How Much Tygon For Stacker?

[Justintoxicated]

Ok I'm new to liquid cooling and don't have the case yet, but it is on the way here and I want to order some more parts right away since my old PC Died..

I'm going to put together a kit similar to th e Swiftech Apogee kit, only with a storm and 2x120 DD Radiator.

How much Tygon would I need to set something like this up?

Not sure If I want to go with a T-line or Resevoir, but hell I was even thinking about making some kind of fill port in the top of the case (not sure yet though how this would be done)

Thanks.

 

[zog]

I have an original Stacker. Running with a pump, 2 blocks, res, and double heater core I ended using a little over 3ft of Tygon. It will vary with what/where you are installing and how you do your tube runs.

When you say a "DD radiator" are you talking about the double heater core they sell? The double heatercore DD sells is too wide to fit within a Stackers (original) drive rails without doing some extensive case modifications. A double Thermochill or Black Ice will fit without problem.

If you are looking for a double heatercore that will fit within a Stackers' drive rails then I could recommend 2Fresh (HardForum) or Weapon (Overclockers Forum) that sell premodded cores. Both have excellent reps. Or you could pick up a 2-302 core for a 77 Bonneville at an auto parts store and mod it yourself.

Hope this helps

Zog

 

[Justintoxicated]

I have an original Stacker. Running with a pump, 2 blocks, res, and double heater core I ended using a little over 3ft of Tygon. It will vary with what/where you are installing and how you do your tube runs.

When you say a "DD radiator" are you talking about the double heater core they sell? The double heatercore DD sells is too wide to fit within a Stackers (original) drive rails without doing some extensive case modifications. A double Thermochill or Black Ice will fit without problem.

If you are looking for a double heatercore that will fit within a Stackers' drive rails then I could recommend 2Fresh (HardForum) or Weapon (Overclockers Forum) that sell premodded cores. Both have excellent reps. Or you could pick up a 2-302 core for a 77 Bonneville at an auto parts store and mod it yourself.

Hope this helps

Zog

Great thanks for the heads up on the heatercores! Ya I need a 120mm double. What is the difference between the pre-modded ones and the Black Ice?

I might be getting SLI video cards but it sounds like 6 feet of tygon would be enough then with a little room to spare?

 

[boof]

The difference between Black Ice rads and heatercores is that BIs are specifically designed for watercooling (built in fan holes, etc) whereas heatercores are taken from cars. Heatercores are generally slightly better performers.
6 feet of tygon should probably be fine. More can never hurt though (except the wallet).

 

[Justintoxicated]

The difference between Black Ice rads and heatercores is that BIs are specifically designed for watercooling (built in fan holes, etc) whereas heatercores are taken from cars. Heatercores are generally slightly better performers.
6 feet of tygon should probably be fine. More can never hurt though (except the wallet).

Thanks, I'll go for 10 feet then!

But on the radiators, I know heatercores are taken from cars, but I was curious on what needs to be modified on them to fit in the front of a stacker?

In other Words, what is the difference in buying the Black Ice, Thermo Chill, or a heatercore modified by 2Fresh or Weapon? What is my best bet I only want to have to buy one!

I take it no one is using Fan Shrouds anymore?

$30 sounds like alot for tubing I guess, but it is what it is!

 

[penguin]

Go for some MasterKleer from McMaster-Carr.
It's basically non-food rated Tygon, and it costs about $.45 / foot.

 

[Justintoxicated]

Go for some MasterKleer from McMaster-Carr.
It's basically non-food rated Tygon, and it costs about $.45 / foot.

Thats quite a cost difference, so the tubing looks and works the same too?


If so I'll just get 20 feet! just because...

Thanks.

Still not sure what radiator to get for the stacker now, Don't understand the differences.

 

[sprocket]

Heatercores typically have a thicker matrix and denser fins, so they benefit from higher pressure/CFM fans.
The "PC specific" radiators (think the Thermochill PA series) are thinner and can perform well will slower, hence quieter, fans.
Either route works.

 

[zog]

Its not so much modding the heatercore to fit. It more lies in modding the inlet/outlet pipes in order to fit your tubing. A 2-302 has a inlet pipe dimension of .75" and an outlet pipe dimension of .625". Some people just cut the original fittings off and stretch the tubing over it. Others sweat/braze barbed fittings on. There is allot of different ways to mod the core to fit your size tubing. You can do a search on modding a heatercore and find out more on this.

In general the "made for PC" radiators are easier to pipe and mount fans but are more expensive. Heatercores are generally cheaper, give a slightly better cooling performance (my experience about 3-5°C) but are harder to connect and mount fans too.

A shroud will give you better perfomance and help quite fan noise. Shrouds are your friend.

Do a search. There are many topics about the advantages/disadvantages of both types.

I have tried both types. Both worked well. It basically comes down to what you want, what you are comfortable with, and how much you want to spend.

Zog

 

[Justintoxicated]

Well $10 isn't going to kill me to save me time, my time is money.

I want something that will work well withquieter lower CFM fans, I was looking into something like the Panaflo wave bearing fans, they seem to be a good choise and up to 80 CFM which is decent without alot of noise.

Noise is definately a concern this time around. Sounds like perhaps the Black Ice is my best bet.

Not sure how to mount this to the front of a stacker though. I have sceen it done, I guess I figured more people would have done this.

Zog how did you mount your radiator in your origional stacker (same one I am getting) and what rez are you using? Any Pics?

I was hoping to get a radiator and shroud that would go in the front of my case without having to make anything special.

I'm confused what makes some blackice radiators so much better than the others? Are they worth the price for example there is a $108 and a $35 one, are they both going to work about the same?

 

[zog]

I have a double heatercore mounted in my Stacker between the drive rails in the front of the case. It takes up the lower seven(7) drive slots. I made a sheet metal shroud to mount the fans with (Not the prettiest thing but it serves it purpose). I used 2" wide velcro strips to mount the heatercore. A 4" long strip of velcro on each side and a 2" long strip on the bottom tank. Case has been rolled/carried all over the house and the heatercore has not moved.

The res I am using is a Alphacool Cape Coolplex 25 mounted vertically inside the case.

I think the Panaflo's are one of the better fans out there. There are two Panaflo Ultra's (115cfm @ 45 db) connected to a Vantec fan controller sitting on my heatercore.

Friday I am supposed to get my digital camera back from the service center. I will take some pics over the weekend and put them up.

Zog

 

[Justintoxicated]

Zog (or whoever), the thermochill is quite expensive, would it be better to put this money (about $50) towards a Storm instead of a TDX? Or should I just get their $50 Black Ice Xtreme? What about the regular one they have for $35, is this a bad radiator compared to the others? is it really worth getting a 100 radiator? If it comes down to lower fan noise I would gladly spend $50 to have closer to silence.

I PMed 2Fresh, but this one does not look like it comes with a shroud, and it's a heatercore right so it would not work well with low CFM fans?

BlackIce Pro II,
BlackIce Xtreme (sounds like it might need high CFM fans?)

Xflow or regular?

or
Just get the

Thermochill PA 120.2?

 

[zog]

From MY experience and research:

BIP: (about 1" thick, high fin density) works well with low CFM fans and will benefit from high CFM fans

BIX: (about 1.75" thick, high fin density) works slightly worse (maybe 1-2°C) than BIP with low CFM fans but will perform better with high CFM fans

Black Ice X-flow series: I have not used or researched

Thermochill 120.2: (about 1" thick, very high fin density) will work with low CFM fans but they were designed to work with high CFM

Thermochill PA series: I have not used, but they are being billed as being very effective with low CFM fans

Heatercore: (about 2" thick, moderate fin density) works well with low CFM fans and even better with high CFM fans

I dont know what your primary application will be with the computer but you might want to think about a fan controller. For general use (e.g. surfing the net, word processing, etc.) you could turn the fans down so they are almost silent and then ramp them up for max cooling when using cpu/gpu intensive programs (e.g. gaming, video editing, etc.)

There are allot of choices and variables involved with watercooling. I researched and asked questions on forums for about 4 months before I set up my 1st watercooled rig.

Zog

 

[sprocket]

I have two Weapon heatercore/shrouds (302 dualpass and 342 singlepass), a BIX3 and a Thermochill PA120.3
Temps using the first three units were identical, although to my ear the BIX was a bit quieter...I'm guessing less turbulance through the core?

The Thermochill is the easiest to mount (holes alredy drilled in the sideplates) and (reputedly) does not require a shroud. My build is not yet finished so temps are unknown but an initial test with fans (Aerocool 140mm, also new and unproven) leads me to believe that it will be the quietest of the group.

I was able to run the first three passively most of the time, which is where using an oversized rad becomes worth the extra space it requires.
Im hoping for similar results withe the PA- time will tell.

 

[Justintoxicated]

yea I am researching believe me but I don't have 4 months because my PC died, I got Battlefield 2 and 2 gigs of OCZ for X-mas that seem to have killed my system.

I have been waiting forever to play this game and want to do so before it is obsolete!

The ans I'm thinking about using anre Panaflos something like 80CFM @ 35 DB

These are the fans I am considering.

http://www.svc.com/12aocalframc.html

http://www.svc.com/fba12g12l1a.html

http://www.svc.com/fba12g12m1a.html

http://www.svc.com/fba12g12m-nba.html

Will Definately be purchasing a fan Controller, Maybe Another Nexus, I don't trust the cheap ones anymore as the last one (Aerocool) is likely what caused my last PC's death, the fan controller burned out but only partialy, so the low RPM alarm did not go off, but the fan would nt spin up all the way (CPU FAN!) when plugged into oine channel on the Areocool controller. not only that but then Aerocool told me they "might" be able to fix it for $20, but even if they can't it is a $20 charge! I'll never purchase another Aerocool product again EVER.

procket, IYO, do you feel the thermochill double is worth $108? No1 has tested the X-flow? I mgiht just go with the Modded heatercore from 2Fresh? let me Know I will spend the extra cash if it will make a pretty noticable difference.

Thanks.

Looking for reviews online but having a hard time finding any...

 

[sprocket]

Sprocket, IYO, do you feel the thermochill double is worth $108? .

I got the 120.3 (for slightly more money) and yes, I do feel it is worth it.
You can use very low CFM fans and still achieve good cooling (I can't prove this until my loop is up and running again, but tests with my inaudible/slow Aerocool fans show excellent airflow through the matrix so I'm fairly confident).
Build quality is very good also.