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G-Sync Pulsar monitors worth waiting for? Or should I side grade to current IPS monitor?

jbltecnicspro said:
Where did you get this screenshot? I ended up returning the viewsonic OLED. I think it was a panel issue so I'm back to having the XG-2431 as my motion clarity monitor now.
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TFTC's review of the Asus model. My jaw dropped when I saw the motion clarity performance, really hoping the Acer 5K monitor is glossy as I'm seeing Pulsar as something I must have now lol.
 
jbltecnicspro said:
I think you're being a little too hard. Vinyl diehards are not the same as CRT enthusiasts. I'm a CRT enthusiast who would have gladly ditched all of my CRTs when I had them had OLED with this kind of motion clarity existed. Most of the dudes calibrating their FW900s on the huge FW900 thread are of a similar mindset.
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I dunno, I feel like it is very close. Yes there is the one feature, motion clarity, but that's it. Is that REALLY worth hanging on to it with all the other downsides? Particularly since the motion clarity benefits lessen as framerate goes up, and it can't do high frame rate. I mean I've seen CRTs recently, in a few different settings and yes they are more clear than LCD or OLED, particularly with 60 fps (or lower) content like old schools games... But everything else is so much worse I just can't see wanting to use one. Particularly with how smooth things get at 240Hz (or 480Hz). It is hanging on to one rather minor upside as the reason the technology is better.

Yes it actually is an upside, unlike the vinyl argument where all those are gone now, but it still feels similar "No my old technology is better, this one little facet makes it completely worth it! Why would you want all the other stuff that's better about newer technology? This is the only thing that matters!"
 
Sycraft said:
I dunno, I feel like it is very close. Yes there is the one feature, motion clarity, but that's it. Is that REALLY worth hanging on to it with all the other downsides? Particularly since the motion clarity benefits lessen as framerate goes up, and it can't do high frame rate. I mean I've seen CRTs recently, in a few different settings and yes they are more clear than LCD or OLED, particularly with 60 fps (or lower) content like old schools games... But everything else is so much worse I just can't see wanting to use one. Particularly with how smooth things get at 240Hz (or 480Hz). It is hanging on to one rather minor upside as the reason the technology is better.

Yes it actually is an upside, unlike the vinyl argument where all those are gone now, but it still feels similar "No my old technology is better, this one little facet makes it completely worth it! Why would you want all the other stuff that's better about newer technology? This is the only thing that matters!"
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I've had GDM-FW900 that was calibrated, a calibrated F520 and Artisan. The hype is real. Excellent examples of those monitors still hold their own today. Imagine near OLED contrast while having world-class motion clarity. 2304x1440 looked fantastic on good sets. F520 could mostly resolve 2048x1536. On a 20-inch viewable games at that resolution look razor sharp, while having native 15,000:1 contrast.

That all said, I'm completely fine with my XG-2431. At 85hz the motion clarity is a little better than the FW900. Obviously the contrast sucks ass in comparison but we can't have it all can we. :)

I read that TFT Central review MistaSparkul. Damn that looks amazing. Bring on the OLED's.
 
jbltecnicspro said:
I've had GDM-FW900 that was calibrated, a calibrated F520 and Artisan. The hype is real. Excellent examples of those monitors still hold their own today. Imagine near OLED contrast while having world-class motion clarity. 2304x1440 looked fantastic on good sets. F520 could mostly resolve 2048x1536. On a 20-inch viewable games at that resolution look razor sharp, while having native 15,000:1 contrast.
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I mean, fair I guess I can't tell you what you like and don't like. As Duke Ellington said, "If it sounds good it IS good," and that applies to looks as well and what you value and what I value can differ and neither of us are wrong. It just surprises me that the one feature is so worth it to you given all the tradeoffs. Like I got it back in the day, and when I moved from CRT to LCD I could see why others would choose not to. These days though, particularly next to OLED, I just can't see wanting one at all. There's too many advantages and while no single one is decisive, they all add up to a way better experience.
 
Sycraft said:
I mean, fair I guess I can't tell you what you like and don't like. As Duke Ellington said, "If it sounds good it IS good," and that applies to looks as well and what you value and what I value can differ and neither of us are wrong. It just surprises me that the one feature is so worth it to you given all the tradeoffs. Like I got it back in the day, and when I moved from CRT to LCD I could see why others would choose not to. These days though, particularly next to OLED, I just can't see wanting one at all. There's too many advantages and while no single one is decisive, they all add up to a way better experience.
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I’m a CRT fan with a Pulsar display, the Pulsar still has trade offs next to my OLED. I am now sacrificing Contrast in deep blacks and highlights for real HDR. IPS off angle is bad too, also that glowy vignette effect.

But motion clarity is king for me, when I go back to my OLED I’m struggling to look at it in motion. The blur is irritating/jarring my eyes are trying to look for detail that’s being hidden, maybe some people are just really sensitive to it.

I was gaming for 2 weeks on the Pulsar, went back to oled and it felt like a slap in the face.
 
brownvim said:
I’m a CRT fan with a Pulsar display, the Pulsar still has trade offs next to my OLED. I am now sacrificing Contrast in deep blacks and highlights for real HDR. IPS off angle is bad too, also that glowy vignette effect.

But motion clarity is king for me, when I go back to my OLED I’m struggling to look at it in motion. The blur is irritating/jarring my eyes are trying to look for detail that’s being hidden, maybe some people are just really sensitive to it.

I was gaming for 2 weeks on the Pulsar, went back to oled and it felt like a slap in the face.
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Could you do me a favor? In TFTC's review, he only showed pictures of ULMB 2 at 60Hz, but no photos of 120Hz. How does 120Hz ULMB2 with PW 25 look compared to TFTC's ULMB2 60Hz PW 10?
 
MistaSparkul said:
Could you do me a favor? In TFTC's review, he only showed pictures of ULMB 2 at 60Hz, but no photos of 120Hz. How does 120Hz ULMB2 with PW 25 look compared to TFTC's ULMB2 60Hz PW 10?
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I can have a look tomorrow and let you know, off memory nothing looks better than 60hz PW 10 clarity wise but its really dim.

I rolled back to the previous firmware as there's a ghosting bug between 90-180fps in Pulsar mode, ill update and let you know but I need some sleep first.
 
brownvim said:
I can have a look tomorrow and let you know, off memory nothing looks better than 60hz PW 10 clarity wise but its really dim.

I rolled back to the previous firmware as there's a ghosting bug between 90-180fps in Pulsar mode, ill update and let you know but I need some sleep first.
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Wouldn't 120Hz PW 10 look better than 60Hz PW 10 though? I'm really just wondering if there is any way to get the same image as 60Hz PW 10 by using 120Hz with a higher PW like 25 for better brightness levels as 54 nits is quite dim.
 
MistaSparkul said:
Wouldn't 120Hz PW 10 look better than 60Hz PW 10 though? I'm really just wondering if there is any way to get the same image as 60Hz PW 10 by using 120Hz with a higher PW like 25 for better brightness levels as 54 nits is quite dim.
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So, 120hz doesn't look better than the 60hz mode and what doesn't make sense is the clarity is pretty much the same along the whole PW range in 120hz mode or its very subtle, like its only effecting brightness, maybe broken or stuck tuned like the same as Pulsars 25% duty cycle.

The clarity at 120hz looks around the same as the 60hz mode at PW 60 which is 331 nits.

As you go up in frame rate to 240hz and 360hz the clarity jumps higher and higher but adjusting PW doesn't have anywhere near as much effect as the 60hz mode. Maybe they kept the PW around 25% like the Pulsar modes and didn't tune it different.
 
brownvim said:
So, 120hz doesn't look better than the 60hz mode and what doesn't make sense is the clarity is pretty much the same along the whole PW range in 120hz mode or its very subtle, like its only effecting brightness, maybe broken or stuck tuned like the same as Pulsars 25% duty cycle.

The clarity at 120hz looks around the same as the 60hz mode at PW 60 which is 331 nits.

As you go up in frame rate to 240hz and 360hz the clarity jumps higher and higher but adjusting PW doesn't have anywhere near as much effect as the 60hz mode. Maybe they kept the PW around 25% like the Pulsar modes and didn't tune it different.
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Interesting find, thanks for sharing! Wonder if they'll add the ability to tune the PW in a future firmware update.
 
MistaSparkul said:
Interesting find, thanks for sharing! Wonder if they'll add the ability to tune the PW in a future firmware update.
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Always something. Other than the fact that the XG-2431 needs QFT to make it crosstalk-free, I feel like that is the only monitor right now that "gets it right", when it comes to adjusting backlight strobing.
 
well the hype is real I joined the pulsar bandwagon and it really is clearer in motion vs oled and the best thing of all in games were you can't hit say 500 fps and are limited to like 60 or even 120 its better on pulsar vs oled. Its gonna be interesting to see pulsar as it updates in the future and they add it to more panels and even mini led monitors to pulsar at higher resolutions
 
jdizzy said:
well the hype is real I joined the pulsar bandwagon and it really is clearer in motion vs oled and the best thing of all in games were you can't hit say 500 fps and are limited to like 60 or even 120 its better on pulsar vs oled. Its gonna be interesting to see pulsar as it updates in the future and they add it to more panels and even mini led monitors to pulsar at higher resolutions
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Yeah it’s going to be a slow slow roll out. It took forever for VRR to be in everything. I modded my catleap to have gsync back in the day.
 
MistaSparkul said:
Interesting find, thanks for sharing! Wonder if they'll add the ability to tune the PW in a future firmware update.
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A new Pulsar firmware update is out today (1.1.8) that does 120hz at adjustable Pulse Widths like the 60hz mode, looks excellent in games.

Its the 60hz clarity at higher brightness, no flicker.
 

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brownvim said:
A new Pulsar firmware update is out today (1.1.8) that does 120hz at adjustable Pulse Widths like the 60hz mode, looks excellent in games.

Its the 60hz clarity at higher brightness, no flicker.
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This is exactly what I was looking for. Thanks! Do you know if this firmware update is for all models?
 
brownvim said:
Yeah all models have the 60hz and 120hz adjustable pulse width modes.

The Acer and Asus did get the updates earlier, all have the same now.
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Thanks for the info! Just placed my order for the Acer model since it's on sale. It will be here tomorrow. So excited to finally try this out!
 

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brownvim said:
A new Pulsar firmware update is out today (1.1.8) that does 120hz at adjustable Pulse Widths like the 60hz mode, looks excellent in games.

Its the 60hz clarity at higher brightness, no flicker.
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I hope this fixes an issue I've been having since 1.1.6 where the monitor loses the displayport signal every time I launch a game.
 
brownvim said:
Did you get it yet, what you think?
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Yep received it yesterday and spent the entire day playing a bunch of games on it. One small note is the firmware update port on the Acer model is covered by a piece of plastic with some really sticky glue that's a bit of a pain in the ass to remove, and it requires a micro USB cable which they don't include. The firmware update itself took about 10 minutes to complete.

Now onto Pulsar itself: WOW this thing is definitely worth the hype 100%. Totally clears my 480Hz OLED when it comes to motion clarity, and best part is that you don't need to get 360fps to achieve that. I spent hours playing Destiny 2 where my frame rate is anywhere from 200-300fps due to CPU bottlenecking and the motion clarity with Pulsar was just nuts. My PG32UCDP is already boxed up and will be heading to a new home with the Acer now being my full time monitor for anything fast paced.

Obviously, image quality on the Acer sucks being an edge lit IPS. I haven't owned such a monitor in a long time so I don't remember how much IPS glow and vignetting is a normal thing for these panel types, but mine has a lot of it and it's pretty bad. One thing that did surprise me is how well 2.25x DLDSR cleans up 1440p resolution. This is my first time ever trying out DLDSR and I was pleasantly surprised by how good it looked, makes 1440p actually not so bad to game on honestly.

Overall, Pulsar is meant for motion clarity above all else and it achieves that. If you're looking for a "do it all" monitor then a Mini LED or OLED would be a better choice. I already have a dedicated display purely for image quality so I don't really care too much about that on the Acer. Hopefully Pulsar tech gets future improvements such as working with a Mini LED backlight and being able to operate at the same time as HDR. THAT would be a true endgame do it all display.
 
Yeah I would love this in a Mini LED if they can keep it working with the backlight for the extra contrast as IPS after using an OLED is really bad.

Have you tried the 120hz ULMB2 mode yet? For anything slower paced like using a controller it has even better motion clarity than the Pulsar mode. 120hz is a little too slow for a shooter.

I have an OLED next to mine but I end up playing on the Pulsar instead because the motion is so good.
 
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brownvim said:
Yeah I would love this in a Mini LED if they can keep it working with the backlight for the extra contrast as IPS after using an OLED is really bad.

Have you tried the 120hz ULMB2 mode yet? For anything slower paced like using a controller it has even better motion clarity than the Pulsar mode.

I have an OLED next to mine but I end up playing on the Pulsar instead because the motion is so good.
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Yeah 120Hz ULMB2 is also great. For games that have a 120fps lock or even 60fps lock then you can use Nvidia's Smooth Motion to double it to 120, although the super clear motion clarity means frame doubling artifacts do become more noticeable but overall it's still a great experience. For really old games that just lack the optimization to hit very high frame rates consistently, maybe due to being single threaded perhaps, locking the frame rate to 120 and using ULMB2 is my preferred way to play. For such games I went back and fourth between 120Hz ULMB2 versus injecting HDR using RenoDX/Luma for playing on my S95F and honestly I think playing with ULMB2 is more enjoyable. Those older titles just lack overall visual fidelity to begin with so having HDR isn't really adding much for me IMO when the rest of the visuals has poor texture resolution and mediocre lighting so I'd rather just stick to the original SDR presentation and play with the best possible motion clarity.
 
Yeah its great for console gaming too, the Switch 2/PS5 Pro have never looked so good.

Excited to see how the tech develops.
 
MistaSparkul said:
I tried out dynamic MFG and maybe it's just Pulsar's motion clarity making artifacts super obvious, but I'm just not seeing how people find anything more than 2x FG to currently be useable. The halo'ing around Edward is very distracting.
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Could be the clarity makes it obvious, also could vary game by game. When I tried MFG 2x in Hogwarts Legacy quite some time ago, I found it extremely noticeable and distracting. In Cyberpunk 2077, I find 3x quite nice.

However the strobing might do it. Clarity is not always good, blur is not always bad when you are talking our visual system. Movies make extensive use of motion blur to deal with their 24fps rate. If you shot a whole film with a high shutter angle it would look pretty jarring, particularly in a theater where they strobe the projector.
 
Sycraft said:
Could be the clarity makes it obvious, also could vary game by game. When I tried MFG 2x in Hogwarts Legacy quite some time ago, I found it extremely noticeable and distracting. In Cyberpunk 2077, I find 3x quite nice.

However the strobing might do it. Clarity is not always good, blur is not always bad when you are talking our visual system. Movies make extensive use of motion blur to deal with their 24fps rate. If you shot a whole film with a high shutter angle it would look pretty jarring, particularly in a theater where they strobe the projector.
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I think you're on to something here. I just tried out 3x FG in Dying Light 2 which is a first person game and it actually looks great. Hogwart's Legacy and Black Flag Resynced are 3rd person games and they can have quite a bit of HUD elements. CP2077 and DL2 are both 1st person games and you can tweak the HUD in DL2 to be minimal or even nonexistent, this seems to be the best case scenario for MFG. Thinking back on it now my impression of MFG has only been on 3rd person games and I always noticed artifacts around the character model as I'm spinning the camera around. In 1st person games with a minimalist HUD it looks way better.
 
MistaSparkul said:
I think you're on to something here. I just tried out 3x FG in Dying Light 2 which is a first person game and it actually looks great. Hogwart's Legacy and Black Flag Resynced are 3rd person games and they can have quite a bit of HUD elements. CP2077 and DL2 are both 1st person games and you can tweak the HUD in DL2 to be minimal or even nonexistent, this seems to be the best case scenario for MFG. Thinking back on it now my impression of MFG has only been on 3rd person games and I always noticed artifacts around the character model as I'm spinning the camera around. In 1st person games with a minimalist HUD it looks way better.
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I think it also depends on the kind of HUD and shit like that. Like in Cyberpunk, I can totally see frame gen distortion on HUD elements if I look... but it is real minor, and I have to be looking because the kind of distortion is just not that noticeable.

Basically I think that MFG is just going to be a per-game kind of thing. Some games, it works great for, others it has issues with. Also depends on base FPS, of course, if you can get a 100fps+ base FPS it is going to be way less noticeable than a 50 base fps (which is about the usable minimum IMO). It'll probably get better with time, there's a new version B that was released some time ago that allows for HUD to be draw after FG and thus ignored, but I imagine some games will just suffer artifacts more than others.
 
Sycraft said:
I think it also depends on the kind of HUD and shit like that. Like in Cyberpunk, I can totally see frame gen distortion on HUD elements if I look... but it is real minor, and I have to be looking because the kind of distortion is just not that noticeable.

Basically I think that MFG is just going to be a per-game kind of thing. Some games, it works great for, others it has issues with. Also depends on base FPS, of course, if you can get a 100fps+ base FPS it is going to be way less noticeable than a 50 base fps (which is about the usable minimum IMO). It'll probably get better with time, there's a new version B that was released some time ago that allows for HUD to be draw after FG and thus ignored, but I imagine some games will just suffer artifacts more than others.
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Yeah maybe it's just the game itself, either way I'm really happy with how it's looking in Dying Light 2. Pulsar is easily the best way to play this game since it lacks native HDR support and RenoDX has actually given up on supporting the HDR mod for this game and I have zero interest in resorting to using RTX HDR or AutoHDR ever again.
 
MistaSparkul said:
Yeah maybe it's just the game itself, either way I'm really happy with how it's looking in Dying Light 2. Pulsar is easily the best way to play this game since it lacks native HDR support and RenoDX has actually given up on supporting the HDR mod for this game and I have zero interest in resorting to using RTX HDR or AutoHDR ever again.
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I've become a Reno snob too. RTX HDR just over brightens shit. Reno is the only one I feel that really does do HDR where there are bright parts, but the overall image is unchanged.

Either way, glad it works for you and the first person thing is an interesting observation. I'll have to try 3x in a 3rd person game when next I play one that needs that much, or when I get a faster monitor. Right now I have 240Hz so for me 3x only really becomes viable with games where base FPS doesn't go much above 75 or so. I don't like the switchable FG as of yet, still needs more work, and I want to stay below the monitor's scan rate, I'd rather do 2x FG at 160fps than 3x at 240fps and risk tearing when it goes above 240. So most games end up being only 2x. They have to hit pretty hard before 3x becomes something I want. Cyberpunk is one of the few.
 
MistaSparkul said:
I tried out dynamic MFG and maybe it's just Pulsar's motion clarity making artifacts super obvious, but I'm just not seeing how people find anything more than 2x FG to currently be useable. The halo'ing around Edward is very distracting.


View: https://youtube.com/shorts/A_TgpDwQb4s?feature=share
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I have noticed this using Pulsar too, not just for MFG, for anything lower than DLAA (like DLSS Quality) I notice the clarity of image suffer more compared to my OLED.

With MFG in some games it just seems to add blurry frames in between the good ones. Some games do it well so I just have to test it out. It’s another thing to tweak to add to the list for PC games.

The image on Pulsar is a lot clearer in motion so artefacts stick out more.
 
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