'Miracle' Tech Turns Water into Fuel

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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May 9, 2000
Messages
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We’ve all heard these claims for many years about turning water into fuel and now it seems, that those rumors are very true. Sunfire, a German firm, has produced a machine that can take ordinary water and carbon dioxide and produce a useable synthetic fuel. It’s a small step, but a step in the right direction.

The rig, at this stage, is for demonstration and feasiblity purposes; its capacity for CO2 recycling is currently at around 3.2 tonnes per day, and it has the capacity to produce a barrel of fuel per day.
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I heard about this on Coast to Coast like a year ago I'm sure it's possible world will be fully polluted when this finally comes out =)
 
jnmunsey said:
Of course no mention on how much energy is used to create this fuel...
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At small scale they claim with Solar and wind, so I guess when the solar panels don't have sufficient sun (night and cloudy days) and the wind isnt blowing they will use normal electricity from coal, gas or nuke, which will end up being the majority of the time. So we will burn tons of fossil fuels to make synthetic fossil fuels.

Yes, good plan.
 
*Wonders when some oil/gas company will either buy it or kill off the people working on it.
 
schizrade said:
At small scale they claim with Solar and wind, so I guess when the solar panels don't have sufficient sun (night and cloudy days) and the wind isnt blowing they will use normal electricity from coal, gas or nuke, which will end up being the majority of the time. So we will burn tons of fossil fuels to make synthetic fossil fuels.

Yes, good plan.
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There is no point running it when there is no solar/wind. It doesn't have to keep up with hourly demand, just daily demand.

My guess is that it won't even be connected to the power grid, and will be wired straight to dedicated panels and turbines instead, and they will have it automatically turn itself on and off depending on the sun and wind.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
According to libertarians and anarchists, companies never do evil things.
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According to the 'enlightened' governments never do either.

Anyway, libertarians don't actually believe that. But they believe the cure is oft worse than the disease.
 
jpm100 said:
According to the 'enlightened' governments never do either.
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No one is free of that kinda guilt and if you count the prosecution of war, then governments probably have done worse. Then again, governments aren't going away and...

Anyway, libertarians don't actually believe that. But they believe the cure is oft worse than the disease.
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...the founders of libertarians, the Koch brothers, leverage their government very heavily to serve their own interests and benefit their corporations so I highly suspect anything in the libertarian doctorine as truthful or genuine given the bigness of their funding and lobbying efforts which speak to conventional government procedures and processes. Their whole thing is just a scammy way of gathering the support of people who don't wanna think critically.
 
I thought the Fischer-Tropp process required coal as an input. If they've done away with that and can convert electricity to petrol and oil and can scale it then this is indeed useful as you could use the electricity generated by nuclear power stations.
 
70% efficiency could mean 70% of the reactants convert to product. I highly doubt it includes energy necessary for heating. There are a number of companies working in the biofuel space and there are a number of companies that have gone bankrupt. Fuel from oil is incredibly cheap which makes any alternative tech have a tough road ahead of it. I see someone mentioned Fischer-Tropsch which this isn't. In fischer-tropsch you feed hydrogen and usually carbon monoxide to get alkanes and water. Here they are using water and carbon dioxide to get fuels. I'd be happy if one of these products really got off the ground, but barrel scale doesn't mean shit. You need thousands of barrels per day to be economical, then we will talk.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
No one is free of that kinda guilt and if you count the prosecution of war, then governments probably have done worse. Then again, governments aren't going away and...
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No, but they can be kept small which limits the damage and aspirations.
...the founders of libertarians, the Koch brothers, leverage their government very heavily to serve their own interests and benefit their corporations so I highly suspect anything in the libertarian doctorine as truthful or genuine given the bigness of their funding and lobbying efforts which speak to conventional government procedures and processes. Their whole thing is just a scammy way of gathering the support of people who don't wanna think critically.
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The evil Koch brother conspiracy. Have fun with that.
 
jpm100 said:
No, but they can be kept small which limits the damage and aspirations.
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Yes, they can, but then again it's a lot easier to get a small number of people to do something unethical than it is in a larger organization. It's also difficult to offer a full suite of services that would otherwise not be provided by private industry without a substantial workforce.

The evil Koch brother conspiracy. Have fun with that.
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I do. :) Partly because they make it easy and partly because it's true and quite a few libertarians aren't even aware that the ideology they support originates from a couple of people who are central to the very things they object to like shadow companies to fund elected officials and that ilk.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Yes, they can, but then again it's a lot easier to get a small number of people to do something unethical than it is in a larger organization.
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Not sure about that!!
- Smoking industry has hidden important data for years if not decades
- Global warming skeptic organizations mainly funded by oil companies
 
MaddBomber83 said:
http://www.defensenews.com/article/...y-Converting-Seawater-Into-Fuel-Game-Changer-

This is any different from the US Navy? They mention the tech is proven, but still a decade off from having it to the point that they put it on ships.
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Different. The navy is working in a more developed area, that of the Fischer-Tropsch process. All they have to worry about is extracting the necessary reactants from sea water. I'm guessing they are probably splitting water to get hydrogen/oxygen and dumping the oxygen while keeping the hydrogen. If the level of dissolved CO is high enough you'd probably be able to capture it as it bubbles out before you actually get high enough voltage to split water. The difficulties of the navy are mainly seperatory in nature. How do you get just Hydrogen and just carbon monoxide out of the complex clusterfuck of seawater? They can be as inefficient as they want because onboard nuclear reactors mean you have enough power for just about whatever you want.
 
RadXge said:
Not sure about that!!
- Smoking industry has hidden important data for years if not decades
- Global warming skeptic organizations mainly funded by oil companies
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You do have a point. I think the monetary incentives were pretty important factors in the smoking thing and mental defects of people with addiction-prone minds also influenced that whole thing sorta. I mean really, there are still people that insist smoking isn't harmful even now. Sure we kinda laugh and shake our heads when we hear people say that kinda thing now, but those were really, really loud voices not that long ago.

As for global warming...totally not going there in this forum. There are too many old people who are just soo waiting to get into an argument about that so they can use it as a reason to stick in broasting about their cars or their computers. :p
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Yes, they can, but then again it's a lot easier to get a small number of people to do something unethical than it is in a larger organization. It's also difficult to offer a full suite of services that would otherwise not be provided by private industry without a substantial workforce.



I do. :) Partly because they make it easy and partly because it's true and quite a few libertarians aren't even aware that the ideology they support originates from a couple of people who are central to the very things they object to like shadow companies to fund elected officials and that ilk.
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Do you realize how insane you sound? LMAO.

"IT'S THE KOCH BROITHERS AND THE ILLUMINATTI!!!! THE POPE EATS BABIES TO GAIN POWER!!!"

Companies and wealthy interests have always rallied around their interests in political figures. This is nothing new. How do you think Barak Obama got elected? Love and unicorns? Nope. Big money and lobby.

The *philosophy* of libertarianism has been around long before the Koch Brothers. Read a few books, don't be such a damn tool for christs sake. Hint, these philosophies were at the heart of the enlightenment, which we have moved farther and farther away from since the dawn of the 20th century. Anti-rationalists are in charge.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
You do have a point. I think the monetary incentives were pretty important factors in the smoking thing and mental defects of people with addiction-prone minds also influenced that whole thing sorta. I mean really, there are still people that insist smoking isn't harmful even now. Sure we kinda laugh and shake our heads when we hear people say that kinda thing now, but those were really, really loud voices not that long ago.

As for global warming...totally not going there in this forum. There are too many old people who are just soo waiting to get into an argument about that so they can use it as a reason to stick in broasting about their cars or their computers. :p
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People have known for centuries that smoking is bad for you and kills you. That doesn't seem to stop people does it? Same with drinking.

Guess you cannot control humanity with a decree. Anti-rationalism.
 
lasserith said:
70% efficiency could mean 70% of the reactants convert to product. I highly doubt it includes energy necessary for heating. There are a number of companies working in the biofuel space and there are a number of companies that have gone bankrupt. Fuel from oil is incredibly cheap which makes any alternative tech have a tough road ahead of it. I see someone mentioned Fischer-Tropsch which this isn't. In fischer-tropsch you feed hydrogen and usually carbon monoxide to get alkanes and water. Here they are using water and carbon dioxide to get fuels. I'd be happy if one of these products really got off the ground, but barrel scale doesn't mean shit. You need thousands of barrels per day to be economical, then we will talk.
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Unless they sell the things small scale to consumers. I could live with a barrel a day.
 
schizrade said:
Do you realize how insane you sound? LMAO.

"IT'S THE KOCH BROITHERS AND THE ILLUMINATTI!!!! THE POPE EATS BABIES TO GAIN POWER!!!"
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Do you realize how insane you sound? We all know that all caps people are pretty much completely out there. Also, can you please hyperlink the post where I talk about the Pope's babies or the Illuminati? I'm having trouble finding it in this thread.

Anyhow, what's so insane about pointing out that someone is funding election outcomes to further their own agenda? Is it insane because it offends your personal alligence to a political ideology? I think so, because in the next paragraph of your post you go on to say...

Companies and wealthy interests have always rallied around their interests in political figures. This is nothing new. How do you think Barak Obama got elected? Love and unicorns? Nope. Big money and lobby.
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...which is pretty similar in tone and content to a post you think is insane, but about someone you personally dislike. Hmm, funny how that kinda ends up working isn't it?

The *philosophy* of libertarianism has been around long before the Koch Brothers. Read a few books, don't be such a damn tool for christs sake. Hint, these philosophies were at the heart of the enlightenment, which we have moved farther and farther away from since the dawn of the 20th century. Anti-rationalists are in charge.
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Of course they didn't come up with anything original on their own. We all are fully aware of the fact that they're just parroting something they heard somplace else.

Anyway, you're crazy-cakes and seething with political angst so I'm not gonna talk to you further about this. :)
 
So we get this working and fusion we're set. Then we can start a new problem, "we've depleted the CO2 in the air! Global cooling!"
 
Reminds me of the old Pontiac Trans-Am commercials. "with ram air technology that turns air...into fuel"
 
(Sigh) another "baby step" forward in the "public" arena. It's so frustrating to know and understand the numerous massive leaps in energy production from the days of Telsa forward that have been suppressed. Anyone who challenges one the major pillars of modern capitalism (Energy industry) with breakthroughs that challenge the systems in which Energy is used to profit ends with one of three possibilities...

1) $ell your patent to a existing Energy titan (Exxon/Mobile, BP, etc) for it to be locked away never to be released.

2) Oh your an idealist huh, cant be negotiated with? Threats and Harassment of you and everyone you care about. Character/work assassination begin at this point as well.

3) Still determined to share your life changing innovation with the world? One of two things happen at this point.

A) Law enforcement seizes all your work and shuts you down

B) You "tragically" die suddenly, often under suspicious circumstances.

In the black ops world, free energy and numerous advanced applications of it are many decades old. Humanity has been capable of thriving as a Type II civilization longer than most of us have been alive. However, this is one of the most well guarded secrets as those in power know they cannot rule and control us in such a self serving way where free energy (and thus abundance for all) thrives.

10277691_10152272424848026_2479562640803068358_n.jpg
 
B00nie said:
Unless they sell the things small scale to consumers. I could live with a barrel a day.
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A barrel of gas a day eh? 120 L in a barrel so let's pretend we're making octane (Just for shits n gigs) that means we need 739 moles of octane. So we need 8 times that amount of Carbon Monoxide (because 8 carbons in an octane) so 5912 mols of CO. In order to get that you as a user would have to separate it from air where it is something like 2-3 ppm. That means you need to filter 3 billion mols of air which is to say 67.2 billion liters of air. Not possible. Not even going to bother doing the energy calculations for 100% efficiency of separation and conversion. This kind of thing just doesn't make sense on the individual scale.
 
Dayaks said:
So we get this working and fusion we're set. Then we can start a new problem, "we've depleted the CO2 in the air! Global cooling!"
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Heh.

Actually, by its very nature, this technology will be carbon neutral, as the CO2 removed from the air will be put back when the fuel is used.
 
This tech makes the most sense used with shipping as they are sitting in water and as a whole, use plenty of fuel. If carbon monoxide is a needed component I'm sure they are looking into hybrid solutions of teaming it with a regular internal combustion engine.
 
schizrade said:
Do you realize how insane you sound? LMAO.

"IT'S THE KOCH BROITHERS AND THE ILLUMINATTI!!!! THE POPE EATS BABIES TO GAIN POWER!!!"

Companies and wealthy interests have always rallied around their interests in political figures. This is nothing new. How do you think Barak Obama got elected? Love and unicorns? Nope. Big money and lobby.

The *philosophy* of libertarianism has been around long before the Koch Brothers. Read a few books, don't be such a damn tool for christs sake. Hint, these philosophies were at the heart of the enlightenment, which we have moved farther and farther away from since the dawn of the 20th century. Anti-rationalists are in charge.
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Consider who it is you're arguing with. CUG has a distinct advantage in that he/she/it doesn't use any sort of logic or factual information in its argument/elaborate ongoing troll.
 
Parja said:
Consider who it is you're arguing with. CUG has a distinct advantage in that he/she/it doesn't use any sort of logic or factual information in its argument/elaborate ongoing troll.
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You're just jealous that you didn't think of it first. :p
 
It's no miracle, but unlike many "magic energy" articles the science in this one isn't nonsense. The article just neglects to mention any of the associated drawbacks.
 
Wait up, if you "split" water and separate the hydrogen from the oxygen then isn't hydrogen flammable and couldn't you recombined the two gasses in controlled proportions as a combustible fuel? I thought this had been done but I am unsure of the efficiency of the process.
 
Bassmankr said:
This tech makes the most sense used with shipping as they are sitting in water and as a whole, use plenty of fuel. If carbon monoxide is a needed component I'm sure they are looking into hybrid solutions of teaming it with a regular internal combustion engine.
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Sea water isn't "pure" water, there would have to be a lot of filtration going on, better have that process down and very efficient.
 
Your already there T4rd, just go buy a bottle of water at the gas station, do the math buddy, it costs more than the gas.
 
lcpiper said:
Your already there T4rd, just go buy a bottle of water at the gas station, do the math buddy, it costs more than the gas.
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Lol, well that's "premium" water. I'm just talking about regular 87 octane equivalent (tap) water. :D
 
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