Anyone else disheartened by the announced lack of partner boards for NVidia NVidia Titan X?

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clbri

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In AnandTech's article about the new board announcement, these two sentences popped out:

"the handful of pictures released so far confirm that the card will be following NVIDIA’s previous reference design, in the new GTX 1000 series triangular style. This means we’re looking at a blower based card – now clad in black for Titan X – using a vapor chamber setup like the GTX 1080"

and

"Meanwhile for distribution, making a departure from previous generations, the card is only being sold directly by NVIDIA through their website. The company’s board partners will not be distributing it"

This read very depressing to me. Given that with GTX 1080 FE, NVidia showed how they are not currently capable of delivering a competitive thermal solution in comparison to state of the art from ASUS, Palit, MSI and the rest. Upping the TDP from GTX 1080 with its 180W to the announced NVidia Titan X's 250W, I don't see how this card would have any chance of avoiding even more choking thermal throttling, unless its fan solution is taken up to loud 57+ dBA levels (reported 100% fan speed value from the above article). Palit developed a GTX 1080 board that was 9 degrees celsius cooler than NVidia's under load while being a tiny bit quieter, and ASUS's version was 15 degrees celsius cooler than NVidia's and in techPowerUp's report, 4 dBA quieter.

There is a strong business point that can be seen with this move, with NVidia wanting to create a kind of exclusive offering to its system builder partners with this board, which aligns really well with the timing since vendors are now racing to build VR-capable all-in-one solutions.

However, for customers.. "want the thermally adequate/liquid-cooled NVidia Titan X instead of the loud and hot reference board? Too bad, gotta buy the whole computer to go with it from Razer or Alienware."

Hopefully this fear will be proven wrong with once the boards actually arrive for review, looking very much forward to seeing how they perform with respect to thermals and decibels. Anyone else who thinks this is going to be a big trouble for the NVidia NVidia Titan X?
 
Not nearly as much as say 1080 if also did that to 1080.

They never did let Mitan X have any sort of custom design, so basically every Mitan X was the same, barring only whom you have to deal RMA with.

I am not terribly concerned about it, if that's what nVidia want to do, that's entirely up to them. They just need to be ready for any consequences of cutting out the middle man for the Pitan.
 
clbri said:
In AnandTech's article about the new board announcement, these two sentences popped out:

"the handful of pictures released so far confirm that the card will be following NVIDIA’s previous reference design, in the new GTX 1000 series triangular style. This means we’re looking at a blower based card – now clad in black for Titan X – using a vapor chamber setup like the GTX 1080"

and

"Meanwhile for distribution, making a departure from previous generations, the card is only being sold directly by NVIDIA through their website. The company’s board partners will not be distributing it"

This read very depressing to me. Given that with GTX 1080 FE, NVidia showed how they are not currently capable of delivering a competitive thermal solution in comparison to state of the art from ASUS, Palit, MSI and the rest. Upping the TDP from GTX 1080 with its 180W to the announced NVidia Titan X's 250W, I don't see how this card would have any chance of avoiding even more choking thermal throttling, unless its fan solution is taken up to loud 57+ dBA levels (reported 100% fan speed value from the above article). Palit developed a GTX 1080 board that was 9 degrees celsius cooler than NVidia's under load while being a tiny bit quieter, and ASUS's version was 15 degrees celsius cooler than NVidia's and in techPowerUp's report, 4 dBA quieter.

There is a strong business point that can be seen with this move, with NVidia wanting to create a kind of exclusive offering to its system builder partners with this board, which aligns really well with the timing since vendors are now racing to build VR-capable all-in-one solutions.

However, for customers.. "want the thermally adequate/liquid-cooled NVidia Titan X instead of the loud and hot reference board? Too bad, gotta buy the whole computer to go with it from Razer or Alienware."

Hopefully this fear will be proven wrong with once the boards actually arrive for review, looking very much forward to seeing how they perform with respect to thermals and decibels. Anyone else who thinks this is going to be a big trouble for the NVidia NVidia Titan X?
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These coolers are designed to not fail and work in any system, not keep the GPU cool. This means they get a rear exhaust design which removes air from the chassis and a blower that should keep spinning almost forever. The needs of system integrators and pro users are not based around the card maintaining sub 70C temps while playing Doom 4 at 4K.
 
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I guess I'm the only one glad its nVidia only, but then again, how are they at RMA's? I'm sure this should be a non issue on a part of this price.
 
Couldn't Nvidia develop a watercooled variant? If AMD could do this for a while, then why not Nvidia?
 
When was the last time you saw an AIB Titan?

The AIB versions og GP102 will be 1080TI cards.
 
At least they get to keep the standard on product quality. Sure, you get cooler things from AIB partners, but you also get their cost cutting shenanigans to. EVGA > ALL on RMA however.

I did in the past deal with nVIdia directly, and sent them my 560 Ti back when they were looking for cards to nail down the TDR's. Got a 660 GTX Ti in return for nothing except shipping to them. Was fine and still is as far as I'm aware, they even sent me one from EVGA AIB. Can't complain, that was the only time I've dealt directly with nVIdia themselves.
 
The partners will sell AIO watercooling kits, guaranteed. With this being a monster $1200 card, you're probably going to want water anyway.
 
I've dealt with nvidia RMA and it was actually better than evga so if anything I'm happy they are selling it directly.
 
I would have really liked a hybrid design or triple slot blower as an option. That's going to be a lot of watts for a two slot blower.

$1,200 is a lot. Planning $150 - 300 over that for AIO or custom loop is... Painful.
 
Dayaks said:
I would have really liked a hybrid design or triple slot blower as an option. That's going to be a lot of watts for a two slot blower.

$1,200 is a lot. Planning $150 - 300 over that for AIO or custom loop is... Painful.
Click to expand...

Agreed, NVIDIA should have made this a premium part with hybrid cooling for that $1200 asking price. Gives me pause about grabbing one vs waiting on a 1080Ti which will inevitably come in a few months.
 
Reimu said:
Couldn't Nvidia develop a watercooled variant? If AMD could do this for a while, then why not Nvidia?
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The EVGA GTX 980 Ti/Titan X CLC fits the GTX 1080. It will probably fit screw cutouts of the new Titan X Pascal as well. All you have to do is a get a mini screw driver set and remove the glass shroud and aluminum heatsink and just fit the closed loop cooler on top of it.

That said I'm only jumping on if there is an ACX cooler that will fit the new Titan X. CLC pumps are are too loud for me.
 
Shintai said:
When was the last time you saw an AIB Titan?

The AIB versions og GP102 will be 1080TI cards.
Click to expand...

Not in the U.S. but in Asia they had multiple AIB Titan X SKUs with triple fan coolers and CLCs. You could always buy them on eBay or as 3rd party marketplace sellers on some websites.
 
its a top tier card for a special population, Low volume high margin product for nvidia. I'm not surprised at all with this approach, if an enthusiast wants better thermals there will certainly be water options for them based on the reference (possibly only board) design
 
My mistake then. The Titan segment isn't exactly getting much of my attention :)
 
Shintai said:
My mistake then. The Titan segment isn't exactly getting much of my attention :)
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That is also the sole exception.
When I got GK110 Titan, the box said Asus...but that was just print on the box...the cards were identical, no matter the brand.

Titans have always been "Founders Edition" and most Titan owners don't care.

I hope to get all Titan cards with time (a collectors thing) as they seem to be cards that really annoy the heck out of people that don't own them...they sure love to rage about other peoples choices
 
Now that the reviews have started to pour in, the results sadly look exactly like I anticipated before launch.

Hexus.net concludes that the thermal solution is indeed too weak: "Cooler holds potential back".
PC Perspective ranks the card among the loudest of the bunch in their review, although the card fan speeds seem to have been optimized down by quite a bit to the quiet end, preferring to thermally throttle at the 84c limit point instead of running the fans at 100% duty cycle to maximize dissipation.
Guru3D sees the thermal solution as poor as well, writing "However I am not impressed by the reference cooler as it is a limiting factor on the dynamic clock frequency."
TechPowerUp also complains about the card being both noisy under load and limited by thermals.
HardwareCanucks observe the thermal throttling and mention dreaming about having it water-cooled instead.

Given that NVidia decided to slap a considerable price markup on this generation Titan, I don't think these are the kind of reviews one should expect. Sure, it is notably faster than GTX 1080, but having such a glaring weakness to it makes this feel like a pass and wait for the 1080 Ti cards.

Although, EK just announced a custom water-cooling solution for the card. Now, that looks interesting!
 
clbri said:
Now that the reviews have started to pour in, the results sadly look exactly like I anticipated before launch.

Hexus.net concludes that the thermal solution is indeed too weak: "Cooler holds potential back".
PC Perspective ranks the card among the loudest of the bunch in their review, although the card fan speeds seem to have been optimized down by quite a bit to the quiet end, preferring to thermally throttle at the 84c limit point instead of running the fans at 100% duty cycle to maximize dissipation.
Guru3D sees the thermal solution as poor as well, writing "However I am not impressed by the reference cooler as it is a limiting factor on the dynamic clock frequency."
TechPowerUp also complains about the card being both noisy under load and limited by thermals.
HardwareCanucks observe the thermal throttling and mention dreaming about having it water-cooled instead.

Given that NVidia decided to slap a considerable price markup on this generation Titan, I don't think these are the kind of reviews one should expect. Sure, it is notably faster than GTX 1080, but having such a glaring weakness to it makes this feel like a pass and wait for the 1080 Ti cards.

Although, EK just announced a custom water-cooling solution for the card. Now, that looks interesting!
Click to expand...

As noted earlier, the main design goal is for the cooler to never fail and work in any system, not to keep the cards cool. Nvidia knows damn well that the cards throttle. It's a trade off to sell one SKU Titan hardware that will work in any system from pro desktops to gaming PCs. AIO water coolers are a pain in the ass for common folk to integrate into a system, and people would bitch about the AIOs anyway because EK blocks are so much better.
 
Honestly, it isn't worth the integrators' time to spec and build such a card.
They simply won't sell enough of them to justify the costs involved.
 
I really don't see how the cooler is a problem. Do you worry for the Ferrari owner, how are they gonna pay for the insurance costs? Really?
 
They need to build chips with dead silicon around them to assist in heat transfer, but silicon cost is prohibitive.
 
thesmokingman said:
I really don't see how the cooler is a problem. Do you worry for the Ferrari owner, how are they gonna pay for the insurance costs? Really?
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Is it customary to purchase something as expensive as a Ferrari and have it gimped as it rolls out of the dealership?
 
Depends on the word 'gimped'.

If it was supposed to roll out of the factory like that, then it's not gimped. If the car needed mods to draw out more power, then the modder would have to support the Warranty.

Currently, GPUs does that, cars do not, AFAIK.

I don't know about you, but if modding cars voids warranty of the original factory, and the modder won't guarentee it, then I won't mod it.

Same with GPU. If the AIB won't warranty the custom GPU's, but nVidia's stock will, then I probably will only buy from nVidia.

My only problem, in this case exclusively about Pitan X, is availability. I could always count of Asus, MSI or Gigabyte releasing their cards (even if only in their box) here, nVidia has not yet done so, so no retailers currently has the card.

If only nVidia had better distribution infrastructure.
 
chenw said:
Depends on the word 'gimped'.

If it was supposed to roll out of the factory like that, then it's not gimped. If the car needed mods to draw out more power, then the modder would have to support the Warranty.

Currently, GPUs does that, cars do not, AFAIK.

I don't know about you, but if modding cars voids warranty of the original factory, and the modder won't guarentee it, then I won't mod it.

Same with GPU. If the AIB won't warranty the custom GPU's, but nVidia's stock will, then I probably will only buy from nVidia.

My only problem, in this case exclusively about Pitan X, is availability. I could always count of Asus, MSI or Gigabyte releasing their cards (even if only in their box) here, nVidia has not yet done so, so no retailers currently has the card.

If only nVidia had better distribution infrastructure.
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Some people buy their GPUs and just like to drop them into their machines, and don't ever consider touching/modding their cards. This is a $1,200 dollar flagship GPU, with a cooling shroud similar looking to the other 10 series FE line with their "premium materials and superior craftsmanship" - thermal throttling shouldn't be happening out of the gate, especially if they're not letting AIB's touch this card.
 
More annoyed at the price increase. Distribution doesn't really bother me. Just want to see EVGA come out with a compatible ACX cooler for it and it should be able to stretch it's legs fully at 2+ GHz and stay cool and quiet.
 
Factum said:
That is also the sole exception.
When I got GK110 Titan, the box said Asus...but that was just print on the box...the cards were identical, no matter the brand.

Titans have always been "Founders Edition" and most Titan owners don't care.

I hope to get all Titan cards with time (a collectors thing) as they seem to be cards that really annoy the heck out of people that don't own them...they sure love to rage about other peoples choices
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They're just envious they can't pony up the cash. (Like me. Fucking university...)
 
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