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5900 vs. 9700 Pro

F

Fetti

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 24, 2004
Messages
131
I know this debate goes back a LONG way.

I have ALWAYS been a fan of Nvidia hardware and their driver team. I have never had a problem installing their drivers. They just install and forget basically. They have some really nice hardware. I even baught a 5900 even though people said the 9700/9800 was better. Of course, that's mostly ATI fanboyism speaking with some people that actually had used both and were speaking from experience.

I recently picked up a 9700 Pro for a system I was building a friend. I got a really good deal on it compared to a 5900 and so I went with the 9700. I was also curious of what the REAL difference was. I wanted to PERSONALLY see the difference. I wanted to see for myself proof of whether there really was any difference. I know ATI had a better AA engine as I could see that myself in pics people have posted.

Well, the day came, I got the 9700 installed in her system. The 4.2 drivers actually installed first time without a hitch and no problems in any of the games. I got it all working and stuff installed and decided to see if I could see a real difference.

I fired up both systems side by side. I loaded up EQ and SWG and began to compare. I took screenshots, I looked at both screens in the game and so on.

My 5900 was faster than the 9700 Pro. I got better FPS and it seemed smoother. The only other operational difference was in SWG near water. On my 5900, the controls become sluggish around water. It has to do with their particle system and pixel/vertex shader system as I can choose options to stop it. With the 9700 Pro, no sluggishness at all around water.

Now comes the image quality test. I had both systems set to the highest quality settings and 2xAA, 4xAF.

The 9700 Pro had a richer looking picture and in EQ, the tiles on the buildings in Plane of Knowledge looked a lot more defined and sharper. On the 5900, even with 4xAF, the tiles on the roof had more blur to them, especially the lines seperating the tiles. The 9700, the lines were nice a crisp.

The 9700 Pro had a much better image quality. Everything else though was basically the same with the 5900 being faster for ME in the games I was playing. No synthetic benchmarks. Picture quality though goes to the 9700 Pro.

I know, you going to say we told you so and the majority of the hardware review sites say so also BUT, they NEVER test Online games and they never tested the games *I* play. It's always Doom this and Quake that. I understand because that's what a LOT of people play. I just had to see for myself though in the stuff I played.

I still love my 5900 though but, I will definately be looking at a Radeon also for my next upgrade. It just depends on how things go with Nvidia and ATI in the coming months.
 
Were the boxes the cards on similar? Also, I highly doubt the 5900 had the same AA and AF settings the 9700 pro had when you got better fps with the 5900, that'd be ludicrous.

I'm not a fanboy, but every benchmark I've seen has the entire nvidia gfx card stock at lower fps with the same aa and af as either of the 9700/9800 line.

~Adam
 
Originally posted by CleanSlate
Were the boxes the cards on similar? Also, I highly doubt the 5900 had the same AA and AF settings the 9700 pro had when you got better fps with the 5900, that'd be ludicrous.

I'm not a fanboy, but every benchmark I've seen has the entire nvidia gfx card stock at lower fps with the same aa and af as either of the 9700/9800 line.

~Adam
Click to expand...

That's mainly when you start introducing higher levels of AA/AF, like 4xAA/8xAF, he was doing 2xAA/4xAF and typically 5900's win with those levels.
 
My old ti 4600 also had significant particle problems like you said with the 5900. When smoke or large bushes appeared in any of my games, the framerate dropped to high hell.. Went to a 9800 pro and will never look back.
 
I have a couple of friends who use 5900s on MMORPGS and I still think my 9700 has a lot better IQ in FFXI than the 5900.
 
5900 system - AN7 - AMD XP-M 2400+ @ 2.2ghz 200x11 PC3500

9700 Pro - NF7-S - AMD 2100+ @ 2.2ghz 200x11 PC3200

Mojo3k70 aye, I see the same thing. In SWG, any HIGH particle usage and my FPS on the 5900 starts bouncing bad or controls become sluggish. They added a particle slider though and that helped. The 5900 can't handle their particle system as well as the 9700 does. It still handles it ok, you learn how to get around it though.

If you take the variations into account, you could say the 5900 and 9700 are very very close performance wise, in the games I play but, when you have the 9700 running almost as good but, also having a better looking picture, well, lets just say I have changed my mind about Radeon cards. AT least the 9xxx series.

I have seen some benchmarks and games where the 5900 wins and some where the 9700/9800 wins. I have never seen the 9700/9800 walk away a total 100% winner everytime. It's usually back and forth with the Radeons winning in IQ. Least that's what I have seen. Now I see it in person on the MMORPGs I play and the way I play.

I know most of you have heard this time and again and sorry if I am just repeating things everyone already knows. I just thought it would be good to hear from another person that has no agenda other than reporting their own personal experiences and not a web site that may have some hidden agenda or prefer one card over the other (not all do this by no means). I have been a hardcore Nvidia user ever since the TNT cards.

I'm a believer and convert :)

Of course, I am still going to wait and see what happens in the coming months with both companies before I upgrade my personal system. I just hope Nvidia can get their IQ up to par with the 9xxx series.
 
Pretty amazing considering that the 9700 is over a year and a half old...

Good to finally see a conclusive user test and not just the usual rigged benchmarks.

I wouldn't devote myself to any one company, though. The winds of fortune change very rapidly, and the videocard market is no exception. With every new generation, it seems the definitive lead switches. With the GF2 and GF3, it was nVidia. With the GF4 and GFFX, ATI has held the reins. The NV40 and R420 will likely change this once again - everything I've read suggests that the NV40 will come out on top. Ah, well, we'll just have to see...
 
Thanks! I was looking for a post like this. Looks like I'll be going with the 9700 pro.
 
The t-bred core in the 2100+ has LESS cache than the barton core of the 2400+... not to mention the slower ram speeds... Switch the cards and bench again and see if there is a difference... my money is on that there is a large difference.

~Adam
 
Yeah I have converted a few people too but in my part of the world, nVidia is where it's at. People just do not want to buy ATi because they are misinformed. A dude just purchased an fx 5200 over a Radeon 9100. How friggin stupid is that? They would buy fx 5600 ultra rev 2 boards and not go for the 9600XT. Some are wise and get the fx 5700 w/ tsop memory instead :rolleyes:

Anyways as far as the 9800 Pro and Fx 5900 Ultra tests go, I too have personally tested them. 9800 Pro wins IQ hands down. It wins at higher AA/AF levels also. Secondly, somehow the fx 5900 series looks fuzzy after watching a Radeon 9700/9800 series card. Secondly, I did not bench any MMOs but the games I benched (action, racing and strategy and 1 RPG -- Max Payne 2, NFSU, Collin McRae 04 Demo, Gangland SP Demo, Halo, UT2004 Demo, Painkiller Demo, Far Cry Sp Demo, SW KOTOR, Warcraft 3, C&C Generals) in all games when played on a 2.6C Rig w/ ddr 400 and 4xAA and 8xAF, my 9800 Pro benched higher than 5900 Ultra except SWKOTOR for which I blame Bioware :p.

I would recommend Radeon 9800 series to anyone looking for a cheap high end gaming solution w/o hassles of the fx series. nVidia drivers are pretty much in similar shit as the Radeon Drivers. Catalyst 4.2s have served me well.
 
Aye, after playing online a bit with her system to test it out to make sure it's stable, then switching to my system, I can tell a difference. The 5900 is a little fuzzier.

I have never had a single problem with any Nvidia driver since TNT days so, no problem there. They have been great to me and I have always liked the cards.

Things are changing though and ATI seems ot have gotten their act together pretty much.

They have had nice hardware that competed with Nvidia finally since the 9500 but, their drivers were still subpar. Seems they have gotten that worked out for the most part now though.

Yea, I only tested 2xAA and 4xAF as that's normally what I play at in SWG.

MMORPGs are a little different than FPS games. Online games, you get crowds of 20,30 or more people in a small area and that puts a strain on systems. It's a different breed and I finally got to physically test them side by side myself.

I don't think the performance would change all that much switching the cards around. My 5900 performed pretty much the same in the Tbred system as it does the Barton system. There isn't enough of a difference in SWG to even notice speed wise.

The Image Quality though, you can't argue with that. Ther eIS a difference there. So, speed wise, they about the same, IQ wise, the 9700 wins hands down.

Yea, ther eare a lot of people that just don't know the difference in the cards. They go out and buy a regular 5600 with 256mb memory because they think the extra memory will make a huge difference. The plain 5600 is a dog though for online games.

The 5700 Ultra now, that and the 9600XT are neck and neck but, again there is the IQ difference.

Can't wait to see what the next few months bring. I'll hold out on upgrading my main system as the 5900 still serves me well. Besides, when the new stuff comes out, the 9800s will drop even more in price :)
 
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