review. cool: the MP-05 SP LE is working better for you, as far as your diode temps are reporting. i'm glad that it's working well for you.

i would like to see some good testing of the new versions of the MP-05. i don't own one. i don't own a storm. i reccomend what well executed reviews indicate is better, and more good tests only help matters.

incidently.....i am a bit weirded out by the fact that you are almost as old as my tech-illeterate father.

 

[Top Nurse]

Is it just me or do the rest of you see a milled surface here? I thought Swiftech did machine lapping on all their blocks?

 

[scwam]

Does removing the IHS devalue the resale value of the chip?

 

[Top Nurse]

Does removing the IHS devalue the resale value of the chip?

Depends on who your selling to.

 

[DFI Daishi]

Is it just me or do the rest of you see a milled surface here? I thought Swiftech did machine lapping on all their blocks?

personally, i'm seeing machine lapping marks.

milling marks are usually semi-circualr, are they not?

these straight lines look like a machine lapped surface, even if it is coarser that i would like to see.

 

[phide]

How large in the pin array? Seems to be on the fairly large side (> 3cm x 3cm).

 

[scwam]

They are straight lines. The block looks better in person and feels smooth, no sound when rubbing your fingernail against the surface. It was actually more shiny and smooth than the mp-05 SP limited ed. cpu waterblock. Copper was brighter gold color. As far as the pins: there is around 144 of them I believe I counted on the gpu waterblock. The metal is real soft, I've already got the Nvidia logo indented on the block. The mounting of it is not quite the easiest to put on without it rubbing against the core as your trying to put the screws throught the mounting holes. The ramsinks had some really crappy thermal tape as they didn't stay on the ram very well, I had to reapply my own seki-sui tape which worked better. Front 2 ramsinks had to be cut down halfway because of using 7/16" tubing. They included adapters that supposedly use 3/8" and don't need to cut the ramsinks.

 

[Top Nurse]

personally, i'm seeing machine lapping marks.

milling marks are usually semi-circualr, are they not?

these straight lines look like a machine lapped surface, even if it is coarser that i would like to see.

Looks like a large face mill machined it to me. Perhaps they are machining ten or twenty at a time. The bigger the face mill the less noticeable the lines, but those look circular to me.

 

[WCES Ryan]

Does opening up the block void the warranty or harm the seal? I should have one of these blocks coming today and I'd like to open it up and have a look inside to see what the big hubbub is allabout.

Also, how do I open it?

 

[scwam]

I'm guessing with the way companies are that it would void the warantee. It was really easy to open. Just make sure to open it as you would put a tire on a car. Go from one corner to the corner directly across it and turn each hex key an even amount of turns. Do the same when you tighten it. Don't just tight each screw down all the way and go to the next, make sure you distribute the tightening/opening evenly from one screw to the other directly on the other side of it. Don't overtighten it as you may strip the threads on the copper. Just take note on how tight it felt the first time you loosen the screws.
Let us know if you find shavings. I found none. I don't even think their was copper dust in it.

 

[Bio-Hazard]

Heck, I get a load temp of only 31c with my poor little cool running ATI X800XL OC'd with the MCW60 block.....................

 

[AtomicFire]

i've got shavings in my DD TDX

 

[MadMikeSS]

Does opening up the block void the warranty or harm the seal? I should have one of these blocks coming today and I'd like to open it up and have a look inside to see what the big hubbub is allabout.

Also, how do I open it?

I would imagine it would void the warranty. DD always puts little stickers on theirs that say "warranty void is removed". My personal opinion on this is why do they bother to send new rubber gaskets for replacements if they don't want people to open the block up to change it? No matter, I've opened up all my blocks when I have gotten them because I just don't trust them not to be 100% clean inside. I pay a lot for my watercooling gear to have shavings or crap in one block mess up my setup and subsequently also mess up my computer hardware. It's a small price to pay for my own piece of mind.

When you receive your block you'll see the screws on the top side of the block that you loosen to open up the block, it's real simple, you'll have to find your own hex wrench to do it tho, none provided.

 

[andersson.j]

If there's no sticker that breaks when you open the block, there's no way for them to tell whether or not you opened it. Hence it never happened...

I think it's got a strange design.
Why cool such a large area when you only want to cool a small gpu core? The MCW-60 base looks alot like the Apogees base. Using the same base for both blocks would save lots of money. And that's probably why they use this strange design. If it's the same baseplate you could use MCW-60 instead of Apogee in narrow cases like HTPCs and barbones.
Does anyone own both blocks? If you do, could you please check if it's the same base plate?

And why the stepped base? I hate it...
With such a large cooling area, the block would be a nice peltierblock. I'd like to see a TEC cooled gpu block with a full cover coldplate. This way you would have a sub zero core temp and pretty cold ram chips too! Insulation would be a bitch though!

 

[WCES Ryan]

Not a great pic, but here are the pins on my MCW-60.... no shavings inside and it doesn't appear that anything is out of order, I will have to see how it performs and then I will post my REAL opinion on it

 

[plywood99]

Is it just me or do the rest of you see a milled surface here? I thought Swiftech did machine lapping on all their blocks?

That is most certainly not a milled face...

 

[plywood99]

air isn't quite the same as water, and resistance increases as flow increases: do you honestly know how whatever you can puff out stacks up against what a block is experiencing when a decent pump is moving water through it?

the MP-05 has tested as a pretty restrictive block in reviews, and blocks using a similar desight have also been very high resistance. even if the storm isn't exactly free-flowing, compared to the MP-05, it's going to give better flow through the whole loop.

Actually, blowing into the block is a simple and effective way of testing for resistance. Not as accurate as a flow meter or timed flow of course. I have done this many times myself when testing small mods on blocks and loop changes.

And I agree with Pickles on LE version of MP-05 when it comes to restriction. Remember the testing done by Lee was with a faulty block, jets not lined up correctly with base plate. Add that and the revisions to increase flow, should make for a less restrictive block...

 

[plywood99]

If there's no sticker that breaks when you open the block, there's no way for them to tell whether or not you opened it. Hence it never happened...

I think it's got a strange design.
Why cool such a large area when you only want to cool a small gpu core? The MCW-60 base looks alot like the Apogees base. Using the same base for both blocks would save lots of money. And that's probably why they use this strange design. If it's the same baseplate you could use MCW-60 instead of Apogee in narrow cases like HTPCs and barbones.
Does anyone own both blocks? If you do, could you please check if it's the same base plate?

And why the stepped base? I hate it...
With such a large cooling area, the block would be a nice peltierblock. I'd like to see a TEC cooled gpu block with a full cover coldplate. This way you would have a sub zero core temp and pretty cold ram chips too! Insulation would be a bitch though!

IIRC Apogee and MCW-60 share the same base. Only the top and mounting plate change...

 

[scwam]

I had rma'd my 7800GT last month to get one that clocks even higher at 520/1250 and teh temp runs lower at even higher ambient temp. The maximum I've been able to get this core was 38-39c using this block after hours of gaming. The core ran hot on my other card. I though cores of the same cards all ran the same temps.... apparently not.

 

[Erasmus354]

I had rma'd my 7800GT last month to get one that clocks even higher at 520/1250 and teh temp runs lower at even higher ambient temp. The maximum I've been able to get this core was 38-39c using this block after hours of gaming. The core ran hot on my other card. I though cores of the same cards all ran the same temps.... apparently not.

Im sorry I have to say it....you said you RMA'd the card because it wouldn't overclock high enough ?!?

 

[Bbq]

I would imagine it would void the warranty. DD always puts little stickers on theirs that say "warranty void is removed".

The DD 'warrenty void' stickers are actually not an indication of void warrenty, They are there to show people that if the seal isn't broken, then it's quality assured.

personally, i'm seeing machine lapping marks.

milling marks are usually semi-circualr, are they not?

these straight lines look like a machine lapped surface, even if it is coarser that i would like to see.

Big ass facemill ?

Does removing the IHS devalue the resale value of the chip?

To normal people, Yes. It voids warrenty (who needs it anyways) and makes it easier to screw up. To others, it's worth the +-10 degree decrease.

i've got shavings in my DD TDX

pop 'er open and remove ?

I had rma'd my 7800GT last month to get one that clocks even higher at 520/1250 and teh temp runs lower at even higher ambient temp. The maximum I've been able to get this core was 38-39c using this block after hours of gaming. The core ran hot on my other card. I though cores of the same cards all ran the same temps.... apparently not.

Instead of flaming you, lets just say: RMA is for DEFECTIVE products. If you want a better overclocker, then buy a new card. I'm sorry, but I don't agree. If you're not satisfied, too bad. Overclocks all vary from system to system, even day to day.

 

[Demon_of_The_Fall]

I had rma'd my 7800GT last month to get one that clocks even higher at 520/1250 and teh temp runs lower at even higher ambient temp. The maximum I've been able to get this core was 38-39c using this block after hours of gaming. The core ran hot on my other card. I though cores of the same cards all ran the same temps.... apparently not.

wow that is lame. Way to be a jerk.

 

[scwam]

Bahoops. Misunderstanding. Maybe I should have said "rma'd my card to end up getting a card that overclocks more."

Yeah, the card went defective. Random lines and crashes especially when i just started to get worm. I think it had a bad ram chip in it. I really doubt Evga would have taken the card back as "unsatisfactory overclock."
The point is that this core despite being able to oc much better ran much cooler.... ~7c cooler.